Mall bans unsupervised kids/teens

[luvsJack]

I don't think they put this rule in effect lightly. The mall and the businesses are there for one thing to make money. If they stood to lose money by instating this rule, they wouldn't do it. I'm guessing they had enough of a problem with loitering, troublemaking and worse (fights, shoplifting, weapons) and not enough teen shoppers to make them put these rules in effect. As others have said, the no teen rule on weekend nights has brought in more families and adults and I don't know any family or adult who just goes to the mall to hang out, they are there to shop, unlike the majority of teens who are there to just hang out.

Well, I can only base my opinion on the mall we frequent. When school is in session or on week nights, the mall is empty. On weekend nights there are lots of kids, yes, but LOTS of kids shopping. They are walking, talking, joking and playing but they are also carrying bags and some from some pretty expensive stores. And all you have to do is look around the food court to know that they wouldn't be making a dime if it wasn't for the kids/teens there. And there are all the little kiosks with ice cream, pretzels, hats, etc that cater mainly to the age group. There are still plenty of families and adult shoppers there too. I have never heard anyone say they would stop shopping there because of the teens.

We did have another mall that had a gang problem many, many years ago. When the new mall opened they changed the format of the old mall. The stores all open to the outside now and the center of the mall is only a food court and some offices. Prior to that they tried the "no teens, no loitering" etc. rule. Didn't work. Got rid of the wrong teens. Gangs still hung around outside. I think the new mall may have a rule about gang symbols or colors or clothing being worn (whatever gangs do to be recognized??)

Like I said, their business, their rule. And if they don't have security running around on a power trip, if nothing else, its a rule to fall back on when they want to get a kid out of the mall. I still think checking ID's at the door of a mall is ludicrous.

As for adults going to "hang out", well, I think we usually call it "window shopping".

 

[Disneyadore]

Again, hate to ruin your joke, but I conceded that point a long time ago in this thread. But carry on cracking yourself up...

Are the grapes that sour?

 

[luvmy3]

Well, I can only base my opinion on the mall we frequent. When school is in session or on week nights, the mall is empty. On weekend nights there are lots of kids, yes, but LOTS of kids shopping. They are walking, talking, joking and playing but they are also carrying bags and some from some pretty expensive stores. And all you have to do is look around the food court to know that they wouldn't be making a dime if it wasn't for the kids/teens there. And there are all the little kiosks with ice cream, pretzels, hats, etc that cater mainly to the age group. There are still plenty of families and adult shoppers there too. I have never heard anyone say they would stop shopping there because of the teens.

We did have another mall that had a gang problem many, many years ago. When the new mall opened they changed the format of the old mall. The stores all open to the outside now and the center of the mall is only a food court and some offices. Prior to that they tried the "no teens, no loitering" etc. rule. Didn't work. Got rid of the wrong teens. Gangs still hung around outside. I think the new mall may have a rule about gang symbols or colors or clothing being worn (whatever gangs do to be recognized??)

Like I said, their business, their rule. And if they don't have security running around on a power trip, if nothing else, its a rule to fall back on when they want to get a kid out of the mall. I still think checking ID's at the door of a mall is ludicrous.

As for adults going to "hang out", well, I think we usually call it "window shopping".

Window shopping leads to spending money, more money than a $2 burger at the food court

My mall was bad before the no under 18 rule went into effect so I do agree that it depends on what goes on in your mall. For the malls that don't have the gang problems ours did, there would probably be no need for such a rule however we aren't all that lucky to have a mall where teens go to shop not shoplift or hangout without fighting.

 

[Planogirl]

I haven't read every page of this but I wonder about those 16 and 17 yr olds who work at the mall? Are the stores not permitted to hire those under 18 anymore? I do understand some of the concerns and agree that there certainly are some obnoxious teens in the malls but I also was thrilled when my ds got his driver's license this summer and was able to take his younger brother and go school shopping without me having to tag along.

They are apparently issuing mall ID cards to teens who work at the mall.

 

[eliza61]

Have not read all 17 pages. Sorry if this is a repeat.
2 malls in my area have issued this also.
The order was issued because of a serious problem at the mall on Friday and Saturday nights. As usual its a few bad apples who probably are ruining it for all the other teens who just want to get together with friends.
Philly had a severe problem with gangs of teenagers who were connecting on facebook and actively meeting to trash and loot South Street.

I also avoid going to the mall on Friday and Saturday nights. I rather avoid the bag language (sorry, it seems teens now feel the need to add a curse word like they are nouns) and ill mannered.

 

[Ppufi]

Our mall did this for a while, but with the addition of a teen hangout in our mall and a general decline in visitors it has been lifted. I don't think the problem is as bad as it was. Now if kids want to hang out they go get high at the Rez.

 

[Indiana Rose Lee]

True, I agree that they do not have any business doing that; but not all teens become a problem. Truth be known the majority of teens do NOT become a problem.

A mall is a private business and as a private business can set most any rule they choose to (unless of course the rule is proved to be discriminatory). I do know that many malls (not all, but many) would lose money in the process of doing this. Teens do a huge amount of shopping.

From a business prospective, I would think enforcement would be better along the lines that the pp described. If the teen is not causing problems and is indeed shopping then they aren't asked to leave. Checking ID's at the door of the mall is just ridiculous and personally I would stop shopping there if our mall started doing such a thing. Besides it would add personnel costs to the mall, security cannot be catching shoplifters if they are busy checking IDs.

I don't think all teens are a problem, either. I have my 3rd and 4th that are in that age range, and they are good kids. But, unfortunately, the kids that are a problem ruin for others. It is just like so many other situations.

One of my sons worked at the mall, and I worked at one when I was going through college. An i.d. wouldn't be a big deal for me. I have to have one for work, now. No difference.

I think that it is silly to speculate as to whether it is a good thing or a bad thing. For a mall to make this decision they had to believe the problem was big enough to warrant it. I don't think that has to be gang related. I just think that kids in mass do not always behave the best (think brazilian tour groups at wdw) and if it has become a hangout rather than a shopping place it is a problem.

As for the heelies, I have never seen them in a mall or at WDW...And families tend to buy. That is why they will never be banned.

 

[FireDancer]

Don't you think, though, that at some point they reach an age where they are a bit too old for constant parental supervision?

Yep. The age varies but it is when they can be trusted to to go places, like the mall, and behave without that constant parental supervision. Up until that time a private enterprise can limit them from entering their establishment and those that no longer need the supervision are just casualties. Some obviously need it all the way up until 18.

I imagine that the rule wasn't put into place on a whim. There had to be enough of a problem for a long enough period of time to necessitate it. If the mall security and/or local police posted a blotter of all the incidents they had to respond to at the mall that were instigated by minors maybe it would all make more sense.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Sure. But they have no business becoming a problem for others. I think that he parents/community has a responsibility to them. Not business owners.

Probably precisely the reason for the bans.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I haven't read every page of this but I wonder about those 16 and 17 yr olds who work at the mall? Are the stores not permitted to hire those under 18 anymore? I do understand some of the concerns and agree that there certainly are some obnoxious teens in the malls but I also was thrilled when my ds got his driver's license this summer and was able to take his younger brother and go school shopping without me having to tag along.

If you had read the first post--it does indicate that employees would be permitted in the mall.

Doesn't take reading all 17 pages. But yet, that keeps getting brought up over and over and over and over again.

If your student has a license, then he would be able to enter the mall in the OP, ANY TIME during the week EXCEPT Friday and Saturday nights.

But for some reason--magically, it is suddenly the only time anyone is available to go shopping.

Some how I managed to do all that shopping--prior to adult hood without committing myself to Friday and Saturday night...with a single mom in the military even.

 

[TheDisneyGirl02]

I forget which poster mentioned that it was mostly the kids between the ages of 12 - 15 that cause most of the problems at the mall. I have seen that be the case many times.

I work at the Disney Store and although we provide a magical experience for any person (regardless of age) who comes into the store, we still are a retail location. Just like the Gap or Aero, we have numbers that we need to make in order to stay sucessful.

I don't know if it's just something that happens at my mall, but around the area the kids play what they call 'The Game' at the Disney Store. Basically what 'The Game' is is that they need to get from the front of the store to the back of the store and touch the wall without being greeted by a CM. It may sound funny, but it's been going on for years.

We have kids who walk in, we greet them and they turn around and leave complaining loudly that we 'ruined their game'. Other times, older teenagers will run to the back of the store to touch the wall putting other guests in danger. It's not safe and it's just not fair.

This past holiday, we had a group of middle school aged girls come into the store after 11pm by themselves to play 'The Game'. I couldn't believe that any parent would leave their child who may have been as young as 6th grade at the mall by themselves at 11pm at night. FWIW, I ruined their game. It's part of my job to greet the guests and I was just doing my job.

I personally would be interested in seeing the mall where I work doing like a 'trial time period' of banning teens without parents to see if sales do go up or down. If they go down, by all means let the teens in - if they went up, then that is the way to go.

 

[PlutoLuvr]

We have two indoor malls in my area, and I sure wish they'd institute something like this.

 

[fluffycow333]

So, would they have to stay with their parent the whole time at the mall or would they be allowed to split up and go in one store while their parent is in another?

 

[luvsJack]

I forget which poster mentioned that it was mostly the kids between the ages of 12 - 15 that cause most of the problems at the mall. I have seen that be the case many times.

I work at the Disney Store and although we provide a magical experience for any person (regardless of age) who comes into the store, we still are a retail location. Just like the Gap or Aero, we have numbers that we need to make in order to stay sucessful.

I don't know if it's just something that happens at my mall, but around the area the kids play what they call 'The Game' at the Disney Store. Basically what 'The Game' is is that they need to get from the front of the store to the back of the store and touch the wall without being greeted by a CM. It may sound funny, but it's been going on for years.

We have kids who walk in, we greet them and they turn around and leave complaining loudly that we 'ruined their game'. Other times, older teenagers will run to the back of the store to touch the wall putting other guests in danger. It's not safe and it's just not fair.

This past holiday, we had a group of middle school aged girls come into the store after 11pm by themselves to play 'The Game'. I couldn't believe that any parent would leave their child who may have been as young as 6th grade at the mall by themselves at 11pm at night. FWIW, I ruined their game. It's part of my job to greet the guests and I was just doing my job.

I personally would be interested in seeing the mall where I work doing like a 'trial time period' of banning teens without parents to see if sales do go up or down. If they go down, by all means let the teens in - if they went up, then that is the way to go.

That was what my friend was saying about the ages, she said the 12-15 year olds tend to want to do more "playing". And the older teens seem to have more money so they would actually be shopping and eating in the food court and such.

My older kids used to go to the mall to hangout, but they actually did do some shopping. Many times I would give them money for shoes or whatever while they were there. I am sure dd will do it when she gets old enough (only 11 right now and I won't let her go unless I am actually IN the mall). Which brings up another question--

If a group of kids are brought to the mall by an adult but the adult is, say, in the food court while the kids are walking around the mall or at the arcade; is that permissible?

The reason that I ask is that I have seen sooo many kids that would actually act worse knowing their parent was there to bail them out of trouble, so I was just curious.

ETA: FluffyCow, I guess we asked the same question at the same time!

 

[luvsJack]

Yep. The age varies but it is when they can be trusted to to go places, like the mall, and behave without that constant parental supervision. Up until that time a private enterprise can limit them from entering their establishment and those that no longer need the supervision are just casualties. Some obviously need it all the way up until 18.

I imagine that the rule wasn't put into place on a whim. There had to be enough of a problem for a long enough period of time to necessitate it. If the mall security and/or local police posted a blotter of all the incidents they had to respond to at the mall that were instigated by minors maybe it would all make more sense.

If that is the case, sadly, I highly doubt the person will improve their behavior after 18.

 

[ohiomom28]

We have a mall around here that is like that but its age 16

 

[TheDisneyGirl02]

That was what my friend was saying about the ages, she said the 12-15 year olds tend to want to do more "playing". And the older teens seem to have more money so they would actually be shopping and eating in the food court and such.

I must say that 'The Game' isn't exclusive to younger kids - heck I've seen college age students still playing (which I think is crazy). We have our share of older teens who do come in just to mess around with things or take pictures of themselves in the mirrors (I still don't get that) but most of the older teenaged girls who come in are either serious shoppers or just browsing. There's a big difference between browsing and messing things up.