Girl scouts threaten lawsuit

[cabanafrau]

I just read the article and am not surprised by the response from the Girl Scouts organization.

As a former Cookie Mom, yes, the troop/girls/families are responsible for selling the cookies they order from GSA. GSA gets paid FIRST. From then, whether you sell the remaining cookies or not, the GSA could care less. Each troop gets a very small percentage of each box. When I did it, the cookies sold for $3.50 each and the troop got .55 from each box. Once we paid off our debt to GSA, then the rest was our profit.

The paperwork and accounting was a nightmare! I've spent less time doing my taxes! Each box IS accounted for and if you want to exchange types of cookies, there is a form for that.

The amount of time and effort put into cookies sales is horrible for the rate of return. BUT, GSA REQUIRES each troop to sell cookies. If you do not sell cookies, then you are not allowed to participate in any type of fund raising for your troop.

Living in the DC area, another troop leader and I had to go to the GSA store in DC. We walked into the wrong entrance and ended up in the GSA Executive offices. Both of us looked at each other and said, "At least we now know where the cookie money goes."

I would just like to see the individual troops get more money from these sales. In turn, now that my DD is out of GS, when I see a troop selling cookies, I hand over a $10 or $20 and tell them that is for the troop's kitty. Beats the 55 cents they would get if I bought a box.

Sorry to say that the mother in question is going to have to pay for the cookies. It's on that ton of paperwork she signed at the beginning of cookie sales.

I also do not care at all for the way our local council handles almost everything. GS is a wonderful concept & can be a fantastic experience for the girls if they have good leaders. My youngest is still in scouting in HS because she has had an incredible group of leaders since she started as a Daisy in kindergarten. This year council has seriously overstepped on many issues with the girls & the leaders. As a result my daughter & the two leaders who remain from the original four, along with nearly every other girl in the troop will be finished. What a sad end to a group that was committed to earning their Gold. Their top leader all these years has no children, was a GS herself & planned to take any of them who were committed all the way through. Council here is definitely out to serve the interests of council employees, paid for on the backs of the fundraising efforts of the girls, their leaders and their parents. Sad and wrong.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Well as a former leader and cookie mom of many yrs, we often had a situation where we had unsold cookies.

Our troop would ban together to get those cookies sold because after all our troop would be "on the hook" so to speak for them.

Heck one year, I had to go and pick up a ton of cookies from a druggy mom who refused to deliver them.

The co leader and I hustled our butts off to get them sold. Any unsold comes out of the cookie profit for the troop.

All parents were made aware of the boxes we needed to sell and they did their part to help.

So basically the troop that this kid belongs to refused to help sell the cookies. I would say that is cutting off your nose to spite your face.

 

[Piper]

When I was a GS leader, I had a break-in the night before the cookie money was due and it was stolen. The police came and found the lock jimmied, some fingerprints and several muddy shoe prints around the back door (where they came in.) They also found a few checks scattered around the area. They concluded that it was neighborhood teenagers.

I turned in a copy of the police report and the council's insurance reimbursed the troop for the loss. I was so thankful! I never handled the cookie money after that--I didn't want to expose my family to that again. It was very traumatic.

 

[sapdaddy2]

I was a cub scout leader for years and the way the cubs sold the popcorn was the pack would place a show and sell order and receive it before the scouts personal orders would be turned in. From the personal orders they would take out the unsold popcorn and then place the personal order. In the end we were lucky to have a case of popcorn left. My niece has 500 boxes of GS cookies in her basement she needs to get rid of.

 

[KennesawNemo]

Well as a former leader and cookie mom of many yrs, we often had a situation where we had unsold cookies.

Our troop would ban together to get those cookies sold because after all our troop would be "on the hook" so to speak for them.

Heck one year, I had to go and pick up a ton of cookies from a druggy mom who refused to deliver them.

The co leader and I hustled our butts off to get them sold. Any unsold comes out of the cookie profit for the troop.

All parents were made aware of the boxes we needed to sell and they did their part to help.

So basically the troop that this kid belongs to refused to help sell the cookies. I would say that is cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Wow, one of the reasons my girl will not be a girl scout.

 

[pryncess527]

Does anyone else think that a national organization that is willing to get this much bad press over what has to be under $1500 is being very short sighted?

Well, to be fair, the National Organziation to my knowledge has not gotten involved yet. One troop leader talked to a mom and threatened legal action. Even the larger council office said that they'd work with the parents first and try a formal mediation before they'd resort to litigation.

The mom sounds a bit melodramatic. The last line of that article is her saying, "I did not want to go to jail over cookies" as if cops showed up at her door and cuffed her. Even if she were sued for the balance, it's highly unlikely she'd be sent off to jail . . . way to blow things out of proportion.

we always did pre-sales and then only bought cookies that had already been paid for. There is no way in hell my mom would have gone out on a line and agreed to take custody of hundreds of boxes of cookies that we'd be responsible for if we could not sell.

 

[NHdisneylover]

If the girl was truly being bullies, the parents trid speaking with the council to resolve the situation in teh troop or move her to another troop, and the council would not help at all, then yes, this would be a bad thing for the Girl Scouts to do.

My hunch, based on many years in scouting in four different councils, is that it is much more like a PP said (that Mom ordered the cookies then decided not to deal with it and pulled the girl) or something similar (girl has lost interest or decided she would rather take dance the same night, etc and so mom does not want to uphold the commitment she made).

Does anyone else think that a national organization that is willing to get this much bad press over what has to be under $1500 is being very short sighted?

I think when I was a scout that if you got cookies for specific people you already had orders but they didn't pay for them until we delivered the cookies (so it was risky doing door to door sales or even sales to coworkers of parents that they didn't know well). I'm not sure if the troop paid for them before they were delivered though. The few times this happened we tended to just add them to our troop pile to sell at booths (again don't know if those were paid for before hand or if they could be returned or not).

I think the issue is that it is never just this one parent. Every neighborhood I have been in has had at least one parent a year take hundreds of dollars in cookies and then either want to return them, or not even do that and also not pay. Most just don't go to the media with a sob story when they realize they cannot get out of the commitment they made.

BTW nowhere I have lived has ever made any girl or parent take cookies, often girls are told they must at least participate in booth sales to have a share in the money for field trips, etc but nobody ever has to take and sell cookies on their own, that is heavily pushed--too much so IMO--but NOT required.

 

[blingbowsparkles]

Yeah the Girl Scouts are not really the upstanding organization that they would like everyone to think they are. However if the mom took these cookies knowing she would be on the hook for them then that's her own fault. Perhaps she should read the fine print before signing for things. I have never gotten the fascination over GS cookies they really aren't that good .

 

[NHdisneylover]

Well, to be fair, the National Organziation to my knowledge has not gotten involved yet. One troop leader talked to a mom and threatened legal action. Even the larger council office said that they'd work with the parents first and try a formal mediation before they'd resort to litigation.

The mom sounds a bit melodramatic. The last line of that article is her saying, "I did not want to go to jail over cookies" as if cops showed up at her door and cuffed her. Even if she were sued for the balance, it's highly unlikely she'd be sent off to jail . . . way to blow things out of proportion.

we always did pre-sales and then only bought cookies that had already been paid for. There is no way in hell my mom would have gone out on a line and agreed to take custody of hundreds of boxes of cookies that we'd be responsible for if we could not sell.

Yeah, I also felt the mm was being super dramatic, which is a large part of why I question any of her story.

 

[sbtrfly74]

We have a lot of moms that order a boat load of cookies and just put them on their desks at work until they sell. They are not allowed to return them, we had one try last year and it was a firm "NO".

If the troop has to file a small claim suit then thats what they have to do.

Last year any left over cookies went to our local food bank that the leader had over ordered.

 

[teller80]

Wow, one of the reasons my girl will not be a girl scout.

This type of thing happens in EVERY organization - sports, band, PTO, boy scouts, church groups... you name it. You ask kids/parents to sell a product, the kids/parents take the product but don't pay for it. Then you're on the hook for the money.

When I run a fundraiser like that, I tell people I want cash (no check!) up front before I'll give them the product. The problem is, the Girl Scouts Organization says you can't do that. They make the troops let the girls take cookies and hope they pay for them.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Wow, one of the reasons my girl will not be a girl scout.

Which reason?

I mean I do not like how the GS's operate the cookie sales, but nothing you can do if you want to make money off cookies.

As a leader/cookie mom, I would not want the troop punished for another girl's abandonment of her cookies.

It is pretty easy to sell them actually.

You know going in that you might have an issue, you never know. That is why you make sure you do cookie booths.

As I got more experienced, you got better at ordering, booths, etc...

The way the councils I have been in operated was you had to buy by the case, so you ALWAYS had cookies that were extra you HAD to sell.

 

[jdb in AZ]

One of the neighbors down the street put out a sign that they have girl scout cookies for sale. DH came home with two cases of thin mints. In spite of the politics, they sell a great product.

Unfortunately, a lot of charities receive a very low percentage of their fund raising.

 

[TLuvsD]

Every Council sets the price of cookies (in some areas councils do it regionally)...a lot of the money stays in Girl Scouts--some to the troops, some to the Council to pay for staff, insurance, etc. Every parent signs a form that includes the fact that the cookies are not returnable and they are financially responsible for the cookies they take...they can take fewer and get more when the first batch is sold (some troops don't like this, but the parents can do it). It sounds like the mom got in over her head and now wants out.

The bullying is a separate issue. If it's happening, the local Council staff can advise the Leaders on how to solve the issue. But it's not fair for the other girls to have to pay for this woman's cookies (cookies are pulled by the troop from the council, not by individual parents).

 

[aprilgail2]

The way the councils I have been in operated was you had to buy by the case, so you ALWAYS had cookies that were extra you HAD to sell.

Wow that is not how it is here- if you sell 27 boxes of thin mints you get 2 cases and 3 loose boxes- no way would I take an extra 9 boxes if we had not sold them. I was cookie mom for 9 years in my daughters troop! Booth sales were easy, you went to council, handed in your paper saying you were having a booth sale, they loaded you up with a bunch of cases of each type of cookie- if you had your sale on a Saturday you had 4 or 5 days to return all the cookies you did not sell, cases and loose boxes. You never ever paid for ANYTHING you did not sell, there was no risk in doing booth sales, you never got stuck with extras!

 

[JanaDee]

Every Council sets the price of cookies (in some areas councils do it regionally)...a lot of the money stays in Girl Scouts--some to the troops, some to the Council to pay for staff, insurance, etc. Every parent signs a form that includes the fact that the cookies are not returnable and they are financially responsible for the cookies they take...they can take fewer and get more when the first batch is sold (some troops don't like this, but the parents can do it). It sounds like the mom got in over her head and now wants out.

The bullying is a separate issue. If it's happening, the local Council staff can advise the Leaders on how to solve the issue. But it's not fair for the other girls to have to pay for this woman's cookies (cookies are pulled by the troop from the council, not by individual parents).

Our troop got 45 cents per box they sold...a paltry amount.

How cookie sales were handled was one of the main reasons why DD is no longer a Girl Scout. Our council was less than impressive with how leaders and troops were treated.

 

[MSLRAC]

Wow that is not how it is here- if you sell 27 boxes of thin mints you get 2 cases and 3 loose boxes- no way would I take an extra 9 boxes if we had not sold them. I was cookie mom for 9 years in my daughters troop! Booth sales were easy, you went to council, handed in your paper saying you were having a booth sale, they loaded you up with a bunch of cases of each type of cookie- if you had your sale on a Saturday you had 4 or 5 days to return all the cookies you did not sell, cases and loose boxes. You never ever paid for ANYTHING you did not sell, there was no risk in doing booth sales, you never got stuck with extras!

The girls get the exact amount they sell here too. The troops do have to order by whole cases but those extras are used for cookie booths or transferred to other troops that need/want them. We never force extra cookies on parents or troops.

 

[msjprincess]

The girls get the exact amount they sell here too. The troops do have to order by whole cases but those extras are used for cookie booths or transferred to other troops that need/want them. We never force extra cookies on parents or troops.

I've been a Troop Leader and/or Cookie Mom for 6 years. It's the same here. But we don't have to order up to make full cases. We can go to Council and get loose boxes. Some things I'll order up because I know I can get rid of them. But I refuse to order 10 extra boxes of Savannah Smiles.

 

[NotUrsula]

I'll take those Savannah Smiles, LOL. DD's troop got a tasting box back in December, and they were on them like ravening wolves. We ordered 6 boxes for the family.

The timing of this complaint is a bit odd. AFAIK, the deadline for turning in advance cookie orders to the councils was this past Sunday. If the bullying thing had been happening as recently as the last meeting, the mom would have had plenty of time to pull the order before it went in. It sounds like a case of immediate cold feet to me.

My DD6 is the world's lousiest cookie seller, and I am not allowed to sell them at work. We ordered our pitiful 34 boxes (half of which were orders from her Dad and I), and that will be it. To compensate, I will be giving the troop a deductible donation of $50; they will get more direct revenue from that donation than from the sale of 100 boxes, so it's all good.

 

[MSLRAC]

The timing of this complaint is a bit odd. AFAIK, the deadline for turning in advance cookie orders to the councils was this past Sunday. If the bullying thing had been happening as recently as the last meeting, the mom would have had plenty of time to pull the order before it went in. It sounds like a case of immediate cold feet to me.

The sale periods vary by council. Most NC councils have had cookies from about a month now. At this point, the mother has yet to substantiate any of the bullying claims. From what I'm hearing from a cookie manager friend in that council, the girl didn't leave the troop until the troop leader refused to take the cookies back and there were no bullying claims until the mother went to the media.

I've also heard that the mother was offered multiple ideas and suggestions and even help to rid of the extra cookies but she didn't want to have to do anything herself to move them. That is when the leader stood firm and said that the troop would not take them back and they would turn her over to council for collection if she didn't pay.

It's a bad situation no matter how you look at it but it happens every single year to some degree. Cookies are big money and with big money comes lots of problems.