Help - Prices in school holidays

[kristieuk]

I say well done to the headmaster for having high standards!!

Yes, I totally agree with you about the travel agents being greedy.. but its all about supply and demand...when demand is high.. the prices rise...
Out of school holidays the prices go down as less people want to travel.

I MUCH prefer going out of season to Disney.. but now my son is in school - that is the price (no pun intended!) that we pay.

It is the law that your child should be in school full time - and thats why the school is standing firm on this issue.

I realise that this is a contencious subject - and of course, you must all do what you think is best for your child - but to me making sure that my son is in school when he should be is a priority. I do not want him to feel different from the other children by missing two to three weeks out of school so we can save a few hundred pounds!! (Dont get me wrong, I would LOVE the savings!)

But actually its not about the money to me, its about the principle. We would not be allowed to take our child out of school either for a holiday - and I would never ever ask to head teacher if we could. I believe strongly that kids should learn that there are rules that they have to follow. One of the rules is that you should be in school in term time (unless unable to attend due to illness).

What sort of example are we setting our future generation by telling that that its ok to break these rules.. just to save money?!

I am sure I will be flamed for this... but it is an issue I feel very strongly about.

If you dont like the prices.. then dont go.. its as simple as that. I would love a mercedes, but I cant afford one!

(climbing into flame proof suit and ducking!)

FYI there is no 'law' that says children must attend school every day unless they are ill. Many schools will authorise absences for holidays, and it is the unauthorised absences that cause problems....

I appreciate that we are each entitled to our opinions, but I don't feel that this is place to castigate other people for how they choose to bring up their own children and make them feel as though they are doing something wrong.

We would not have a problem paying the extra we would pay for our November trip during the summer holidays. It is not about the money in every case - in ours it's simply that we prefer to take our main holiday in November to escape the grey and drizzle, and because even if we wanted to go away in the summer holidays, it would be very awkward if not impossible for us both to take the time off work (we are both criminal solicitors at our firm. It is extremely expensive if not virtually impossible to get locum solicitors during school holidays).

At the end of the day, it is personal choice. We went on family holidays during term time many times when I was younger - my dad worked in the Middle East, and we had to go when he had his leave. It did me no harm at all, and it certainly didn't give me the impresssion that 'it's ok to break the rules'. As far as I was concerned, and as I still believe, there are no rules that are being broken just because you take your children on holiday - particularly when it is with the blessing of the school.

 

[The Wolf]

I have to say I do think the attitude of schools has become quite disgudting.

We are trying to take friends with a 7 and 8 year old with us to our place over there next year and the jacked-up prices outside of term time are laughable. Why does it suddenly cost more to fuel, crew and fly the plane in those times of the year, yet becomes cheaper when less people fly? Yes I do understand supply and demand but at some point logic has to take over.

As for the attitude of schools, as long as the kids aren't struggling and they aren't missing anything important, my opinion is they would have a much more educational experience for the few days either side of the holidays (exposure to different environment, culture etc) than sitting in a class room. A time when let's be honest, most of the kids and staff are looking forward to a break than hard academic achievements.

I understand the need for education but I know from my own experience that does not always come from sitting in a class room.

 

[SammieG]

By law, all children of compulsory school age (between 5 and 16) must get a proper full- time education. Parents are responsible for making this happen, either by registering the child at school or by making other arrangements which provide an effective education. (I dont think that includes taking your child to Disney world.. as much as we would all love it to!!) -
I am suprised at you Kristieuk, with you being a lawyer- I would expect you to be aware of that.

It is not the parents right to take kids out of school for holidays.

I am not suggesting in any way that your kids will be damaged by taking them out in terms of missing work etc, but as you have proven, (as you were taken out of school in term time - and you now think its ok!) it does make you believe that its ok to be absent from school for holidays during term time. I can totally understand that you want to get away in November as its grey and drizzly... but you do have half term around then! The other issue is completely understandable - and may well lead you to take holidays at other times of the year.

Of course, its also down to the school whether they grant you up to 10 days leave a year of authorised absence -. I personally wouldnt want to choose a school that allowed kids time off willy nilly.. but dont critisise the school for not allowing it.. its their right!

Yes, I appreciate that family time is very very important. Yes I appreciate that visiting other countries is an important educational experience, but these are really excuses! You can do ALL these things within the very long school holidays if you so wish.

You would like to go away when its cheaper and less crowded.. I dont blame you! So do I!

I am interested to know how you would feel if the teachers wanted to go on holiday during term time... is that acceptable? It wouldnt be to me if my sons teacher was away having fun during term time.

You are more than entitled to your opinion.. but so am I. And this is a discussion board and we are discussing. You say: "I appreciate that we are each entitled to our opinions, but I don't feel that this is place to castigate other people for how they choose to bring up their own children and make them feel as though they are doing something wrong."

Its got nothing to do with how you choose to bring up your children, and I am certainly not "castigating" you. I dont mind what you do.. I dont even know you! I also dont think any less of anyone for taking their kids out of school. I almost envy the fact that it doesnt worry you! But for me its about following a legal requirement to have your children in school (or equivalent).

Yes, of course there will always be cases where you have to remove a child from school as parents cant get time off in holiday times etc.. but unless you are one of those cases, I do believe to take your child out of school for 2 - 3 weeks is unnecessary during term time when we have a fifth of the year off school as it is.

To tag a day or two onto the holidays either way doesnt worry me so much to be honest... its the length of time (two weeks plus!), and the feeling in this country that we are owed that time.. and its our time to take. No its not.. its totally at the descretion of the school - and I still believe that headmaster was right. He had standards that he wanted to keep up!

I am sorry if this offends anyone. I just feel so strongly that standards are allowed to slip in this country and people get too scared to stand up for their beliefs for fear of being shouted down.

You are entitled to your views as much as I am - I am just stating the law, and saying that I personally dont find it an acceptable way to behave for my own child.

Flame proof suit re-zipped up!

 

[alisonbestford]

hi
have you thought about disneyland paris i know its not quite the same but we used to do that every year.the children go free from jan tomarch so you could consider the feb half term.

michelle

Hi Michelle ,

Does DLP not exclude free child places for Feb half term?

I'm asking because I have no idea and am interested

It always seems to work out so expensive whenever I've tried to 'price it up' but I suspect I may not be looking in the right places

 

[SammieG]

Alison: I see from your siggy.. that you are renewing your wedding vows? Are you doing that at Disney?

That sounds wonderful.. would love to know more about it!

 

[alisonbestford]

Unfortunately the WDW vow re-newals are way, way beyond our budget..

Thanks to the DIS wedding boards I've found two likely venues:

http://www.centralfloridaweddingchapel.com/

http://www.whitechapelweddings.com/wedding_chapel3.htm

Both places have reasonably priced vow re-newals so we need to ask if a date is available (once we've decided on one!), arrange the stretch limo (DD's request ) and then a character meal or something for later

Should be fun .

There'll only be the 3 of us and then DF and her DGD who live locally.

Actually, thinking on that one, I guess we have to look into dates for school holidays in Orlando so that DGD can attend!

 

[kristieuk]

SammieG - I really don't appreciate your attitude. As I have said, you are more than entitled to your opinion, and I am not criticising your opinion. What I am annoyed about is the way that you appear to be criticising other people's actions.

I have to say that your tone IMHO goes beyond 'discussion'. You haven't put your case in terms of 'it may be what other people do, but we prefer not to' - you are basically saying that the state of the country is somehow contributed to by parents who choose to allow their children to go on holiday. And while we are on the subject of the state of the country - it's 'contentious' (your sp).

The fact that I was allowed time off when I was younger has not, as you insinuate, had some kind of negative effect on the way that I now view the world.

And yes, I am a lawyer, and whilst I don't disagree with what you say about the law stating children must be educated full time, I don't accept that by taking them on holiday with leave authorised by the school, any of us are breaking the law.

This discussion has come on these boards many times, and I must say that in the past there has been a mutual respect no matter what the view of the writer, and I echo that now. Of course parents who are concerned about taking their children out of school have the right not to so, and I would never feel so superior that I would tell them they were wrong.

All I am saying is that we have sought the view of the school (a very highly respected local church school), and if they are happy to encourage it, and I am happy that our daughter is happy, I have no problem.

I think you should be careful the way you put your views, to avoid causing offence to others.

 

[Miffy2003]

Hi Michelle ,

Does DLP not exclude free child places for Feb half term?

I'm asking because I have no idea and am interested

It always seems to work out so expensive whenever I've tried to 'price it up' but I suspect I may not be looking in the right places

Alison I am delighted to let you know that the offer still applies in Feb half term!!! Delighted because I am going to be using it then I think

If you have any DLP questions please come and join us on the DLP board! (Link in my sig)

 

[alisonbestford]

Alison I am delighted to let you know that the offer still applies in Feb half term!!! Delighted because I am going to be using it then I think

If you have any DLP questions please come and join us on the DLP board! (Link in my sig)

Thanks

 

[SammieG]

I think you should be careful the way you put your views, to avoid causing offence to others.

likewise Kristie!

Please dont read more into what was said, than is actually there!!
I am as entitled to my opinion as you are.. and have stated that for MY child I would not do it. I also stated that I do not think less of people that do take their children out of school.

Also, I never said "you are basically saying that the state of the country is somehow contributed to by parents who choose to allow their children to go on holiday" -

I have said nothing of the sort!
I was merely replying to your statement that it was not a legal requirement to have your children in school -( which it is!) and saying that I was pleased that the headmaster stuck to his guns on this issue. I also said I quite understood why YOUR family might want to go out of season.

Also, I thought it was rather petty that you corrected my spelling! I wasnt aware that spelling words correctly was an issue on the boards! But if it is, I will make an effort to try harder next time.

Now, please at least be decent enough to allow me to have my opinion -I am allowing you to have yours. I am not interested in correcting your grammar or spelling as that seems rather immature (and anyway yours is completely perfect! )

I am not saying you are a bad parent.. just stating what the law says.. and saying that for me and my sons school, it matters. I also said that I envy you for not minding.. I would love to save the money - and not go at the hottest time of year! I personally couldnt do it.. I would feel too guilty and dont feel that it sets a good example to my child.

Now, can we please be friends!?

(You flippin lawyers are all the same (I should know I come from an ENTIRE family of them!! argue argue argue.. see.. and I have to learn to stand up for me!!!)

 

[kristieuk]

Ok, if I have taken what you have said in the wrong way, I apologise. I don't come on these boards to argue - quite the opposite - it makes a refreshing return to happy things .

 

[pmcpmc]

I have never paid more than £350 .
I leave it until the price is right.
Flew this year from glasgow for £269 on the 8th July.

 

[rob@rar.org.uk]

FYI there is no 'law' that says children must attend school every day unless they are ill.

There is a law which requires parents to ensure their child recieves a full-time education (which means, in effect, 'every day'). The basis for the many regulations and Orders concerning the requirement to attend full-time school (or other approved provision, including education at home) is S7 of the Education Act 1996 which states that:

"The parent of every child of compulsory school age shall cause him to receive efficient full-time education suitable -
(a) to his age, ability and aptitude, and
(b) to any special educational needs he may have,

either by regular attendance at school or otherwise."

Regards

Rob

 

[alisonbestford]

There is a law which requires parents to ensure their child recieves a full-time education (which means, in effect, 'every day'). The basis for the many regulations and Orders concerning the requirement to attend full-time school (or other approved provision, including education at home) is S7 of the Education Act 1996 which states that:

"The parent of every child of compulsory school age shall cause him to receive efficient full-time education suitable -
(a) to his age, ability and aptitude, and
(b) to any special educational needs he may have,

either by regular attendance at school or otherwise."

Regards

Rob

Fair does but, if the school allows it. the parents aren't against it and the child has neither learning, nor excessive absence through illness problems (or for any other reason come to that!) it should remain a personal/family choice-especially as legislation, in many areas, allows it to date

 

[rob@rar.org.uk]

Fair does but, if the school allows it. the parents aren't against it and the child has neither learning, nor excessive absence through illness problems (or for any other reason come to that!) it should remain a personal/family choice-especially as legislation, in many areas, allows it to date

Yes, I agree with you. I was simply correcting a factual error made earlier in this thread.

I think term-time holidays should be the result of negotiation and agreement between school and parents (as with so much else in education), and every effort should be made by both sides to achieve this. Where agreement can't be reached I think that parents views are more important, providing they don't act unreasonably (in which case schools have more serious sanctions than recording absence as unauthorisd).

Regards

Rob

 

[kristieuk]

There is a law which requires parents to ensure their child recieves a full-time education (which means, in effect, 'every day'). The basis for the many regulations and Orders concerning the requirement to attend full-time school (or other approved provision, including education at home) is S7 of the Education Act 1996 which states that:

"The parent of every child of compulsory school age shall cause him to receive efficient full-time education suitable -
(a) to his age, ability and aptitude, and
(b) to any special educational needs he may have,

either by regular attendance at school or otherwise."

Regards

Rob

Perhaps I didn't explain myself properly. I do not dispute that the law says children must have a full time education by attending school regularly. I am well aware that this is the case.

I felt it was being implied that the law says parents are breaking the law for taking their children on holiday, and I do not accept that this is correct, when leave has been authorised in advance.

All I was trying to point out was that taking a child on holiday does not negate the fact that they are having a full time and regular education. The law does not say 'children must attend school every single day of the school year'. If it did, it would no doubt be unlawful to take them out for holidays, and schools would not authorise absences.

Of course, it's a matter of semantics, and there must come a point (eg if children are regularly not attending school) that their education would not be considered to be 'full-time'. All I was saying is that parents who do go on holiday during term time are not, per se, breaking the law, or preventing their children from having a full time education.

This is an argument that will go on forever, and I for one wish I had never become involved in this discussion.

 

[Pixiebell]

By reading these posts, I realise that this is a hotly contended issue, but i do feel that schools (and the law) should have a more lenient view depending on the age of the child.
A child in secondary school, or studying GSCE's, probably should not be taken out of school, as this could have an effect on their studies, but for children under 10, surely there could be a more sensible arrangement?

Yes, they have to understand the 'rules' of school life, and should be getting that experience, but are they really missing anything of vital importance, especially for the younger section (5 and 6), that two weeks away would stiffle their education?

Could parents ask the school what sort of things the child would be learning during those two weeks, and try to incorporate it into the holiday (learning to read the menus, or writing a postcard back home, or adding up the till receipts of the day for their maths - and to scare the adults on how much they have spent that day! A quick trip to the Everglades, or even just on an air boat ride could show them some of the geography of the area, and some of the natural history and wildlife. The holy land experience would give them religious education! They could even do a whole project on space travel at Kennedy. Most of the Disney parks (and SeaWorld) offer educational tours that could be helpful to them.

I probably agree that two weeks away to go and lie on a beach somewhere is not really worth taking your kids away from school, but going to Disney is so much more than that.

 

[wilma-bride]

I have never paid more than £350 .
I leave it until the price is right.
Flew this year from glasgow for £269 on the 8th July.

To be fair, 8th July is not school summer holidays though - most English schools don't start their summer holidays until the end of July.

 

[alisonbestford]

This is an argument that will go on forever, and I for one wish I had never become involved in this discussion.

LOL This subject, alongside re-fillable mugs and the use of family/companion restrooms is one best avoided if at all possible

Problem is, we all have our own opinions which MUST be heard (Iknow I feel like that at times when I need to vent ) and so they'll go on......

 

[rob@rar.org.uk]

The law does not say 'children must attend school every single day of the school year'. If it did, it would no doubt be unlawful to take them out for holidays, and schools would not authorise absences.

The law states "full-time" education. I'm not sure how else that could be interpreted other than every day? It certainly doesn't mean that parents can pick and choose what days they send their kids to school.

The reason why authorised absences can be given for term-time holidays is that there is a specific regulation [Education (Pupil Registration) Regulation 1995] which enables headteachers to authorise up to 10 days per academic year for the purpose of family holidays. There are also regulations which permit parents to withdraw their children on specific days for things like religous reasons. These regulations were put in place so there was some flexibility about school attendance, but they do not mean that the Education Act 1996 is null and void.

Regards

Rob