GRAND OPENING - GRAND CLOSING (Florida)

[wombat_5606]

But where is the money coming from? In the end someone is gonna pay, most likely tax payers and it will hit the middle class the hardest in the coming years.

Perhaps those billionaires and companies that operate tax-free can pony up.

 

[RamblingMad]

Since this seems to be the active Covid thread, I’ll ask here, even if it’s a little off topic.

I was just reading this. If there isn’t a belief we can get herd immunity because immunity doesn’t last long enough, how will a vaccine be different? I’m not being snarky, I truly don’t understand the science. Is there a way a vaccine could give longer immunity, where it ould be an annual vaccine like the flu shot?

(also understanding this guy is talking about coronviruses in general, not specific to Covid).

https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news...23-20-intl/h_5994a02b5e0c50867ebdb04243cea7b9

Let’s say you can’t get herd immunity. Then your best option is treatment plans to lower the case fatality rate. But you still need an adequate number of ICU beds. Right now, 85% are in use in AZ, and we’re out of flu season.

 

[jlwhitney]

So we should have a nanny state since we have learned people are incapable of saving for a rainy day. It’s pouring right now.

no we shouldn’t. People need to take ownership of the decisions they make with their life. Yes I know there are many that try hard do everything they can to save and get ahead and get knocked down a lot. But there are many that spend foolishly and don’t think if the future.

 

[wombat_5606]

no we shouldn’t. People need to take ownership of the decisions they make with their life. Yes I know there are many that try hard do everything they can to save and get ahead and get knocked down a lot. But there are many that spend foolishly and don’t think if the future.

Sadly, in this country, there are a huge number that aren't paid adequately also.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

NOT AT ALL on expert on this

But I think the thought process is similar to the idea behind the flu vaccine

In both cases (getting it "naturally" or from a vaccine) once you have some sort of antibodies to it, your next round is often less severe. I think I remember from last year them saying if you got the flu and after the flu shot your symptoms and recovery time seemed to be less???

Interested to hear others take on this idea

That’s my hope too! I’m still hopeful for a vaccine, just trying to figure out if it can actually offer longer immunity. But yes, hopefully at the very least it can help in the severity of actually catching it later

You would need a booster if the immunity from a vaccine isn't lasting

Yes, I know that. So, if immunity only lasts a few months, you think we’ll all be getting this shot 4x a year? That doesn’t seem practical to me.

I do think this will be more like the flu vaccine and given annually and we cross our fingers the rest of the year. It would be easier if it this appeared to have a “season” like the flu because we coordinate inoculations to those hardest hitting months.

Let’s say you can’t get herd immunity. Then your best option is treatment plans to lower the case fatality rate. But you still need an adequate number of ICU beds. Right now, 85% are in use in AZ, and we’re out of flu season.

We’re not talking about ICU beds right now. I know that’s a problem, but not at all what I’m asking about. I’m trying to figure out the science in regards to the difference in length of immunity from herd immunity vs vaccination. Can vaccinations give us longer immunity?

Theraputics will have to be a given either way.

 

[SaintsManiac]

Yup. The US will be in debt for many more years because of all the Corona virus bailouts. Americans have been laid off and lost their health insurance. The measures to stop the virus spread have resulted in the spread of poverty.

I don't think printing more money is going to help.

The dangers of a greedy and capitalist society being exposed. Shocking.

 

[RamblingMad]

We’re not talking about ICU beds right now. I know that’s a problem, but not at all what I’m asking about. I’m trying to figure out the science in regards to the difference in length of immunity from herd immunity vs vaccination. Can vaccinations give us longer immunity?

Theraputics will have to be a given either way.

Depends on the vaccine. When I went to South America, one of the vaccines I had had two different times it lasted based on whether I took the pill form or the injection. I have no clue how long a COVID-19 vaccine would last.

 

[Jrb1979]

That’s my hope too! I’m still hopeful for a vaccine, just trying to figure out if it can actually offer longer immunity. But yes, hopefully at the very least it can help in the severity of actually catching it later

Yes, I know that. So, if immunity only lasts a few months, you think we’ll all be getting this shot 4x a year? That doesn’t seem practical to me.

I do think this will be more like the flu vaccine and given annually and we cross our fingers the rest of the year. It would be easier if it this appeared to have a “season” like the flu because we coordinate inoculations to those hardest hitting months.


We’re not talking about ICU beds right now. I know that’s a problem, but not at all what I’m asking about. I’m trying to figure out the science in regards to the difference in length of immunity from herd immunity vs vaccination. Can vaccinations give us longer immunity?

Theraputics will have to be a given either way.

At this point we are probably better off looking for better treatment options. Once that happens we can really get back to way things were.

 

[KayMichigan]

Yeah, an effective treatment is much more likely than a vaccine. I know there are tons of vaccines in development right now, but there's a good chance none of them will pan out. There has never been a successful vaccine developed for a coronavirus.

I'm concerned that they're fast tracking the vaccines just so things can open back up and they'll approve one that has dangerous long term side effects that won't be revealed until it's too late.

 

[Planogirl]

I can understand why so many people want things to be open and normal. I sympathize with those who need to work and have been hit hard by this. I can understand the desire to get out and enjoy life.

However things aren't normal no matter how hard some people pretend. I hate wearing a mask! I do wear one when I'm out because I feel like it's the right thing to do. I'm not being noble but mindful that we can help keep others from getting sick which in turn helps me avoid getting sick. It's a give-give idea.

I'm very disappointed that so many Texans aren't wearing the masks. I can only conclude that they just don't care about others. I know that there are exceptions where people are claustrophobic and so on but I don't believe that this is a large number. I sometimes think "why bother?" but still wear the horrible things.

Wearing these could have been required here. Businesses could still be open and people could still do what they want. But no, "my rights!"

 

[godisney14]

For the glass half full people, you can reclassify “daily new cases” to “daily vaccinations”. Is there a difference between being infected and being vaccinated (with a ~2% chance of a serious adverse effect)?


/sarcasm

And please don’t mistake this comment to think herd immunity is an option right now. The US has the most cases in the world, yet we’re nowhere even close to thinking about herd immunity.

 

[tippity]

They could have given those corporate bail outs to the citizens of their country so that way we don't end up with mass poverty... but what do I know

Yes, of course. SAme with the real estate/ bank bailouts in 2008. But it never happens does it?

 

[NotUrsula]

Florida has begun pulling the liquor licenses of bars that do not enforce social distancing: https://www.tampabay.com/news/healt...-follow-social-distancing-guidelines-or-else/ They were previously giving warnings, but now the ABT agents are empowered to do immediate closures. It's not clear from the news story how many temporary closures might be allowed before permanent license loss, but personally I hope it is zero when blatent disregard is the reason why. Losing your liquor license is a truly big deal in Florida, because there are only a finite number of them.

Based on tracing accounts that I have seen, next to group living facilities for the elderly and disabled, bars seem to be ground zero for hotspots with traceable multiple infections among younger adults. I think that if the state can get a handle on the bar situation, that will probably be the most effective step toward knocking the spike back down.

 

[tippity]

The dangers of a greedy and capitalist society being exposed. Shocking.

Unfortunately , this happens everywhere, doesn't matter what form of government is in charge.

 

[tippity]

I sure do, and it has been solidified by words and actions the last few months. If that type of behavior is acceptable to you, then I'm sorry for you.

Ah yes, that's a great attitude. Every viewpoint is acceptable as long as it matches yours. I try to keep an open mind as to why people aren't compliant with the masks. I never said that I supported them or that I thought they were right. I only suggested trying to look at the world from their POV.

 

[hertamaniac]

Florida has begun pulling the liquor licenses of bars that do not enforce social distancing: https://www.tampabay.com/news/healt...-follow-social-distancing-guidelines-or-else/ They were previously giving warnings, but now the ABT agents are empowered to do immediate closures. It's not clear from the news story how many temporary closures might be allowed before permanent license loss, but personally I hope it is zero when blatent disregard is the reason why. Losing your liquor license is a truly big deal in Florida, because there are only a finite number of them.

In the Orlando area, a local bar near UCF just had it's license suspended after 13 employees and 28 patrons tested positive.

https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/k...mployees-customers-test-positive-for-covid-19

 

[tippity]

In the Orlando area, a local bar near UCF just had it's license suspended after 13 employees and 28 patrons tested positive.

https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/k...mployees-customers-test-positive-for-covid-19

Glad to hear it. I hope that happens here in AZ too.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

Florida has begun pulling the liquor licenses of bars that do not enforce social distancing: https://www.tampabay.com/news/healt...-follow-social-distancing-guidelines-or-else/ They were previously giving warnings, but now the ABT agents are empowered to do immediate closures. It's not clear from the news story how many temporary closures might be allowed before permanent license loss, but personally I hope it is zero when blatent disregard is the reason why. Losing your liquor license is a truly big deal in Florida, because there are only a finite number of them.

Based on tracing accounts that I have seen, next to group living facilities for the elderly and disabled, bars seem to be ground zero for hotspots with traceable multiple infections among younger adults. I think that if the state can get a handle on the bar situation, that will probably be the most effective step toward knocking the spike back down.

I think I read last night that TX is doing the same.

I know there are people who get their livelihood from bars, but this one that didn't make sense to me on reopenings. They aren't necessary and seem like the perfect storm to release inhibitions counter intuitive to social distance!

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

Just an updated to the vaccine conversation. This company thinks it may require 1-2 booster shots. And is expected to have it widespread by mid 2021. Will be interesting to watch this vaccine race. Despite beings skeptical, I will continue to keep my fingers crossed I'm wrong and one of these works.

https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news...23-20-intl/h_0bd7e4cfcf63eff4f26fc222789bd884

 

[godisney14]

An update on Florida's ICU hospitalization status:
Even with adding new ICU beds, the availability has been going down. The number of patients currently in the ICU went up by 29% in just 3 days. And this is just the beginning of the current uptrend.

Date	Adult ICU census	Available Adult ICU	Available Adult ICU%	Total Adult ICU Capacity	Pediatric ICU census	Available Pediatric ICU	Available Pediatric ICU%	Total Pediatric ICU Capacity
June 21	4,316	1,647	27.62%	5,963	368	238	39.27%	606
June 24	5,573	1,325	19.21%	6,898	384	223	36.74%	607