Holy Smokes! Look at all the resales at the TimeShare Store.

[childsplay]

I would like to second (or third??? I lost track) the notions that #1: the total number of contracts for sale is miniscule in relation to the total number of owners ....most likely far below 1% and #2: that there are a host of valid reasons for unloading DVC that have nothing to do with dissatisfaction. Divorce was the biggest one mentioned to me when I bought resale several years ago, followed by change in lifestyle (death of a partner, kids too old, etc.). I know there are many people on this board who bought back in the early 90's, not only could they get their money back, they could make a handsome profit, this after staying at Disney for the bettter part of a decade, basically for free, with free passes to boot! To some more "veteran members" I'm sure this senerio look awfully tempting.

 

[Bob H]

We bought 200 pts in '99 during our honeymoon. The offered price from DVC direct was $65/pt for the Boardwalk. We took advantage of the Magical Beginnings promotion therefore our out of pocket was $55/pt. If I had it to do again, I would have purchased 350 - 400 points, and I would have done it through a resale. The reason for the extra points is so I could rent the excess 200 points out at the market rental rate in order to help pay for my maintenance costs and vacation transportation costs.

I have been watching the resales for several years because I believe is shows the fair market value of the points versus the offered retail price by Disney. Two years ago I was seeing resales going for $65/pt. Now I am seeing about $72-75/pt. To me this looks like a $20/pt increase in equity in a 5 year time period. This change represents a 30% increase on my investment not including what I have made through renting out the points.

I think the increase in resales of the older properties is because the people are finding that they have to compete with more members for their non-home properties during the 7 month windows. This problem is only going to increase as more properties open. This is yet another afirmation that you should buy where you want to stay. If I were an original owner of OKW 15 some odd years ago, my investment has long since paid for itself. I could resell my holding, and then put that cash towards one of the new properties. My incremental cost would end up being only about $20/pt. Not bad for a new 50 year lease-hold.

(Regarding point rental, I haven't seen a significant increase in point rental price in the entire 5 years of my ownership. The rental price has remained fairly steady at $10/pt. I expect that in the near future you will see this price try to creap up, especially as the old contracts are resold. $10/pt is close to the break-even point for me based on my maintenance cost and my loan payment per month. As the cost of ownership increases, and the maintenance cost increases with inflation, the rental cost will start to go up. Therefore, those of you who choose not to own, but to rent because it is cheaper, will eventually see inflationary increases similar to hotel rate increases.)

 

[Kelly Nelly]

Originally posted by tjkraz
In all fairness, anytime you read a public forum you're going to get a variety of opinions. In the past, I've read posts from people who thought they were the "smartest guy in the room" for buying a VB resale at $52 per point and always using their points to book WDW resorts a 7 mos.

I've also read of people who were ENCOURAGED to buy VB by their DVC guides becuase they were told they would have no trouble using those points at a WDW property.

But by and large, most folks here do preach the "buy where you want to stay" mantra. You can never go wrong with that approach.

If there turns out to be any truth to the current VB sale rumor, it really won't affect us very much. Yes, it was a nice selling point to know that VB and HH were non-WDW options in the program. But it will probably take us a decade to work one of those resorts into our travel plans.

I'm following the VB rumor, as I'm sure many here are, but it doesn't really concern me. As I stated in a prior post, even if Disney transferred management of the entire DVC program to another entity, you probably wouldn't see our contract listed on a resale site anytime soon. Our intention was to buy into a resort on WDW property, and that's what we did. Whether DVC or Mariott or some other company manages the property is a secondary concern.

I do not want to stir up any trouble here but I have been observing your posts for the past little while. The one thing that kinda of baffles me is that you act like you are the biggest expert about DVC and infact you have only been a DVC member for about 6 months and have yet to actually go on a DVC vacation with your own points. I have been a member for years and the one thing I hate on this boards is how people talk about how the only resort you can stay at is your home resort because it is next to impossible to book at the other DVC resorts. I do not believe this at all, I own points at all the resorts except for Vero and I have been able to book vacations from 3 months to 2 weeks, to 3 days before we leave, and I have been able to book what I wanted as well. Because the people on this board are obsessive planners they tend to use the 11 month window every time, so that is why every one here preachs about how important the 11 month window is. However this board is only a very very small segement of DVC members and actually the vast majority of members like myself do not use the 11 month window either. ( I just cannot plan a vacation that far in advance) I just do not like how if people are thinking about becoming members and they do some research on these boards they will get the opionion that the only resort you can stay at is your home resort and that you have to book it almost a year in advance. I think this is far from the truth and being a DVC member now for a good number of years proves that. For example If my home resort is VWL and I am getting 42 years of points from that resort do you think that every time I am going to use those points I am going to stay at VWL. The answer is of course not, people like to change to different resorts to spice things up a little bit every time they use there DVC points.Through experence with my DVC membership I have learned over the years that your home resort is not really that big of a deal.It is totally overly hyped on these boards.You will realise after a few years of owning your membership that DVC is very flexable and you will be able to book at all the resorts with out a problem.

 

[tjkraz]

Originally posted by Kelly Nelly
I do not want to stir up any trouble here but I have been observing your posts for the past little while. The one thing that kinda of baffles me is that you act like you are the biggest expert about DVC and infact you have only been a DVC member for about 6 months and have yet to actually go on a DVC vacation with your own points.

And your point would be???

Correct me if I'm wrong but I assumed we were all here to share our OPINIONS. Sorry, I didn't realize I had to present my DVC resume at the door. The mere fact that you seem to know my entire DVC history leads me to believe that I've done a pretty good job of communicating that to people. I never claimed to be a 10 year member with 25 stays behind me.

Perhaps you should be a little more forthcoming with your years and years worth of experience.

If you just don't want to read my opinions, feel free to add me to your "ignore" list.

I have been a member for years and the one thing I hate on this boards is how people talk about how the only resort you can stay at is your home resort because it is next to impossible to book at the other DVC resorts. I do not believe this at all, I own points at all the resorts except for Vero and I have been able to book vacations from 3 months to 2 weeks, to 3 days before we leave, and I have been able to book what I wanted as well.

Since you chose to single me out, would you care to share which part of my statement you believe states this? I don't consider myself a reactionary that claims "it's impossble to book at non-home resorts!!!"

It can be difficult at certain times of the year as I found out on the two occasions that I've rented points and the three on which I've booked stays using my own points.

And, if my days and days of DVC experience count for anything, I just booked a stay on 2 1/2 months notice and did not get my first, second or third choice resort. If you get your first choice every time out when booking 3 mos to 3 days in advance, then good for you. Some of us have not been as fortunate.

Because the people on this board are obsessive planners they tend to use the 11 month window every time, so that is why every one here preachs about how important the 11 month window is. However this board is only a very very small segement of DVC members and actually the vast majority of members like myself do not use the 11 month window either. ( I just cannot plan a vacation that far in advance)

I agree wholeheartedly with this statement and have stated as such on past occasions.

At the same time, it's nice to see that your anger isn't just directed at me. Darn those "obsessive planners"...

I just do not like how if people are thinking about becoming members and they do some research on these boards they will get the opionion that the only resort you can stay at is your home resort and that you have to book it almost a year in advance. I think this is far from the truth and being a DVC member now for a good number of years proves that. For example If my home resort is VWL and I am getting 42 years of points from that resort do you think that every time I am going to use those points I am going to stay at VWL. The answer is of course not, people like to change to different resorts to spice things up a little bit every time they use there DVC points.Through experence with my DVC membership I have learned over the years that your home resort is not really that big of a deal.It is totally overly hyped on these boards.You will realise after a few years of owning your membership that DVC is very flexable and you will be able to book at all the resorts with out a problem.

And you are more than welcome to share that POV with any current and future members of this board. But when people come here looking for an OBJECTIVE point of view, it is only fair to present them with both sides of the story. DVC gives them the rosy "you can get whatever you want, whenever you want" viewpoint. In reality, it isn't quite that simple.

If you want to tell prospective buyers that it is very easy to get the room you want on 3 days notice, then go for it. Personally I think that presenting such a slanted opinion to people considering a $15000+ investment is irresponsible.

In my mind, the collective members of this board prsent people with the FACTS and let the readers draw their own conclusions.

 

[DrTomorrow]

Disclaimer: I too have only been a DVC owner since September of last year, and won't be making my first trip home until this May.

Kelly Nelly: I respectfully disagree, in the strongest possible way, your characterization of tjkraz. He has done a lot of research into the DVC and has put a lot of effort into gathering up an enormous amount of SSR info into his SSR FAQ. He always offers helpful advice when asked, yet always qualifies his opinions as just that - opinions. And I'm certain that there are thousands of DVC owners that have made dozens of trips yet still know less about the specifics, ins and outs of the DVC than tjkraz or many of the other helpful DIS souls. I would have been much worse off when I was researching our SSR purchase decision had I not had the advice of the DIS DVC 'family'. Harrumph.

And while you may have had luck booking last-minute in the past, I truly believe that this won't be the case in 5-10 years. I just can't see how, when SSR is fully built - and sold out - the 7-month competition in May, or October, or December (or any month) for VWL or BWV (or any resort) will be anything but fierce. We bought into SSR believing that we will be spending the vast majority of our DVC stays right there. So I too would advise that any prospective DVC buyer keep "buy where you plan to stay" in mind. You "may" be able to book any resort, but whether or not you actually "can" remains to be seen - and I'd hate to see someone make such a significant purchase unaware of this situation. Of course, this is only MHO, YMMV. EIEIO.

 

[David&Danielle]

K.I.S.S. We've all heard this adage, right? So take a look...Christmas bills have been coming...tax season is right around the corner....if you are doing your yearly budget, which many probably do in December or January, DVC would look like a place to not only save $$ but a potential winfall (sp?) for those experiencing a cash crunch this time of year.

Also, say what you want about Eisner, etc. DVC investment is not, or at least should not, be a knee-jerk reaction to the day-to-day news stories.

"Everyone is selling....then buy, buy. Their all buying! Then sell, sell." - Rodney Dangerfield...Caddyshack.




Less than 24 hours to Lift Off!!!!!Woohoo!!!

 

[PamOKW]

Since the Vero sale rumor has come up in this thread --- The original poster has returned to retract their statement about Vero (and HHI) being sold.

 

[HookdonWDW]

Originally posted by Kelly Nelly
I have been a member for years and the one thing I hate on this boards is how people talk about how the only resort you can stay at is your home resort because it is next to impossible to book at the other DVC resorts. I do not believe this at all, I own points at all the resorts except for Vero and I have been able to book vacations from 3 months to 2 weeks, to 3 days before we leave, and I have been able to book what I wanted as well. Because the people on this board are obsessive planners they tend to use the 11 month window every time, so that is why every one here preachs about how important the 11 month window is.

Hi,

Since I've owned for a while now, and have stayed at most of the resorts, maybe it will be okay with you if I comment. I believe that I was the person who first stated in this thread that UY matters. I stand behind my post.

If you read what I wrote, you will see that I said The home resort advantage really matters if it is a busy period for DVC (DVC busy periods aren't the same as WDWs). It can already be tricky to book into a non-home resort during peak periods, or to book a Grand Villa.

I never said that you couldn't book these things. Just that it matters. I've booked reservations while already at the parks. Part of the reason is because I didn't care which resort I booked. But, if you want to get a room for VWL during Christmas week, the window WILL matter. JMTCW. YMMV.

 

[PamOKW]

Another reason for the number of resales to show an increase is if they aren't selling as quickly as in the past. If 5 resales a week come on the market but it now takes 3 weeks instead of 1 week for them to sell, we'll be seeing 15 listings at a time instead of 5 -- even though the number coming to market is the same.

Sales may have slowed due to both the turmoil surrounding Disney and the incentive of buying SSR direct from Disney with its extended contract. I imagine things will settle down again as summer rolls around.

 

[HookdonWDW]

Great point Pam!

 

[Nick@ VB+OKW]

Who needs the debate board

when you have this thread?

 

[tguy47]

The glut of resales seems to be abating (esp. at BWV, BCV, and VWL) and being replaced by a bunch of sale pending. We're among those awaiting ROFR on a VWL. I assume the price increase at SSR would motivate people to move up their buying plans before resale prices increase also.

This doesn't seem to be happening for OKW. Perhaps OKW owners are selling and buying SSR before the price inrease? Or perhaps the small sample size doesn't represent a trend.

Just trying to justify paying more for VWL.

 

[MelissathePooh]

Originally posted by OneMoreTry
My concern is not so much sale of DVC. It would be sale of the parks and subsequent mismanagement resulting in lower demand. :

subsequent?

 

[LeftCoaster]

Originally posted by Kelly Nelly
I was just browsing to day at the timeshare store and I was just checking out the DVC resales. I could not believe my eyes when I saw all the resales that are available right now.Do you guys think that people are getting woried about DVC selling to some body else?( Like Marriot) I just cannot get over the amount that is on there right now.

I think they need to update their website. I returned home 9 days ago from my first trip to OKW and my contract is still listed on their site as "sale pending".
Sale Pending? Ha! I've got the deed to prove it's mine. all mine.
Now, I must figure out a way to get through the next 7 months before my next trip there. ::sigh::