Maybe it's time to Boycott Universal

[jenniferm]

We just got back from a week in Orlando. We went to Universal Studios on Dec 29 and IOA on the 31st and the Express Pass machines were NOT working. They were all covered and according to one of the ride attendants, had been turned off since September.

We are one family who will not be returning to Universal anytime soon because of this. I guess we were spoiled by our 4 days at Disney before going to Universal.

Part of the problem was that we didn't arrive at the park until 10am. I knew going in that it would mean more crowds and longer lines but I didn't know that EP wouldn't be working. All in all, we just had a bad day at Universal. My DH bought his tickets online before hand because they said, "Save time when you get to the park, buy e-tickets". Well, we waited in line for 30 minutes to get our e-tickets, which put us in the park at 10:30. The person at that counter mentioned that if we used a MasterCard, we could get the Express Plus Pass for half price. When we saw the lines for the rides, we thought we'd go for it. Well, we found out that it was only valid if you bought the EP when you bought your tickets which really irritated us. Maybe if they would say upfront "our regular express machines aren't working and this is the only way that you can get on the rides without a wait" then we would have known to do this. DH doesn't even remember seeing anything about this being an option when he bought his tickets but who knows. It may have been and he may not have realized how important this might be. So, our only option was to buy the Express Pass for $35 a person, to which we said "no way".

The wait time for Shrek and Jimmy Neutron were about 60 minutes so we decided to bypass them and go to Twister. It was a smart move as the wait there was only about 20minutes. We waited about 30 minutes for MIB, 15-20 minutes for Back to the Future and 1 hour for ET (which totally sucked and was not worth waiting that long for--GRR). We got back to Shrek and waited 40 minutes and then 25 minutes for Jimmy Neutron. After riding more rides at Disney with a max wait of 20 minutes(75% of the time we waited 10 min or less), this was a HUGE disappointment. Shrek and Twister were really great and we were glad to have seen them but the rest of the park was not worth it for how much time we spent waiting in lines.

Our trip to IOA was much better, mostly because we got there closer to 9am. We were able to ride Spider Man 3 times with only a 5-10 minute wait each time, then rode a few other rides before heading into Seuss Landing and riding those rides with 5 minute waits. We left the park around 12:30 and by then the wait time for the Seuss Landing rides was 20 minutes. We LOVED Spider Man and Seuss Landing was on par with Disney but otherwise the park didn't impress us and we probably won't be back. Our kids are young (5 & 7) so we knew there wouldn't be as many rides for them and it was a bit chilly for us to get soaked on the water rides. So maybe when they are older and can ride more rides and its really hot that day we might go back there.

Honestly, with the exception of Spider Man, we had more fun with less waiting and a cheaper price at Great America in Santa Clara this summer than we did at either US or IOA.

 

[phamton]

From what I understand there is no decision to remove them permanently at Universal. The old tickets and annual passes were alphanumeric (meaning the barcode had both numbers and letters like "234ac987mn12") The new tickets and annual passes are just numeric (345671239). The express machines weren't able to read many of the new tickets and annual passes. They have been replacing the software in them which suggest to me that they aren't planning on getting rid of express pass forever.

Free Express pass is expected to be reinstated around SpringBreak at Universal. That doesn't mean for sure they are coming back as I know they are looking at the whole system and making a decision in the future. For what it's worth, Disney is considering eliminating fastpass in the future also. Who knows what may become of express/fast pass? Neither SeaWorld nor Busch Gardens (Tampa) have fastpass and guests never seem to miss it. Most of us went for years to Disneyland and WDW without fastpass and never knew what we were missing. Now we are all used to the convenience and whatever the parks decide are definitely going to make for a lot of unhappy guests. I do know that fastpass has become a headache for both Disney and Universal. They may both decide to keep it just to make guests happy or they may decide to eliminate it and deal with the complaints.

It was first started at WDW in hopes that guest would get a fastpass and shop until their return time. Instead they are riding other attractions instead of shopping. I know it is hard to understand but fastpass and express pass make all the lines longer for everyone. In the past, you would get in line at Haunted Mansion and wait for 45 minutes. Now with fast pass, you ride two or more rides while waiting for your fastpass. You are riding other rides during what you would normally be waiting in line at Haunted Mansion. This doubles the wait time because you are essentially saving a place for yourself on haunted mansion while you ride several other rides. Multiply this by the thousands of people doing the same thing and you have twice the wait time for everyone. In the old days, you would wait in line and possibly only ride 8 rides all day. Now with fastpass, you can increase your rides to 12 rides that day. That makes the wait times longer, if that makes sense. More fun for you but longer lines for everyone. This does effect you even if you utilize the fastpass system as you will then be waiting longer in line for the rides that you can't get a fastpass for as everyone is riding more rides in one day and thus longer lines.

Not to mention, each ride has to station a castmember to check the express/fast passes on each ride and a castmember to be stationed at the express/fastpass distribution machines. These cast members could be loading people on the ride instead of policing and distributing fast pass. Both Universal and Disney are seriously understaffed and that is a position they could eliminate and put the castmember as a ride operator, etc.

Those who are saying that express is gone for sure are just speculating. No one knows for sure except the bigwigs and they ain't talking.

 

[damo]

Im kinda wondering...can you iggy people on this board . I am SOOOOO bored with reading anything davehfx has to say. The energy is just so negative.

Do you mean block them? Just put them on your ignore list. Click on their user name and then go into their public profile. You will see the option of putting them on your buddy list or ignore list.

 

[davehfx]

Sorry you find my post so negative, But when Mr MaCraven has the nerve
to accuse me of starting the rumor of no more express pass, when in fact
he was the first to post it on Dec 4....

 

[damo]

Sorry you find my post so negative, But when Mr MaCraven has the nerve
to accuse me of starting the rumor of no more express pass, when in fact
he was the first to post it on Dec 4....

I think macraven is female!

 

[phamton]

Sorry you find my post so negative, But when Mr MaCraven has the nerve
to accuse me of starting the rumor of no more express pass, when in fact
he was the first to post it on Dec 4....

Since when is Macraven a "mister"? Did she recently have surgery?

 

[Laurabearz]

Since when is Macraven a "mister"? Did she recently have surgery?

Shhhhh it was part of the fun!!!

 

[Bryce's Mom]

I have the 2006 Universal Orlando guide and it says that Express Pass is alive and well. That's why we are staying on-site (in addition to it being walking distance from the parks.)

 

[phamton]

nevermind

 

[Slacking]

Wow, this thread has gotten ridiculous. Its either petty arguing or people posting opinions I personally don't agree with.

Express pass isn't needed to tour the parks. I hate the whole Fastpass concept and its gotten to the point where people pretty much try to depend solely on it. You don't need Express/Fastpass to enjoy a park. There are plenty of ways to tour the park that don't rely on these systems.

1- Arrive right before opening. Simple as that. First hour or so, the park will be empty. Hit the popular rides at this time. Even if you're not necesarily early morning people, change your habits for a day. It will make for a better experience.

2- Save Shows and other "people eater" attractions for the busy part of the day. Twister? Earthquake? Any sort of show? These attractions take up large amounts of people and usually lasts 15-30 min. Save these attractions for when the lines are long for other attractions.

3- If a wait time is unacceptable to you, skip it and come back later.

I for one wouldn't mind seeing the free express passes shut down permanently. In fact, I'd love it even more if the Express system was shut down altogether, but Universal makes too much of a profit on the passes and its a nice perk for resort guests, so I don't see that happening.

 

[JohnnySharp2]

hey johnny, thanks for the detailed reply.

of all the brits i have met at the parks, most stay off site for disney.
when i am at the hrh, i have met several that stay there for a couple of weeks. i am always amazed on how they can swing that.

when i first started going to orlando, the kids and i stayed at quality inn suites for the extra bed space and room. the boys would get on each others nerves if they were too close to each other.......but we never cooked in the suites. just used the fridge for soda and water and leftovers from resturants.

we switched over to disney all stars when they got older for the extra one and a half hours in advance for on site guests to enter the park. it really helped out as we had to go during summer.

now, i go solo or have for the last 2 going on 3 trips. i am a teacher and take off the time from work. i can't stand fighting the crowds by myself.
its a trade off of many things, the weather, crowds, value season, cheaper airfare, etc.
we never had the fast/express passes when we started going and were able to see it all.
when is your next trip to the motherland???? disney/universal that is

Hi - we are going for 3 weeks next August.

Generally stay in a villa these days because we really prefer the extra room and privacy and it's just so much better for our son.
We have to go August now because my wife is a teacher and with Joshua at school it's just difficult..we have been lucky and been at quieter times of the year in the past.
Actually didn't find August too bad at all last year(seems strange saying that about 2005) as the crowds are much lighter mid-August onwards.

It is just the crazy flight prices, twice as much as it is at other times of the year, hence we go for 3 weeks now.

 

[the Dark Marauder]

Wow, this thread has gotten ridiculous. Its either petty arguing or people posting opinions I personally don't agree with.

Express pass isn't needed to tour the parks. I hate the whole Fastpass concept and its gotten to the point where people pretty much try to depend solely on it. You don't need Express/Fastpass to enjoy a park. There are plenty of ways to tour the park that don't rely on these systems.

1- Arrive right before opening. Simple as that. First hour or so, the park will be empty. Hit the popular rides at this time. Even if you're not necesarily early morning people, change your habits for a day. It will make for a better experience.

2- Save Shows and other "people eater" attractions for the busy part of the day. Twister? Earthquake? Any sort of show? These attractions take up large amounts of people and usually lasts 15-30 min. Save these attractions for when the lines are long for other attractions.

3- If a wait time is unacceptable to you, skip it and come back later.

I for one wouldn't mind seeing the free express passes shut down permanently. In fact, I'd love it even more if the Express system was shut down altogether, but Universal makes too much of a profit on the passes and its a nice perk for resort guests, so I don't see that happening.

Well said. The Express perk will not go away for the on-site guests, as that is a major draw. If the free express was abolished, several attractions would have shorter wait times becuase they could draw on the regular line much more. ROTM, Shrek, BTTF, MIB, JPRA, ET, Doom. All these attractions have dual loading (either sides or RVs) abilities, and would be able to make the regular wait time much smaller with less express.

 

[mill4023]

Neither SeaWorld nor Busch Gardens (Tampa) have fastpass and guests never seem to miss it. Most of us went for years to Disneyland and WDW without fastpass and never knew what we were missing.

Yes, but now a lot of us have seen that there is an alternative to waiting in line for an hour. It's true that we are spoiled. But I don't see why that's a bad thing. We've been given a system that lets us minimize time standing in line. We enjoy it and we don't want to go back to long lines.

This doubles the wait time because you are essentially saving a place for yourself on haunted mansion while you ride several other rides. Multiply this by the thousands of people doing the same thing and you have twice the wait time for everyone. In the old days, you would wait in line and possibly only ride 8 rides all day. Now with fastpass, you can increase your rides to 12 rides that day. That makes the wait times longer, if that makes sense. More fun for you but longer lines for everyone. This does effect you even if you utilize the fastpass system as you will then be waiting longer in line for the rides that you can't get a fastpass for as everyone is riding more rides in one day and thus longer lines.

Actually, no, it doesn't make sense. If wait times are longer and you have "twice the wait time for everyone", how in the world can you go on more rides each day.

 

[phamton]

Actually, no, it doesn't make sense. If wait times are longer and you have "twice the wait time for everyone", how in the world can you go on more rides each day.

I said "This does effect you even if you utilize the fastpass system as you will then be waiting longer in line for the rides that you can't get a fastpass for as everyone is riding more rides in one day and thus longer lines.

Ok here's an example: Using fast pass, you can ride 4 rides with wait times of 15 minutes or less. That leaves all the other rides that you can't use fastpass and will have to wait in line for 45-90 minutes.

Without fast pass available for anyone you will wait in line an average of 30 minutes for every ride. Plus in the days before fastpass, if the line was too long, you skipped it and went to a ride with less wait time.


Ok here's an example: (Pre Fastpass years)

Arrive 9:00 AM Ride the train around the park (no waiting in line)

9:30 Get in line for Small World--wait 30 minutes

10:30 Get in line for Peter Pan---wait 30 minutes

11:15 Get in line for Haunted Mansion---wait 30 minutes

11:45 Get in line for SpaceMountain---wait 30 minutes.

12:30 Eat lunch

1:30 Get in line for Pirates---wait 30 minutes

2:30 Get in line for Jungle Cruise---wait 40 minutes

3:40 Get in line for BTMR--wait 40 minutes

4:50 Get in line Splash Mountain---wait 45 minutes

6:00-7:15 Caruossel of Progress--- Wait 45 minutes.



Now a touring plan with fastpass in the same timeframe:

9:00 Run for a fastpass for SplashMountain. Ride the train with only 15 minute wait.

9:30 Space Mountain wait 30 minutes

10:10 Philharmagic---wait 45 minutes

11:00 Ride Splash---used fastpass so wait time was 5 minutes.

11:15 Get fast pass for BTMRR. Get in line for Pirates--Wait time 45 minutes.

12:00 Eat lunch.

1:00 Jungle Cruise---wait time 60 minutes, Get fast pass for Buzz Lightyear

2:15 Haunted Mansion--- wait time 60 minutes

3:20 Space Mountain---wait time 90 minutes. Get fastpass for Peter Pan.

5:00 Time for BTMR fastpass. Wait 10 minutes.

5:30 Time for fastpass for Buzz (wait time 10 minutes)

6:00 Ride Pirates (wait time 60 minutes)

7:00-7:15 Time for fastpass for PeterPan (wait time 5 minutes) (12 rides total)

 

[Laurabearz]

6:00-7:15 Caruossel of Progress--- Wait 45 minutes.

I was with ya until this!!!

I must say if both US/IOA and WDW were to get rid of their express pass systems DH, more than the kids, would flip. He is our worst line waiter....

Beinging the super de duper park planner that I am, we would adapt, but for the next 100 years I will hear from DH (and the kids) REMEMBER when....

 

[phamton]

I was with ya until this!!!

Yeah, I was running out of rides.

I must say if both US/IOA and WDW were to get rid of their express pass systems DH, more than the kids, would flip. He is our worst line waiter...

Honestly, in the old days before fast/express pass, waiting inline was part of the experience. You talked to your family while waiting and also got to know the others in line. You looked at the theming in the queues. 30 minutes passed very quickly. Now we run through the lines with express pass, hardly noticing anything in the queues.

I usually skip lines longer than 30 minutes but did wait for Soarin' for over an hour and a half. The wait would have been less than an hour if there was no fastpass.


We actually had fun answering the trivia questions in the queue slide show, visited with other families, etc. I was surprised how pleasant our wait was except for occassionally glaring at the fastpass people since the rest of us had tried to get fastpass and they had run out. I certainly don't recommend waiting in hour long lines, but 30 minutes isn't bad at all.

 

[macraven]

a few years back, i had my son walk with me thru the regular line for dr. doom and spiderman.

we had fotl and wanted to see the entire layout and sights in the wait line for these two rides.

when you go in the single line/ or express line, you miss all these neat attractions during your wait.

last year since the spidey and doom lines were short, i went in the regular line just for the ambience of it all.

you do miss some of the finer things to see when you by pass the regular lines.

not that i am willing to give up fotl or single rider lines.......

say, anyone can use the single rider line......if the regular line is too long, jump into that one. great for MIB. the 3 of us did that before and even got on the same car a few times.

 

[jenniferm]

I agree its not as bad waiting in line when there are interesting things to look at. MIB was awful. It was just the lab rat maze. ET wasn't much better since the story line/setup was so lame.

I am questioning your Fast Pass scenario at Disney, though. I guess I shouldn't say questioning as it could very well be your experience. Mine was just very different.

We were there on Xmas eve and arrived around 7:40 for a 8am park opening. I went to Space Mountain to get FP while DH took the boys (7 and 5) on Snow White. I met them at the exit and we all walked on Peter Pan and Winnie the Pooh. Then it was off to Tomorrowland. Our time hadn't come up yet for Space Mountain so we rode Buzz and Stitch. The standby line at SM was 5 min so we did that. Then we rode Buzz again, got a FP for later, then rode SM with our fastpasses. Then we did Tomorrowland Transit Authority and afterwards headed for the train in Toontown.

Took train over to Frontierland. BTMR was closed for repair so rode Splash Mountain with about a 20 minute wait. As we exited Splash, Big Thunder opened so we lucked out and got on there with a 5 min wait. Rode it again right away with a 15 minute wait. It was now 11am and time for lunch. Before lunch, we grabbed a set of FP for Philharmagic.

After lunch we grabbed a set of FP for Jungle Cruise then rode Aladdin with a 5-10 minute wait, then we saw the Tiki Room show. I don't remember if we rode Pirates before or after Jungle Cruise, but we had maybe a 20-30 minute wait for Pirates.

Headed over to watch Philharmagic after Pirates but picked up a FP for Buzz first and then walked over to Liberty Square, caught the Xmas parade (3:15?), then after the parade was over we went to Liberty Tree Tavern for our 4:10 dinner reservations. After dinner, we wanted to do Haunted Mansion and Small World, but the lines were 45 minutes for each of them so we did Hall of Presidents. If I had known that it would take 60 minutes to do HOP (waittime and showtime) we would have just done Haunted Mansion.

We left the park around 6pm and gave away our last set of FP for Buzz to a family just coming in.

So in a nutshell, we saw/rode:

Snow White
Peter Pan
Winnie
Space Mountain x 2
Buzz x 2
Stitch
TTA
Train ride
Splash Mountain
Big Thunder Mtn Railroad x 2
Aladdin
Jungle Cruise
Tiki ROom
Pirates
Philharmagic
Hall of Presidents (BORING! lol)
Xmas Parade

for a total of 20 rides/shows (including the train ride and parade) compared to your 12 rides.

Honestly, we never waited more than 30 minutes to get into ANYTHING at Disney and we went to all 4 parks between Dec 24-28. To me, Fastpass is wonderful and I will miss it if it ever goes away. To us, waiting in lines is not part of the theme park experience and if 45-60 minute waits were routine for all rides, we just flat out wouldn't go.

A big part of it however, is making sure you get there as early as you can. That was our big downfall in our day at Universal. By the time we got into the actual park it was 10:30 and we waited a minimum of 20 minutes to get on everything. We were there from 10:30-7ish and only saw/rode 7 things. I knew that we would experience longer lines because we got there later, but I didn't know that the EP machines wouldn't be working. If they had I'm guessing we could have gotten 2 fastpasses before they ran out, which would have saved us probably 2 hours of line waiting.

You do make an interesting point about the lines being longer because of the fastpass. I see this being a problem only in the late afternoon though. In the morning/early afternoon, I think the standby lines are actually shorter due to the many people getting their fastpasses for later in the day. Those people aren't in line with you, they are getting their fp then getting out of there. Just a thought.

 

[mill4023]

I said "This does effect you even if you utilize the fastpass system as you will then be waiting longer in line for the rides that you can't get a fastpass for as everyone is riding more rides in one day and thus longer lines.

I understand the idea of what you are saying, but it still doesn't make sense.

You are saying that all the wait times are longer, yet people are riding more rides in a day. Logically, it should be the opposite. There is only so much time in the day. If the wait times are longer, each ride would take up a larger chunk of your day and you would end up riding fewer rides, not more.

In your first example, you have a total wait time of 320 minutes for 10 rides. Average wait time of 32 minutes.
In your second example, you have a total wait time of 435 minutes for 12 rides. Average wait time of 36 minutes.

How exactly did the second day end up with an extra 115 minutes available?

Do you see what I mean? If it is true that the average wait time with FP is 36 minutes and the average wait time without FP is 32 minutes, then clearly you should be able to ride just as many or more rides without FP. Yet you state the opposite is true.

It's almost like you are arguing two conflicting points. On the one hand, you are trying to say that FP makes overall wait times longer. Then you turn around and say that the waiting is part of the theme park experience and everyone should be willing to wait in long lines. If the first is true, the second doesn't make any sense since you'd do more waiting with FP.

If the wait for rides was 30 minutes, that wouldn't be a big deal. I've only been to WDW once, but I spent plenty of time in DL both pre and post fastpass. Obviously this is all anectdotal evidence from both of us, but I remember plenty of times pre-FP when we waited 60 minutes or more for rides like Space Mountain.

More anectdotal evidence, but during our 10 day trip to WDW during the first week of the 50th celebration, we NEVER waited in line longer than 15 minutes.

I really don't buy the argument that FP makes total waiting time longer for everyone. If you were telling me that FP makes lines longer for those who choose not to use it, that I might believe. But I'm still not completely convinced. I see it as a way of spreading out the visitors over the course of the day.

What I don't understand is why people get so upset about FP. They act as if it's some secret benefit only available to special guests. Unlike Universal's FOTL, FP and the free Express Passes are available to everyone. You can choose to use it or not. For me, standing in a line for 60-90 minutes with 4 kids when it's 90 degrees out is NOT a part of the theme park experience I enjoy. That is the bad thing I remember about my pre-FP trips to DL. And it's something I do NOT want to go back to.

 

[momof3disneyholics]

I agree its not as bad waiting in line when there are interesting things to look at. MIB was awful. It was just the lab rat maze. ET wasn't much better since the story line/setup was so lame.

I was going to stay out of this, but I have to respond now.
Did you ride the same MIB ride that I have rode? The themeing is wonderful on that ride. If you are a fan of the movie then you totally get it. Everything from the fake tour that you are taking in the beginning, to being loaded into a elevator and then coming out and walking past the break room where the aliens are having coffee all the way till you are loaded is nothing but themeing. You can even touch the fake doors in the line and something will happen. I just don't see how you missed all of this.