Further devaluation of owning at DVC !!!

[cdziuba]

RCI members seem to have found the Golden Goose, and are grabbing DVC exchanges and selling them on EBAY. Here are several running ads, all noting the RCI $95 fee. SOMEONE should be policing this. Disney...are you listening? It will be a free-for-all for RCI members if RCI and or Disney doesn't stop this. If you see ads for RCI DVC exchanges, you should report them, or it will be the death knell for DVC owners trying to rent, or trying to sell for decent money.

I'm not an owner, we decided to simply rent whenever we want to go, but if I was an owner, I'd be outraged. These should be reported, and if you're a DVC owner, I would think you'd know better who to send it to so someone at Disney would listen. This is another reason we won't buy... Disney doesn't protect its inventory or its owners from devaluation. Some of these ads have been running for many days.

 

[chris1gill]

If I didn't know renting out RCI reservations was against their rules and the reservation could be canceled, I'd be happy to take one of those 4th of July weeks.

I think this should be on the DVC Mouscellaneous board where everyone will see it. We've been members for ten years and I've not ever seen such a thing when we were under the II umbrella.

 

[CarolA]

So... what's the difference between this and a member renting it out? Sorry, but owners rent out all the time on here so I am not getting "outraged" at this LOL!

And since the ads have been running for seveal days... the Goose may turn out to be not so golden!

 

[Inkmahm]

So... what's the difference between this and a member renting it out? Sorry, but owners rent out all the time on here so I am not getting "outraged" at this LOL!

And since the ads have been running for seveal days... the Goose may turn out to be not so golden!

That was my question, too. Not sure what difference it makes as to who is doing the renting. DVC allows it as long as it isn't commercial renting.

 

[MikeyNS]

To me if the room is booked, the room is booked. I'm not bothered by who is taking up the room and by what means. Yes, DVC is a busy spot but we're lucky in that we can book way in advance and not worry about possibly not getting a room.

 

[culli]

If people don't care that I understand. But then why do people get fired up that Disney rents units for huge$$$$ especially when members can't book the dates?

Keep in mind that people are getting 2 br DVC resorts for under $700 for the week and then renting them out to others. When members rent their points I see this as a little different then someone grabing the DVCs off RCI with their cheap good traders just to churn them for a profit. Oh yeah this is also against RCI and II policy but I doubt they police the issue.

So when you don't understand why others don't understand why you own DVC and say they can get weeks for cheap.......well so be it.

It doesn't bother me that other can trade into DVC but the fact that they are not using them but using to churn a profit that bothers me. It is always the few that ruin it for the majority.

 

[Cmbar]

I agree this is a devalue of the DVC membership. Why would members want people to commercially rent DVC units. Dont' you think this is one of the reasons for the reallocation of points?? I have rented points from a DVC member but I wasn't going to pay for a Fri or Sat night because the point cost was too high. Therefore I believe a large number of the Sun-Thur crowd are renters and not actually owners. I think it is sad that people have used the the DVC for their own profit scam. There is a guy on the Rent Trade board renting for 13 and 15 dollars and only booking at 11 month window. He is clearly doing this to make money. Does he report his earning, probably not. I think Disney should close this loophole by doing what the Cruise Line does and saying if you have a booked reservation, fine, but if you change all the names on the reservation then you need to cancel and try again for the room. This would prevent the booking of a reservation and then switch it to a renter routine that is going on especially at premium times like Christmas and Easter. At least the DIS did something about it and won't let the profiteers rent a confirmed reservation outside of 30 days. Way to go DIS

I wouldn't mind loosing out to a fellow member to a reservation for prime time, but doesn't it irk you that you are loosing out to people who purposely book the difficult reservations to sell the reservation?

 

[LoveBWVVBR]

So... what's the difference between this and a member renting it out? Sorry, but owners rent out all the time on here so I am not getting "outraged" at this LOL!

And since the ads have been running for seveal days... the Goose may turn out to be not so golden!

There is a big difference between an owner who bought their points and pays annual maintenance fees on said points renting them out and a trader selling a prime DVC/RCI 2 bedroom trade obtained with their junky trade unit that they bought on Ebay for $1 may pay $450/year in fees on. That trader is making hundreds if not thousands of dollars in profit on something that you as an owner may not even be able to book as a member.

There is simply no point in owning DVC if you can buy prime reservations on Ebay for less than the cost of maintenance fees on the points. You don't think that people are going to catch onto that as more and more RCI trades show up for sale on Ebay? What, exactly, do you think will happen to the resale and rental value of the points then? ALL DVC members should care about this. It's a far cry from a DVC member renting out points that they can't use this year for $10 when they pay $5/point in fees anyways. This is pure profit for the seller and undercuts both our rental and resale value.

One of the Ebay auctions of an RCI week that I saw is selling a prime 2 bedroom week for the equivalent of $4.09/point. Do you not think that our rental and resale value will be hurt by this trend if it is not stopped? It is going to be happening more and more frequently because DVC is giving a lot of prime inventory to RCI that I never personally saw show up on II. I don't know why this is, but the scammer sellers have already caught onto it and it needs to be stopped. I definitely would be selling my DVC points if the economy were better, and frankly I may end up putting them up for sale even in the poor economy. If this keeps up, the bottom will fall out of the DVC market IMHO.

 

[jbthi]

They are renting very cheaply on e-bay, especially when you consider this is for the whole week, high weekend points included. You are taking a risk to rent these because RCI can easily cancel your reservation if it is reported.

As a DVC owner who very rarely rents our points, I still don't like it when I cannot come close to matching the e-bay rates if I rent my points for $10.

 

[cheezNE1]

That was my question, too. Not sure what difference it makes as to who is doing the renting. DVC allows it as long as it isn't commercial renting.

What is consider commercial renting. I've seen rentals on ebay right now for BLT and has 4 availabilities. I'm assuming the rooms are already booked considering how limited they are and given a date range. That's 4 rooms taking away from members before the resort even opens.

 

[DeeCee735]

When we bought into DVC we bought with the mindset that we were going to use our points. Renting wasn't really on our minds. We do however, understand that it might be necessary to rent due to unusual circumstances, but we've only needed to rent once in our 9 years of ownership so far.

I understand how this can be upsetting to those DVC members who rent their points out every year, or on some sort of regular basis, but I think I speak for the majority of owners when I say that DVC ownership is really for the main purpose of using one's points for the life of the contract, and ultimately leaving it to our children (for those who most likely won't outlive their contracts), not for renting out to others on a regular basis, or using it for a "money making" scheme.

Those who use the opportunity to rent points for vacations, great for them! , but is that usually every single year at specific times, or is it for the few times over years that they want to go? I wonder how many are out there that rent their DVC vacations year after year during times like Christmas break, Spring Break, F&W Festival, Thanksgiving week, etc. I would imagine that the majority of those who rent to get into DVC don't do it on yearly or semi-annual basis. JMHO

And speaking as an owner, I don't have one regret about buying in, we use our points multiple times per year for our own vacations, and repeated Disney vacations would not be possible if we didn't own. Nothing beats our family trips, or my 3/4 night trips with friends or cousins. I certainly wouldn't be looking to rent to do these shorter trips that I've become quite fond of and look forward to one or two times a year....on top of going with my family for a week!

 

[Chuck S]

Given that rooms are turned over to RCI based upon either actual or anticipated trades by DVC members, those rooms would not be available for members to book anyway.

The problem is with the re-renting of RCI reservations. And here is where RCI should be responsible and not allow any RCI trade owner to change the names on an exchange reservation. RCI could easily not allow an exchanger to make name changes to the primary occupant.

However, I see little difference between this and DVC owners renting, either way it takes inventory from members for the use of rental by non-Members without benefit to the membership as a whole. The only real difference is which individual makes $ off of DVC. This practice only devalues DVC if you are an owner trying to rent.

It makes no difference to owners that use the points themselves, or for friends & family.

 

[LoveBWVVBR]

This practice only devalues DVC if you are an owner trying to rent.

It makes no difference to owners that use the points themselves, or for friends & family.

Or an owner trying to sell IMHO. Why would someone buy DVC points when they can rent prime reservations for less than the annual maintenance fees on the points that that reservation would cost Unless someone needs to go during a specific, prime time of year every year there would be no point in buying points.

I am seriously thinking of selling my points because 1) I can now reliably trade into bigger DVC accomodations much more cheaply through RCI than I could get with my points (II was just not as reliable in this department) and 2) I want to get out while the getting is still somewhat good. The getting isn't going to be good anymore when people realize that they can buy these reservations for less than annual maintenance fees off of Ebay. I'd venture to guess that the majority of Disney guests don't know about the disboards, but most everybody knows about Ebay.

 

[Chuck S]

But, any timeshare is not an investment. DVC resales will, depending upon your resort, become valueless as get closer to the contract end dates, anyway. I went in to this in 1992 thinking resale prices would eventually be $0. Even our initial paperwork states it is not an investment, but a pre-paid plan.

Someone, either DVC or RCI has to be allowing name changes on these RCI weeks, or the "buyer" would not be allowed to check-in at the resort. If you find this to be a problem, I suggest you contact either DVC and ask for a clarification of their policy regarding renting an RCI exchange reservation AND ask that they not allow name changes. But be careful what you wish for, they apply no name changes to DVC members, too, and that would prevent DVC members from renting an existing reservation or even changing names to another family member in the event someone in your travel party has to cancel for any reason.

 

[jodifla]

Or an owner trying to sell IMHO. Why would someone buy DVC points when they can rent prime reservations for less than the annual maintenance fees on the points that that reservation would cost Unless someone needs to go during a specific, prime time of year every year there would be no point in buying points.

I am seriously thinking of selling my points because 1) I can now reliably trade into bigger DVC accomodations much more cheaply through RCI than I could get with my points (II was just not as reliable in this department) and 2) I want to get out while the getting is still somewhat good. The getting isn't going to be good anymore when people realize that they can buy these reservations for less than annual maintenance fees off of Ebay. I'd venture to guess that the majority of Disney guests don't know about the disboards, but most everybody knows about Ebay.

Even if it is cheaper, renting doesn't appeal to me. I want to CONTROL my reservations. I want to be able to move around dates. I want all the perks that come with membership, not renting.

 

[littlestar]

I heard that II (Interval) used to police E-bay for people running businesses renting DVC and prime Marriott Vacation Club inventory. I would imagine RCI does the same thing.

Renting exchange weeks gets a little scary to me from an insurance point of view. It would be like if you rented your condo or house for a week to someone (checked references, etc.) and then they rerented it without your permission to a bunch of spring break kids. That's where the rentals of exchange weeks worry me.

There's also the potential that these people who rent these exchange weeks off of Ebay may think they are getting some kind of package. Can't you just hear the conversations at the resort front desk? What do you mean I don't get free park tickets, this is a Disney resort isn't it? What do you mean I have to pay a $95.00 resort fee? I feel sorry for the CM that checks this guest in if they don't understand exactly what they purchased. It's the perfect recipe for a totally messy situation at check-in. The biggest scare, though, would be showing up at the front desk and having it cancelled by RCI because it's against the rules to rent out exchange weeks. You can give an exchange away, but you can't rent it. The sad thing is, somebody could be trying to rent an exchange week they had to cancel (maybe they can't go on their trip) and they may not even know it's against the exchange company rules to try to rent it.

I wouldn't worry too much about this, though - I think the big boys - Disney and RCI can probably take care of themselves pretty good.

 

[mtmbyck]

I do not own points - I rent them. There are many places to rent these points/vacations. In fact, my stay in 2 weeks was done through RedWeek.com. At the time, there was a post for 1 week at AKV in a 2 bedroom for $1700!! That was for March. I tried for it but never got a call back.

But I was able to secure a reservation for much less than $10 a point directly through the owner. I know that may sting, and even at $10 per point, I feel it is a deal since I can stay much cheaper than I could on rack rates.....

Interestingly enough, by posting this thread, you have alerted all DVC renters to a better deal than the disboards ......now they will all be rushing to ebay!

 

[calgarygary]

So... what's the difference between this and a member renting it out? Sorry, but owners rent out all the time on here so I am not getting "outraged" at this LOL!

And since the ads have been running for seveal days... the Goose may turn out to be not so golden!

Carol, I don't know if you were aware but RCI can cancel the reservation without notifying either party. In other words, the people can arrive at WDW without a place to stay. So yes, there is something very, very wrong with this.

 

[LoveToDisney]

We didn't have this trouble when Interval International was the exchange company because it was AGAINST POLICY to sell any II reservation. I wasn't happy when DVC changed to RCI and I am even madder if selling RCI exchange reservations is allowed!

 

[Mamiamjo]

We didn't have this trouble when Interval International was the exchange company because it was AGAINST POLICY to sell any II reservation. I wasn't happy when DVC changed to RCI and I am even madder if selling RCI exchange reservations is allowed!

RCI doesn't allow exchangers to rent out an exchange either. After all they want the option of renting out those weeks themselves (at a much higher rate).
They very well could cancel the exchange, and then the person renting from the exchanger would get to Orlando only to find out that they don't have a room after all.