Group or Individual Discipline??

[Luv'sTink]

He told them from day one that to play as a team they had to act as a team and a team acts as one. So if someone was not paying attention at practice, they all ran laps for instance. Or if someone did something wrong on the field, they all did push ups. For that particular set of boys, they started encouraging each other, started making sure everyone was paying attention (like nudging the guy next to them if he was looking off or something), they would call each other and make sure everyone was getting to practice, etc. Now it may not work for every group but it did for THAT group. On a later team with this coach, he had a couple of boys that just wouldn't respond to the rest of the team and he just switched to individual discipline and basically set them on the bench.

I do agree with the pp, punishing an entire grade or class doesn't work at all. Too many people involved and too many that don't care. A coach has a different situation in that at least 99% of the players WANT to be there and WANT to do well--not the same in a classroom situation.

Thanks for your reply.

That really was a special situation! How old were these kids?

 

[Luv'sTink]

It depends on the lesson you are teaching.

If you are emphasizing teamwork, then group discipline is appropriate. Otherwise it should all be individual.

Please tell me how to make those that don't do what is expected them, do what is expected of them...In a teamwork situation.

 

[perdidochas]

Please tell me how to make those that don't do what is expected them, do what is expected of them...In a teamwork situation.

Peer pressure.

It doesn't work for all groups, but does for some.

 

[Luv'sTink]

Peer pressure.

It doesn't work for all groups, but does for some.

Thank you for your reply.

 

[bicker]

Peer pressure. It doesn't work for all groups, but does for some.

Peer pressure is overrated as a means of evoking positive reactions. It works great, often, as a means of evoking negative reactions. So the objections to that approach aren't just a matter of "works" versus "doesn't work" but also a matter of "causing things to get better" versus "causes things to be worse". How often do the folks seeking to employ this approach take the time, and reasonably evaluate, whether they can be sure that the results of this approach will be only positive or neutral (i.e., that they, themselves, by pawning off their responsibility to lead onto the mob, will not effectively cause harm)?

 

[perdidochas]

Peer pressure is overrated as a means of evoking positive reactions. It works great, often, as a means of evoking negative reactions. So the objections to that approach aren't just a matter of "works" versus "doesn't work" but also a matter of "causing things to get better" versus "causes things to be worse". How often do the folks seeking to employ this approach take the time, and reasonably evaluate, whether they can be sure that the results of this approach will be only positive or neutral (i.e., that they, themselves, by pawning off their responsibility to lead onto the mob, will not effectively cause harm)?

Well, my father-in-law claims that they used peer pressure to great effect in Marine bootcamp in the 1950s.....

 

[bicker]

Well, my father-in-law claims that they used peer pressure to great effect in Marine bootcamp in the 1950s.....

The word "great" could mean "large" rather than "good". Regardless, part of the intention of Marine boot camp is to essentially break soldiers down - change their personality, as it were - such that they would be more willing to subvert what's best for themselves in favor of what's best for the platoon. It is a necessary aspect of military service, but most folks feel that citizens in society, in general, shouldn't be subjected to psychological manipulation to make them substantially more willing to sacrifice their own needs for that of society. That should be something that they willingly decide for themselves, in context and in terms of measure.

 

[LuvOrlando]

Well, my father-in-law claims that they used peer pressure to great effect in Marine bootcamp in the 1950s.....

Aren't ticked off marines better marines? What I mean to say is in some situations, even in some sports such as football, the aggression triggered by negative energy could cause a positive outcome if the groups goals can benefit from harnessing hostility and aggression. In the case of the marines & war I'd say your FIL is right, anything where the fight response is to be favored over the flight one when stressed.

I answered the original post under the assumption that the group leader wanted to bring about co-operation & unity for more peaceful goals... we were talking about kids right? I was thinking about a school environment, boy/girlscouts, within a household or something like that but if this is about something else where angry energy is desired then I will be the first to admit my first post is way off base. If you want to make someone angry or aggressive then group punishment is definitely going to be more effective than anything else.

 

[PixiePop]

Individual discipline.

 

[dislaney]

Personally I hate group discipline. I can see where it might work in some situations but most of the times I've seen it used it did not work and caused more *******. I do think the ones that are misbehaving, have to actual care for it to work and that is a big part of the problem.