fp+ and rope dropping - a new era

[mom2rtk]

Oh Disney...

 

[Jkpark]

OP. Thanks for the report. This bums me out as I was hoping to hit RD, ride RnR first, maybe ToT before starting our FPs. I knew things would get tighter, but thought I would still have an hour or two?

In regards to FP+ the first hour, I think (a) MDE puts those in and many people don't know they can adjust times, and (2) with the possibility of a 4th FP - I have had people on these boards advise me to grab those so I can then get a 4th. You also have people using the strategy or hitting RD early at Park A and booking FP+ for afternoon at Park B. Hoping late September still sees lower crowds and I get some advantage to RD.

 

[Planogirl]

Oh Disney...

I love the expression.

 

[Aggiegrl]

Not disputing that crowds may be increasing some, but sorry there is simply no way that your claim of FP being gone after you rode at RD is accurate. Given the total capacity of Soarin in a day, even taking lower than now percentage of FP allocation per day based on that capacity in 2012, even if it took you an hour to ride it , it is not possibly for that number of guests to grab all FP for the day that quickly. We are regular October visitors for the last several years and I agree that they can run out early, as in 1 to 3pm was the earliest we remember seeing. Even with FP+ added to the mix in 2013, Soarin and TSMM ran out only around noon or so. ( only being relative as I think it is ridiculous and day guest were losing their minds!)

The last week of Sept 2012 was our last trip. The fastpasses for Soarin on our Epcot day were gone by 11 am. Test Track was closed for refurb at the time, and it seemed like every single person in that park was inside The Land pavilion. I have never seen something so crazy in my life.

No, it wasn't immediately after rope drop, but it sure was early.

 

[KYDisneyDad]

The last week of Sept 2012 was our last trip. The fastpasses for Soarin on our Epcot day were gone by 11 am. Test Track was closed for refurb at the time, and it seemed like every single person in that park was inside The Land pavilion. I have never seen something so crazy in my life. No, it wasn't immediately after rope drop, but it sure was early.

Yeah it was bad during the TT refurb, was that an EMH morning or something? Soarins daily capacity is around 17000 I think, and FP allocation back then was what, around 60% or so? So given anEMH morning I could see that they could run through in three hours, but there is simply no way it is possible for that many thousands to process after one ride cycle completes at rope drop.
We just don't need crazy exaggerations added to all this mix...

 

[Babe the Blue Ox]

I thought that this new system was supposed to give people a chance to sleep in? Now it sounds like you'll be lucky to do one headliner if you make it to rope drop but I suppose that that is better than none....

This isn't really accurate. Just a few weeks ago, we slept in every morning, arriving at the parks around 10:30 of later each day.

It was nice to have three headliners already reserved. The ability to add additional reservations after the first three was a good perk also.

I think what FP+ has done has added to the illusion that the only way to successfully tour the park is to arrive pre rope drop and fight the crowds.

This thinking is causing the majority of guests to tire and leave early. The parks were emptier than I have ever seen them late in the evenings. We had no problem riding any headliner we wanted to, including Toy Story an 7 Dwarfs, multiple times in the last few hours of operation.

Of course, websites like EasyWDW are now touting the benefits of late night touring which could negatively affect us night owls.

 

[Jkpark]

(1) can I ask what late hours of operation are? B/c I'm worried that doesn't help us in late September when parks close at 9? Would love to hear otherwise.

(2). In regards to the potential "exaggeration" of Sept 2012. We were also there the last week of sept. TP says 1-3 level crowds. We walked in at RD, right to Soarin and at that time, we got 1-2. Right over our lunch ADR. We were able to move our ADR to work this out. But yes, with TT down, things were crazy.

 

[CanadianPaco]

Maybe they shouldn't start FP+ times until 10am? Who even needs one at rope drop anyway?

I agree! At MK in March, we were able to ride BTRR at least 4 times at rope drop ...simply walking around, up and on. By the 5th time, we stood for a minute then walked on. I was done by the 6th ride, so I sat and watched while the family rode it again. I saw many people use their FP+ for a 5min standby...and this was when we only got 3 FP+'s per day! It was a waste of a FP+.

 

[mom2rtk]

Maybe they shouldn't start FP+ times until 10am? Who even needs one at rope drop anyway?

The problem (as I'm sure you know) is that they are looking for ways to milk MORE FP slots out of the system, and that would just result in less.

 

[nkereina]

Are the tiers still in effect at DHS and Epcot? I'd have no problem with the standby passes and even avoiding rope drop if I could make FP+ reservations for ALL the headliners and not have to choose. Until they drop the tiers, if you want to ride all headliners, you almost HAVE to get there at rope drop. Especially at Epcot with Soarin and the SB+ testing.

 

[mom2rtk]

Are the tiers still in effect at DHS and Epcot? I'd have no problem with the standby passes and even avoiding rope drop if I could make FP+ reservations for ALL the headliners and not have to choose. Until they drop the tiers, if you want to ride all headliners, you almost HAVE to get there at rope drop. Especially at Epcot with Soarin and the SB+ testing.

Tiers still in effect. And not going anywhere.

 

[FlipHipster]

Maybe they shouldn't start FP+ times until 10am? Who even needs one at rope drop anyway?

Yeah it was bad during the TT refurb, was that an EMH morning or something? Soarins daily capacity is around 17000 I think, and FP allocation back then was what, around 60% or so? So given anEMH morning I could see that they could run through in three hours, but there is simply no way it is possible for that many thousands to process after one ride cycle completes at rope drop.
We just don't need crazy exaggerations added to all this mix...

The part you are missing is that pre-FP+ guests weren't grabbing FP's to skip a 15-20 min line, they get in SB at 9:00AM. Now guests are pre-booking their appt. to skip the SB queue 60 days out before they even know what the line looks like. Guests are showing up at 9:00 with a pass to skip a short line which will ultimately make that short line a long one because FP has priority. In addition Disney is allowing guests to book the entire day's FP capacity before park opening and it's any guest with an active ticket vs. only the guests standing in the park in front of Soarin'. The old system at least had limits to help manage distribution, the new system removed some of those limits, so yeah they could run out quicker than before. Have you been following the A&E FP+ threads? FP gone at 00:05 60 days out.....

I think SB+ is at least a step in the right direction since they aren't issuing return tickets until the SB line gets long enough to make them necessary. Unfortunately all the guests running up at 9:00AM with FP's will make that happen very quickly.

oh yeah, and the lack of capacity

 

[mom2rtk]

The part you are missing is that pre-FP+ guests weren't grabbing FP's to skip a 15-20 min line, they get in SB at 9:00AM. Now guests are pre-booking their appt. to skip the SB queue 60 days out before they even know what the line looks like. Guests are showing up at 9:00 with a pass to skip a short line which will ultimately make that short line a long one because FP has priority. In addition Disney is allowing guests to book the entire day's FP capacity before park opening and it's any guest with an active ticket vs. only the guests standing in the park in front of Soarin'. The old system at least had limits to help manage distribution, the new system removed some of those limits, so yeah they could run out quicker than before. Have you been following the A&E FP+ threads? FP gone at 00:05 60 days out.....

I think SB+ is at least a step in the right direction since they aren't issuing return tickets until the SB line gets long enough to make them necessary. Unfortunately all the guests running up at 9:00AM with FP's will make that happen very quickly.

oh yeah, and the lack of capacity

Yep. Part of the reason you used to be able to get a lot done in the first hour or two of park times is that nobody was being prioritized ahead of them from the FP line.

So far it seems they are only doing this for the uber busy attractions. So unfortunately hitting that 30 minute threshold is probably not taking long enough to even matter.

 

[redsbe]

Just checked app for wait times (Fri Aug 1st 945a) and still seeing plenty of low waits with only A&E, Soarin, TT, TSM, and 7DMT longer then 20 minutes (and Soarin, TT, TSM were long waits soon after RD even before FP+ was an option), so I would say RD still provides a big advantage even with FP+ and some visitors pre-booking FP+ for early morning times.

 

[Planogirl]

Just checked app for wait times (Fri Aug 1st 945a) and still seeing plenty of low waits with only A&E, Soarin, TT, TSM, and 7DMT longer then 20 minutes (and Soarin, TT, TSM were long waits soon after RD even before FP+ was an option), so I would say RD still provides a big advantage even with FP+ and some visitors pre-booking FP+ for early morning times.

Soarin' is back to normal today though. I was conjecturing that Soarin's test might have escalated Test Track's numbers since there are so few top tier rides at Epcot. There's no way to know for sure though.

 

[Praying Colonel]

Pre-FP+, FP return times didn't start until about 45 minutes after rope drop. So even if someone took that earliest FP (not many would due to low crowd levels that 1st hour), you still had 45 minutes of pure standby before FPs began slowing down the SB line.

Now return times start at 9. And when Disney incentivizes you to burn through your FP+s early so you can pull a 4th, 5th, etc., people are more likely to take those. So the SB wait is higher earlier in the morning than it would be otherwise.

Now on our May trip we were able to counter that a little bit by being at the turnstiles super-duper early if they let people in before scheduled start time. DHS was really good for this, as was EP. But now DHS has reinstated a rope drop show (Frozen), so getting to DHS early is countered because everybody gets held up there.

Frustrating.

 

[redsbe]

Pre-FP+, FP return times didn't start until about 45 minutes after rope drop. So even if someone took that earliest FP (not many would due to low crowd levels that 1st hour), you still had 45 minutes of pure standby before FPs began slowing down the SB line.

Now return times start at 9. And when Disney incentivizes you to burn through your FP+s early so you can pull a 4th, 5th, etc., people are more likely to take those. So the SB wait is higher earlier in the morning than it would be otherwise.

Now on our May trip we were able to counter that a little bit by being at the turnstiles super-duper early if they let people in before scheduled start time. DHS was really good for this, as was EP. But now DHS has reinstated a rope drop show (Frozen), so getting to DHS early is countered because everybody gets held up there.

Frustrating.

But again it is still more dependent on the crowd level, on 7+ days (like today) more people are going to be in the parks, including using RD and even booking early morning FP+. However if you are "off season" with lower crowds (below 5), many fewer guests means much smaller numbers at RD and small numbers reserving early morning FP+.

Even with FP+ I still say RD is going to provide an advantage, one that is even greater during periods of non-peak crowds.

 

[practicallyperfect77]

But again it is still more dependent on the crowd level, on 7+ days (like today) more people are going to be in the parks, including using RD and even booking early morning FP+. However if you are "off season" with lower crowds (below 5), many fewer guests means much smaller numbers at RD and small numbers reserving early morning FP+.

Even with FP+ I still say RD is going to provide an advantage, one that is even greater during periods of non-peak crowds.

In my opinion the question isn't really does RD provide an advantage...it does. No disputing that. It's that the advantage has changed from an 1 1/2 hours or even conservative end 1 hour to 20 minutes. That's the problem.

 

[vinotinto]

Now on our May trip we were able to counter that a little bit by being at the turnstiles super-duper early if they let people in before scheduled start time. DHS was really good for this, as was EP. But now DHS has reinstated a rope drop show (Frozen), so getting to DHS early is countered because everybody gets held up there.

Frustrating.

So, you mean to tell me that instead of allowing you to 'sleep in' FP+ is making you get up earlier? ;-) Who would have thought that?

 

[practicallyperfect77]

So, you mean to tell me that instead of allowing you to 'sleep in' FP+ is making you get up earlier? ;-) Who would have thought that?

Only if you want to go on all the headliners and/or more than once. If not, sleep in and go on TSM your 1 time and then shop. You would be Disney's ideal guest.

ETA: I do find it rather ironic tho when "super users" (I'm one) would tell folks all they need to do in order to ride standby with short waits was arrive at RD and that seemed to be an unacceptable answer. But not if we want to ride both headliners at the tiered parks that is what we're told to do.