Help with math

[davper]

I taken many here on their word that it was not worth it to use points for the Cruise. But now that I am doing the math for myself, I am not seeing it.

Assumptions
4 Night Bahamian Cruise in April on Dream
Inside Stateroom category 11
Cash Price = 2457.16
2 passengers
87 points per person conversion = 174 points needed.
13 per point rental from David's
25% tax rate
$6 Maint Fee * 174 = 1044


$13 David's Rental rate* 174 points = $2262
$2262 minus Income Tax( (2262-1044)*.25 = 304.50) = $1957.50 cash in pocket to pay for Cruise.

So if I rent my points, I have $1957.50 to pay for the cruise and need $499.66 more.
If I just exchange the points, I just need $95 more.

Seems to me that you are better to use the points than rent them out. Or have I missed something?

 

[disneynutz]

IMO there are many variables which may make using points a possibility for the non-DVC room reservations. Bottom line is that Disney wants to advertise that your points can be used for things other than DVC resort stays but they deliberately set the cost high and add additional fees. In addition DCL and DVC are run by the same executive so he doesn't have to negotiate with another department or management team so you would think that they would use a small DCL discount as a perk but they don't.

If DCL occupancy picked up, DVC would be blacked out from booking as they have in the past.

If the numbers work for you than go for it.

Bill

 

[supersnoop]

Two issues with your math:

1. Four nights on the dream start at 103 points per person in regular season.
2. When I pulled up a cruise for February, it was $1,400 total for two people.

So, 103x2x$13 = $2,678, or $1,200 more than simply paying cash.

 

[davper]

The chart I found showed 87 points in April and the cash price was for April.

 

[erionm]

The chart I found showed 87 points in April and the cash price was for April.

The points you looked at were for the Disney Wonder.

 

[supersnoop]

The chart I found showed 87 points in April and the cash price was for April.

As erionm noted, you weren't looking at the Dream. I found a 4-night Bahama in April on the Dream for $1,890. That's still an extra $700.

There may well be some outlier scenarios where trading makes sense. I think the math works out more frequently for Disneyland hotels. But, the vast majority of the time, it's a terrible trade value.

 

[Dean]

I taken many here on their word that it was not worth it to use points for the Cruise. But now that I am doing the math for myself, I am not seeing it.

Assumptions
4 Night Bahamian Cruise in April on Dream
Inside Stateroom category 11
Cash Price = 2457.16
2 passengers
87 points per person conversion = 174 points needed.
13 per point rental from David's
25% tax rate
$6 Maint Fee * 174 = 1044


$13 David's Rental rate* 174 points = $2262
$2262 minus Income Tax( (2262-1044)*.25 = 304.50) = $1957.50 cash in pocket to pay for Cruise.

So if I rent my points, I have $1957.50 to pay for the cruise and need $499.66 more.
If I just exchange the points, I just need $95 more.

Seems to me that you are better to use the points than rent them out. Or have I missed something?

Normally you'll get a return of between $6 & $7.50 per point but there may well be an exception here and there. Normally it's when one missed the early booking discounts. The real value of DVC points is more in the $13-14 range renting privately minus taxes which would only be the tax rate on roughly half (the amount above dues). IMO this is never a reasonable scenario to buy but might be to use if you already own the points depending on the return, limitations of the points and personal situations. I'd also submit that the risk of using points, or points plus cash,is more than the risk of renting them out.

 

[davper]

The points you looked at were for the Disney Magic.

Your right. The link said Dream but gave me Magic.

 

[erionm]

Your right. The link said Dream but gave me Magic.

The point chart on the member website is for all 4-night cruises across all ships. And I was incorrect, 80-87 points for Apr 2016 is on the Wonder.

https://disneyvacationclub.disney.g...collection/2016_DVC_DCL_P3_4_Night_060115.pdf

 

[Anal Annie]

We used points for a cruise ONCE when we were new DVC members (in July-August). We banked nearly 3/4 of our yearly allotment of points and used those plus a whole years worth of points for 4 n cruise on the Wonder. We booked an inside Cat 10. THEN we were out of points and would have to either borrow or book with cash to take a trip the next year. Hard lesson learned. We own enough points to get 2 weeks a year in a studio so we in effect traded 2 weeks of vacation for 4 nights. Won't be doing that again any time soon….We just don't have enough points to squander them….

 

[SandyinMonterey]

We booked our first Disney Cruise sailing in 2016. We had to use an entire years worth of points and borrow most of the year after points PLUS pay cash. But we are splurging, it's a milestone birthday for me and our anniversary and we booked concierge. My husband has never been on a cruise and our daughter is more excited for the cruise than she has ever been for either a Disneyland or Disneyworld vacation. IMO, no it's not a great way to use points but this will be our once in a lifetime trip. .

 

[3dog2kidmom]

We're using points. The difference in what we could save by renting them and paying cash was minimal, and I get a cruise vacation for "free." If we used the points for a room reservation, we'd still have the cost of tickets and meals to come up with. Plus I have absolutely no appetite for the risks involved with renting my points. YMMV.

 

[Dean]

We're using points. The difference in what we could save by renting them and paying cash was minimal, and I get a cruise vacation for "free." If we used the points for a room reservation, we'd still have the cost of tickets and meals to come up with. Plus I have absolutely no appetite for the risks involved with renting my points. YMMV.

For others benefit, while the cost of the other items like tickets may play into one's budget, it does not play into the relative return on points between different options such as DVC vs a cruise.

 

[JimMIA]

April 2016 -- just one example of a competitive value:

Royal Caribbean Majesty of the Seas - similar size and quality to DCL Dream, inside stateroom:
Four nights -- Miami, Nassau, Coco Cay, Key West, Miami -- $269 per person.

And that's directly from the RCCL website -- not even bothering to check the cruise consolidators.

Just sayin'

 

[Lynne M]

Have you checked to see if there's availability on points for that cabin and those sailing dates? Don't assume that because it's available for cash, it's available for points.

 

[mort1331]

While for majority using points for DCL is points costly. There are some times it works out. I don't have the exact point totals, but I have a good friend that is using points on his Med cruise later this year and it works out beter for the them. These are people that know their points and are on their 20th cruise. So sometimes it might work.

 

[disneynutz]

While for majority using points for DCL is points costly. There are some times it works out. I don't have the exact point totals, but I have a good friend that is using points on his Med cruise later this year and it works out beter for the them. These are people that know their points and are on their 20th cruise. So sometimes it might work.

It might work but who wants to have to deal with it? Just like waitlists, why mess with them unless you have to?

Buy your DVC contracts at your favorite resorts for resort stays, book at 11 months and spend your free time on something other than trying to get a Disney reservation. Vacations should be fun and not extra work.

Bill

 

[mort1331]

It might work but who wants to have to deal with it? Just like waitlists, why mess with them unless you have to?

Buy your DVC contracts at your favorite resorts for resort stays, book at 11 months and spend your free time on something other than trying to get a Disney reservation. Vacations should be fun and not extra work.

Bill

While I agree, its no extra work for them, and this trip is almost free with points for flights, and just his dues for the points needed for the cruise.
This has only happened once before for him, but no work he just checks before booking and if it works. Bobs your uncle.

 

[Dean]

While for majority using points for DCL is points costly. There are some times it works out. I don't have the exact point totals, but I have a good friend that is using points on his Med cruise later this year and it works out beter for the them. These are people that know their points and are on their 20th cruise. So sometimes it might work.

There have been very limited situations where it can work, the same for other cash type exchanges as well as RCI/BVTC. Certainly not enough to EVER make it reasonable to buy for that reason but one should always look at the options. The first AK on the Dream I think was $10 a point. Someone posted they got a transatlantic for $18 a point though I suspect that's because they missed other discounts rather than the inherent savings or more likely, they miscalculated in some way. And if one hit's something that is not discounted, that may work out as well. Maybe a holiday week for the CC, a higher cabin that may not be discounted much or a high end week through BVTC. In addition to the almost always inherently higher costs there is significant risk using DVC points for anything where the points cease being DVC points. For a cruise for a direct cash reservation, one can cancel without any penalty up until 75 to 120 days prior to sailing unless the agency used has any additional charges or fees for changing/canceling. Normal deposit amounts 10-20% IIRC. Any points used will now be reservation points if one has to change or cancel and any cash amount is due in full up front. Plus the $95 fee is charged again with most any changes and is non refundable. To me that puts the risk of using points at far greater than risks when renting unless one is near the cancelation cutoff window anyway. There have been a number of reports of people losing the points or having to setting for minimal options when the deal with south for some reason.

 

[mort1331]

There have been very limited situations where it can work, the same for other cash type exchanges as well as RCI/BVTC. Certainly not enough to EVER make it reasonable to buy for that reason but one should always look at the options. The first AK on the Dream I think was $10 a point. Someone posted they got a transatlantic for $18 a point though I suspect that's because they missed other discounts rather than the inherent savings or more likely, they miscalculated in some way. And if one hit's something that is not discounted, that may work out as well. Maybe a holiday week for the CC, a higher cabin that may not be discounted much or a high end week through BVTC. In addition to the almost always inherently higher costs there is significant risk using DVC points for anything where the points cease being DVC points. For a cruise for a direct cash reservation, one can cancel without any penalty up until 75 to 120 days prior to sailing unless the agency used has any additional charges or fees for changing/canceling. Normal deposit amounts 10-20% IIRC. Any points used will now be reservation points if one has to change or cancel and any cash amount is due in full up front. Plus the $95 fee is charged again with most any changes and is non refundable. To me that puts the risk of using points at far greater than risks when renting unless one is near the cancelation cutoff window anyway. There have been a number of reports of people losing the points or having to setting for minimal options when the deal with south for some reason.

100% agree, just pointing out that it can work. I would never recommend it, but it works for them.