Half the street shuttered – Now that’s MAGIC!!

[Another Voice]

By the way –

"Michael Eisner's been around the block AV and you and I both know what that party looks like…Once you get a taste of the other side, its unbelievably difficult to walk away from the money.'

So now that he's siphoned a billion dollars from the company he's supposed to be excused somehow to make The Hot Chick and the 'Orange Spinner'? Worse, we're supposed to just shut-up and accept that "that's how everyone else does it? What an amazing view of success – it lets you do even less.

I am truely amazed at the number of people who scream that Disney is the biggest, the best and the brightest - yet never hold to a standard higher than "everyone else does the same thing".

Enjoy your sitckers.

 

[KNWVIKING]

When I say "how does it affect me" I'm not implying that if doesn't affect me its not big deal. I'm trying to put myself in the situation that the poster is talking about to try and understand what they mean. Just because someone threws out a catchy phrase like "more for less" doesn't make so. Being charged $5 for 5 chick fingers today and $5 for 4 tomorrowisn't the same as $6 for 4.

***How ABOUT staying on property. What you're saying is that it's okay for Disney to charge more, as long as they offer you a discount?! HUH?!? ***

I'm sorry,it must be late because that makes no sense to me. With the room discounts today, does the same room at any resort cost more or less then what they were charging when WDW was running nearly 100% occupancy ? Unless I'm mistaken they are charging less. So where does "more for less" apply. And since we're discussing WDW, off-site properties are meaningless. Of course they're cheaper.


Okay, let me see if I get this right. CBR and CS both are 160.56 but I'm paying 0.04 per square foot more at CS. Well I guess I just don't have an answer for that astounding bit of information. I hope nobody who enjoys staying at CS reads this thread, I'm sure it would ruin their next trip there.

Meal Deals: What rates were jacked up ? The price of the items included in the deal didn't go up. With the meal deal you can get approx an $18.00 meal/soda/ice cream for $12.50 (or something close to those figures). Is that more for less ?

*** Sure is an unbelieveable deal. It's amazing how it's the first discount that Disney has advertised on such a huge scale. Have you ever seen ads for discount codes before the fairy tale package? I hadn't. Me thinks something stinks in the land of Disney.***

This is also confusing. What stinks ? Is this an example of more for less ?

*** I see.....you're back into that mode of "it doesn't affect me, so it doesn't matter". Does it matter that that $2 increase went into effect for the off season too? ***

The $2.00 increase affects me the same as everybody else.Only I accept the fact that prices go up. I raised my shop rate $2.00 in Jan. I guess you'd conclude that my customers are paying more for less. Of course the tech's that got pay raises may disagree with your concept but hey, this isn't about them is it.

*** Do you work for Eisner? That sounds like his rationale.***
***Mention of the bottom line, AND self-reference! You DO work for Eisner!!!! ***

Amazing comeback responses for what I experience on my vacations. I guess I should invent horror stories about trips "others" take so I'm not considered an ME employee. Heaven forbid I give an honest opinion of my trips. I'm curious if the hard working CM's out there that read this boards would be offended by your inferences to working for Eisner ? You phrase it in such a demeaning manner.


AV,

*** (and they've been through crises far worse than 9/11 – and why has everyone else recovered and not WDW)***

What could have been worse then 9/11 ? (no sarcasm intended)
And has everyone else recovered? Last week the parking lots & garages at SW and US/IOA were the same so-so filled as MK and EPCOT. The Sherraton we stayed at was just now hitting 30% occupancy. Seemed everybody was in the same boat out there.

*** unable to convince its most loyal fans to drive twenty minutes ***

Why would they spend 20 minutes driving. Can't they just walk the three blocks and get there in 5 minutes

 

[hopemax]

While 9-11 was an overwelming tragegy in terms of human loss and our sense of safety, on an economic level it isn't as bad as the 1981-1982 recession or the recession of the 1970's.

Of course, the way the media acts you wouldn't know it.

For example, the national unemployment rate in May 2003 was 6.1%. In June 1992 it was 7.8% and in late 1982 it was 10.8% (and this was the highest rate sice 1940).

BTW, if anyone cares you can see the yearly national averages here.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/prev_yrs.htm

 

[EUROPA]

BTW....looks like someone has posted that Disney is in fact just cutting staff. I know its only one post but it does seem to match the Screamscape post as well...



http://disboards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=395505&perpage=15&pagenumber=4

Write Letters to Disney
In order for to get changes to be made at Walt Disney World, you need to write letters not only to Walt Disney World in Florida but also to the Walt Disney Company Head-Quarters in Burbank CA.

I know for a fact that staffing at Walt Disney World was Reduced or Cut-back in May 2003 at each Department in all areas at WDW in order to save money on Labor Costs, and is why the parks are not open as late as they use to be in the summer & with Fewer Parades & Shows, as well as having Slow-Service at the Attractions, Restaurants, Gift Shops and Transportation to Disney Hotels.

 

[crusader]

Hey I'm not excusing the guy just because I see this stuff everywhere. I've been hoping for integrity for a long time - but have yet to see any sign of it. The general consensus appears to be that a simple change at the top will automatically ressurrect Walt Disney. There has to be a little more realism in expectation here. It's ugly up there.

Oh by the way - nice editing job. Very effective.

As I have said before, I don't agree that the cutbacks are primarily responsible for the drop in attendance. It does not appear that many who are extremely vocal here are definatively leaving this place behind.

Surprisingly, the next generation of disneygoers are having a fantastic experience and identifying with the place similar to us. What that seems to imply is that the Disney of today still has the ability to surround our youth with the feeling that there is no other place like this.

We get older and see the differences and gripe about it but it may not transcend beyond this.

 

[KNWVIKING]

***We get older and see the differences and gripe about it but it may not transcend beyond this.***

This is where when we were kids and now our kids sorta roll their eyes up into the back of their heads as we ol' timers babble on about the "good ol' days". Wether we're talking Disney,music,television,school,clothes,etc.....

 

[KNWVIKING]

***While 9-11 was an overwelming tragegy in terms of human loss and our sense of safety, on an economic level it isn't as bad as the 1981-1982 recession or the recession of the 1970's. ***


I was thinking more along the lines of the sudden impact of the event. It was like everything in this country just stopped and we're still not back up to speed yet. Past recessions and recoveries have been like slow moving rollercoaster rides where 9/11 was like stepping off a cliff. My Disney history basically started in '95 so I don't know the effects the mentioned recessions had on WDW. I just think the last few years we've been hit with a lot all at once- recession,9/11,war.... Hard to imagine a worse time since Vietnam.

 

[Planogirl]

Economically, there have been worse times than the time since 9-11 and Disney managed to sail on through most of them. Now they seem to be stumbling a bit.

I am one of those happy shoppers that will notice the closed stores and while I can certainly handle fewer stores, where does it end? I remember people worrying about the closed skyride stations. Those are still sitting there appearing mighty dejected IMO. We've also lost the uniqueness of Main Street, rides that included unique audioanimatronics instead of "thrills", many musical acts (RIP Hitmen ), that extra chicken finger, etc. It's a little here, a little there and maybe a Mickey butter there and a submarine ride there... It just adds up to a gradual deterioration of the product or of "The Show" as the Baron puts it. Where will it end?

As for any of us going elsewhere, does a Disney fanatic cutting back on time spent at WDW and exploring other options instead count? I can't quit going to WDW cold turkey. I'm too hopeful that things will improve and yes, I still have a good time. It's not as good as it once was though so I'm looking around at other options and it's fun! Is this what Disney wants? I doubt whether Michael Eisner cares one way or the other what the Disney fanatics do.

Besides, remember that most vacationers aren't Disney fanatics, they just want to have a nice time on vacation.

 

[mickey2001]

Disney is looking for a NEW crowd with the FTP. People who DON"T remember what it was like and know no better! Thus they won't complain. Almost like they are on a mission to create a new customer base and not worry about their past loyal customers. They miust really be hurting when they have to make simple cuts as these. And I'm sorry , my CM friend who is a security person at MK still says that MK is VERY SLOW and that Disney inflates their estimates in hopes of making people believe its full.
As I said before its a quick way for Disney to make fast money. I'm surprised no one mentioned the cut back hours at PI which have been in place for months. These cut backs in services and staff throughout the property were planned long ago.

The thing that worries me with a smaller staff and somewhat larger crowds will be security at the parks!

 

[DisneyKidds]

Originally posted by thedscoop
...here's the deal. I've been out of town on business since the day after The World is Just That Simple Baron started this thread

Could somebody please save me some time and do a one or two paragraph summary. By looking at the last page, the discussion now appears to involve Stickers and 9/11...which, at first glance anyway, doesn't sound like much to do with early closings in Frontierland...

Thanks!

I think this thread has touched about all the bases...............................

Prices, quality, quantity, subjective based (how it affects me) vs. objective based (how it affects WDW) analysis of hours/attractions, etc., todays business environs vs. those of yesteryear and how that impedes or doesn't impede people from being as successful today as Walt was in the past, the effect 9-11/the current down market/war have today vs. the economic difficulties of the past, attendance, the ever closing gap between Disney and the competition which makes Waltonian success something that couldn't be replicated today, philosophy, tradition.........................and even the almighty chicken finger.

Pick your topic and jump in. I bet you won't believe this, but 9 pages and Baron and I might only account for a half - and most of my keystrokes were dedicated to agreeing with the Baronmeister. It is nice to see some relatively newer folk discuss topics we have been over time and again - and have some of them dual with the dark side .

As for the stickers.........................you got me . My guess is that it is one of AV's nebulous derogatory allusions to something he thinks the car 1 and 2 types are suckers for .

 

[Pinnie]

DisneyKidds,

Great Cliff Note version!!!

I did speak to a friend of mine who is a CM. He worked on Saturday night at the MK and said "Some of those shops don't do SQAUT in the evenings." and that staff could be pulled to areas that are in more need. There are times that he said the only action he got at his store was people coming in asking for quarters for the shooting gallery.

Staffing IS an issue. There are fewer College interns this year. My DS was approved for the program but pulled out when his university was going to refuse to give him credit. He can't afford to blow off a semester with NO credit.

He did make an interesting statement. Think about those pin carts. Everyone of them has a CM...if they closed THOSE, there would be enough staff to reopen stores!

pin

 

[CasualObserver]

Kidds,

I don't think I could possibly have done such a succinct summarization of this thread.


... and to even remember the chicken fingers! What thread would be complete without the chicken fingers.


Casual Observer

 

[KNWVIKING]

***It is nice to see some relatively newer folk discuss topics we have been over time and again - and have some of them dual with the dark side ***

I guess you mean me? Let me ask: Does anyone ever concede anything ? Any chance of a "you know,you're right. I never thought of it like that" ? Otherwise this is a tremendous waste of time. But it has been fun.

 

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by KNWVIKING


I guess you mean me? Let me ask: Does anyone ever concede anything ? Any chance of a "you know,you're right. I never thought of it like that" ? Otherwise this is a tremendous waste of time. But it has been fun.

No. Even the main point as to Why Disney is down is not conceded by either side.

You have the side that says its the 9/11 and bad economy.

Then you have the side that says Disney was going down before then and Quality, bad Investments and cutting services are the problems.

 

[DisneyKidds]

I guess you mean me? Let me ask: Does anyone ever concede anything ? Any chance of a "you know,you're right. I never thought of it like that" ? Otherwise this is a tremendous waste of time. But it has been fun.

Not just you, but it is nice to see you keep 'em on their toes. As for your question, well - that is a very dangerous one...................

Let me just say this. We travel on a street that goes in both directions, yet I only see learning go on in one . I think we ALL have something to learn, but one side of the aisle seems less inclined.....................OK, enough getting myself in hot water. Before you know it, this could lead to a new crop of modertors in the chilly vastness of the Disney internet .

Waste of time? Have you seen some of the past discussions we've had, and the time I've invested on a few of them . While it may not have moved some of us far from our beliefs, I have learned a lot about the history of Disney and I don't feel my time has been wasted, as is evidence by the fact that I am still here .

And yes, it still can be fun. Anyway, I don't need someone from the dark side to admit it to know that I am right .

 

[DisneyKidds]

All that being said, what's really the big deal?

I won't go into a chilly, Baronesque or AV-like diatribe on exactly what the big deal is, but I will state my agreement with Baron from this thread. It is simply bad Show. Why is that important?

I always think about my visits to other amusement parks. Take Hershey Park the last couple of times for instance. Every time I go I always notice all the closed shops and eating establishments. You know me, I'm not a nit-picky hard-a@@ looking for a reason to be frustrated , but I really do notice those closed establishments. It gives the park a desolate feeling, kind of dead and abandoned, lacking a certain joie de vive that makes for exciting atmosphere. Furthermore, I believe it is something specific that Walt made sure never happened in HIS parks. WDW is as much about Show as it is attractions, and bad Show has an impact. Add to that that it might very well be an inconvenience to some (if you absolutely have to have those baubles from Agrabah and you will only be in the MK until 10:30) and I think it is a bad idea. As I also said in my agreement with herr Baron, Disney needs to be a little more original in dealing with their problems that the tired old cut costs by reducing service (and diminishing Show) response.

I'm not sure if it was related to this new schedule for shops in the lands, but in May we wanted to get a Dole Whip and the place didn't open until 11:15. That really sucked.

BTW - you are welcome.

 

[d-r]

Maybe he means if you put a Disney sticker on a box we'd ride in it?

Maybe he means like the stickers that you give to kids to make them happy - it is just a cheap thing that you give them?

SnackyStacky-- do you really choose hotel rooms based on cost per square foot? Because as a consumer, I might decide that the newerness of coronado makes up for the difference in square foot - but yeah, CBR was the first "moderate" - the first resort not right next to a park - and it was built with bigger rooms - smaller than the ones that existed at the other resorts then, but bigger than the moderates built since then-

DR

 

[KNWVIKING]

***I have learned a lot about the history of Disney and I don't feel my time has been wasted, as is evidence by the fact that I am still here .***

Gotta agree with ya there. I now know more about Disney then I ever imagined I'd want to.

 

[crusader]

As for the stickers.........................you got me

I believe this was a shot fired in the general direction of yours truly to obliterate a certain smiley.

 

[DisneyKidds]

Originally posted by crusader
I believe this was a shot fired in the general direction of yours truly to obliterate a certain smiley.

Perhaps, as I know how much some people REALLY love those smilies.

pssst...... sometimes it is the only reason I use 'em .