How do you feel about this?

Magic Mom

<font color=teal>EVERYONE has the God given right
Joined
Mar 11, 2008
Messages
9,276
On the surface this seems OK. It would help prevent blackouts. But do I really want the state to have control over my home like that? Sure today its set up to use only in emergencies, but once its in place, how easy would it be to increase the control to all the time? Is this omething you think your state should mandate?


State proposes to take control of home temps
By: BRADLEY J. FIKES - Staff Writer
Revision to building standards would make some power conservation mandatory | Monday, January 7, 2008 11:08 PM PST ∞

California utilities would control the temperature of new homes and commercial buildings in emergencies with a radio-controlled thermostat, under a proposed state update to building energy efficiency standards.

Customers could not override the thermostats during "emergency events," according to the proposal, part of a 236-page revision to building standards. The document is scheduled to be considered by the California Energy Commission, a state agency, on Jan. 30.

The description does not provide any exception for health or safety concerns. It also does not define what are "emergency events."

During heat waves, customers crank up the air conditioning, putting severe strains on the state's power supply. By giving utilities the power to automatically adjust power demand by reducing air conditioning, the hope is that more severe interruptions, such as rolling blackouts, can be avoided.

However, both the Utility Consumers Action Network, a consumer rights group, and the Riverside County Chapter of the Building Industry Association said customers should be allowed to override the thermostat.

State and utility spokespersons said utilities will provide health and safety exemptions, although that is not specified in the document. Imminent threats of blackouts would qualify as emergency events, they said. Final adoption of the revised standards is scheduled by April 2009.

The document, available at http://*******.com/225htc, outlines the mandatory use of Programmable Communicating Thermostats on page 64:

"Upon receiving an emergency signal, the PCT shall respond to commands contained in the emergency signal, including changing the set-point by any number of degrees or to a specific temperature set-point. The PCT shall not allow customer changes to thermostat settings during emergency events."

The PCT specifications require them to include a "non-removable Radio Data System device that is compatible with the default statewide DR (Demand Response) communications system, which can be used by utilities to send price and emergency signals."

The mandatory nature of the proposal was described in a Jan. 4 article in the American Thinker, an online political magazine with a conservative bent. The article, which denounced the plan as overly intrusive ---- and economically counterproductive ---- is at http://*******.com/29q2tp.

Michael Shames, UCAN's executive director, called the directive "a stunner" in an e-mail. "These 'advanced' energy technologies have the potential to be used for both good and evil.�It looks like the California Energy Commission wants it both ways ... good and evil."

Shames wrote that allowing external control of thermostats can help customers better manage their energy use, which he supports.

"However, it is repugnant and entirely unacceptable to mandate that the customer loses control over the device that will be mandatorily placed in their homes," Shames wrote.

Borre Winckel, executive officer of the Riverside building association, said the mandatory aspect of the proposal smacks of "Big Brother" governmental planning.

"This is not too different from certain voices we've heard from the water world ... where if somebody were to use too much water, the water agency can (by) remote control turn your water off," he said.

"What's there to keep people from deciding you've had your lights on too long?" Winckel continued. "This really does go very deep into government control into how we lead our lives."

The thermostat control would be exercised only in cases of need, and is the latest refinement of a 30-year-old building energy conservation program, said Adam Gottlieb, a spokesman for the California Energy Commission.

Thanks to efficiency standards, California's demand for electricity has remained flat since the late 1970s even as its population has doubled, Gottlieb said.

Utilities know how to interpret the new mandate, he said, and when to apply it, even though the definitions are not specified in the document.

According to Gottlieb, though, the phrase "emergency events" refers to a Stage II event or higher as defined by the California Independent System Operator, which manages the state's electrical grid.

A Stage II event occurs when electricity reserves, or the surplus of supply over demand, fall below 5 percent. A Stage III event takes place when reserves drop below 1.5 percent, and customer power may be shut down involuntarily.

"Any emergency event would be a limited-time occurrence to prevent an imminent outage," Gottlieb said.

The terms "Stage II" and "Stage III" are not defined in the document, Gottlieb said. "It's more a term of art that the utilities are familiar with."

Rachel Laing, a spokeswoman for San Diego Gas & Electric Co., said the proposals are in the early stage of consideration, and explicit exemptions for health and safety would be adopted later.

"I think you're right, that it doesn't have in this proposal what the exemption criteria would be," Laing said. "This proposal is the start of the whole long process of several hearings, and those hearings are meant to identify issues just like this one. We expect that the final plan will have exemptions."

Laing said SDG&E notifies those with medical needs beforehand of rolling blackouts.

"Their account is flagged, and when we have a rolling blackout, a message is sent out in advance to those folks," Laing said.
 
My DS has Asthma and because of this my home is always colder than normal in order to keep environmental mold at bay and to help his breathing. The notion that I would have to justify myself to some nit-wit behind a desk would drive me up a wall.

What is wrong with people in California, its like they are from another planet? No other State in the Union is as self righteous and self absorbed... I think the voters really need to get those lawmakers out there on a shorter leash. They are running amok.
 
On the surface this seems OK. It would help prevent blackouts. But do I really want the state to have control over my home like that? Sure today its set up to use only in emergencies, but once its in place, how easy would it be to increase the control to all the time? Is this omething you think your state should mandate?

I've got a better idea. Why don't they increase the energy supply?

I won't even suggest new coal or nuclear plants, since they are generally too whacko in their environmentalism. But come on California, lead the way. Show us the wonders of green energy!! Where are all the tidal/wave energy plants? Geothermal plants? Wind farms? Solar energy?

Or are you all a bunch of NIMBY's too?
 
My DS has Asthma and because of this my home is always colder than normal in order to keep environmental mold at bay and to help his breathing. The notion that I would have to justify myself to some nit-wit behind a desk would drive me up a wall.

What is wrong with people in California, its like they are from another planet? No other State in the Union is as self righteous and self absorbed... I think the voters really need to get those lawmakers out there on a shorter leash. They are running amok.

I don't have the medical reason you do, but I like to adjust the temp now and then for whatever reason. I can't imagine how irritating it would be to not have that option.
 

I think it's a horrible idea. One beauty of living in a free country is that I can choose to keep my house at whatever temperature I want, as long as I am willing to pay my electric bill every month. I would move to another state if something like that passed where I live.
 
Thanks for the thread. What an appalling idea! Big Brother indeed!
 
I can't even begin to say how much I would not like that or for how many reasons, not the least of which is "Mind your own business."
 
No way. There are so many what ifs that it shouldnt even be a consideration!
 
Kalifornia has ignored its power and water problems for 40 years. This is what happens when you let people who put politics above practicallity run your government. The next step? More of the same - even more government control.

Those who live on the left coast have been siphoning power and water from sister states for too long. Same goes for cities like Las Vegas, where they might very well have to abandon the entire area in a few years as their water supply runs out.

They all want more water, but there is no more. And they want more power, but they are not willing to build the power plants. Quite a problem...
 
Leave it to the Republic of California to come up with an idea like that!

I agree that they need to come up with more power resources. There are also ways for the individual consumer to conserve, but leaving that control up to the state is insane. I see a promising future in home generator sales out there...
 
No thanks - I'm a big girl and capable of conserving on my own.

Yeah on the surface it seems okay. Then what happens once they've got their foot in the door? It's scary when you think about it - we get closer and closer to being a "Big Brother" nation every day.
 
Een Soviet Russia, Evedy-body has same temperature in home.

Same as outside!

Da?
 
Leave it to the Republic of California to come up with an idea like that!

I agree that they need to come up with more power resources. There are also ways for the individual consumer to conserve, but leaving that control up to the state is insane. I see a promising future in home generator sales out there...

Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if the mayor of Seattle came up with an idea like that. He's not going to be happy until he makes Seattle a nanny city.
 
Leave it to the Republic of California to come up with an idea like that!

I agree that they need to come up with more power resources. There are also ways for the individual consumer to conserve, but leaving that control up to the state is insane. I see a promising future in home generator sales out there...

Nobody is willing to put those resources in their backyard. Can you imagine asking to put wind mills up alomg the coast in Malibu. Those celebrities would have a cow, but their enormous mansions sure use a lot of juice. I wonder how many of them would end up with an exemption to state controlled thermostats??
 
My only response is One word, Two syllables,starts with 'b" ends in "t"

Now if they are gonna also pay the energy bills I woul be able to compromise.

like every thing else there are ALWAYS way around it. :thumbsup2
 
If the problem is too much electrical energy consumption, then that can be readily addressed by the state modifying the state's energy tax rates. There is no need for this high-tech approach.

I've got a better idea. Why don't they increase the energy supply?
Are you volunteering to move next door to a new refinery? :confused3

Show us the wonders of green energy!!
How is that going to help now, when they're actually having the problem? It think it is easy to criticize about lack of foresight, but that still doesn't resolve anything. Unless you're intending to say that they should just suffer. :confused3
 
How about they upgrade all the homes instead! Oh, too expensive, they don't want to do that. In our house, the bedrooms roast while the main floor of the house is always freezing...set on that tropical setting of 68 degrees. :rolleyes: Give me a thermostat for each bedroom and for each floor.

My excitement of what they suggest is as good as my cable company being able to see when someone is on our phone line. :sad2:
 
Like so much in todays world Government and business seem to be controlling so much of our lives. Yes I know they always did but we seem to be losing the war on control of our personal life.

Never mind socialism it's beginning to sound a lot like communism.

When a state or utility company can control the inside temperature of my home, I begin to wonder whats next?
 


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