Four Day School Week

[Feralpeg]

In order to save money, a couple of counties in Central Florida are considering going to a four day school week. I have mixed feelings about this. They say it will save one of the counties five million dollars.

The state of Florida requires, I believe, 180 days of school each year. I am not certain if they plan to increase the length of the school day to cover the hours that would be missed by going to the four day week. If so, I wonder how effective it would be to have such a long school day. If they do not increase the school day, I don't know how they will get around the state requirement and I would be concerned about how many fewer hours of instruction the kids would receive.

As a former working parent, I can honestly say that going to a four day school week would present a great problem for many working parents. Who would provide the care for the students on the off days? One of the counties proposing this happens to have some very low income areas. I must say that I am concerned with children who might end up on their own for those days. Too much time unsupervised could lead to all sorts of problems.

I just have a really bad feeling about this. I really feel for the school districts (by county here in Florida) who are trying to get by without sufficient funding, but this seems like a bad idea.

Any thoughts? I have no school age children, so it really isn't a personal issue. It is just a general concern for the kids involved.

 

[stepmommyof1]

This is the best idea ever. School AND work should be 4 days a week. I never could do anything longer than 4 days in a row before I needed a day off (I missed a lot of school)
But do not increase the school day because I think that would just be too long of a day for kids. They should be home with their families and spending time playing- no ten hour school days

 

[Jedana]

They are talking about this up in Duval county also.

I'm ok with it, except for the whole "kids being at home 3 days" thing.

The kids already get out of school 1.5 hours early every other Wednesday.

Duval is also talking dropping all extracurriculars, including band, football, art, etc. at ALL grade levels. If they do that, my daughter's hs will empty--about 75% are only there because of the athletics program, and the chance it gives them.

 

[Feralpeg]

They are talking about this up in Duval county also.

I'm ok with it, except for the whole "kids being at home 3 days" thing.

The kids already get out of school 1.5 hours early every other Wednesday.

Duval is also talking dropping all extracurriculars, including band, football, art, etc. at ALL grade levels. If they do that, my daughter's hs will empty--about 75% are only there because of the athletics program, and the chance it gives them.

Dropping the extracurriculars is sad. When I think of my high school days, it was the extracurriulars that made it special. I was a drama kid! I hope they don't do it!

 

[horseshowmom]

I'm sure they'll have to lengthen the days to make up the time. I recently read an article about some schools that had gone to the 4 day week for budget reasons, and it had actually worked out quite well after some adjustment pains. While it was initially met with resistance by parents, it seems that many came around to really liking it for various reasons. One district started off with a weird schedule M-T, off W, then Th-F. They found out pretty quickly that it didn't work too well so they switched to 4 consecutive days and were much better satisfied. I've never been involved with a district that did this though so I have no personal experience.

 

[Witch Mountain]

Haven't heard about it in my county yet. If they extend the school day to get the correct amount of hours it probably be a lot rougher on the elementary school kids. I think the high school students would love it.

If it seriously comes to pass locally, I'd get a day care license and take school age only clients for that one day that parents have to work and the kids have no school. It's likely others would consider doing the same thing.

 

[MrsPete]

This will save money. Our school does it in the summer; the custodians and office staff work "four 10s" in the summer months, which means less electricity is used. The staff likes this, and as a worker I think I would too. As a parent, I'd hate it for my kids.

To save the most money they'd have to use four consecutive days -- that'd mean they could cut off/down the air conditioning (or heat) for the long weekend. Combine that with a 20% reduction in bus rides, and you'd be talking about serious money saved.

The school day will have to be lengthened in order to get in the hours for the Carnegie units. So that probably means 10-hour days for the students. That's going to be bad for the kids in several ways:

- Kids are only good for so many hours, and then they're DONE. So that means that younger kids are going to need more hours at recess, and they'll probably need an afternoon snack. So realistically, that means more in-school hours but NOT more learning hours. So that means kids'd lose learning hours over the whole school year.

- It'd mean the end of homework during the week because kids just can't be expected to do 10 hours at school, THEN more work at home. But it'd mean homework on the long-weekends; otherwise, the curriculum just wouldn't be covered completely.

- It'd be tough for sports teams (both for practice and for games) and for clubs. Fewer hours after school means less time for these activities. Although sports/clubs shouldn't be the focus of the decision, they should be in there as a secondary concern. For some students, sports/clubs are why they keep coming to school. Sports/clubs are also big in building school spirit. School shouldn't have a job-feel, and sports/clubs are part of what makes school school.

- It'd be harder for high schoolers to have after-school jobs. Most employers count on them working 3:00-close, which works right now because they tend to get out of school 2:15-2:30 ish.

- School attendance might increase because doctor's appointments, orthodontist appointments, etc. could be made on Friday (assuming that's the day-off). Also, with fewer days, parents would feel it's less acceptable to miss even one.

- I don't foresee a day-care problem. Our schools offer day care before/after school and on teacher workdays. If this schedule became common, the school programs'd expand to include the no-school days. Also, local church day cares, etc. would adjust their schedules to accomodate paying customers. And don't forget that high schoolers'd be available to babysit on Fridays because they wouldn't be in school. It WOULD cost parents more in day care costs. On the other hand, those same parents would no longer have to pay after-school care for their kids (because the kids'd be in school about as long as the parents are at work), so it'd work out to about the same cost overall.

Overall, I think it would mean a decrease in learning, but the savings woud be HUGE.

 

[CurlyGirl]

One of our local, private high schools has a 4-day school week. Their school day is longer than regular schools by something like 2 or 2 1/2 hours. The "off" day is Monday. Because so many holidays fall on a Monday, they don't have to "take" that day off. By the end of the school year, the kids end up being in school the equivalent of 10 days longer than the public school kids. Go figure! So, yeah ... not a bad deal. ETA - most tests are given on a Tuesday, so the kids have lots of time to study. And, the day off is when they do the majority of their homework.

 

[Cinderella94]

I can see how it saves money, for sure, but as a high school student I would absolutely hate this. Thank goodness I'm graduating.

 

[horseshowmom]

Haven't heard about it in my county yet. If they extend the school day to get the correct amount of hours it probably be a lot rougher on the elementary school kids. I think the high school students would love it.

If it seriously comes to pass locally, I'd get a day care license and take school age only clients for that one day that parents have to work and the kids have no school. It's likely others would consider doing the same thing.

The article that I mentioned did say that this sort of thing came up along with many churches doing the same thing.

 

[Belle0101]

I don't live in FL so I can't speak to their laws but where I live the law is 180 days of school. Generally, as long as a lunch is served, even if lunchtime is moved up, it is counted as a day.

Given that, would the school day legally need to be lengthened?

Interesting concept. I'm just not sure how I feel about it.


ETA: I read my post back and I'm not sure I was clear so I'm adding an example.

School starts at 8:35 with lunch at 11:55 for my DS class and dismissal is at 3:15.

There have been occassions where lunch was moved to 10:00 for DS class with dismissal at noon. Because lunch had been served it was counted as a whole day.

 

[MrsPete]

The "off" day is Monday. Because so many holidays fall on a Monday, they don't have to "take" that day off.

Ah, now I see that Monday would be the logical day off.

I don't live in FL so I can't speak to their laws but where I live the law is 180 days of school. Generally, as long as a lunch is served, even if lunchtime is moved up, it is counted as a day.

Given that, would the school day legally need to be lengthened?

Interesting concept. I'm just not sure how I feel about it.

We all tend to say and think 180 days, but in reality students are required to attend a certain number of HOURS per class per year in order to earn a credit. So if you cut the number of days, you'd have to increase the number of hours in a day.

 

[stepmommyof1]

Well if you'd save money but lose learning hours, then you haven't really saved anything in the long run.

But I don't get WHY you'd have to extend the day at all. Society arbitrarily decided Monday thru Friday were business/school days, with Saturday and Sunday off, right? Couldn't that be changed?? Why extend the school days? Why not just have a society where kids go to school four days a week? I don't get why you'd have to extend the length of the school day. Just change the "rules".

 

[SookieStackhouse]

I have heard about the idea, as an employee of the school I would support the idea. I guess it really would make the day seem pretty long. I know we had to add 30 minutes onto the day for a week to make up for snow, and that was a really rough week. I would assume to cut an entire day out of the week it would require adding maybe 1:15 to each day. That might be painful, but an extra day off would be great.

 

[daisyduck123]

I'd love it.

Our school system already does that in the summer for all of our 11th & 12th month employees. They work M-Th, longer days.

To make up the missed day, about an hour & 10 or 15 minutes would need to be added to each school day. Our school day is presently 6 hours & 40 minutes, but you wouldn't need to make up the 25 minutes that the kids use to have lunch on that 5th day.

 

[MrsPete]

Well if you'd save money but lose learning hours, then you haven't really saved anything in the long run.

But I don't get WHY you'd have to extend the day at all. Society arbitrarily decided Monday thru Friday were business/school days, with Saturday and Sunday off, right? Couldn't that be changed?? Why extend the school days? Why not just have a society where kids go to school four days a week? I don't get why you'd have to extend the length of the school day. Just change the "rules".

Yes, I agree you'd lose learning in the long run.

The idea of going to school August - June was chosen for agricultural reasons, and I agree that's rather arbitrary for most places these days.

Monday - Friday were chosen to emulate the business world, and that was essentially chosen by labor unions a century or more ago.

But the amount of TIME spent in a certain class isn't arbitrary. It's accepted across the educational world -- from the elementary school to the university lelvel -- that a certain number of hours in class equals "one credit", one Carnegie unit. An individual school district can decide how it wants to divide up the hours, but they can't cut the hours. Not if they want to remain accredited. Not if they don't want to lose funding. Not if they want their students to have the option of ever transfering to another school or being admitted to college. This is a basic-basic-basic in the educational world, and we can't just turn our backs on it.

 

[shortbun]

Our district shortened each day by one period and had teachers meet in that hour. The shortened day ruled out a lot of extras for kids because they didn't have enough periods in the day. High schoolers are already loading up and skipping lunch for music, drama, sports, etc. Here, they started the day later so at least kids got a little more sleep.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I like the idea, but it takes a culturally accepted norm of a 5 day workweek and now burdens hundreds if not thousands of families to figure out arrangements at their expense on day 5.

Someone asked why to extend the day--

The reason is that there is a standard school year, 180 days based on so many class hours per day. To change the school year to a 4 day week, but not increase the hours, reduces the school year. 180 days is the equivilant of 36 weeks, so 36 days are LOST. 36 days is 7 weeks of instruction! That would NEVER work in today's education environment. Group education could not support that. They would have to increase the day to at least make up some of that.

Not sure what the hours are of required instruction, but the above at least demonstrates what would happen if you did not increase the other 4 days (or the length of the year).

Though Mrs. Pete's idea of 10 hour days makes sense. But the kids would be burnt out. Especially the younger kids.

 

[CurlyGirl]

Just remembered this and wanted to add it in ... the kids never get a day off for teacher in-service/conferences/meetings because teachers do all of those things on Mondays since the kids are off anyway!

 

[Belle0101]

Ah, now I see that Monday would be the logical day off. We all tend to say and think 180 days, but in reality students are required to attend a certain number of HOURS per class per year in order to earn a credit. So if you cut the number of days, you'd have to increase the number of hours in a day.

That's where I think our high school may be the odd one out. DS, in high school, earns 1 credit for Algebra class. The class is 50 minutes long and is for 60 days. (We have trimesters.) Compare that to his English class. It's 2 periods long, 100 minutes, 60 days and he still earns just the 1 credit.

3000 hours in Algebra = a credit
6000 hours in English = a credit

I've questioned the discrepancy and I've never gotten a clear answer except for that's the way it's done here (his high school).

Anyhow, sorry I hijacked the OPs post.