Friends / Money

[DeterminedOne]

Have you ever lost a friend over money? A week ago I could say that it has never happened to me, but now it has. A friend called and asked if I could give her a ride to pay her cell phone bill because it was shut off. But I was on my way to work and couldn't take her so she asked if I could pay the bill over the phone and she would give me the $ later. I agreed and paid the $60

Now she won't call me back or take my calls. I was very upfront about needing the $ back and when I would pick it up. If she had asked to borrow $60 I would have said no, but since she said she would give it to me later I didn't think anything of it. I don't know what hurts worse - the fact that she knew I needed it back and won't give it to me, or the fact that she is ignoring me instead of saying she doesn't have it. I would have more sympathy and respect if she did the later, but to completely ignore/blow me off. How selfish is that.?

 

[scorpad99]

maybe she doesnt have it to give you back and is embarrast! I have a friend who lives her whole life not having money to pay bills and it gets old. I used to help her make ends meet, but I realized you cant save them.
Take the friendship and 60 bucks as a life lesson learned and get on with your life, sorry!

 

[DeterminedOne]

maybe she doesnt have it to give you back and is embarrast! I have a friend who lives her whole life not having money to pay bills and it gets old. I used to help her make ends meet, but I realized you cant save them.
Take the friendship and 60 bucks as a life lesson learned and get on with your life, sorry!

I know you're right. It's just that right now I'm still too honked off. I've been calling her every day, three or four times a day. If she's not going to give it back I'm at least going to drive her nuts for a while!

 

[Hedy]

I have a friend who's in the process of having this happen right now...
to the OP.

 

[disneynutt1225]

Yep, we stupidly loaned a lot of money (well it was a lot to us - $1200) to a friend so they wouldn't be evicted. We signed a contract outlining when we expected to be paid back - we weren't charging interest or anything, and we gave them almost 3 months to pay it off. Well, it was supposed to be paid back to us by October but it ended up not getting paid back until December and we started having financial problems because of it (unexpected bills and that was our EF). We stopped talking shortly after they paid us back.

I will never again loan a "friend" money.

 

[DVC Sadie]

One lesson I learned many years was to never "lend" money that you could not afford to lose.

After learning that lesson I also learned to either "gift" the money ahead of time or to just say no.

 

[Sethsmom]

One lesson I learned many years was to never "lend" money that you could not afford to lose.

After learning that lesson I also learned to either "gift" the money ahead of time or to just say no.

You are right about this. If it is someone that you are in regular contact with, it can cause some very hard feelings. Like, why can't they pay me back if they are buying lunch out or going to the movies or buying clothes. I loaned a friend our extra vehicle for her to get to work. This was for a several month period of time. This was with the instructions that her son not drive it. One of our mutual friends let me know that her son was driving it and had wrecked it. She told me she had hit a dog with it. I finally got it back wrecked($500 deductible) and missing a hubcap. She never paid the deductible and I have since not felt the same way about our friendship. We are no longer friends basically.

The same goes with lending money. I have always heard not to lend with the expectation of getting it back. I do have some friends that I will loan $20 now and then but they have always paid it back. It's just hard to say no sometimes. I can afford to give away a 20 now and then but I would be inclined not to give more than that just because friendships are important and sometimes the one borrowing starts acting strange. It may be the guilt about not being able to pay it back.

Anyway, you might just want to chalk it up to experience, leave her alone and let her feel guilty and one day you may get it back. I don't think any amount of harrassing her will help in the long run.

 

[Stein]

When I was in college, I moved in with two friends and it certainly hurt our relationship. We didn't loan money, but there were constant arguments on who pays what, what cable tv plan to get, who drank my milk, etc.

My wife also borrowed money from a relative about the same time.

It is just a bad idea all around. If we have the money and someone is hurting, we will just give it to them. The only trick is making sure it is a blessing and not fanning the flames of imprudence.

 

[Sparkie]

At least you only lost a friend over $60- I loaned my ex-friend $500 when she was out of a job and she "promised to pay me back as soon as I get another job". Well that was 2 years ago and she has been working all but 3 months of that time. I have asked her several times to pay me back. And she just avoids me. It really has made me bitter especially when I see her daughter driving a new car and renting pagent dresses for $300 and the like.

Now I'm not rich- that $500 came from a 401k cash out from another employer and it had plans- plans that had to be delayed.

The way I figure it- over the past 2 years- if she had paid a mere $5 a week we would be square.

I thought I was helping a friend in need and I guess I shouldnt have given her the money if I really didnt have it to give freely but I thought it was a loan and not a gift. I have recently asked her once more for the money- that was 6 weeks ago and she told me she would "give me some on friday when she gets paid"- sure is a long time until Friday.

I am currently thinking of taking her to small claims court- what do you guys think I should do?

 

[eliza61]

I am currently thinking of taking her to small claims court- what do you guys think I should do?

Unfortunately Sparkie I say skip it. First, check with the small claims court in your area, most have some sort of staute of limitations (time limit). 2 years is a long time to wait to file. Did you get any thing in writing? if not, what is to stop her from saying she paid you back a year ago? I think the loser of the case has to pay the court fees and without a 100% certainity of winning its just not worth it.
Chalk it up to a lesson learned, cut her lose (if you haven't already) and let go of the bitterness.

I too have learned the hard way. I actually cosigned on a friends furniture because she had lousy credit. Now I have 1 friend who I would give money to or float a loan. Now when any one else (including some family members) ask, I simply say "sorry, I would love to help you but I simply don't have it"

 

[Kay1]

Really, the only person I know who would "borrow" from me is my MIL. I know that so I've learned to head it off by "poor mouthing" right by when she starts doing it to me. Also, I think people assume we're poor because we drive older cars, live in a house that no one would call a McMansion, and buy almost everything from garage sales and thrift stores.

 

[disykat]

I'd be tempted to be very frank with your "friend". Tell her you loaned her money you could not afford to lose and you feel bad that she thinks so poorly of you that she would take advantage of your friendship by not doing her best to pay you back. After that, it'd be goodbye for me.

A friend who was doing her best to pay you back would be calling you back and making a visible effort to do so.

Honestly, I would feel so bad about that friend that I would have no qualms about leaving the friendship and would probably be honest with anyone who asked why I no longer spent time with her.

I understand that people can get in rough spots, but if you are close enough to someone to ask for money, you should be close enough to not avoid the issue of paying them back - whether you have the money or not isn't the issue. To me, it's about whether you have the intention to pay it back. If you aren't facing it, you aren't planning on paying it back.

 

[problemchild718]

I would drive my butt to her house and discuss it with her. If she is any kind of friend, she will talk to you about it. My guess is if her cell was to be turned off, she is she is having financial problems. She probably can't come up with the money and doesn't know how to handle it. Offer to help her get things in order if you can and let her know how upset you are about it, but stick to your guns.

 

[DeterminedOne]

I would drive my butt to her house and discuss it with her. If she is any kind of friend, she will talk to you about it. My guess is if her cell was to be turned off, she is she is having financial problems. She probably can't come up with the money and doesn't know how to handle it. Offer to help her get things in order if you can and let her know how upset you are about it, but stick to your guns.

I am seriously thinking about driving to her house, or showing up at her job. She works at a restaurant. I wouldn't confront her about it at work, I would just go to make my presence known.

And you know what really ticks me off ... I understand that she may not be able to come up with the money ... but I paid the bill with the impression that she already had the money. Therefore, she lied when she said I could come and pick it up when she never actually had it, OR - she had the money and spent it on something else once the bill was paid. I don't know which one makes me madder.

 

[sbpuckett]

At least you only lost a friend over $60- I loaned my ex-friend $500 when she was out of a job and she "promised to pay me back as soon as I get another job". Well that was 2 years ago and she has been working all but 3 months of that time. I have asked her several times to pay me back. And she just avoids me. It really has made me bitter especially when I see her daughter driving a new car and renting pagent dresses for $300 and the like.

Now I'm not rich- that $500 came from a 401k cash out from another employer and it had plans- plans that had to be delayed.

The way I figure it- over the past 2 years- if she had paid a mere $5 a week we would be square.

I thought I was helping a friend in need and I guess I shouldnt have given her the money if I really didnt have it to give freely but I thought it was a loan and not a gift. I have recently asked her once more for the money- that was 6 weeks ago and she told me she would "give me some on friday when she gets paid"- sure is a long time until Friday.

I am currently thinking of taking her to small claims court- what do you guys think I should do?

I haven't read past your post here, but I would check into how things work in small claims court. Here in my area of VA, it costs you money to file the papers and such. Even if they find in your favor, there is no guarantee that you will get your money. Four and a half years ago I did home daycare and had two sets of parents stiff me. That really set my family up for financial crisis because I lost the income of 3 children in addition for not receiving money I had already worked for (I fell for a sob story and promise that they would pay me at the end of the week). Anyway, we're talking about $500 here and it was right at C'mas that year. I paid the money when my tax return came in a couple of months later and filed the papers. I went to court and had my contracts and all of my paperwork and the judge ruled in my favor. I have never seen a penny and there is nothing I can do about it. There was no promise that they would pay and there was no court order or punishment if they didn't... just a waste of my time and more money!! So check your areas laws and see if it's worth it. If they will garnish her wages or something, then it will be worth it if you can prove your case. If they won't do anything to force her to pay if you win, don't bother and move on... JMHO...

 

[Sethsmom]

I have never seen a penny and there is nothing I can do about it. There was no promise that they would pay and there was no court order or punishment if they didn't... just a waste of my time and more money!! So check your areas laws and see if it's worth it. If they will garnish her wages or something, then it will be worth it if you can prove your case. If they won't do anything to force her to pay if you win, don't bother and move on... JMHO...

Did you not get a judgment against them? In our court, if you know where they work or bank you can file a garnishment once you have the judgment. The court does not do your collection work, but if you file a garnishment, they will issue it and it will be collected. You could also file a judgment on their property in the probate court where their property is. There might be a minimal charge to do this but it would be worth it.

 

[Sparkie]

Thanks for the responses. You guys are right. I should move on and let go of the bitterness.

Lesson learned- the hard way.

 

[KTMEMOMMY]

At least 8 or 9 years ago, my dh (before we were dating!) was going to see an out of state friend who wanted his help/knowledge with getting her set up with a computer. He picked up for her what he knew to be a good one, laying out $600 and went to see her for the weekend and set it up, etc. She was supposed to send him a check for it, but never did.

He never heard from her, ever again! They had been friends since college, which was a good 15 years before this happened. He tried calling her, she never returned his calls again, and just dropped off the face of the earth. He laughs sometimes about what good friends they were, and now she never even knows he's married, has kids, etc.

What bothers him the most is the non-responsiveness after this happened. He always said he would rather that she told him she couldn't afford it and paid him even $10 a month for 5 years or whatever than just take the computer and never speak to him again!

 

[Kickapoo Joie Juice]

Here's the thing, if people were good with money, they wouldn't need to borrow it from you. If they're bad with money, then it's a habit.

Unless you know the habit has changed, then don't expect the money back. You're just furthering the belief that what they're doing is ok.

And it's not.

I can absolutely tell you what those people are thinking when you give them the money:

"Well, they SHOULD give it to me because they can afford to."

They're not thinking 'thank you', they're thinking, "I deserve some of that, too."

Keep that in mind the next time sombody gets themselves into a financial scrape. They put themselves there, and they're expecting you to bail them out. Because you should, you know. After all, it's only fair that you share. Whether you want to or not. This is what happens when we make our children read Rainbow Fish. They grow up to be like this.

 

[KKB]

I owned a business several years ago with a business partner (friend for years). The majority of the debt for the business was in DH & my name. We ended up having to declare bankruptcy. We had all the cc debt and both families had to declare for the lease. THIS was not the problem...I knew that going into it (the debt imbalance)

Here's the clinker...neither of us took a salary for the first year; she took $1K/month the second year, I chose not to. Third year I went back to work, as I felt the store could not afford to pay me. I understood her home financial issues, and I still was OK. (my store had a manager...hers did not)
Well, my mom loaned us $4K early in the third year for the business. DH & I socked our savings of $7K in the last few months, thinking things would turn around. Well, when we declared, we were able to keep around $10K cash as well as some stock(DO NOT ask me how this works...I was stunned, too). We had a garage sale, split the proceeds and split the small bank account balance from here store. This left about $7K. I was therefore going to pay my mom back, and figured the rest helped make up the cash DH & I had contributed. I knew that they were getting a large tax refund, and the attorney had said we would need to turn in any signifigant refunds. She calls me to get "her half" of what is left a few months later. I said that I had paid my mom, and that only left $3K, and since we had put up $7K cash, that helps to pay us back. (and frankly, I should have paid that back FIRST...NEVER mix business and friendship!) They had SPENT a $7K tax refund, the attorney had called for it, and she thought she was still entitled to half of what was left!!! I was stunned, to say the least. She hung up in a huff and we have not spoken in several years.

I was sad. At the time, it seemed that her taking a salary when I wasn't was simply necessary. I knew financially they were not in as good a shape as us with only one income to our two as we went thru the bankruptcy...so I was willing to split some of the $ initially. FOOLISH. I not only got taken by a business, but also by a friend.

PS It was VERY tight for quite a few years...but we finally have our heads above water, and NO DEBT!