Make anti-vaccine parents pay higher premiums

Topper

The One True Duck
Joined
Jul 16, 2001
Messages
2,706
Make anti-vaccine parents pay higher premiumsBy Rahul Parikh, Special to CNN

STORY HIGHLIGHTS
Rahul Parikh says the idea that autism and vaccines are linked has been totally discredited
Parikh says some parents still don't vaccinate their children, putting them and others at risk
He says anti-vaccine parents should pay substantially higher health insurance premiums
Editor's note:Rahul K. Parikh is a physician and writer who lives in the San Francisco Bay Area. Follow him on Twitter at http://twitter.com/docrkp.

Walnut Creek, California (CNN) -- Evidence disputing any link between autism and vaccines has been gathering for a decade. The anti-vaccine movement's lynchpin, Dr. Andrew Wakefield, has been shown to be nothing more than a grifter in a lab coat, with the prestigious British Medical Journal calling his work "an elaborate fraud."

Two new books, "Deadly Choices" by Paul Offit and "The Panic Virus" by Seth Mnookin, detail the sordid story of the anti-vaccine movement.

Given that, it's hard for me to believe that some parents still refuse to vaccinate their children. But they do, frightened by the rants and raves of anti-vaccine fundamentalists such as Jenny McCarthy, who can effortlessly get on "Oprah" or any other TV talk show to advance what is nothing short of a myth.

It's that fiction and the fear it incites that has challenged and frustrated pediatricians like me for 10 years. I don't foresee any quick shift in the trend among affluent, highly educated older parents against childhood vaccines. As Offit often points out, it's much harder to unscare people once they've been scared. McCarthy has it easy. We doctors have to do the hard part.

Refusing to vaccinate a child is dangerous not just for that child but for entire communities. It's precisely this point a colleague of mine was considering when he had the idea that parents who refuse to vaccinate their kids should pay substantially higher health insurance premiums.

It makes sense. Insurance, after all, is just a pool of money into which we all pay. In determining how much we or our employers pay, risk is taken into account.

The perfect analogy is smoking. If you smoke -- and want to turn your lungs black and spend a greater portion of that pot of money on your possible chronic lung disease or any cancers you'll get -- then you may have to pay more.

Why shouldn't we impose the same logic on parents who refuse to vaccinate their children?

The link between smoking and lung cancer is as clear as that between refusing vaccines and increasing the risk of infectious disease. And the one between secondhand smoke and a litany of health problems pales in comparison to the link between going unvaccinated and spreading "secondhand disease."

Researchers looking at the 2008 measles outbreak in San Diego, California, showed just how expensive and serious an outbreak of a disease that could have been prevented with a vaccine can be. A child whose parents refused to vaccinate him traveled to Europe and brought home the measles.

That family exposed 839 people, resulting in 11 additional cases of measles. One child too young to be vaccinated had to be hospitalized.

Forty-eight children too young to be vaccinated had to be quarantined, at an average family cost of $775 per child. The total cost of the outbreak was $124,517, about $11,000 per case and substantially more for the hospitalized child. That was just in the money the county and state spent to clean the mess up, and doesn't take into the account the costs to private insurers.

Nothing in this argument should supersede that doctors need to slow down and talk carefully with parents who are worried about vaccines. And none of it should distract from the fact that parents of children with autism deserve answers.

But if the Wakefield-McCarthy tribe had anything to say about this, they may agree. After all, their latest slogan is "vaccine choice."

In reflecting on what happened, the mother of the San Diego child told Time magazine that "we analyze the diseases and we analyze the risks of the disease, and that's how my husband and I made our decision about which vaccines to give our children."

Fair enough. If they want to make a risky choice, let's have this mother and others like her pay more for it.

As an aside, perhaps we could make doctors complicit in that choice pay higher malpractice premiums as well. Perhaps then, the combination of proof, medical crimes, stories like what happened in San Diego and a little moral hazard for patients and doctors will help move the needle toward common sense and preventive medicine.


The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Rahul Parikh.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/01/20/parikh.childhood.immunizations/index.html?hpt=T2
 
Make anti-vaccine parents pay higher premiumsBy Rahul Parikh, Special to CNN

STORY HIGHLIGHTS
Rahul Parikh says the idea that autism and vaccines are linked has been totally discredited
Parikh says some parents still don't vaccinate their children, putting them and others at risk
He says anti-vaccine parents should pay substantially higher health insurance premiums
Editor's note:Rahul K. Parikh is a physician and writer who lives in the San Francisco Bay Area. Follow him on Twitter at http://twitter.com/docrkp.

Walnut Creek, California (CNN) -- Evidence disputing any link between autism and vaccines has been gathering for a decade. The anti-vaccine movement's lynchpin, Dr. Andrew Wakefield, has been shown to be nothing more than a grifter in a lab coat, with the prestigious British Medical Journal calling his work "an elaborate fraud."

Two new books, "Deadly Choices" by Paul Offit and "The Panic Virus" by Seth Mnookin, detail the sordid story of the anti-vaccine movement.

Given that, it's hard for me to believe that some parents still refuse to vaccinate their children. But they do, frightened by the rants and raves of anti-vaccine fundamentalists such as Jenny McCarthy, who can effortlessly get on "Oprah" or any other TV talk show to advance what is nothing short of a myth.

It's that fiction and the fear it incites that has challenged and frustrated pediatricians like me for 10 years. I don't foresee any quick shift in the trend among affluent, highly educated older parents against childhood vaccines. As Offit often points out, it's much harder to unscare people once they've been scared. McCarthy has it easy. We doctors have to do the hard part.

Refusing to vaccinate a child is dangerous not just for that child but for entire communities. It's precisely this point a colleague of mine was considering when he had the idea that parents who refuse to vaccinate their kids should pay substantially higher health insurance premiums.

It makes sense. Insurance, after all, is just a pool of money into which we all pay. In determining how much we or our employers pay, risk is taken into account.

The perfect analogy is smoking. If you smoke -- and want to turn your lungs black and spend a greater portion of that pot of money on your possible chronic lung disease or any cancers you'll get -- then you may have to pay more.

Why shouldn't we impose the same logic on parents who refuse to vaccinate their children?

The link between smoking and lung cancer is as clear as that between refusing vaccines and increasing the risk of infectious disease. And the one between secondhand smoke and a litany of health problems pales in comparison to the link between going unvaccinated and spreading "secondhand disease."

Researchers looking at the 2008 measles outbreak in San Diego, California, showed just how expensive and serious an outbreak of a disease that could have been prevented with a vaccine can be. A child whose parents refused to vaccinate him traveled to Europe and brought home the measles.

That family exposed 839 people, resulting in 11 additional cases of measles. One child too young to be vaccinated had to be hospitalized.

Forty-eight children too young to be vaccinated had to be quarantined, at an average family cost of $775 per child. The total cost of the outbreak was $124,517, about $11,000 per case and substantially more for the hospitalized child. That was just in the money the county and state spent to clean the mess up, and doesn't take into the account the costs to private insurers.

Nothing in this argument should supersede that doctors need to slow down and talk carefully with parents who are worried about vaccines. And none of it should distract from the fact that parents of children with autism deserve answers.

But if the Wakefield-McCarthy tribe had anything to say about this, they may agree. After all, their latest slogan is "vaccine choice."

In reflecting on what happened, the mother of the San Diego child told Time magazine that "we analyze the diseases and we analyze the risks of the disease, and that's how my husband and I made our decision about which vaccines to give our children."

Fair enough. If they want to make a risky choice, let's have this mother and others like her pay more for it.

As an aside, perhaps we could make doctors complicit in that choice pay higher malpractice premiums as well. Perhaps then, the combination of proof, medical crimes, stories like what happened in San Diego and a little moral hazard for patients and doctors will help move the needle toward common sense and preventive medicine.


The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Rahul Parikh.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/01/20/parikh.childhood.immunizations/index.html?hpt=T2

As much as I want to agree with this it leaves out the fact that children die from vaccinations.

My oldest has a vaccine allergy with the Pertussis. So she should have to pay a higher premium because she cannot get the full vaccine.

I think not.

As much as you want to think this is a good indea, giving that kind of power to insurance companies is probably not a good idea in the end.
 
Stupid idea! Parents should have the right to reasonable make choices for their kids without fear of monetary repercussions.

I am a strong advocate of vaccine usage, but I still believe there are cases where vaccines can cause harm to some children.
 
As much as I want to agree with this it leaves out the fact that children die from vaccinations.

My oldest has a vaccine allergy with the Pertussis. So she should have to pay a higher premium because she cannot get the full vaccine.

I think not.

As much as you want to think this is a good indea, giving that kind of power to insurance companies is probably not a good idea in the end.

:thumbsup2Same here. My daughter had a very serious allergic reaction to the pertusis shot also. She has not received any more of that shot since that first one. As per doctor's orders.
 

As much as you want to think this is a good indea, giving that kind of power to insurance companies is probably not a good idea in the end.

Actually, I never gave my opinion on the matter. I thought the concept was interesting.
 
That actually made me cringe.

I understand the additional burden un-vaccinated children put on the rest of society but to punish parents for not falling in line with policy just isn't a road I am willing to start down. What's next? Fining parents of overweight kids? I am no fan of erecting a "Gattaca" like society.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not being glib. Both of my kids are vaccinated as are my DH and I, I completely understand the mechanisms behind vaccinations and am a huge proponent of them. But, I don't have any familial health issues which make this particular issue a concern. On the other hand, I do have other family tendencies that make things which are safe for other people more dangerous for us so I can empathize with the parents on the other side of the vaccine debate.

My age group was among a large number of NYC students who were prohibited from finishing College unless we got another Measles shot because something was discovered to be wrong with the one we got as kids. One friend of mine got sick shortly thereafter and it got worse & worse until she was ultimately diagnosed with MS. Now there is no way to say whether the vaccine was a trigger, her nephew also has Autism so maybe that particular family has trouble with vaccines, could be their systems just can't handle the assault. On the other hand it could all just be a co-incidence... I don't know. When the time came to vaccinate her child, and for her sister to vaccinate her second child my view was that it's a hard call either way. These people weren't mindless or foolish, they had genuine concerns and I felt for them. I believe both women chose to vaccinate their kids on a very long & slow schedule after the age of 1. Personally, I would have a hard time sleeping at night thinking they were being punished for not following the lock step schedule. I, myself decided to spread out my childen's vaccines favoring the most dangerous illnesses first. I would go back once a month and the nurses were always giving me a hard time trying to bully me into changing my mind. Good thing I did what I did because I had refused the Rotovirus vaccine for my DD because I knew it was a new one (DS a year earlier didn't get it) and by the time I got back to get it for my kids it was already pulled from the market for causing bowel obstructions and death.

In a nutshell, in the end if a bad decision is made it's only the parents who cry so they get to decide.
 
I'm kind of in the middle on this one...

for medical reasons (allergies, etc), the raised premiums definitely shouldn't apply.

I have a bit of a hard time w/ families who don't vax 'just because'. They always say "look at my kids, they're healthy!" Well, they're healthy because of herd immunity. What about polio? If we all didn't vax our kids, YOUR kids could get polio. They won't get it now because of what everyone else has done. Save the non-vax's for the kids who truly, medically cannot be.

BUT then you get into freedom of choice w/ our bodies and our children's bodies, and it can be a slippery slope "forcing" vax's.

So, I sit on the fence.
 
I didn't read the whole article but I like it. Kinda like smokers pay higher premium so should people who choice to take risks. There could be a clause for documented with proof for actual allergies (not just on parents say so but documented/tested allergies)

why shouldn't the people deciding to take the risks pay for it? why should everyone else pay for it?
 
Until we make all individuals pay premiums that correspond to their health choices, this is a silly suggestion.

(I am not anti-vaccine.)
 
I didn't read the whole article but I like it. Kinda like smokers pay higher premium so should people who choice to take risks. There could be a clause for documented with proof for actual allergies (not just on parents say so but documented/tested allergies)

why shouldn't the people deciding to take the risks pay for it? why should everyone else pay for it?

Then there should be higher premiums for people who eat junk food too. Obesity is getting awfully expensive - those people should pay more.

Really...where does it stop? People make all KINDS of bad choices around their health. How do you pick what makes premiums go up and what doesn't?
 
Instead of paying higher premiums, maybe if someone gets sick because of their lifestyle, the insurance company should cover less of the costs involved. For example, if a smoker gets lung cancer. But if a smoker gets hit by a bus, that's an unrelated injury.
 
Until we make all individuals pay premiums that correspond to their health choices, this is a silly suggestion.

(I am not anti-vaccine.)

I agree with this. I work for a company that does have a higher surcharge for those people that smoke...many people lie during open enrollment and say they don't.

I like that my employer offers incentives to LOWER premiums. So, if I go for my yearly physical, have my well woman and pap done along with a mammogram and since I am over 50 I can get a screening colonscopy then I earn points. The more points I earn the more I get off my premiums in the next plan year. Since the insurance pays 100 % for all these preventive services it's a no brainer to me.
 
Then there should be higher premiums for people who eat junk food too. Obesity is getting awfully expensive - those people should pay more.

Really...where does it stop? People make all KINDS of bad choices around their health. How do you pick what makes premiums go up and what doesn't?

You do pay more for things like life insurance if you are obese.
 
You do pay more for things like life insurance if you are obese.

True, but that is for the benefit of your beneficiaries. Life insurance is not for the benefit of the insured. The premium doesn't go up b/c you are obese. It goes up b/c actuaries have determined that you are more likely to require an insurance payout than someone who is not obese. Also--life insurance is a flat amount. All that gets paid out is the dollar amount you purchased in the event of your death.
 
True, but that is for the benefit of your beneficiaries. Life insurance is not for the benefit of the insured. The premium doesn't go up b/c you are obese. It goes up b/c actuaries have determined that you are more likely to require an insurance payout than someone who is not obese. Also--life insurance is a flat amount. All that gets paid out is the dollar amount you purchased in the event of your death.

same Idea you are a bigger risk so you pay more, especially when it is a choice and not vaccinating without documented medical cause is simply a choice and others should not have to pay for this choice.
 
same Idea you are a bigger risk so you pay more, especially when it is a choice and not vaccinating without documented medical cause is simply a choice and others should not have to pay for this choice.

They are not the same types of insurances. They should not be treated the same.

Folks get charged more for their driving histories as well on auto insurance.:confused3

Unless, in health insurance, they charge EVERYONE respective to their PERSONAL CHOICES in maintaining their health or lack of maintaining their health, then it doesn't matter what statistics are cited for this choice or that choice.

As of now--life insurance is still quite optional. It can be lived without. It isn't even a similar product, so how they choose to charge is irrelevant.
 
This is just silly. The OP posted a news story for discussion. They may be interested in the topic, but posting an article does not equal an opinion. :rolleyes:
I agree. I am curious as to what the OP thinks about it though.

I can see the logic behind the author's opinion but this is a slippery slope that I think could be dangerous. You already have those who are attempting to monitor personal choices and this could get out of hand.
 
Very slippery slope.

I'm very pro vax and I'd never subscribe to such an idea. However, I do believe that schools should have the right to ban students who aren't vaccinated without a known negative reaction or family history of vaccination problems.
 


Disney Vacation Planning. Free. Done for You.
Our Authorized Disney Vacation Planners are here to provide personalized, expert advice, answer every question, and uncover the best discounts. Let Dreams Unlimited Travel take care of all the details, so you can sit back, relax, and enjoy a stress-free vacation.
Start Your Disney Vacation
Disney EarMarked Producer






DIS Facebook DIS youtube DIS Instagram DIS Pinterest DIS Tiktok DIS Twitter

Add as a preferred source on Google

Back
Top Bottom