I don't understand why its such a big deal to take your children out of school..

[C.Ann]

We're talking about WDW, not Rome. I can picture it now. Telling HS and MS teachers that we want our kids excused for educational purposes. AK for science. Epcot for History and Geography. MGM for Comm Arts. MK for Phys Ed.

--------------------

Now we're all the way up to MS and HS students? Did you mention this before - or is it only now?

MS and HS "might" have to be handled differently - depending on the students capabilities..

 

[graygables]

Why can't I? I think I have earned how to raise my child and he (nor I) should have to suffer for loser parents who don't care about their kids (in this scenario).

Sadly, you can't b/c the schools are being dumbed down to the lowest common denominator, they have assumed the role of the parent, so the unreasonable rules follow. In the PC environment that public schools TRY to create, no one can be treated differently, and if Johnny only has 24 crayons, your little Susie can't have 64, it just wouldn't be "fair".

 

[urglewurgle]

Why can't I? I think I have earned how to raise my child and he (nor I) should have to suffer for loser parents who don't care about their kids (in this scenario).

rules are rules... now, no-one is saying you aren't an excellent parent... that isn't what this is about... the rules are there to protect all children, especially those who's parents may not be as "good" as yourself...

and anyway... school holidays are the correct time to take your kids away... during school term time, they should be in school...

in the uk the parent's can be jailed for not having thier kids in school... i agree kids need to continue their learning outside of the classroom.. but this should be as an addittion and not instead....

 

[urglewurgle]

and.. if you are that bothered about taking your child out of school during term time.. i'm sure a private school would be more accommodating... other schools don't have the funding to pander to every parents' needs...

 

[WIcruizer]

Now we're all the way up to MS and HS students? Did you mention this before - or is it only now?

Yes...several times in this 20 page epic saga.

 

[leighe]

Why can't I? I think I have earned how to raise my child and he (nor I) should have to suffer for loser parents who don't care about their kids (in this scenario).

Because there would be lawsuits flying all over (like there aren't enough as it is) if school policies were enforced differently for different students. The schools are asked to do so much in addition to education (counseling, intervention, tutoring, mentoring) and therefore have so much liability that the rules have to apply to everyone. I am terrified sometimes when I think of the liability I have as a teacher. Here is an example of how often teachers are asked to do the impossible. I have a student that threw a desk across my room and stormed out of the classroom last year. Should I have gone after her? If I left my classroom then I was liable for anything that may have happened in the room during my absence - another student getting hurt during a fight, for example or some kid having some kind of accident. On the other hand, the student who stormed out is my responsibility during that class so if she had run out in the parking lot and gotten run over I could also be held responsible for that because she was supposed to be under my supervision. (And this girl definitely had the kind of mother that would have sued the entire school system if something like that had happened.) It is that kind of no-win situation that leads schools to have to create such stringent rules and policies.

Sorry to get so OT.

 

[DisneyDotty]

There are a lot of people out there who do a job not because of the pay, but because it is what they want to do.

And amen to that! Thank goodness there are many, many teachers who chose that PROFESSION because they love kids, love their subject area, etc. I wouldn't want my children stuck in a classroom with someone who became a teacher only because he/she couldn't find anything better, and hey, the pay isn't all that bad, there's a decent pension, etc...

 

[TheWog]

I'm not saying that I am better than anyone else, but when you start with the "this kid is a problem so all should suffer" that is where I have issue. I know why the rules are there. I know not all children are the same. I did send my son to a private school for 3 years. We recently moved school districts and now the public school is so much better than our old district and my son asked to go there, we toured the school, met with administrators and teachers and he is now in public schools. I like the response about the dumbing down of our school systems because that is what it is. At our old public school he would have been pushed aside and left to fend for himself because he was a not a problem child or a case that needed to have attention devoted to him. That is also not fair. So I weighed my options, and fortunately I have the means to send him to a private school that would properly educate him. Now we also have a public school that will properly educate him and all the other children in his classroom. We are those annoying parents who participate. I coach his sports teams, DW is the Mom who bakes and volunteers in class, we have an ongoing email relationship with the teacher for any questions or issues we have and don't remember to ask about while in the school.

I understand the rules, but he is 8 years old. I can certainly teach him anything at this point that he needs and help him catch up with any missed work. We took him out of 1st grade for a week for our Disney Cruise and he survived. Once he is older and the workload is such we will certainly consider going only on school vacation times or during the summer, but for now I am sure he will certainly remember the week he spent with his parents at WDW or on St. Thomas or St. Maarten vs. the single digit addition worksheet he missed out on, but later made up.

 

[MrsPete]

I believe teachers aren't treated as professionals, because they often don't ACT like professionals. Why have unions if your professionals?

I think teachers aren't treated as professionals because they work with children. As a group, children in America are not valued (beyond thier worth as consumers); thus, the people who work with them are not considered as important as other professionals.

Also, there's the widespread (and incorrect) idea that because we were all students at one point, we all know what goes on in school and we can all do it. This brings teaching down to the level of waitressing or other menial labor jobs; if "everyone" can do these things, where's the value?

Finally, teachers' unions are not widespread. They're non-existant in the South. They are prevalent only in the Northeast, which, ironically, is really the only area of the country with a glut of unemployed teachers.

 

[MrsPete]

I don't think anyone here has said they would pull a child out of school that was struggling or perhaps couldn't catch up with what was missed.

No one ADMITS it, but believe me, an amazing number of people do it! Then they don't understand why the child spends the rest of the semester trying to catch up and earning only below-average grades.

It happens more than you'd believe.

 

[MrsPete]

We use a charter e-school and *I* get the check for the $2100 per student per year to spend as I please for them...including WDW tickets (field trip) . . . Just a thought...athletic programs should not be funded by taxpayer dollars.

Charter schools are a whole different animal. Since yours is an e-school, I assume there's no expense for a building, parking lots, busses, etc. That's a huge savings over the typical public school. I'm sure they don't provide the level of special ed services that the public schools have available; it's just not possible.

I disagree with your opinion about athletic programs. Athletics provides an opportunity for success for some kids who have not experienced success in other areas of their lives. Being on "the team" keeps some kids in school. Since athletes are required to maintain an above-average GPA, many kids work harder than they would if athletics didn't exist. Athletics boosts school spirit. Athletics provides a healthy, positive activity for kids who might otherwise be roaming the streets (or simply sitting in front of the TV); a friend of mine whose son played literally every sport offered by our high school once told me something wise: Any teen with hormones needs to be kept busy; sports is one way to do this. And with everyone worrying about our children becoming obese, it provides a healthy outlet for physical activity. I'm not saying that PE class should replace reading, but it's important. There's ample evidence that kids who get adequate exercise do better in their academic classes. Athletic teams encourage this and more.

Many kids would not /could not play if the school teams required an outlay of cash. Do we really want public school athletics to become a world of "haves and have nots"? I grew up as a "have not" and I am greatly appreciative of the things that were available to me through the school system.

Would you also cut out art, music, and drama?

 

[urglewurgle]

Also, there's the widespread (and incorrect) idea that because we were all students at one point, we all know what goes on in school and we can all do it. This brings teaching down to the level of waitressing or other menial labor jobs; if "everyone" can do these things, where's the value?

i completely agree... i only left school (at 18) 4 years ago... and i already feel a bit lost when my mother (who teaches 5-7yo's) shows me some of the stuff they do... and it's not just teaching facts at that age.. it's teaching HOW to do things, how to understand things.. it's a difficult thing to do...

and as for waitressing.. i think that a lot of these people who think they're "above" that kind of job would find it very difficult to do...

 

[WIcruizer]

I think teachers aren't treated as professionals because they work with children.

I'll agree with that, I never thought of it that way before. I'm sure that is a part of it.

 

[WIcruizer]

Finally, teachers' unions are not widespread. They're non-existant in the South. They are prevalent only in the Northeast

And the Midwest...and California..pretty much most of the country.

 

[Whatnext?]

wrong thread

 

[MrsPete]

Which is better? Learning *about* Rome from a textbook, or VISITING Rome? They are literally worlds apart.

In theory, the vacation is much better. In reality, I've had only about three students in 14 years of teaching who've missed school to visit places like Rome. The vast majority go to Myrtle Beach (AKA the Redneck Riviera), the race in Daytona, etc.

Additionally, Rome is open year-round. Visiting it during the school year isn't a necessity.

 

[MrsPete]

i agree kids need to continue their learning outside of the classroom.. but this should be as an addittion and not instead....

This is perhaps the best comment on the thread. Travel is one of the many things that benefit children; however, it should be an addition to their education, not an "instead of". 14 years in the classroom tells me that the vast majority of kids who're pulled out of school are getting "instead of".

 

[MrsPete]

and as for waitressing.. i think that a lot of these people who think they're "above" that kind of job would find it very difficult to do...

Well, I did waitress in college, so I know what's involved. It's something that the average person could do -- if they cared to. Feel free to substitute a different low-level profession, if you like.

My point, which I am sure you got, is that many people think teaching is a job that "anyone" can walk right in and do without much preparation. After all, we were all students. And there's a textbook with all the answers in the back!

The truth is that teaching isn't hard because of the material; it's hard because of the constant (and sometimes conflicting) demands, the individual needs of large groups of students, the time constraints, the children who are not receiving adequate parenting, the wide range of abilities in every class, and more. There's no other job I want, but I do hate to see people assume that "anyone" could walk in and take my place tomorrow.

 

[MrsPete]

And the Midwest...and California..pretty much most of the country.

Hmm. I wonder why the Unions send us information telling us how much better teachers have it in the Northeast, which -- according to the union folks -- is the only area of the country where they really have a stronghold.

 

[WIcruizer]

Hmm. I wonder why the Unions send us information telling us how much better teachers have it in the Northeast, which -- according to the union folks -- is the only area of the country where they really have a stronghold.

Not sure. They have a stronghold in MI,WI,IL,MN,IA,OH, etc. and CA. Not sure about every state. But I would guess the reason they talk about the Northeast the most, is the wage scale is probably higher than the Midwest. I'm most familiar with WI, and the vast majority of districts here get a pension, 100% paid for health insurance, no deductible.