Line cutting and fast pass problems...

[Katnmouse]

It definitely sounds like Univ. has a better handle on the system. Disney's system also creates the situation of packed out parks all day. No ebb and flow in and out throughout the day. The human tide flows in and stays. If you get a fast past in the morning but it's not good until 4pm, you're not going to leave and go back to the resort for a midday break. You are going to stay all day and have to be entertained while you wait for that fast pass time. Thus causing continuous long waits for every attractions.

 

[Redbudlover]

Been to Disney multiple times on and off peek times for several years and never saw the lines as long as they have been this past week.

And what I am complaining about is not when one party leaves the line and comes back...its when one goes and gets fast passes at another attraction then cuts in the line to rejoin the party. That's cutting in my opinion.

I could be wrong - but I believe Touring Plan.com recommends this to handle long lines. Or at least it recommends sending one of your party for FPs while the rest go to a different ride...

I am not sure what the difference it would be for YOUR experience to have a whole group in front of you or just all but one of the group who then comes in to join his group? Sounds more territorial than wounded.... Cutting to me is when someone is not joining , but jumping in front of you - in which case he should probably be shot - or at least slathered with a dole whip,,,,

 

[stalkingmickey]

I agree with the post that joining your family member or leaving and coming back is not cutting. If someone says they are joinging a friend and that is not the case i feel this is cutting.

 

[DisneyDadof3]

It is interesting that when I use my fastpass at most rides, we basically walk right up - maybe behind 5-10 people - but pretty much right up.

With Splash, Space, and Big Thunder - maybe we walk up - maybe we end up behind 15-20 people - but it's never a huge, long line where 50 fastpass people would go and then 10 regular line (of course these people could have fastpasses as well) - it's usually closer to the other way around.... and we go at the busy times usually.

 

[BigGreen73]

I guess I really don't understand the problem with this ~~ The announcement is made to "fill in all available space" and people continue to stand in a line. I'm sorry they don't understand the concept, but maybe when they see others "go past" them to stand in the empty space they'll get it for the next time at another attraction!! The CM is perfectly correct in telling people to move up and "fill in all the space".

I see this all the time. CM's instruct to fill in "all the available space" and nobody moves. This happens mostly a Q rides like Haunted Mansion etc. My wife and I keep moving up until we can't go anymore.

 

[Uncleromulus]

One of several reasons why we don't spend a whole lot of time in the Theme Parks anymore!! But we've been to Disney 38 times, so any line with a wait of more than 10 minutes or so is a "skip" for us.
But this is a huge problem for first time visitors who really do want to see and ride everything. Long lines are bad enough--line cutting just adds to the misery. "Control " of lines by CM's and the Fastpass system definately need work---.

 

[MassMom94]

I could be wrong - but I believe Touring Plan.com recommends this to handle long lines. Or at least it recommends sending one of your party for FPs while the rest go to a different ride...

I am not sure what the difference it would be for YOUR experience to have a whole group in front of you or just all but one of the group who then comes in to join his group? Sounds more territorial than wounded.... Cutting to me is when someone is not joining , but jumping in front of you - in which case he should probably be shot - or at least slathered with a dole whip,,,,

Sending one member to get FPs while the others GO on a different ride is different than sending someone to get FPs while others WAIT in line, and having the FP-getter rejoin them in line, for a different ride. I don't think Touring Plan(aka the Unofficial Guide) is recommending the latter.

I agree that it doesn't make much difference in wait time as long as not too many people are doing it. If every family in Disney started doing this, though, it would impact wait times. Just imagine what would happen if this became routine in the Dumbo line. I think fights would break out.

 

[BigGreen73]

My thoughts on this.

After working for both companies (WDW, Universal) I agree that Universal's "skip the line system" is a bit better.

Most would disagree because it costs more, but think like this...

In Disney, EVERYONE is entitled to a FastPass... EVERYONE! This means that basically, for every major attraction, there are 2 lines coming at the "merge" area. The ratios for this area are insane. In the attraction I worked at Disney, the FP ratios were to allow 9 stand by guests, then 50 FP guests. Soarin, I've heard, is even worse.

If fastpass wasn't there, I could let 60 standby guests go.

And, since it's free, the line is always long and backed up, because everyone has a FP.

At Universal, yes, the Express Pass is more money, but think like this. I don't know if you all know this, but the Express Pass is only good one time at each attraction. We mark them with a symbol from each ride (H for hulk, SP for spiderman...).

So if it's only good once in each express line, then yes, the express lines are long in the morning, but by the afternoon, their are barely anyone in them, basically just the resort guests (who get unlimited express with their room key).

It makes it nicer for them, and keeps the express line short, which means more standby guests can get onto the attraction.

I hope this made sense.

Universal does seem to have a good handle on the line situation. Disney needs to rework the fastpass a bit by maybe giving out less, limiting the amount per guest, or by changing the return times. There are many times I have witnessed a longer fast pass line than stand by line.

 

[BigGreen73]

It is interesting that when I use my fastpass at most rides, we basically walk right up - maybe behind 5-10 people - but pretty much right up.

With Splash, Space, and Big Thunder - maybe we walk up - maybe we end up behind 15-20 people - but it's never a huge, long line where 50 fastpass people would go and then 10 regular line (of course these people could have fastpasses as well) - it's usually closer to the other way around.... and we go at the busy times usually.

It's not usually too bad at MK, but more so at the parks with one or two major ride attactions like Epcot or Animal Kingdom. At Epcot, Soarin and Test track, and at Aminal Kingdom, Everest and The Safari. At times the standby and fastpass lines can be ridiculous.

This is why I hit the big ones at park open and avoid the lines. I can get in 2-3 rides while everyones frenzying over fast passes.

 

[MassMom94]

My thoughts on this.

In Disney, EVERYONE is entitled to a FastPass... EVERYONE! This means that basically, for every major attraction, there are 2 lines coming at the "merge" area. The ratios for this area are insane. In the attraction I worked at Disney, the FP ratios were to allow 9 stand by guests, then 50 FP guests. Soarin, I've heard, is even worse.

Wow, I have never been in an FP line with 50 other guests, and that includes the Soarin' FP line. The longest has probably been TT. I've never gotten FPs for attractions like LMA, Indy, or Philharmargic, though. Maybe those FP lines are longer.

 

[BigGreen73]

My wife and I have visited WDW during the beginning of May for the past 4 years. We have not experienced problems with cutters or too many issues with Fast Passes. In reality, we rarely even use fast pass now as we have a good game plan when we head to the parks. I know it can be more difficult with larger groups and families.

 

[BigGreen73]

Wow, I have never been in an FP line with 50 other guests, and that includes the Soarin' FP line. The longest has probably been TT. I've never gotten FPs for attractions like LMA, Indy, or Philharmargic, though. Maybe those FP lines are longer.

The worst fast pass lines I have seen are Soarin, Everest, Test Track, and the Safari which are mostly the lines before lunch and mid-late afternoon. I have literaly seen the test track fast pass line lineed up out of the building. But I agree, most fast pass lines are pretty minimal, maybe 20 or so people waiting.

 

[seashoreCM]

Just another point of view:

We could think of the fastpass line as the regular line.

The standby line then exists only to keep the ride operating when there is nobody in the fastpass line.

Going a bit further using this reasoning, suppose we truncate the standby line, after so many people are in it, anyone else must just keep moving on, go someplace else. The space the standby line occupies could then be decreased and it would be easier to police it.

Of course, if we go back to the other reasoning that the standby line is meant to quietly corral guests in a small area so they are not visibly taking up space on the walkways and making the park look more crowded, then we would leave things the way they are -- 50 fastpass riders for every 9 standby riders -- and all. The breaking point will occur when the corralled guests don't remain there quietly. (Who said that the parks were designed with the intention that about a third of the guests be standing in lines?)

The problem is not the fastpass. The problem is the ride itself. There is a maximum on the number of people who could go on the ride altogether. Let's say the number is 20,000 from park opening to park closing. If the ratio was 50 fastpass riders for every 9 standby riders, then something like 16,900 of the 20,000 "ride slots" have been given out in advance in a fashion that guests would not be standing in line for long periods. By allowing more standby riders, let alone do away with fastpass, we have the same 20,000 "ride slots" but the amount of time spent waiting for them multiplied by all the guests involved, just becomes greater.

Let's shift our attention to the restaurants, just to provide an analogy. During busy times guests with "ADR"s take up most of the restaurant's capacity. There really aren't that many standby guests here. The length of the wait seems to "self-limit" the number of standby guests.

The question arises, why does the fastpass line get so long in the examples given? I do know the answer to the Test Track situation, Test Track breaks down often. Do Soarin' and Expedition Everest have similar long breakdowns and is (Kilimanjaro) Safari often blocked by an elephant or a giraffe in the roadway?

Disney hints: http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/disney.htm

 

[pixie dust 112]

I could be wrong - but I believe Touring Plan.com recommends this to handle long lines. Or at least it recommends sending one of your party for FPs while the rest go to a different ride...

I am not sure what the difference it would be for YOUR experience to have a whole group in front of you or just all but one of the group who then comes in to join his group? Sounds more territorial than wounded.... Cutting to me is when someone is not joining , but jumping in front of you - in which case he should probably be shot - or at least slathered with a dole whip,,,,

But I have to say you might have to stick with the shooting....I think I might like being slathered with a dole whip!

 

[Davscotcar]

We were at disney 2 weeks ago. When Soarin' opened dd and I rode it in the standby line and dh got a rider switch pass. While him and dd rode it on rider switch ds and I walked over to test track and mission space and got the fasspasses which at 9.20am were 2 hours later. Then walked back to Soarin' to meet the other 2 before going on Figment for ds. On test track the wait was ages on fast pass as it was so busy. Mission space wasn't too bad as ds and I got a drink and then settled near the exit to wait on them. We rider switched mission space at 8.50pm and it was great at ds loved the soft play bit which I wish we'd known about the first time. Our fast pass which we walked away from was Big Thunder Mountain. The fast pass queue was down to the entrance to splash and I just wasn't willing to wait on that when dd and dh had waited 40 minutes in the fast pass queue for splash. We found the express lanes at Universal were very few people and laughed at the group of 6 who stood in the express line for a ride when there was no one else on it. That made our day at the fact there was no one in line so we'll stand in the express lane instead of using it at a busier time. We reckon star tours had the best rider switch as well as it saved the 90 minute waits we sometimes had. Though it is strange. DLRP have an age limit of 3 on it while MGM have a height restriction. Not one disney person could explain that to me at either park. I'm still waiting a response to an email about it.

 

[Hannathy]

I think a lot of the abuse would stop if people just wouldn't let cutters thru. WE don't. I'm not moving. if you leave the line you leave the line. If you want past us you will have to physically move us and that hasn't happened yet. On BTMR 2 teens tried to join their family about 2/3 of the way thru the line, sorry, you are old enough to ride by yourself and why weren't you with your group. They had made it all the way thru the line to us and when we stood our ground the people in front of us also responded that they weren't moving either.

 

[HeresYourEars]

Hubby and I just returned from a week at Disney. I have to agree that FastPass is useless for most people, when the park is crowded (and yes...I know that mid-summer is a busy time, but this was our only opportunity to go to Florida...some people don't have the luxury of picking and choosing their vacation time!). Most of the time, if you don't get to the machine before 11:30 AM, you're facing a long, long, long wait for a 3 minute ride.

As for line-cutters, we saw this happening in virtually every line we waited in. They just aggressively push through the line to the front, stepping over little kids, shouldering past old people...it's unreal.

Maybe they need to make a no-cutting rule across the board.

 

[Uncleromulus]

Maybe. I guess enforcing it would be the problem. I suspect most CM's (at least now) wouldn't want to get involved--and they are stretched very thin as it is.

 

[Dorisk3]

And this past Tuesday (one of those insanely busy days) one of the "million dreams" awards gave a family a ride on Soarin alone...just those 4 or 5 folks on the ride alone...with all those empty seats and all those people waiting in the cue. I don't really understand why they didn't just seat them front and center and then fill in the rest of the theater. People were not happy at waiting for the ride to run essentially empty.

That is a crime! Why is riding any ride by yourself considered a prize?!?!!?

 

[Idroveallnight]

I don't really have a problem with one person getting fastpasses and then joining their family - as long as we are talking one person! They are not really going to impact my wait time. I don't mind letting someone "catch up" to their family - if you can see their group and know they aren't just using it as an excuse.