It really annoys me how people sterotype the Americans as DUMB!

[angel659]

Hi

I am rather annoyed at the moment. My dad always moans about how the americans are up thier own bum and but dumb at the same time.

I was forwarded a video today about a women who didnt know what european country the capital of Budapest was in. She basically thought Europe was a country of its own and asked is France a country.

Ok its all rather simple to us and seems to be easy and dumb. What annoys me is that thier education is different to ours. We only study europe because its literally on our door step. We never studied America at all. I wouldnt even have a clue what were states or where places where until now.

I dont understand why people cant accept that they cant stereotype people or countries like that. I argued that the american nurses are like junior doctors, the best doctors are in America etc..... How can a country be classed as dumb only because they show these people.

I said that where we live I am sure people wouldnt know where Budapest was.

Sorry about the rant. I have so many american friends and it annoys me that people are like this. Especially my parents of all people. Not only that my dad having a Masters Degree should know better surely?????

 

[mark&sue]

I totally agree with you Michelle.

Can't wait to get back to the states


susan

 

[Booknut]

I love America and Americans and would never stop going there, its a great country and I love every principle that country was founded on.

However... as a Canadian growing up next door to our 'big brother' I have to say that in general, Americans are very VERY poorly educated. Across the board, including at college. Obviously not everyone is 'dumb' and there are millions of exceptions to the rule. But i've lost track of the number of times i've met Americans throughout my life who have no clue AT ALL about Canada. I mean, we're attached to them, share a gigantic border, have almost identical cultures and yet i've been asked stupid questions about igloos, moose, lumberjacks, saying 'eh' a lot (although to be fair I do end a lot of my sentences with 'eh'!) etc. And don't get me started on Quebec and explaining the French thing...

Most of the time we take it in good fun but seriously, we only have 10 provinces and 3 territories, not so hard to remember. If it weren't for ice hockey I doubt most Americans could name 3 Canadian cities. Seriously.

To a very large extent its a failing of their educational system. But its also a bit of lack of interest in learning about the world around them.

Having said all this I still love them and I wouldn't say Americans are 'dumb'. But there is an ignorance towards the world around them that is quite endemic in their culture. I guess we'll all just have to go over more often and teach them a bit about us

 

[DisneyJo]

It is silly to stereotype any country as there are dumb people and very clever people in all countries. The same as each country will have nice and nasty people. I'm not really sure what I'm saying but hope YKWIM

 

[wideeyes]

We did quite alot about the USA, in school.

It is amazing how little some Americans know about outside there own country however it does not make them dumb it just a culture difference.

 

[rpbert1]

Here in Northern Ireland catholic schools learn about Irish history while protestant schools learn all about British history, so protestant children basically know nothing or very very littleabout the history of the country we live in, all be it a very small island, so you cannot call people dumb just because the education system decides it is not relevant to their teaching.

 

[Jakey Rowling]

I think it's all relative, you have to think about the size of the country.

Our local news is pretty limited, our national news is maybe state size.
Their national news is maybe European size, how many of us pay attention to news from other parts of Europe.
There is a limit as to how much folk will sit and watch news to keep up with current affairs for example.
I would say that the "typical" American tourist you might meet over here is not representative.

I'll might admit to being pretty ignorant of world affairs at times but I will make the effort to find out things before travel somewhere and there is maybe an attitude difference there.

However I would object to you saying that "american nurses are like junior doctors, the best doctors are in America etc."
Why do you think that is the case, because that's as guilty a stereotype as you are objecting to and not true in my opinion.

 

[rpbert1]

Here in Northern Ireland catholic schools learn about Irish history while protestant schools learn all about British history, so protestant children basically know nothing or very very littleabout the history of the country we live in, all be it a very small island, so you cannot call people dumb just because the education system decides it is not relevant to their teaching.
I love going over for our holidays, people are friendly, courteous and the service you recieve is excellent.

 

[wils]

My British room mate at Uni couldn't locate Italy on the map (even when we talked about it being a big boot)

She was studying to be a Geography teacher!!!

My Dad is big on the whole stereotype thing too - it does my head in!

 

[angel659]

However I would object to you saying that "american nurses are like junior doctors, the best doctors are in America etc."
Why do you think that is the case, because that's as guilty a stereotype as you are objecting to and not true in my opinion.

First of all I work with Consultants who has worked in Dubai, Middle East, America and England. All with different cultures. Most of them if not all of them has said that the best "docotors" are in America. Mainly due to the pay and the resources in which they have that we do not have. As stated by my Consultants that many people has flown to America to seek expertise help in illness or operations that we do not have the knowledge about. Not only that I know quite a few Senior House Officers who has relocated to the states for a better life other than working for the NHS. Ok we do have some excellent surgeons in this country I do not deny this. Having spoke to so many and experiencing doctors in USA when my mum was ill shows. I have worked in A&E, MAU, SAU and my own ward. I have seen many screw ups and many miracles. Medical treatment being denied because of funding, medication being denied because of funding, medical treatment being denied because of resources, the list continues.........................

Ok now about the nurse statement. Again I have friends who work in LA. I have colleagues who has either again worked or relcoated. Or they themselves has friends who work out there. Many of them again has worked over the world. Said by far this country is the worst!!! Not only for the hospital cleanliness, standard of general nursing in the country. For instance our nurses are diploma based. American nurses, phillipino nurses, Canadian nurses are all degree based. Working with my colleagues who has either or friends has explained thier job spec. Since when can a english nurse give fluids when a patients blood pressure is in thier shoes, a patient is having a hypo we cant give out certain medication without doctors signature first that was not responding to general hypo stop, patient is in urine retention we can not either give fluids or adjust the fluid intake again the list goes on. Our nurses are based on social nursing i.e social care, care plans, etc..... thier nursing is more psychological, physics etc.... I.e if a patient is in urine rention you need to why and what is causing it. If the blood pressure is low again why and what is causing it. You can treat this yourself without calling the doctor if you are a (UK terms-Senior Nurse) (AKA - Licensed Practioner in the States). To be able to nurse in the States I would have to pass an exam called NCLEX. Which is a hard and very much a complicated exam. Without this you are not allowed to nurse. You have to be registered in thier State as well to be allowed to nurse. Not only does the NCLEX ask you certain questions its very broad and covers alot from mental illness to life threatening illness.

This is why I feel that nurses and doctors are generally better, because they have had the training or the resources are better. I would not of said a statement without having first hand knowledge or at least other peoples experiences. Many nurses are leaving and I think there are 5 who has relocated to Australia and USA within the last 3 months. Does this tell you something.

I am not stereotyping at all. I was explaining to my dad how come this is whats the case! How can they be dumb when they have this much knowledge etc..... I will not change my statement. There are excellent nurses in this country I do not disagree, but they are still limited. This is due to the poor funding of the goverment. The education system needs to be more physical, psycological instead of writing essays regarding.......... close you eyes and listen to the noises what do you hear. Design a poster in how you advertise this.

Hope this answers your question. This isnt meant to sound rude or anything its hard to put your point across when it comes to writing it.

 

[carolfoy]

I'm pretty sure that their lack of knowledge of outside their own country just stems from the fact that their own country is so vast it takes years to teach them about that! Geography lessons don't seem to teach countries and capitals any more, I can remember my own being full of crop rotation and weather patterns whereas I wanted to learn about cultures, sights and 'where' everywhere was!
My ex husband was educated in Scotland and was taught an awful lot of history, he could name every king and queen and their reigning period, My own education of history was almost entirely world war 2 based. Maybe the curriculums are to blame for that?
I think as well that the rich/poor divide when it comes to education is probably larger in the states so better off families are the only ones who can afford the sort of education that leads them to be acknowledged as 'the best' in their field.

 

[angel659]

I agree Carol. My geography was terrible. I had to count how many people went into certain shops and draw the shop fronts. I wanted to learn more about places and culture etc.. It certainly does depend on certain places and education system.

 

[T16GEM]

It is silly to stereotype any country as there are dumb people and very clever people in all countries. The same as each country will have nice and nasty people. I'm not really sure what I'm saying but hope YKWIM

Exactly!

Having said that I do remember a very funny moment at Congo River Golf once when a couple of Americans were infront of us and they started talking to us, and asked where we were from we replied England and they said "what language do y'all speak there?"

 

[Hotdoggie1977]

Ok as an american, I have to say there are a lot of people here that are dumb. Overall though I think most people in the world are dumb

A lot of americans are stuck in their own little world. They dont want to learn or even think of things outside of the U.S. Heck most dont even want to learn of stuff happening in the states.
On the "Tonight show with Jay leno" he has a segment where he goes around the streets of L.A and asks basic questions. Alot of the answers you get are so stupid.

We have lots of dumb people but also alot of very smart people. Just like any other country.

 

[Andy B]

First of all I work with Consultants who has worked in Dubai, Middle East, America and England. All with different cultures. Most of them if not all of them has said that the best "docotors" are in America. Mainly due to the pay and the resources in which they have that we do not have. As stated by my Consultants that many people has flown to America to seek expertise help in illness or operations that we do not have the knowledge about. Not only that I know quite a few Senior House Officers who has relocated to the states for a better life other than working for the NHS. Ok we do have some excellent surgeons in this country I do not deny this. Having spoke to so many and experiencing doctors in USA when my mum was ill shows. I have worked in A&E, MAU, SAU and my own ward. I have seen many screw ups and many miracles. Medical treatment being denied because of funding, medication being denied because of funding, medical treatment being denied because of resources, the list continues.........................

Ok now about the nurse statement. Again I have friends who work in LA. I have colleagues who has either again worked or relcoated. Or they themselves has friends who work out there. Many of them again has worked over the world. Said by far this country is the worst!!! Not only for the hospital cleanliness, standard of general nursing in the country. For instance our nurses are diploma based. American nurses, phillipino nurses, Canadian nurses are all degree based. Working with my colleagues who has either or friends has explained thier job spec. Since when can a english nurse give fluids when a patients blood pressure is in thier shoes, a patient is having a hypo we cant give out certain medication without doctors signature first that was not responding to general hypo stop, patient is in urine retention we can not either give fluids or adjust the fluid intake again the list goes on. Our nurses are based on social nursing i.e social care, care plans, etc..... thier nursing is more psychological, physics etc.... I.e if a patient is in urine rention you need to why and what is causing it. If the blood pressure is low again why and what is causing it. You can treat this yourself without calling the doctor if you are a (UK terms-Senior Nurse) (AKA - Licensed Practioner in the States). To be able to nurse in the States I would have to pass an exam called NCLEX. Which is a hard and very much a complicated exam. Without this you are not allowed to nurse. You have to be registered in thier State as well to be allowed to nurse. Not only does the NCLEX ask you certain questions its very broad and covers alot from mental illness to life threatening illness.

This is why I feel that nurses and doctors are generally better, because they have had the training or the resources are better. I would not of said a statement without having first hand knowledge or at least other peoples experiences. Many nurses are leaving and I think there are 5 who has relocated to Australia and USA within the last 3 months. Does this tell you something.

I am not stereotyping at all. I was explaining to my dad how come this is whats the case! How can they be dumb when they have this much knowledge etc..... I will not change my statement. There are excellent nurses in this country I do not disagree, but they are still limited. This is due to the poor funding of the goverment. The education system needs to be more physical, psycological instead of writing essays regarding.......... close you eyes and listen to the noises what do you hear. Design a poster in how you advertise this.

Hope this answers your question. This isnt meant to sound rude or anything its hard to put your point across when it comes to writing it.

A very full post with interesting points but some seem to contradict.

If we were so bad here how could doctors and nurses easily relocate to other countries.

Saying the life for doctors or nurses is better for them in the US does not mean they must be better.

You complain about lack of treatment here due to funding but I think you are comparing to privately funded care in the US, for those without insurance provisions in the US their treatment is more restricted.

 

[Jakey Rowling]

... stuff deleted

Hope this answers your question. This isnt meant to sound rude or anything its hard to put your point across when it comes to writing it.

I dont agree with all that you said but that's getting off topic and it's only my opinion anyway.

The point I was trying to make was that while it is not right to make sweeping statements about a nation because of ones experience, neither is it right to make sweeping statements about a whole employment sector and the individuals in it.

Back on topic.
Go and ask your Dad to name a few american state capitals, it's roughly equivalent to knowing european capitals for americans.
Florida - Tallahassee, Idaho - Boise, Michigan - Lansing, New York - Albany, New Hampshire - Concord

See if that takes him down a few pegs.

 

[angel659]

I dont agree with all that you said but that's getting off topic and it's only my opinion anyway.

The point I was trying to make was that while it is not right to make sweeping statements about a nation because of ones experience, neither is it right to make sweeping statements about a whole employment sector and the individuals in it.

Back on topic.
Go and ask your Dad to name a few american state capitals, it's roughly equivalent to knowing european capitals for americans.
Florida - Tallahassee, Idaho - Boise, Michigan - Lansing, New York - Albany, New Hampshire - Concord

See if that takes him down a few pegs.

I have done that. See what he comes up with.

Anyway I think we will have to agree to disagree. I work as a nurse and see the difference in nursing between countries. From a job specification and other peoples working experience. My point is not that our nurses are crap! Point blank, on the contray. I am saying that the nursing education is much better in the USA for nursing. For me to move and nurse in America is very hard. Without being able to pass this NCLEX I wouldnt even be able to nurse in America. The curriculum in this country is more social based rather than science based. If you get what I mean. I dont know if you have seen the questions on NCLEX, but its very tough. Whether your a nurse yourself. I am not making a statement. I am talking on education purposes and certainly many people seek America's help when they hear news that thier cancer can not be cured.

Anyway its well off topic now and I didnt come here to be flamed at. I was putting across an argument between my dad and I. This is what I used as ammo along with capitals of America. I came here to vent and not to get involved in arguement with someone else. In future I think I will keep all opinions of mine and any arguements that I feel very strong about to myself too myself.

 

[angel659]

A very full post with interesting points but some seem to contradict.

If we were so bad here how could doctors and nurses easily relocate to other countries.

Saying the life for doctors or nurses is better for them in the US does not mean they must be better.

You complain about lack of treatment here due to funding but I think you are comparing to privately funded care in the US, for those without insurance provisions in the US their treatment is more restricted.

See your point, but the people who are relocating are Phillipinos (American based nursing) easier for them to pass the NCLEX ours is english nursing hence the NCLEX is rather scary and hard to pass. Indian nurses who has nursed in Dubai or phillipino nurses that also has nursed in Dubai. For instance Indian nurses has to pass a local exam after thier nursing degree, because they are employed by the 'government'. Even though they passed thier exams they still have to pass others to be able to nurse. Canadian nurses is also American based nursing. A couple of colleagues of mine who are either Arabic or Irish has moved to the USA, Australia or Canada itself to nurse. So its not as easy to relocate and nurse as it sounds in my post. Hence why it is rather hard to put your points and values across in writing when its a very complicated system.

I am talking about funding mainly when it falls down to catchment areas. Certain people are not allowed certain anti cancerous drugs, because of the hospitals funding issues. They have to either move to another area or basically go without. Especially for breast cancer some of the medications are rather expensive and not all hospitals are able to fund these. I think the NHS has some serious sorting out to do. For instance my hospital had over twenty matrons who walked on a ward once a week for 5 minutes. They went to bed meetings, organising budgets etc.... Eventually they learned that matrons were not needed and it was a waste of money to keep them on. Instead of redundancy they created new posts for them. Our matron now works on flexi bank. She basically manages the office. She is on the same money as before, that means she earns more money than my Ward Manager who works all the hours without getting any extra money, because the hospital can not afford to pay her overtime. She now does what the matron did. There are lots of problems in the NHS. There is so much beauocracy its unbelievable.

I am not saying because life is so much better makes them better. Its education I am talking about. Not general skills etc.... Its really hard to compare the two without you seeing both sides or hearing both sides from other nurses. Life is better i.e they nurse no more than 3-5 unlike my hospital the nurse is responsible for 13 patients. That can make it stressful. Many patients has questioned me who is my named nurse today. They dont get to see them like we used to, all down to paperwork. The future doesnt look any better. I dont feel looking after 13 patients can be safe practice, compared to the states. Also the job specification of a Licensed Practioner (Comparable to Senior staff nurse that we do not have anymore) has more responsibilities.

I will try and re-write what I meant. Due to UK and US different circumstances i.e money, education and job specification USA nurses are not dumb. The nurse training is harder than the UK, but this doesnt make the US nurses better than UK nurses. It only means you cant be dumb to pass the nurse or doctor training in the first place. So how can my dad write a statement that Americans are dumb. I hope this explains it better.

 

[angel659]

duplicated post.