Here now, and here is the problem

[CanadaJulie]

Your post is fabulous! But, you did forget the one category of Disney guest. That is the "bench-folks". You know the perfectly healthy ones who come back with, "Well, I just love the new system ! (even though they ride no headliners and admit that they pay to enter an amusement park and just sit on a bench and watch people go by).

Do they not realize that they can do that outside the (not sure if I can say gates or turnstyles these days) entrance on a bench for FREE?

Ah yes ! The "I'm here for the atmosphere" type. They come for a Dole Whip and watch the crowds. Of course, they typically visit multiple times a year and can afford to do a ride here and there, and if the lines were too long, no problem ! They can ride it next time.

They often don't understand that some families don't have that luxury (me !). It is costing us a small fortune to travel down from Canada with our family of 5. This is my step-kids first time (they are 14 and 11) and we will likely not be coming back with them anytime soon. Is is really too much to ask to ride all the headliners on our "once in a childhood" trip ?

 

[pitterpint23]

He's not posting because he's arguing with some other poor shlub on the magic bands post.. fun.

 

[LuvFFPlus]

Ah yes ! The "I'm here for the atmosphere" type. They come for a Dole Whip and watch the crowds. Of course, they typically visit multiple times a year and can afford to do a ride here and there, and if the lines were too long, no problem ! They can ride it next time.

They often don't understand that some families don't have that luxury (me !). It is costing us a small fortune to travel down from Canada with our family of 5. This is my step-kids first time (they are 14 and 11) and we will likely not be coming back with them anytime soon. Is is really too much to ask to ride all the headliners on our "once in a childhood" trip ?

so have you taken a trip to WDW and find that you are unable to ride all the headliners in your visit? Please do share the reason to Disney so that they may adjust the system so it may be possible. Maybe I will log a complaint too for you to Disney. I still have a link available to me for comments.

 

[CanadaJulie]

I've been here the last 4 days (including thanksgiving day). And so far so good with fast pass plus. Do I wish I could book more than 3 fast pass rides in a day, sure I do but it has not be any kind of determinate to our vacation yet. Take today for example, my 11 month old daughter did not fell well so we stayed in the hotel to let her sleep. We are going to DHS in a bit and I know that we are still okay for TSM at 3:00. If I was on the old system I would have either had to get to the park late and in all likely hood not get a fast pass for TSM, or I would have had to force my daughter to get up and drag her to the park not feeling well just to get a fast pass (something I would never do, but others would IMO). So I just take the good with the bad. But I have never been the type of person who was so rigid with my plans that one thing going not according to plan ruins my vacation.

Problem is, once everyone is able to book TSM FP+ 60 days out, they might be gone in seconds, just like ADRs for Cinderella's castle. I hope not, but it's not impossible. We just don't know until we get there...

 

[LuvFFPlus]

He's not posting because he's arguing with some other poor shlub on the magic bands post.. fun.

Actually I ignored most of you people as it was suggested to me before. Works wonders I guess.

So now you want me to respond and before you wish I'd shut up?

 

[vital]

You have no problem dismissing other people's experience yet you wish other people to agree to your experience. So it's no different to it's my way or the high way.

I get the fact that you loved your old way but is your old way really that good if everyone who goes to WDW tour the same way you do?

Can you imagine if everyone wants to get on TT or Soards 4 to 6 times a day?

You will have a bigger problem at your hand with ride capacity. Maybe you should petition to a system where you can pay a fee on ticket to keep the fp- and let us other kind pay a little less on ticket to use fp+. Is that problem solved?

I would love the option to pay more for unlimited FP access, but then I'm sure I'd be looked down upon because I can afford it. I really don't understand why people think riding the same attraction multiple times a day is odd. I get sick on spinning/motion simulator rides, but can ride coasters and TOT all day every day so that limits what I have to choose from. Why should I be penalized for a physical ailment I have no control over?

I'm not going until the end of May, but I've already thought of my game plan as the system works now. I'll still have a great time, but we will be spending a day at Universal to test the waters for future split stays. We are every other year visitors, but now that my son is older we are ready to try the big coasters at Uni. I know some people will be glad because we'll free up more FP+, but it's not about "Disney Loyalty" to me. It's about getting the most out of my money (and I have no problem spending a lot of it on vacation) and if I feel like I'm not getting enjoyment equal to what I've spent I'll go elsewhere.

 

[LuvFFPlus]

I would love the option to pay more for unlimited FP access, but then I'm sure I'd be looked down upon because I can afford it. I really don't understand why people think riding the same attraction multiple times a day is odd. I get sick on spinning/motion simulator rides, but can ride coasters and TOT all day every day so that limits what I have to choose from. Why should I be penalized for a physical ailment I have no control over?

I'm not going until the end of May, but I've already thought of my game plan as the system works now. I'll still have a great time, but we will be spending a day at Universal to test the waters for future split stays. We are every other year visitors, but now that my son is older we are ready to try the big coasters at Uni. I know some people will be glad because we'll free up more FP+, but it's not about "Disney Loyalty" to me. It's about getting the most out of my money (and I have no problem spending a lot of it on vacation) and if I feel like I'm not getting enjoyment equal to what I've spent I'll go elsewhere.

My point is that Disney cannot sustain EVERYONE wishes to ride TT multiple times a day. It is a capacity issue. I have no problem for you to pay more to get the ability. Just like the Universal system. Love it, more revenue and more happy customer.

 

[LuvFFPlus]

Problem is, once everyone is able to book TSM FP+ 60 days out, they might be gone in seconds, just like ADRs for Cinderella's castle. I hope not, but it's not impossible. We just don't know until we get there...

That's why some kind of tiering is needed. We cannot have it both ways.

 

[Colleen27]

I admit it is tempting to believe that this ill-conceived system was put in place to discourage repeat customers (I'll bet some of the designers and managers who thought they were somehow enhancing guest experience would love reading that). But right behind NextGen components on the list things WDW has been spending money on instead of new attractions is DVC properties.

Without as many repeat customers, why would they do this? Are they counting on selling to that many investors who hope to push timeshare rentals on the hoards of one time WDW visitors that they covet?

They don't need a large number of repeat customers to sell the limited inventory of DVC units being built at GF and Poly, and they're specifically targeting a sub-group of frequent guests with considerable means given the price point of buying into those properties. People dropping 15K+ for a minimum buy-in that won't even get them a week's stay are more likely to be the "buying every new Disney Dooney" demographic than the "packing lunches for park days" demographic.

But I also think there's some degree of the left hand not knowing what the right is doing sometimes, particularly when it comes to projects that are kept need-to-know as long as the My Magic+ initiative has been.

Most of the people started to complain when the perceived "perk" disappeared. It's not because of FP+ or NextGen. It's more in line with I paid $90 a day to enter the park and I want to get to the front of the line 6 times a day to my favorite rides.

I respect your view more as you are presenting a possible change in touring pattern rather than about the loss of ability to ride one single ride multiple times.

I haven't read "most" complaints to be along those lines. Far more are about not wanting to be in clock-watching mode all trip, not wanting to be locked into inflexible appointment times for their vacation 60 days in advance, etc. Secondary to that is the subset that hates the tiering - on a typical Epcot day, I want exactly two fastpasses, one for Test Track and one for Soarin'. We seldom do repeats (well, except Figment - my 5yo's favorite), but the new system still doesn't accommodate the way we tour.

If you hate the new tier system and in turn hate the FP+ that's fine since we need the crowd capacity control. You may not see the crowd when you visit but it is getting worse as each year goes. So before Disney have time to put in a new ride they need to ration the rides. Why is that not easy to see?

I don't think the reactions would be so negative if it appeared Disney was seriously/aggressively pursuing both MM+ and new rides and attractions, but the FLE expansion is heavy on theme and detail but light on rides, Pandora is yet to break ground, Star Wars is still in the discussion phase, it is looking more and more like an east-coast Carsland or expansion of Pixar Place is wishful thinking, and now the rumor mill is buzzing with the news that what parks improvements are in the works may be back-burnered in favor of throwing everything TDO has into fixing the next-gen trainwreck. So there is plenty of reason for the dedicated fan to view MM+/FP+ as "instead of" rather than "in addition to" or "while constructing" improved ride capacity.

 

[maxiesmom]

That's why some kind of tiering is needed. We cannot have it both ways.

I agree. I may not be thrilled with it, but I get why they did it. You can't have everyone at Epcot picking Test Track and Soarin, and leaving Malestrom and Living With The Land for everyone else.

 

[davidl81]

Problem is, once everyone is able to book TSM FP+ 60 days out, they might be gone in seconds, just like ADRs for Cinderella's castle. I hope not, but it's not impossible. We just don't know until we get there...

I do agree with this. I really hope that fast pass plus does not turn into something like the ADR system.

 

[JanaDee]

That's why some kind of tiering is needed. We cannot have it both ways.

Then prices should be adjusted accordingly. We all know that won't happen, will it?

 

[Mrs.Reese]

I do agree with this. I really hope that fast pass plus does not turn into something like the ADR system.

That's my fear too. I will say the idea of not having to crisscross the park to get a fast pass to come back later is appealing.

 

[pitterpint23]

Actually I ignored most of you people as it was suggested to me before. Works wonders I guess.

So now you want me to respond and before you wish I'd shut up?

I never told you to shut up. If I recall, you're the one who insulted my intelligence without me nagging at you.

 

[gina2000]

Originally Posted by LuvFFPlus
I Loooooooooove the new ff+. I am able to book well in advance the rides that i want. I can also use the methods someone posted on line to enable park hopping and ride more than 3 rides using it.

I am also an AP holder so i can book ff+ w/o having to have a resort ressie. The trick is to book a resort ressie and cancel it once you received MB. Once you have a MB it's yours to keep and will continue to function for 2 years. You don't even need to make any more resort ressie after you got the mb. So I don't know why those who said the off-site, and local AP holder doesn't have a chance to get the band.
It's just maybe they are too lazy to make the effort to obtain a mb?

I love the ff+ so much that sometimes i would just book my 3 ff+ ahead of time even if i am not sure if i will be visiting wdw. This way if i do go i will have my 3.

It's just how you use and adapt to the new system. Change is coming and change is the only thing constant. You either change with it or be swept away.

Have you actually visited WDW and used FP+? Have you visited during a high traffic period? Have you visited and not used any of the back door methods to obtain additional FP+ or FP- capability?

If your respond negatively to any of the above, your opinion is no more valid than those who have not visited. At least, by your own stated standard of validity......

I posted this on another thread. Still waiting for a response......

 

[pitterpint23]

I'm being the bigger person. Walking away.

Good luck with your post count, ffplus

 

[Colleen27]

Couple of things.

Us über abusers were at one time once in a lifetime vacationers also. Apparently the ubers didn't do enough to prevent us from becoming frequent visitors. Also, if the frequent visitor wasn't lucrative Disney wouldn't care about building DVC like madmen.

You've been many times, so just make sure you're prepared for a cut in your expectations once FP- goes away.

I absolutely am. I know we're not going to be able to enjoy the parks the way we once did, even though we were never "superusers" (mostly out of lack of desire to repeat most rides, and traveling at slow times when we can repeat many without any system). What remains to be seen is whether the FP+ experience is "good enough" for us to continue paying Disney prices or if we'll be taking a bit of a hiatus and waiting for the next round of changes to (hopefully) improve the situation.

And I know we all started out as "once in a lifetime" types. The problem, from a business perspective, is that spending declines when guests make the transition from "once in a lifetime" to "frequent visitor". So there's little reason to cultivate that loyalty. I've said it before, and the whole next-gen project only makes me more certain - Disney is relying on the status of a visit to their parks as a childhood right of passage, among American children and increasingly for children in other countries around the world, to generate an endless supply of first time/once in a lifetime guests. They don't especially care if those guests "convert" into repeat business, and may actually view too much repeat traffic as a problem rather than an asset.

See this I can understand and are good points. that's why I say I love FP+ but I support your dislike on it. Which is why I hope they end the double/triple dipping quickly and only stick with the 3 FP fast. There are people who is not using FP+ and yet currently uses the double/triple dipping too. So number one thing is to quickly tie them down.

So what you're saying is that you don't want anyone to be able to work/game the system to their advantage except for the specific group to which you belong?

 

[Colleen27]

Problem is, once everyone is able to book TSM FP+ 60 days out, they might be gone in seconds, just like ADRs for Cinderella's castle. I hope not, but it's not impossible. We just don't know until we get there...

Exactly. Cinderella's, Le Cellier, and even Be Our Guest wouldn't be nearly so crazy to book if only on-site guests with verified park tickets could reserve them. I suspect FP+ availability will go the same way, once it is open to the same wide audience that can utilize the ADR system.

 

[bcrook]

I do agree with this. I really hope that fast pass plus does not turn into something like the ADR system.

I just can't see how it can't. This week there was over 80,000 on site guests and probably more than 100,000 offsite guests. All onsite guests are not up to speed yet. When the other 55% get their access, the demand for those ride spots will move to online battles.

Disney execs fully hope this will be the case. So if this is a success for Disney, their goal is an ADR system for rides. The three limit means a more diverse population of people are prebooked for rides in advance, and they won't want to cancel. When these FP become scarce, they become valuable. Supply and demand. When they become in demand people will figure out how to get their share in advance.

 

[going/again]

So let me get this straight. You have just said you have no problem getting 3-4 FP for EE while those FP should have go to another person instead and also hold up the standby line at the same time. The new system is trying to prevent just that. You get the one FP and let the other guest enjoy the 2 - 3 FP rides for EE.

If that is what you mean by how the system works then you are exactly the reason FP+ is now tiered. You have created a FP frenzy that now people needs to go on to a web forum to learn how to get more FP than 1 per ride. Please go visit Universal and jam up HP instead.

The rules allowed them to get 3-4 FP's no one was doing anything other than what WDW allowed, why if they got there at RD should they not have more chance to ride than say someone who gets there mid afternoon, surely that's what the whole point of RD is about.