Hillary Supporters unite part 2; no bashing please

[chobie]

Speaking of getting to know the spouse of the candidate better, what's with Cindy McCain not releasing her tax records?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080508/ap_on_el_pr/cindy_mccain_taxes

 

[Aristocath]

Yes, and a lot of people didn't like the sound of Hillary's voice, hence the nickname some OS use that is so annoying to many of you (and me also).

I'm just astounded by the irony of attacking a potential first lady when that was what Hillary went through.

And no it will not hurt Obama, it just looks petty and desparate to be attacking the wife especially when Hillary went through that.

I thought then, the attacking of Bill by attacking Hillary was stupid, petty and anti-woman. JMHO.

I agree. I remember how painful and irrelevant that was in 1992. Have we not learned anything?

 

["Got Disney"]

Okay you are not attacking her, but that does now seem to be a trend in the Hillary camp to take digs out Michelle. That's all fine and well and part of the game, I just can't get past the irony.

What I am not getting is why is it OKAY for Michelle to state her opinion of how she feels but we are not How come she can voice her opinions that she does not like how things are going her way ...but we are not.

I never said she has no right to her opinions of any other OS that they have no rights to there opinions. An opinion is an opinion.

So does it bother you OS that much that I and others don't like her are we suppose to because the OS do geesh come on already. The article is a article....the words were "quoted" in the article as her words. That is what I was reading ...not the opinion of the writer.

Seems like a mountain made out of a mole hill....it's not like she is the only one in this world that I dont care for...are thre not people that you dont care for....like Hillary maybe!

 

[kinntj]

You almost never hear comments saying that someone can't stand a man because of the sound of his voice. Villifying women by how they talk (shrill, chiding, scolding) is a time honored tradition. Women who are outspoken, such as Hillary, will get nasty comments made about the sound of their voice, when really its the fact that they dare to have an opinion that offends people. When a woman talks forcably about a subject she is being strident, *****y, shrill etc. When a man talks that way he is being strong.


The best way a woman can avoid being ridiculed for the sound of her voice is too keep her mouth shut, then she will be admired like Cindy McCain.

You know I have opinions on everyone and their speech styles, but there was a specific article about Michelle. Maybe the writer of that article had an anti woman sentiment, but I don't share that part of it.

Let's see...McCain, his voice doesn't even fit him. His voice is too soft for my liking. Barack twists his head too much for the teleprompters and it looks like he's going to get dizzy. I don't think Michelle's voice is shrill and it doesn't cackle. It's just the message she sends out and then her voice gets whiney. I think women should voice themselves in the way they want and I'm sure my opinion won't affect Michelle one bit if she knew. She's a strong woman, with strong opinions and feelings, but I don't have to like how it comes out of her mouth at times. Jeesh! Stop knawing on my ankles.

 

[chobie]

I agree. I remember how painful and irrelevant that was in 1992. Have we not learned anything?

Apparently not.

 

[Duckfan-in-Chicago]

Speaking of getting to know the spouse of the candidate better, what's with Cindy McCain not releasing her tax records?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080508/ap_on_el_pr/cindy_mccain_taxes

If I remember correctly, Kerry's wife wasn't going to release hers and waited till less than a month from the election so I'm sure this won't be an issue that gets pushed too hard.

 

[chobie]

If I remember correctly, Kerry's wife wasn't going to release hers and waited till less than a month from the election so I'm sure this won't be an issue that gets pushed too hard.

Well, God Bless those Republican men for picking wives who keep their mouths shut and don't have to be brought into consideration when choosing who to vote for.

 

[Aristocath]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";24994814]Okay...why is it that anytime we post something the OS do not like to read half of you have to come over here and get into our faces about it. Gessh come on already. If we did that every time we read something about Hillary or Bill or anything on those lines we would have to call it the Obama Hillary thread.

Cant you just not do that Lily thanks for coming in and tippy toeing and asking your question

All of a sudden again we are being bombarded and finding that we have to defend our statements. We have our opinions and of course some of you say well they are not the FACTS.....well there is plenty on the OT that we disagree with as being FACTS....but we don't run over there all the time and tell you that.[/QUOTE]

I thought the purpose of a forum is to interact with others. You post something then other people respond to it. By posting in a public forum, you don't get to choose who responds to it.

 

[kinntj]

Apparently not.

Bill was the first candidate I ever voted for, so I'm sure I didn't know anything about how Hillary was portrayed. I was in college and didn't look into things too much back then. I never knew that was an issue. Now I do.

I need awhile to look through those links that Revy provided to get to know her in good times and in bad.

When we get our nominee, then you'll hear more about Cindy and John McCain. She does seem to be behind the scenes and not a talker. I would probably be just the same. I personally, like a first lady who is out there doing her thing out front. I think that should be what the first lady is about in the modern World. Doesn't mean that it won't come without critics.

 

[KikiFan]

Well, God Bless those Republican men for picking wives who keep their mouths shut and don't have to be brought into consideration when choosing who to vote for.

I agree with you to a point. It's really not appropriate to attack a candidates wife (or women in general) with the old shrill voice schtick. Or on their appearance.

However the reality of world politics is that the 1st lady is often sent to represent the US. That makes her a part of the package that we're voting for. So I don't think some discussion about the spouses strengths and weaknesses as person, is out of place, or unfair to either gender. As long as it doesn't fall into the sterotypical gender bashing comments.

My issue with Michelle is not in how she speaks, it's about what she speaks. I find the content of her speeches to be very negative, particularly when she talks about the country she may eventually represent. The is a certain victim mentality that comes across in speeches. I really don't get her feelings about getting student loans. There are so many people that wish they could get SLs to go to an ivy league school.

Most of all when I listen to her, I hear a lot that sounds like Rev Wright and that concerns me. If I'm not mistaken she was the one that brought Obama to the church? or did they meet there?

 

["Got Disney"]

I thought the purpose of a forum is to interact with others. You post something then other people respond to it. By posting in a public forum, you don't get to choose who responds to it.

yes but that was not the point. I have no problem with OS coming in here and asking questions about why we feel a certain way about something. Its when we post anything about Obama or Michelle we get bombarded with saying we are attacking poor Obama or Michelle.

We cant even have our points of views in here anymore. The Obama thread is always neg about Hillary and name calling and nasty stuff but we don't run in there and say "Hay how dare you" Do you have facts to back that up!

Lily came in here and asked a question of why that article was posted from a Right wing writer....she did not come in and start stuff about us attacking Michelle. She kept that in the Obama thread and discussed it among the OS posters. Kudos to her for understanding that at this time our opinions are not the same.

Funny how even if I go into the Obama thread and post a congrats or tell someone like PR that she is inspirational on how hard she is working for Obama....I get thrown out and told off to leave and go back where I belong....pretty much in those words.

Yet I have never ever asked anyone form the OT to please leave unless they are starting a fight. Also funny that the ones that have told me to leave in a nasty way are the same ones that come here to stir things up and don't care that we have opinions because since we are Hillary supporters all of our opinions are wrong and we are to stupid to know the FACTS and we just talk out of our BUTTS.

So go ahead and play that about anyone can post where ever. Funny that I get so much crap from the Obama supporters for going into the Conservative thread every once in awhile....yet have not read anyone saying anything from the Obama thread about your OS posters that go in there chatting once in awhile also.

Double standards I guess.

 

[chobie]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";24996275]yes but that was not the point. I have no problem with OS coming in here and asking questions about why we feel a certain way about something. Its when we post anything about Obama or Michelle we get bombarded with saying we are attacking poor Obama or Michelle.

We cant even have our points of views in here anymore. The Obama thread is always neg about Hillary and name calling and nasty stuff but we don't run in there and say "Hay how dare you" Do you have facts to back that up!

Lily came in here and asked a question of why that article was posted from a Right wing writer....she did not come in and start stuff about us attacking Michelle. She kept that in the Obama thread and discussed it among the OS posters. Kudos to her for understanding that at this time our opinions are not the same.

Funny how even if I go into the Obama thread and post a congrats or tell someone like PR that she is inspirational on how hard she is working for Obama....I get thrown out and told off to leave and go back where I belong....pretty much in those words.

Yet I have never ever asked anyone form the OT to please leave unless they are starting a fight. Also funny that the ones that have told me to leave in a nasty way are the same ones that come here to stir things up and don't care that we have opinions because since we are Hillary supporters all of our opinions are wrong and we are to stupid to know the FACTS and we just talk out of our BUTTS.

So go ahead and play that about anyone can post where ever. Funny that I get so much crap from the Obama supporters for going into the Conservative thread every once in awhile....yet have not read anyone saying anything from the Obama thread about your OS posters that go in there chatting once in awhile also.

Double standards I guess.[/QUOTE]


I came in here to point out that what you were saying about Michelle was exactly the same thing that was said about Hillary. I didn't like it then and I don't like it now.

BTW, the con thread posted a lovely joke about what *****es both Michelle and Hillary are and put up a juvenile collection of every bad picture ever taken of Hillary. Personally I find that kind of thing repugnant, yet helpful in cementing my committment to vote for Hillary if she gets the nom depsite anything she or her supporters may say or do between then and now.

 

[moon]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";24995730]What I am not getting is why is it OKAY for Michelle to state her opinion of how she feels but we are not How come she can voice her opinions that she does not like how things are going her way ...but we are not.

I never said she has no right to her opinions of any other OS that they have no rights to there opinions. An opinion is an opinion.

So does it bother you OS that much that I and others don't like her are we suppose to because the OS do geesh come on already. The article is a article....the words were "quoted" in the article as her words. That is what I was reading ...not the opinion of the writer.

Seems like a mountain made out of a mole hill....it's not like she is the only one in this world that I dont care for...are thre not people that you dont care for....like Hillary maybe![/QUOTE]

ITA. No one was critical of her clothing, hairstyle, her appearance in general or her voice. The comments were about what she said. About her message. How is it wrong to comment on what she publicly said?

 

[kinntj]

I came in here to point out that what you were saying about Michelle was exactly the same thing that was said about Hillary. I didn't like it then and I don't like it now.

BTW, the con thread posted a lovely joke about what *****es both Michelle and Hillary are and put up a juvenile collection of every bad picture ever taken of Hillary. Personally I find that kind of thing repugnant, yet helpful in cementing my committment to vote for Hillary if she gets the nom depsite anything she or her supporters may say or do between then and now.

Thank you for sharing. When the focus stops being on both dem candidates, then the cons won't have it as cushy as they do now. We may or may not say things against the McCain's, but when the DEM's are in the White House, then we can sit back and enjoy the ride. I really think that once we focus on the other side, things will change for the better with our party. Right now we're focused more within the party for obvious reasons. I try to be optomistic and say we'll see our party come together again. At least I believe most of it will be salvaged.

The Cons think they have it in the barrel and that'll wake up the DEMS in a hurry. "All in good time", as the Wicked Witch from the West states in the movie "All in good time".

I do read the Obama thread and the only thing I didn't like reading was the comment that we (HRCS) get our opinions and how we talk from Hillary. I can only speak for myself, but I DO NOT get anything from my candidate. I disagree with many things she's said on the campaign trail and especially those that had to pump up McCain to get a vote. Excuse me Senator Clinton, but I don't need you to say positive things about McCain to attack Obama so you get more votes. I didn't agree with that strategy at all. I'm sure if I picked apart John McCain, I could find 1 good thing to say about the man. 1. He served our country proudly and I thank him for that! See...

Sorry about the ranting...

 

[DISUNC]

Robin, I'm just gently dropping by with a bit of a befuddlement. Why are writers for The National Review (DISUNC's post)

My article I posted is from Ed Koch, posted from the Huffinton post.com

 

[kinntj]

ITA. No one was critical of her clothing, hairstyle, her appearance in general or her voice. The comments were about what she said. About her message. How is it wrong to comment on what she publicly said?

Actually, I think she'll be a very stylish young First Lady. I agree, it's the message of negativity in her last couple of speeches. Now, I can't comment on those earlier one's I haven't seen. I mostly catch Baracks speeches when they show them on CNN or other networks. I barely watch other tv programming, so I haven't been able to catch Michelle's.

Well, I'm off to watch more videos of Michelle. I'm going to be speeched and talked out by the time I'm done with these. Eyes bugging out and everything.

 

[kinntj]

My article I posted is from Ed Koch, posted from the Huffinton post.com

o.k. That's the one I agreed with.

 

["Got Disney"]

I came in here to point out that what you were saying about Michelle was exactly the same thing that was said about Hillary. I didn't like it then and I don't like it now.

BTW, the con thread posted a lovely joke about what *****es both Michelle and Hillary are and put up a juvenile collection of every bad picture ever taken of Hillary. Personally I find that kind of thing repugnant, yet helpful in cementing my commitment to vote for Hillary if she gets the nom depsite anything she or her supporters may say or do between then and now.

Just remember please that I have no problem with anyone coming into this thread. I get upset however when posters come in here and tell me how I should feel and that I have no right to voice my opinion when they are also voicing there's.

When I was at the store about 2 weeks ago I picked up some Hillary buttons. I in addition picked up Obama buttons for my friends that are OS. WE understand how each other feels about our candidates. They know how I feel about Michell. They know my opinion of McCain. I did not give them the buttons to be sarcastic. I gave them to them because they are my friends and are passionate about Obama.

The 8 of us Hillary and Obama supporters sat at our biweekly dinner and wore our buttons. Proudly I might add. Add happy for each other that we are happy with our choice of candidates. On the other hand they don't tell me every step of the way that I am stupid or just don't know the facts about Obama and that is why I am only voting for Hillary or how can i stand to back such a lier...and someone who laughs like that. and I don't do that to them about Obama.

Here on the other hand is a different ball game. To me it seems that if we have nothing nice to say about the others candidate it should stay in that thread . If we don't like what is being said in the OT than our opinions of that should stay in here among us. Just as if you don't like what we have to say about Obama should be discussed in that thread.

IMO it is rude to come in any thread and start telling those posters that there opinions are not FACT. We are talking politics...not ice cream Sundays and what to put on them.

Two thing that are never easy to discuss are Politics and Religion.....they can both get heated and political and religious views are very personal opinions. They are hard at times to discuss.


And to add the way I see Michelle is not how I see Obama.

Okay I'm done ranting one and on thank you

 

[chobie]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";24996953]Just remember please that I have no problem with anyone coming into this thread. I get upset however when posters come in here and tell me how I should feel and that I have no right to voice my opinion when they are also voicing there's.

Okay I'm done ranting one and on thank you [/QUOTE]


But I never told you not to voice your opinions; I pointed out the irony in that opinion being the same one many had about Hillary. You don't find that ironic, I get that.

 

[MerryPoppins]

I really don't think it would make any difference if "Hillary" was "Harold". I think it has more to do with traditional politics in trying to force the second place threat out of the race.

I'm not sure I totally agree. I'm not sure it's a conscious thing, but many are not ready for a woman to be POTUS. They see Hillary in a different light because she's not a man.

Michelle's problem is that she really believes the same things Wright does.

God, I really hope not. But after some of the things I've heard, I wonder. Word has it that her dissertation was very whiny and negative about how unfair it is to be black in the US. But I haven't seen it, so I don't really know. That would explain one reason why her husband was reluctant to distance himself from Wright. I'd love to have a youtube link to the speech in question if anyone finds it.

Her voice isn't a problem for me, as no one can help their voice. She always looks nice. That's sort of silly, but it's good if a First Lady (representing our country) is neat and looks like she cares about her appearance. Michelle does. So I can't honestly say that on the surface I'd have any more problem with Michelle than with Bill.

But I'm not crazy about Michelle. I admit I haven't heard her much...just the times I have heard her I didn't like her attitude. I just think she's got a negative message which sort of is at odds with her husband and his spiel. I've heard rumbles for several months that she feels entitled. I don't really like that in anyone. So I can't say I'd really like to see her as First Lady. I'd like to see someone in that position that could be active and not just sit back and look pretty. I'm not sure she would promote a message I'd like. Just my gut feeling.