How are you handling rising food and energy costs?

[Christine]

Someone has to staff the day shift, when teens are in school. These are often people who aren't college material for a variety of reasons. They aren't capable of getting a college degree to better themselves. They may also not be in a situation where a spouse working makes their job extra income.

They may not be capable of improving their life, but they can do the job they have. Are you saying some people should have to work two or three jobs for their entire adult life to pay the bills, because they don't have the intellect or opportunity to get a better job? I don't think any of us would want to do that. I can't imagine why anyone would support someone else having to do that in order to survive.

Not the person you were asking and I think this is probably derailing the thread, lol, but I'm pushing 60 years old. During my early working years, I worked a LOT of minimum wage jobs well back when things were much more affordable. Even back then, there was no way that I was affording to live independently on that wage. Even when my wage improved a bit, I still couldn't do it unless I had roommates.

I don't pretent to know the answer to this because there are those people who really can't do more than simplistic types of tasks, but it's hard to pay a person who, say works the counter at a dry cleaners (that was one of my jobs), the $40,000 a year it would take in my area to get them in an apartment with a roommate. It would make most small businesses unsustainable.

 

[dvcgirl67]

Eventually no one will be able to afford to eat out so that minimum wage won't matter they wont have jobs.

No one?

 

[barkley]

Someone has to staff the day shift, when teens are in school. These are often people who aren't college material for a variety of reasons. They aren't capable of getting a college degree to better themselves. They may also not be in a situation where a spouse working makes their job extra income.

They may not be capable of improving their life, but they can do the job they have. Are you saying some people should have to work two or three jobs for their entire adult life to pay the bills, because they don't have the intellect or opportunity to get a better job? I don't think any of us would want to do that. I can't imagine why anyone would support someone else having to do that in order to survive.

i guess things work out differently in different places. around here the day staff at the fast foods and in fact the bulk of the staff there tend to be seniors looking to supplement their incomes as well as traditionally stay at home moms who are looking to supplement theirs and can arrange to work the hours their kids are in school. the night staff are adults doing it as a second job or college students awaiting on campus employment opportunities. the teens that do work (and the numbers are low-now only about 20 percent of teens hold a job, which is an all-time low since the United States started keeping track in 1948) are working outside fast food in our region-they can do much better working in restaurants for the identical pay PLUS tips. i haven't seen anyone working in a starbucks or other coffee stand under the age of about 23 in years.

just because someone due to circumstance or by choice works more than 1 job at a time is in no way a reflection on lack of intellect or inability to improve one's own lives. some do it to have the extra money to do things others take for granted (like vacations, sending their kids to summer camps), some for the medical and dental benefits their full time better paying job doesn't offer, and yes-some do it to live their lives.

 

[barkley]

I don't pretent to know the answer to this because there are those people who really can't do more than simplistic types of tasks, but it's hard to pay a person who, say works the counter at a dry cleaners (that was one of my jobs), the $40,000 a year it would take in my area to get them in an apartment with a roommate. It would make most small businesses unsustainable.

ouch-what is rent going for and what kind of apartment is it that 2 people living together each need $40k per year to cover their share?

 

[Christine]

ouch-what is rent going for and what kind of apartment is it that 2 people living together each need $40k per year to cover their share?

Washington DC area. I remember several years ago when rents were MUCH better than they are now, my DD was making $45,000. She rented a 2 bedroom, 780 sqaure foot place that was SO tiny you can't believe. She had this little bedroom that barely fit a double sized bed and a dresser. She was paying $945 per month. The other girl paid more since she had a bigger bedroom as the whole place was a little over $2,000 per month. Of course, my daughter had other bills to pay besides that (and try to save). Tough on $45K.

She is now making much more money but still trying to figure out how to afford the $2300 per month rent to live on her own (she's 31 now and tired of roommates). She could save by moving way out from her work center, but then she'd have the commuting costs.

This is all very regional of course. $40K might sound like a lot of money in some places. I think for the purposes of a national discussion we'd probably need something that level-sets an amount of salary thrown out for discussion based on the area where you live.

 

[MICKIMINI]

Why has your electricity increased so much? My state has the worst inflation in the nation, but thankfully no price increase in electricity or other utilities.

It really goes back to the 1970's when Seabrook Nuclear was being built. At that time, Public Service Co of NH was the owner. Protests ensued and the company went bankrupt. The power plants were sold off and we were at the mercy of out of state utilities.

In the 1970's many New Englander's resorted to adding wood burning stoves to their homes to ensure they could heat their homes. It is a renewable resource and we have lots of wood, however there is a safety factor, there is lots of dangerous work involved and expenses unless you own your woodlot. 7-8 cord of wood (now $350/cord) isn't worth the labor. Most people gave up. Fossil fuels is what heats New England homes - even famous people who preach about going green (I won't name them). Solar is not a great option in the northeast, on a large scale anyway and too expensive vs the payback. In the winter, our skies are cloudy and we only have 8 hours of sunlight on a good day. I have no doubt these issues will be worked out in the future but at this point it is not workable.

We do have a utility commission who seems powerless at this point to prevent these crazy increases. 112% in one year - what about next year? Trying to squeeze people into going green won't speed up the process. That is what I know and my crystal ball isn't working so I just hope we can stay warm without going broke

 

[dvcgirl67]

Have you seen the 2023 Vacation Plans thread? People will still be eating out. Probably not as many, but we supposedly have a severe staffing shortage already.

Exactly right....that poster is on that same thread, posting about their vacation plans. People ate out during the Great Depression....during the civil war for Pete's sake. Are times tough for a lot of people right now....absolutely. Will they get tougher...quite possibly. Will the poorest amongst us suffer the most....absolutely, that is what always happens. But we haven't quite reached "The Road" yet....

 

[HeatherC]

Washington DC area. I remember several years ago when rents were MUCH better than they are now, my DD was making $45,000. She rented a 2 bedroom, 780 sqaure foot place that was SO tiny you can't believe. She had this little bedroom that barely fit a double sized bed and a dresser. She was paying $945 per month. The other girl paid more since she had a bigger bedroom as the whole place was a little over $2,000 per month. Of course, my daughter had other bills to pay besides that (and try to save). Tough on $45K.

She is now making much more money but still trying to figure out how to afford the $2300 per month rent to live on her own (she's 31 now and tired of roommates). She could save by moving way out from her work center, but then she'd have the commuting costs.

This is all very regional of course. $40K might sound like a lot of money in some places. I think for the purposes of a national discussion we'd probably need something that level-sets an amount of salary thrown out for discussion based on the area where you live.

ouch-what is rent going for and what kind of apartment is it that 2 people living together each need $40k per year to cover their share?

In Boston as of October this year, the ‘average” rent for a 1 bedroom is $3030 a month! Insane! Even two people making 40k wouldn’t be able to really afford that.

 

[DCLMP]

No one?

I’m sure the big corporate chains will survive.

 

[DCLMP]

I already provided my definition of a livable wage. Your state obviously has a higher cost of living than most, which makes higher wages necessary to survive. My DH & I ate at Five Guys in Ohio last month. Two double cheeseburgers, a shared fry & two drinks were $27. That makes the $17 an hour in your state less impressive don't you think? The adults working the day shift, when teens are in school, most likely have a family to support. They need to be able to afford to eat too.

As a side note, Five Guys apparently pays better than most. I already posted on a different thread about going to one burger place that had closed their indoor dining due to a staffing shortage, when the Five Guys nearby had more employees than customers.

PS: I don't think I was taking the thread off track, because I was replying to posts already on this thread one of which was worrying about the less fortunate.

Fast food places have never provided a livable wage nor should they. I rarely see anyone over the age of 25 working at them. It’s not a career, but most of the large corporate chains will help you get a career. We used to eat out 3 times a week now maybe once a month. If we continued to eat out three times a week I would have to cancel that trip to Europe. It’s a shame because I like to support my local businesses, but it’s just not in the budget anymore.

 

[DCLMP]

In Boston as of October this year, the ‘average” rent for a 1 bedroom is $3030 a month! Insane! Even two people making 40k wouldn’t be able to really afford that.

That’s why homelessness is increasing. We could not afford 3k a month.

 

[pigletto]

I was thinking what a contrast in the 2 threads. Posters on this thread worrying that people won’t be able to heat their homes or feed their families within months. And posters on that thread planning several cruises or multiple trips around the country & world. Things must not be as bad as some would have us believe.

I’m not sure why it’s so hard to imagine that people with a lot more money aren’t being as affected by inflation as people with less money . Pretty straightforward.

 

[DCLMP]

I’m not sure why it’s so hard to imagine that people with a lot more money aren’t being as affected by inflation as people with less money . Pretty straightforward.

Or that people that can afford a vacation aren’t being affected by this inflation. I know many people on this forum scrimp, save and make sacrifices because vacations are a priority.

 

[dvcgirl67]

I’m sure the big corporate chains will survive.

Plenty of smaller mom and pop restaurants survive downturns, again, even during the Great Depression. Unemployment was up near 25% at the peak of that....and stayed up over 15% for a decade. And plenty of restaurants survived....because people dined in them.

 

[DCLMP]

Plenty of smaller mom and pop restaurants survive downturns, again, even during the Great Depression. Unemployment was up near 25% at the peak of that....and stayed up over 15% for a decade. And plenty of restaurants survived....because people dined in them.

Lots did not survive Covid. Of course not every restaurant will go out of business. I think you like to argue just to argue. I can’t even imagine what our country would look like with unemployment at 25%. People aren’t as civil as they were back then and there a lot more people living here now. Scary thought.

 

[barkley]

And plenty of restaurants survived....because people dined in them.

i recall my father telling of one of the more popular things he and others used to order at restaurants back then-order a cup of tea and tell the server 'i will steep it myself'. server brings you a cup with a tea bag to the side and a small pot of water. fill cup with water, add the catsup, salt and pepper from the center of the table, blend and you now have tomato soup. repeat several times. pocket teabag to use for a future meal. those were his recollections of going to a restaurant during the depression as a young man.

 

[dvcgirl67]

Lots did not survive Covid. Of course not every restaurant will go out of business. I think you like to argue just to argue. I can’t even imagine what our country would look like with unemployment at 25%. People aren’t as civil as they were back then and there a lot more people living here now. Scary thought.

I don't like to argue....you tend to make fantastical apocalyptic statements.....and then when challenged, you walk it back. No biggie....carry on.

 

[DCLMP]

I don't like to argue....you tend to make fantastical apocalyptic statements.....and then when challenged, you walk it back. No biggie....carry on.

Lol. I think you just misinterprete everything. I like the term fantasticall apocalyptic funny.

 

[DCLMP]

i recall my father telling of one of the more popular things he and others used to order at restaurants back then-order a cup of tea and tell the server 'i will steep it myself'. server brings you a cup with a tea bag to the side and a small pot of water. fill cup with water, add the catsup, salt and pepper from the center of the table, blend and you now have tomato soup. repeat several times. pocket teabag to use for a future meal. those were his recollections of going to a restaurant during the depression as a young man.

My mom was raised by a single mom during the depression. She talked about going hungry all the time. I think that’s why she always kept 6 months of emergency food on hand.

 

[disneyseniors]

i guess things work out differently in different places. around here the day staff at the fast foods and in fact the bulk of the staff there tend to be seniors looking to supplement their incomes as well as traditionally stay at home moms who are looking to supplement theirs and can arrange to work the hours their kids are in school. the night staff are adults doing it as a second job or college students awaiting on campus employment opportunities. the teens that do work (and the numbers are low-now only about 20 percent of teens hold a job, which is an all-time low since the United States started keeping track in 1948) are working outside fast food in our region-they can do much better working in restaurants for the identical pay PLUS tips. i haven't seen anyone working in a starbucks or other coffee stand under the age of about 23 in years.

just because someone due to circumstance or by choice works more than 1 job at a time is in no way a reflection on lack of intellect or inability to improve one's own lives. some do it to have the extra money to do things others take for granted (like vacations, sending their kids to summer camps), some for the medical and dental benefits their full time better paying job doesn't offer, and yes-some do it to live their lives.

I agree with you.
In our area, the fast food places hire high school kids for weekends and after school hours. They also employ disabled youth to help out. I haven't seen many seniors at all at our fast food places, but I don't go all the time either. We live in a college town so there are those kids working too. I see a lot of seniors working in other stores here, probably 2/3's of the work force in retail.