Last Hour of flight - rule was lifted (International up to pilots)

[Green Tea]

The problem is you are not any safer by these new rules.

-Stay seated the last hour -- a terrorist will simply act 90 minutes before landing.

-No blankets -- a terrorist can use a hoodie sweatshirt with a big pockets to hide what he is doing.

-No IFE/GPS or updates on location -- a terrorist can just look out the window or use his watch.

All our "enhanced security" only really provides the illusion of security. Security has not improved one bit since 9/11, only inconvenienced millions of Americans. This recent terrorist was on a terrorist watch list, had a valid US Visa, and his father even warned the US Embassy he may try to attack. Yet nothing was done, he was not given secondary screening in AMS, the APIS (Advance Passenger Information System) did not flag him as a threat, nor was his Visa was not revoked by the US Embassy. Simply Pathetic!

So go ahead and give up your coke if it makes you feel safer, I'd much rather have real safety.

agreed1

 

[Phil'sFrontier]

Wow, holy smokes. I just watched the evening news(Canadian) and they reported that at Vancouver International Airport there was total chaos today.
Instead of the reported rules; they now claim no carry-on luggage accept for a small purse, laptop(no carry case..just the computer), and diaper bags. That is it! It is hopefully a temporary measure.

I had to laugh at the Wife because she just bought a new wheeled carry-on and might not get to use it...bahahaha

It's all good, I am real smart. You are still allowed coats, hehe. So you just have to bring a coat that is all pockets...lol

 

[Flossbolna]

Wow, holy smokes. I just watched the evening news(Canadian) and they reported that at Vancouver International Airport there was total chaos today.
Instead of the reported rules; they now claim no carry-on luggage accept for a small purse, laptop(no carry case..just the computer), and diaper bags. That is it! It is hopefully a temporary measure.

I had to laugh at the Wife because she just bought a new wheeled carry-on and might not get to use it...bahahaha

It's all good, I am real smart. You are still allowed coats, hehe. So you just have to bring a coat that is all pockets...lol

I was flying home from the UK three days after the event that brought us the liquids ban. There was a ban on all hand luggage. The only thing allowed was your wallet. I was travelling with my family and two of us had to pack their laptops in checked luggage! By the time we were traveling they had eased the rules slightly and we were given a transparent plastic bag where we could have a book, a phone and the wallet.

 

[Toad]

We fly from Toronto to the US a few times a year. Since 9/11 I have only ever carried on a small purse. In fact, last trip to WDW in october, I had only my passport, drivers license, health card and one credit card - plus my cash - in a money belt thingy around my neck. I carried on a ziploc bag with some moisturizer, a chapstick, nasal spray and eyedrop (to combat the in-flight dryness). I had tissue in my pockets. I had a small novel to read in my hand. Normally I am a high-maintenance gal who daily carries a purse the size of a small suitcase. But if I can do it, anyone can (not counting kiddies and people with medical conditions). There is absolutely nothing that I would pack in my suitcase that I would care gets lost - if I did, it would stay at home. Flying/travelling to another country is NOT a right but a privilege and I for one take that seriously. I certainly hope the person sitting in the seat next to me does too - or else get off my flight.

 

[goofieslonglostsis]

The problem is you are not any safer by these new rules.

-Stay seated the last hour -- a terrorist will simply act 90 minutes before landing.

-No blankets -- a terrorist can use a hoodie sweatshirt with a big pockets to hide what he is doing.

-No IFE/GPS or updates on location -- a terrorist can just look out the window or use his watch.

All our "enhanced security" only really provides the illusion of security. Security has not improved one bit since 9/11, only inconvenienced millions of Americans. This recent terrorist was on a terrorist watch list, had a valid US Visa, and his father even warned the US Embassy he may try to attack. Yet nothing was done, he was not given secondary screening in AMS, the APIS (Advance Passenger Information System) did not flag him as a threat, nor was his Visa was not revoked by the US Embassy. Simply Pathetic!

So go ahead and give up your coke if it makes you feel safer, I'd much rather have real safety.

I agree with a lot you are saying, except the stuff I've bolded.

Nobody flying out of AMS into the US gets onto the plane without at least 1 security check. The infamous extra checks before one can enter the extra secured gate waiting area especially used for US-bound flights. Nobody can enter that area without first being personally questioned (and yes, they will seperate adults travelling together regularly). After that? One has to pass through a detection poort, like used at any US airport. During this time, carry on lugguge will also again be screened. Nobody gets into the gate waiting area and therefor onboard without passing these checkpoints.

If somebody originates their travel to the US at AMS or flies into AMS from within another Schengen-country and then connects onto a US-bound flight, they'll have to go through these same procedures twice. These are just the measures the 'average' traveler sees. Behind the screens ALL flightlists are checked and rechecked. Secondary screening can be part of this, with 'thanks' to the US putting tremendous pressure on amongst others the EU. The US themselves screened the passenger list and cleared it before the flight took off. What more would one have expected AMS security to do?

 

[FireDancer]

I don't think the no bathroom rule would last very long and neither will the no electronics rule. There are often things that are done that do nothing to enhance security and these are some of them. The no liquid rule won't go away because the airports and merchants make way too much selling you those things after security. I have no problem taking off my shoes and think sending them through an x-ray might find something hidden in them. It is more about discouraging the use of the shoe for anything then catching someone try. A terrorist won't hide a bomb in his shoe since it is being x-rayed. Sure, we may never find a bomb in a show but that is because it is known that we are looking for them.

That isn't to say that I think no new measures should be enforced. I like the new scanning systems they are using and would be in favor of multi-factor systems that are not only scanners but also look for chemical signatures. Along with that I would increase the behavior profiling.

I hope it is all figured out before my next international flight which will probably be in Sept 2011...Germany, here I come.

 

[NHdisneylover]

This is a moot point now that the rule has been lifted.

I get that the rule was a knee jerk reaction and not really going to make anyone safer. For that reason it was quite annoying. I am glad that I was not flying while the rule was in effect. I like being able to read or work puzzles during that last hour and I greatly prefer to use the restroom whenever I want. However. . .

I drink a lot of water on flights, and always have to go to the bathroom way too often--even on land. But I still think I could go that hour (goodness, I have had to wait more than that for turbulence several times). Keep an eye on a watch, limit a bit 2 hours before the end of the flight and make sure you go just a bit more than an hour out. It is possibe. If your child is too little to handle it--consider a pull up just for the end of the flight. They will not be scarred for life.

I still have to get in that even kids can fly without half their belongings on board. Really, they can. My kids have never had more than they could carry themselves in a backpack since they were toddlers (as babies I pretty much carried just diapers, sippy cup, and change of clothes). The only eletronics either has ever had are DS11's iPOD and now DD13 will carry her new Kindle (lighter than several books). Kids can handle long flights without DVDs, music, etc. and they CAN handle an hour without anything from home if their parents engage them. Doesn't anyone else ever do any of the following with their families anymore?:
play 20 questions
tell stories (fairy tales, about your childhood, Greek myths, etc. etc.)
play the tell a story one sentence at a time game
play I spy
play peek a boo or ten little piggies with the littlest ones
play the I'm going on vacation game
do hand jives
just talk

I don't know. It just seems from reading several threads about this today that the assumption is that people have lost the ability to entertain themselves. Maybe this is a valuable skill we need to get back. Off my soapbox now

 

[uva185]

I agree with a lot you are saying, except the stuff I've bolded.

Nobody flying out of AMS into the US gets onto the plane without at least 1 security check. The infamous extra checks before one can enter the extra secured gate waiting area especially used for US-bound flights. Nobody can enter that area without first being personally questioned (and yes, they will seperate adults travelling together regularly). After that? One has to pass through a detection poort, like used at any US airport. During this time, carry on lugguge will also again be screened. Nobody gets into the gate waiting area and therefor onboard without passing these checkpoints.

If somebody originates their travel to the US at AMS or flies into AMS from within another Schengen-country and then connects onto a US-bound flight, they'll have to go through these same procedures twice. These are just the measures the 'average' traveler sees. Behind the screens ALL flightlists are checked and rechecked. Secondary screening can be part of this, with 'thanks' to the US putting tremendous pressure on amongst others the EU. The US themselves screened the passenger list and cleared it before the flight took off. What more would one have expected AMS security to do?

I apologize, you misunderstood my terminology.

By "secondary screening" I meant when he was screened in AMS he was not pulled aside for a more thorough screening including a pat down and a swab of his luggage for explosive elements.

I do not fault AMS security. I fault the US for not placing him as a "threat" or "suspicious person" on the APIS which would have triggered the aforementioned "secondary screening" or denial of boarding.

 

[bumbershoot]

I'll find out in about 5 hours what happened in the last hour of the flight, but I know that after going through all the security etc, today in Narita airport they called people for boarding about an hour before the flight, and searched people and bags, again, by hand, before they could board the flight (straight to the US). NWAirlines. Guess I should go to sleep now so I can wake in a couple hours to go pick up DH and get the full scoop!

 

[Muhlenberg]

The whole security issue and how we handle it annoys me. They really need to do behavioral analysis/screening/INTERVIEWING rather than the knee-jerk reaction things that they currently employ. I understand that the public EXPECTS a reaction from TSA after there is an incident. However, they need to use their heads about it.

About once a year I take my parents to FL for a vacation. They are now 85, so I'm not sure how much longer we'll be doing that. I have had TSA agents expect an 80+ year old to get up out of a wheel chair (while they're literally sick) to walk through the metal detector after removing a belt, shoes, money, wallet, etc from the pockets. I kid you not. Is this a person who is a threat to Homeland Security?! No!!! They, like the rest of us, must remove their shoes. Are they a threat to society if they don't? No! But, we have to do the whole routine, just like everyone else. They then have to struggle to put themselves back together after going through security. The 3 of us together LOOK (and ARE) an all-American family with old people near the end of life, just trying to enjoy life to its fullest.

My DH needs to use a CPAP. He ALWAYS has to go through the separate line where they "thoroughly" examine it. I kind of appreciate them examining something that "looks to be the right size/shape" of something other than what it is. He and I also don't look like a threat to anyone. Maybe they'd like to run away, though, when he starts telling jokes.

Perhaps TSA should employ more psychologist/behavioral criminologist type personnel. Perhaps they should study how Israel approaches the airport security issue. But I realize that their approach may not be politically correct, and may use profiling and infringe on our "rights."

Just food for thought. OK...off my soapbox now.

 

[bumbershoot]

I have had TSA agents expect an 80+ year old to get up out of a wheel chair (while they're literally sick) to walk through the metal detector after removing a belt, shoes, money, wallet, etc from the pockets. I kid you not. Is this a person who is a threat to Homeland Security?! No!!!

Why wouldn't that person be a threat? Who's to say what's in their heart?

My FIL was 79 when he died. He was part of WW2, Korea, Vietnam, refused to be part of the first Gulf War, but then came back for the "second", in one way or the other (Navy, Merchant Marines, civilian main guy on those military support ships you see anchored off of San Francisco). And he traveled a whole lot. And he was beyond fine with being screened. He didn't think that just being older, or being a veteran, etc etc, would keep him from having dastardly thoughts.

 

[fla4fun]

I don't know. It just seems from reading several threads about this today that the assumption is that people have lost the ability to entertain themselves. Maybe this is a valuable skill we need to get back. Off my soapbox now

That's all well and good if you are traveling with someone - having a conversation would be enough entertainment for me. But most of my flying is solo - no one to talk to unless I talk to a stranger, which isn't always an appealing option (depending on nearby seatmates). I really count on having good IFE or a good book to keep me occupied during a flight.

I'm still hoping they will relax the carry on rules as well. I had been planning a trip to England for late 2010, and I typically fly business class so I can take two carry ons and no checked luggage. I don't mind checking bags on the return - but I have no desire to keep hand washing the same two outfits for a week on vacation because my other bag went missing. It would help if international carryons weren't restricted to smaller size and weight than domestic carryons.

 

[NHdisneylover]

going through security. The 3 of us together LOOK (and ARE) an all-American family with old people near the end of life, just trying to enjoy life to its fullest.

If all terrorists looked like terrorists (what does that mean anyway? I can think of many terrorsits of different ethnicities and "looks" from just my lifetime) TSA would have an easy job wouldn't they? An elderly person, or a child, or anyone else who looks harmless could be a terrorist or be used by a terrorist. If we do not screen everybody, then the terrorists will learn quickly who to use to get things through security (85 year olds in wheel chairs for example).

That's all well and good if you are traveling with someone - having a conversation would be enough entertainment for me. But most of my flying is solo - no one to talk to unless I talk to a stranger, which isn't always an appealing option (depending on nearby seatmates). I really count on having good IFE or a good book to keep me occupied during a flight.

I'm still hoping they will relax the carry on rules as well. I had been planning a trip to England for late 2010, and I typically fly business class so I can take two carry ons and no checked luggage. I don't mind checking bags on the return - but I have no desire to keep hand washing the same two outfits for a week on vacation because my other bag went missing. It would help if international carryons weren't restricted to smaller size and weight than domestic carryons.

I agree it is much harder alone--or when you are seated seperatly. As I said, I much prefer to have acess to my book, puzzles, etc. However, I saw a number of posts on this board and the CB which essentially acted as if sitting for an hour without outside entertainment was torture--and many, many which acted as if a child could not possibly be expected to get through that hour without breaking down entirely. It irks me that we are so in need of constant entertainment that we cannot sigh and think it is annoying and move on without throwing a huge fit about it--that's all (not that YOU were throwing a fit--I don't think you were).

I fly internationally quite often. I am the opposite of you and would like to see the small carry on size enforced more heavily than it is. I do not think people need nearly so much in flight and it clutters the cabin, slows the boarding process and slows down security. I guess I figure if luggage goes missing for more than a day or two (yes, it has happened to me--but it is not so common as many people seem to think) I can decide to either spend some money (and time) acquiring new things or I can handwash in the hotel. It is just a hazzard of travel.

 

[bavaria]

I fly internationally quite often. I am the opposite of you and would like to see the small carry on size enforced more heavily than it is. I do not think people need nearly so much in flight and it clutters the cabin, slows the boarding process and slows down security. I guess I figure if luggage goes missing for more than a day or two (yes, it has happened to me--but it is not so common as many people seem to think) I can decide to either spend some money (and time) acquiring new things or I can handwash in the hotel. It is just a hazzard of travel.

What she said.

Yes, yes, I am a big mean foreign poopyhead, we all know that, and how long have you all been sick of me saying that it was time to enforce carry on size in America?

And how long have so many of you whinged about the lack of bin space on domestic US flights?

People cannot have it all. On flights outside America gate turn time is so quick and boarding so stressless due to the lack of bin space issues and people trying to preboard or push ahead to secure bin space.

And I fly alone 95% of the time. I carry this wonderful, portable device with which to entertain myself. It is called a brain. It works wonderfully, and tells me all sorts of stories, recites poetry, creates travelogues, and otherwise provides me with hours of cost free entertainment.

 

[bavaria]

If all terrorists looked like terrorists (what does that mean anyway?

All blonde German women will now be subject to extra screening at the airport thanks to one of our most notorious terrorist leaders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gudrun_Ensslin