Make anti-vaccine parents pay higher premiums

[Kallista]

I also think certain vaccines are just a way for big Pharma to make more money. (flu and chicken pox)

Chicken pox is a very mild disease in children, but the virus sits in your body. You never clear it entirely. (Like the herpes virus). When you get old, and your immune system starts to fail, the virus can cause shingles, which is an extremely painful blistering rash. I wouldn't wish that on anyone, much less an old and sick person. I gave my kids the chicken pox vaccine to prevent them from getting shingles.

The flu shot is not 100%, but since flu kills 50 - 90 kids in the US every year, I think it's worth it.

 

[WeLoveLilo05]

You know, I honestly don't begrudge you that choice. As I've stated, having a prior bad reaction is a legitimate reason for exercising caution with a child. And they should accept titer results as an alternative to additional vaccinations since they show immunity... and that's the name of the game in the end.

However, I don't think that you can project your daughter's experience on the general population. I cannot buy the "little bodies" argument as there's no real medical basis to support it and it seems to be a purely emotional reaction. The whole "spread them out" theory seems totally arbitrary and completely ignores that our children's immune systems are under constant attack from the microbial world and all of our bodies are full of other bacteria.

and thats the same reason that I don't begrudge others for their decision to/or not to vaccinate their child. Because research was done on the behalf of the parents and they have decided what would be best for their child based on that. Or they had a previous experience in the family from a vaccine, or a religious reason prohibits them from doing it I can't judge people for the decision that they have made. I mean look at me though, my ped said nothing about the titers and did not want to exempt my daughter even though she did have that reaction and had current medical issues. People go that route for various viable reasons, it not just to go against the societal norm.

 

[WeLoveLilo05]

Christian Science forbids vaxing, along with all conventional medical intervention.

And I think Jehova's witness, although I am not 100% sure, I know they will not take blood transfusions.

 

[Nette]

Chicken pox is a very mild disease in children, but the virus sits in your body. You never clear it entirely. (Like the herpes virus). When you get old, and your immune system starts to fail, the virus can cause shingles, which is an extremely painful blistering rash. I wouldn't wish that on anyone, much less an old and sick person. I gave my kids the chicken pox vaccine to prevent them from getting shingles.

The flu shot is not 100%, but since flu kills 50 - 90 kids in the US every year, I think it's worth it.

Actually your kids can still get shingles. The chicken pox vaccine is a live attenuated vaccine, so vaccinated kids are still carriers and can still get shingles.There are cases of pediatric shingles in kids who got the vaccine. http://kidshealth.org/parent/infections/skin/chicken_pox.html
http://www.vaccineinformation.org/varicel/qandavax.asp

There is also a theory that the reason we're seeing more shingles is because adults are no longer getting a "booster" from being around kids with chicken pox. http://www.news-medical.net/news/2005/09/01/12896.aspx

My reasons for not giving the flu shot are 1) it's success rate has never been proven to be over 50%. 2) I had a really bad reaction to it (see prior posts).

I don't have a problem with people who do decide to give their kids these shots. But I wish all parents would get informed first. (And yes, the FDA and CDC recognizes all of these things... if you can find the info in teeny tiny print on their websites)

 

[Deb in IA]

And I think Jehova's witness, although I am not 100% sure, I know they will not take blood transfusions.

Not anymore.

In the past the Watchtower Society has forbidden its followers to get vaccinations or accept organ transplants, many people died needlessly before the Watchtower Society changed its rules and allowed these procedures.

http://www.towerwatch.com/Witnesses/Beliefs/their_beliefs.htm

 

[Geoff_M]

Actually your kids can still get shingles. The chicken pox vaccine is a live attenuated vaccine, so vaccinated kids are still carriers and can still get shingles.There are cases of pediatric shingles in kids who got the vaccine. http://kidshealth.org/parent/infections/skin/chicken_pox.html
http://www.vaccineinformation.org/varicel/qandavax.asp

I think that's pretty accurate, but I think you leave a couple false impressions. While the CP vaccine is a live attenuated vaccine, only about 1% of vaccinated children develop a mild form of the disease and then become carriers like those of us that have had CP ourselves. In addition, your link points out that the risk of shingles has been oberserved to be less than the risk from the the CP virus itself and tend to led to a milder form of it when it does occur.

There is also a theory that the reason we're seeing more shingles is because adults are no longer getting a "booster" from being around kids with chicken pox. http://www.news-medical.net/news/2005/09/01/12896.aspx

Which is why they are recommending that people over 60 get booster vaccinations. And technically this problem will "go away" as there become fewer and fewer of us around over time that caught Chicken Pox in the wild.

While it's true that the extent of the benefits of the CP vaccine won't be fully known for some time, it does seem pretty clear that it's prevented a lot of kids from developing those more severe cases of the disease that are life threatening and/or required hospitalization. And while the vaccine can still lead to a number of cases of the disease or Shingles, it appears that the severity of those cases on the whole are a lot milder with their wild brethren. Two of our kids contracted the Pox and the youngest got the vaccine, we'll see how that turns out. Also, my wife had a 90+ year old great-aunt that decided to babysit two grand-nieces with Chickenpox. She thought if she hadn't gotten it up to that point in her life, then she must be immune... she was wrong, and it landed her in the hospital for some time.

 

[Nette]

I think that's pretty accurate, but I think you leave a couple false impressions. While the CP vaccine is a live attenuated vaccine, only about 1% of vaccinated children develop a mild form of the disease and then become carriers like those of us that have had CP ourselves. In addition, your link points out that the risk of shingles has been oberserved to be less than the risk from the the CP virus itself and tend to led to a milder form of it when it does occur.

From my first link: http://kidshealth.org/parent/infections/skin/chicken_pox.html

Anyone who has had chickenpox (or the chickenpox vaccine) as a child is at risk for developing shingles later in life, and up to 20% do. After an infection, VZV can remain inactive in nerve cells near the spinal cord and reactivate later as shingles, which can cause tingling, itching, or pain followed by a rash with red bumps and blisters. Shingles is sometimes treated with antiviral drugs, steroids, and pain medications, and there's now a shingles vaccine for people 60 and older.

I'm pretty sure that means ANYONE who has had CP *OR* the vaccine can get shingles later on. It stands to reason that even though the virus in the vaccine is attenuated, it could still take up residence in your body.

Which is why they are recommending that people over 60 get booster vaccinations. And technically this problem will "go away" as there become fewer and fewer of us around over time that caught Chicken Pox in the wild.

While it's true that the extent of the benefits of the CP vaccine won't be fully known for some time, it does seem pretty clear that it's prevented a lot of kids from developing those more severe cases of the disease that are life threatening and/or required hospitalization. And while the vaccine can still lead to a number of cases of the disease or Shingles, it appears that the severity of those cases on the whole are a lot milder with their wild brethren. Two of our kids contracted the Pox and the youngest got the vaccine, we'll see how that turns out. Also, my wife had a 90+ year old great-aunt that decided to babysit two grand-nieces with Chickenpox. She thought if she hadn't gotten it up to that point in her life, then she must be immune... she was wrong, and it landed her in the hospital for some time.

I think if you don't get CP as a child THEN you MIGHT want to get a vaccine. But as it is USUALLY a mild illness as a child, there is no reason other than lining the Pharm execs pockets to get it. And the Shingles vaccine (which they have a lousy track record with) is only the CP vaccine beefed up. So it seems that you're paying the drug company more than once.... How nice for them.

 

[2girlsmom]

I honestly find the subject of vax to be one of differing hypotheses. On the one hand, I absolutely agree that my kids should and did get the proven, long term vaxes, with one exception, we required them to seperate the DPT, as we have a family history of epilepitc reaction to this combo injection. On the other hand, I was never convinced on VZ, and would NOT have given to my children if not required by the schools. It has been the experience of those in my group that the vaxed kids lose some immunity in 10 years, and then ARE getting full blown chicken pox at 11-15 years of age. Both myself and my sister had severe reactions to the influenza shot, and our dr and my childrens' dr do not want any of us getting it because of that. The jury is still VERY out in regards to the safety and eficacy of gardasil, and certainly is not something my dd12 who is NOT sexually active needs right now, until a lot more information is in on it if ever. But FOR THE MOST PART, I believe the advantages are very high and the risks are largely minimal on the part of the long term ones.

 

[Geoff_M]

I'm pretty sure that means ANYONE who has had CP *OR* the vaccine can get shingles later on. It stands to reason that even though the virus in the vaccine is attenuated, it could still take up residence in your body.

I see that, but consider this from your other link:

Can the vaccine cause chickenpox?
Because this vaccine is made from a live, but weakened, virus, about 1% of recipients develop a mild form of the disease, consisting of a limited rash, most often with only 5–6 blisters. Usually there is no fever. These people
are then safe from the more serious, naturally occurring form of the virus.

...

Can the vaccine cause herpes zoster (shingles)?
Yes, this is possible. The risk of zoster following vaccination appears to be less than that following infection with the varicella virus. The majority of cases of shingles following vaccine have been mild and have not been associated with serious complications.

I'll need to do a little more digging, but those two links don't seem to be 100% in sync.

I think if you don't get CP as a child THEN you MIGHT want to get a vaccine. But as it is USUALLY a mild illness as a child, there is no reason other than lining the Pharm execs pockets to get it.

You're sorta looking past that "USUALLY" qualifier and the 2nd group of cases that it implies. But if your primary driver is a seething deep seated dislike of drug companies, then I can see where you're coming from.

 

[Nette]

You're sorta looking past that "USUALLY" qualifier and the 2nd group of cases that it implies. But if your primary driver is a seething deep seated dislike of drug companies, then I can see where you're coming from.

Ah, but that's the very same qualifier that pro-vaxers are ignoring as well. USUALLY a flu shot is safe... but in my case it wasn't.

 

[Geoff_M]

Ah, but that's the very same qualifier that pro-vaxers are ignoring as well. USUALLY a flu shot is safe... but in my case it wasn't.

145 people a year die from the flu vaccine each year?

 

[Nette]

I'll need to do a little more digging, but those two links don't seem to be 100% in sync.

They seem to be saying the same thing to me. They're both saying that if you get the vaccine or Chicken pox you are vulnerable to shingles. One of them just says that if you get the vaccine there is a 1% chance you will get CP from it, the other says there is a 20% risk of shingles from getting either CP or the vaccine.

But the point is, now you are digging deeper. I like that.

 

[Geoff_M]

They seem to be saying the same thing to me. They're both saying that if you get the vaccine or Chicken pox you are vulnerable to shingles. One of them just says that if you get the vaccine there is a 1% chance you will get CP from it, the other says there is a 20% risk of shingles from getting either CP or the vaccine.

But the point is, now you are digging deeper. I like that.

I've always been a digger, sorry.

Recent studies seem to point to vaccine protection from Shingles: Chicken Pox Vaccine Reduces Shingles Risk in Kids "1 case per 3,700 vaccinated children per year" sure sounds at lot less than a 20% risk to me.

Newer studies show Shingles vaccines in older people work pretty effectively: Shingles Vaccine Linked to Lower Disease Risk

More new data about those "other" Chickenpox cases: Chickenpox Vaccine Cuts Hospitalization Rates: Study

According to researchers, the one-dose vaccine program, run by the CDC and state and local governments, prevented about 50,000 hospitalizations in the United States from 2000 to 2006.

"Our study shows that the vaccination program has been successful in reducing varicella-infection hospitalizations not only among the targeted population of 10 years and under, but also has resulted in a 65 percent decline in persons greater than 20 years of age during the one-dose era," said study co-author Adriana Lopez, an epidemiologist in the division of viral diseases in the CDC's National Center for Immunizations and Respiratory Diseases.

During the one-dose era, the annual hospitalization rate for chickenpox decreased 70 percent for children under 20 years old and 65 percent for those aged 20 and older, according to the report in the February issue of Pediatrics.

And another study just out about the newer "two dose" CP vaccine shows that it's far suprior to the the "one-dose" version:

A second study, published in the Feb. 1 issue of the Journal of Infectious Diseases, looked at the clinical effectiveness of giving two versus one dose of the vaccine. In their study, researchers led by Dr. Eugene D. Shapiro of Yale University identified 71 cases of chickenpox in children aged 4 or older in Connecticut.

None of the youngsters who came down with the illness had received the two-dose course of the vaccine, while 93 percent had received one dose and 7 percent had not been vaccinated.

In further study, Shapiro's team compared children who received two doses of the vaccine to those who received one dose and found that the effectiveness rates were 98.3 percent and 86 percent, respectively.

In other words, "the odds of developing varicella were 95 percent lower in children who had received two doses of the vaccine compared with those who had received only one," Shapiro said in a news release from the Infectious Diseases Society of America. His team believes the study findings support the CDC's recommendation for the two-dose regimen.

 

[cm8]

If they allow that to be common practice what next? Fine all parents and make them pay more for the care of their children who are born with any diseases or illness

Maybe we should just relinquish all rights of being a parent and raising a child over to the government. They seem to all want to tell us what is right and what is wrong when raising a child.


Vaccinations have their place in our society but so does our RIGHT to refuse.

 

[lil mermaid]

Chicken pox is a very mild disease in children, .

Usually, it is mild. But it wasn't mild for my BFF in third grade. She somehow got a secondary bacterial infection, and died. I ended up with a bunch of ugly scars on my forehead, but she DIED.

 

[tiggersbombed2]

Oh, I'm so sorry Lil Mermaid. That's so sad.

 

[adkkev]

Maybe we should just relinquish all rights of being a parent and raising a child over to the government. They seem to all want to tell us what is right and what is wrong when raising a child.

Did I miss something in the original post? What does the gov't have to do with the article that was posted by the OP??

 

[WeLoveLilo05]

Did I miss something in the original post? What does the gov't have to do with the article that was posted by the OP??

lol you will have to read the 10 pages