How can we educate the renters

[Cyril pb]

Hello All

For those of you that have ever rented your points on the rent trade board you how difficult it can be.
I have been working on it for a few weeks now, I have made countless calls to member services, and so many pm’s I am starting to get corporal tunnel syndrome. All for little or no results. I am thinking there are only a few reasons for this difficulty. I have no fixes and though maybe a post where we could all put our heads together including the moderators might do the trick.

The biggest issue I see is that those who plan to rent points from a DVC member are not educated on how the 7 and 11 month window works. The do not know the importance of renting early. If you check the boards you will see people trying to rent rooms in December, January and February.

Another issue I have seen numerous times is the one renting points is not entirely truthful to the DVC member. What I mean by this statement is that for one reason or another they neglect to give all the information on their needs to the member.
There for the member spends a lot of tracking down a room that will not fit there needs. If a renter wants only a studio at the Beach club on a Sunday though Thursday in the first week of April and nothing else, they should let the member know this.

Renter’s need to check their posts and respond to the Member. I have pm’s out They’re where I have found the room at the resort and dates of their request and received no reply. I am thinking they forgot they even made the post and they don’t check their pms.

I am sure there are more issues form other members out their that can be added to this post and I am all for it.

This Post was not ment to be an outlet let for my frustrations, but to get help to make it easier for all of us to rent our points.

Sincerely
Cyril PB

 

[CarolAnnC]

Renting out points is a lot of work for the member and is not something that I desire to ever be involved in, myself.

How about requesting the information from the renter before calling MS to check for them? At least name, address, phone number might weed out those who are not really serious about renting.

Otherwise, it does seem that the person renting will have to keep on calling as part of their rental process to check for their potential customers.

 

[Deb & Bill]

I will second CarolAnnC's comment. Renting is too much work.

If you need to rent out your points, rent them out to people you know. You can sit down with them to iron out the problems. Or give them away if you can't use them.

Bill just reminded me of how bad we were on our first trip. We must have called Disney six times, changing the resort, changing the number of rooms, adding this, adding that, deleting this, deleting that. And this wasn't even a DVC reservation.

 

[DVC Mike]

I agree with the above posts. Renting is a big hassle and not one I want to get involved with. I see posts from folks who say "it is easy" to rent your points, but they don't state how it turns you into a travel agent for those folks uninformed about the DVC program and it's rules. No thanks! I'll bank my points if I can't use them.

 

[JimMIA]

I agree with the above posts. Renting is a big hassle and not one I want to get involved with. I see posts from folks who say "it is easy" to rent your points, but they don't state how it turns you into a travel agent for those folks uninformed about the DVC program and it's rules. No thanks! I'll bank my points if I can't use them.

I have the same attitude as Mike. When we did an add-on, I explored renting the extra points, but it was so time-consuming and frustrating that I abandoned the idea and just banked.

To OP's original question: I think it's very difficult to educate renters to anything, much less the details of how a DVC account works...which unfortunately a lot of OWNERs don't fully understand. Look at the efforts the DIS R/T board team has made just to give renters some common-sense guidelines to avoid fraud...and still, most renters just blindly wander into transactions.

I think the onus has to fall on the owners who rent. They need to be prepared to do some individual tutoring. They should be selective in choosing prospective customers. They should set clear parameters for the types of rentals they will consider.

If I ever try to rent again, I would never start a "Points to Rent" thread. I'd lurk and cherry-pick the "Reservations Wanted" ads by people who a) are planning far in advance, b) at a time of year that minimizes the risks for my UY, and c)who know what they want. I'd leave the high-maintenance renters to others. Even being that selective, there will be no shortage of issues to resolve, but at least I won't be starting out with problems.

 

[Mtnman44]

At least some portion of all of these private "rentals" results in less cash customers for Disney. This increases the amount of unsold DVC held points which increases the costs of exchanges for everyone. we are seeing this now in higher fees and less choice and higher point requirements. Personally, I think this renting thing is devaluing the whole ownership. just my two cents.

 

[dianeschlicht]

At least some portion of all of these private "rentals" results in less cash customers for Disney. This increases the amount of unsold DVC held points which increases the costs of exchanges for everyone. we are seeing this now in higher fees and less choice and higher point requirements. Personally, I think this renting thing is devaluing the whole ownership. just my two cents.

I hadn't thought of it that way, but I suspect you MIGHT be correct. At least to a degree.

I have never rented out points, and I have no intention of ever doing so. As in the earlier post, so few MEMBERS understand the system, there is no way you can teach it to non-members in a short time. Another issue is so many NEW members who don't understand the system trying to rent out points. That makes two virgins in the transaction, and that is definitely a recipe for disaster!

 

[mickeymorse]

I'm sorry to hear about everyones frustrations with renting their points, but not all rentees are unknowledgable about DVC and how it works. I just rented points for this past halloween and I researched on this board for a bit before I jumped in looking for points. I found it to be very frustrating having to deal with another person making reservations on my behalf. Everything worked out in the end but I need to have everything organized and it drove me crazy when the renter wouldn't respond to my PMs/emails/phone calls. I do have to admit that by renting points,I realized how much we liked DVC and are now looking to purchase our own pts. Just waiting for the right contract to come available.

Rob

 

[Cyril pb]

I didn’t wish for this topic to get into a debate on renting points. Or did I wish to imply that those of you who rent points are not knowledgeable in how the system works. I have no doubt that there are DVC members out there that are not business minded. Renting Points is a business transaction and needs to be treated as such. Communication between the buyer and seller must be both parties first priority. With out communication trust will break down. When dealing in a business transaction over the Internet with a complete stranger you must rely on trust. When purchasing into DVC I had no idea that some day I would be renting out some of my points. The truth is that stuff happens, and renting points is the only option.

The reason for this post was to ask for suggestions to make renting out points go a bit smoother. Maybe these suggestions could go on a sticky.
Maybe we could make a renters form that could go on a sticky, I don’t know the answer. I am depending on you all for some help.

Regards
Cyril PB

 

[CarolAnnC]

The Rent/Trade Board already has several sticky posts regarding renting and posting there. This one is of particular interest as well.

We encourage anyone interest in renting points, or renting out their own points for that matter, to review the stickies there.

Some folks as posted above have an indepth knowledge of DVC before inquiring about renting. Other folks don't have a clue and just want to check out renting to see if it is something they are interested in. If you desire to rent out points you must be prepared to put in the time, and the many answers to the many questions that will be asked.

Just ask any travel agent how many clients they need to work with and provide information to, before finding one that puts down the deposit.

I think the DIS provides in depth knowledge here on our DVC Boards and if anyone is so inclined, they can find a wealth of information prior to renting.

 

[Cyril pb]

Dear Carol

The Sticky you were referring to

... ask for and review references for anyone you consider working with on a rental. Ask for home address and home telephone number. Ask for a written contract outlining all details of the rental. Review past posts on the DIS for the person you are working with so you can get an idea what type of person they may be. When possible, use a credit card for payment to provide some possible level of security.

There have been only a few instances where renters have found themselves without the reservation they paid for and in all cases, some (if not all) of the above advice was ignored.

We have recently become aware of another such issue - where a renter has sent payment and is apparently without a reservation. Again, it appears that none of the above suggestions were followed.

Please use due diligence before entering into any agreement and certainly before sending any payment.

For a first hand report of some of the issues involved, please review this thread from last fall.

Buyer Beware.

To read a discussion of these issues, please read the thread by the same title on the DVC Operations Forum.

has absolutely nothing to do with my post or what I am asking for. I have read all of the stickys as well.

Reading your post puzzles me. What are you trying to say? What is your bottom line?

Your input is greatly appreciated.

Sincerely
Cyril PB

 

[Happy Birthday Cat]

I rented points to people on a few occasions about four or five years ago. I find the OP's post to be pretty accurate. After having rented and meeting some very nice people through the renting process, I decided not to rent again because to find those nice people you have to wade through a few who are less than upfront in the first place. It just wasn't worth it to me to ever rent again.

HBC

 

[mickeymorse]

Thanks Cyril. I wasn't trying to debate on renting points either.

Communication between the buyer and seller must be both parties first priority. With out communication trust will break down. When dealing in a business transaction over the Internet with a complete stranger you must rely on trust.

This was exactly my thought. I wish that the person I had dealt with felt the same way. I know from this experience that when and if I ever have to rent out points, this will be the first priority between myself and the other individual.

Rob

 

[DMKEDM]

Ok...I'll give Cyril PB's question a shot:

First...I have rented points once--to a "known quantity"...I call her my "DVC sister"...we both got scammed by the same person (me trying for a transfer, her trying to rent...I learned a LOT (the hard way!) from that experience (including how wonderful the DISBoards folks are--especially Webmaster Doc and JimMIA!)...so I'm not sure my experience "counts"...nothing like sharing your points w/a fellow victim w/whom you've made friends to build trust! But I have come to the conclusion that I may have added on more points than I'll need after the next couple of years are behind us...and if my "DVC Sister" doesn't need those points (she has permanent first tibs on my extra's!), here's what I plan to do:

1. Offer the points at a fixed rate. People who want to pay less will get a very polite "no."

2. Require personal contact (phone, personal email address, address) prior to calling MS...the initial phone/personal email "conversation" will allow us to build "comfort" while determining the renter's needs (whether there's flexibility as to villa size, resort choice, dates, etc.) It will also give us a chance to talk through payment options. Personally, I cannot imagine anything but a "this deal is final" option...I'm not a travel agent. I'm happy to do the phone calls to make the reservations, add DDP, add Magical Express, etc. And I'll even make the calls to try to change things around...but I won't return money if those changes can't be made. And if "life happens" and the renter has to cancel, I'll sympathize; I'll offer to call MS to make the change(s) if the renter can find someone to "subrent" to...but I won't do refunds. Just not worth it to me ... once the deal is done I want it to be final.

3. Tell every person who inquires about my points that nothing is final until payment is made. I'll take a personal check...easy enough to cancel the reservation and get my points back if the check bounces! I will not use PayPal (have been burned w/spam and viruses way too often w/PayPal...won't go near PayPal for anyone for any reason...would rather not rent points!)...so, if the renter is uncomfortable w/me or w/sending me a personal check, so be it. I'm not the person to rent from. Of course, this decision can be made after we talk and establish (or fail to establish) some initial comfort...and I guess in my case it helps that there's a 800+ post thread referenced in the PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE sticky...that gives a pretty good "feel" for the kind of person I am...some people will be comforable with a "me-like" person; others won't. Those who aren't shouldn't rent from me.

4. I told myself each time I bought points that I must not buy those points if I felt like I might "have to" rent them...for me, renting is a possiblity (that I've never "really" used...as noted, the one and only time it was to a friend-albeit an internet friend--who refused to even consider taking the points as a gift); it cannot be a "necessity." I figured out my comfort level, my "boundaries" and limits...after that, I'll just let the chips fall where they may...if no one comes along who's comfortable w/my boundaries and limits, well then I will either give away points (I assume I wouldn't rent unless I couldn't bank), or lose them...I really just won't put myself in a position where I "have to" put up w/people who call 4 or 5 possible "landlords" and then pick the best deal...not that that's bad; it's just a "game" I will not play...

Hope that helps!

Happy holidays--Dani

 

[CarolAnnC]

Dear Carol

The Sticky you were referring to



has absolutely nothing to do with my post or what I am asking for. I have read all of the stickys as well.

Reading your post puzzles me. What are you trying to say? What is your bottom line?

Your input is greatly appreciated.

Sincerely
Cyril PB

In that link I posted is another link to a very long and very important thread for all potential renters to review.

I don't have a "bottom line". I am simply posting my views. You don't have to agree with me of course. But this is not a debate board and argumentative posting will not be allowed.

Thank you.

 

[JimMIA]

Dear Carol

The Sticky you were referring to



has absolutely nothing to do with my post or what I am asking for. I have read all of the stickys as well.

Reading your post puzzles me. What are you trying to say? What is your bottom line?

Your input is greatly appreciated.

Sincerely
Cyril PB

Just a suggestion. This kind of stuff is not likely to ellicit much help from people who know enough to help.

 

[LIFERBABE]

OP, I do understand what you are saying and do feel like there should be a forum for new people to discuss renting. That way the ones that dont rent dont have to be bothered and those that do can provide helpful tips and info on renting.

You cannot even answer a question on the RTB (rent trade board) without being sanctioned so that is definitely not the right forum.

When they come to the DVC boards to ask questions, some non renters can be not so encouraging and that can stifle discussion. I've seen people asking about availability and I want to tell them "not a chance" but you can't, so their post goes unanswered and they are none the wiser of what was wrong.

There should be a discussion thread where new owner renters and rentees can discuss, learn and share freely.

The RTB is helpful, but it is so restricted it can be daunting.

 

[byoung]

I agree with the above posts. Renting is a big hassle and not one I want to get involved with. I see posts from folks who say "it is easy" to rent your points, but they don't state how it turns you into a travel agent for those folks uninformed about the DVC program and it's rules. No thanks! I'll bank my points if I can't use them.

Agree my points are for us.

 

[Cyril pb]

Dear Carol

My Apologies to you

I did not mean for my prior post to be mean spirited or to be taken as any type of debate. I truly am interested in your impute. I realize that renting points is hard work. The bottom line for me is what we all can do to make the process go better for both parties. The stickys although they give a lot of information do little in making the process go smoothly.
Again my apologies to you.
Sincerely
Cyril PB

 

[Cyril pb]

Now this it what I am talking about,
Well said

OP, I do understand what you are saying and do feel like there should be a forum for new people to discuss renting. That way the ones that dont rent dont have to be bothered and those that do can provide helpful tips and info on renting.

You cannot even answer a question on the RTB (rent trade board) without being sanctioned so that is definitely not the right forum.

When they come to the DVC boards to ask questions, some non renters can be not so encouraging and that can stifle discussion. I've seen people asking about availability and I want to tell them "not a chance" but you can't, so their post goes unanswered and they are none the wiser of what was wrong.

There should be a discussion thread where new owner renters and rentees can discuss, learn and share freely.

The RTB is helpful, but it is so restricted it can be daunting.