For $2 Billion Disney could have built 16 major attractions instead of fast pass+

[Laketravis]

Boy. Their "Panoramic Flight Simulator" looks vaguely familiar.

LOL! Yes it does. Their pedigree includes many well known favorites as Barnstormer, Rock N Roller Coaster, and.....well, you get the idea.

 

[jade1]

Could be, but then a major component of the $2B effort was to have a system that entices guests to spend more. Not going to happen during tough times.

I think you missed my point.

Additional FP+ offerings can help tip the scales for visitors on the fence in tough times, just like free dining did/does.

 

[Laketravis]

I think you missed my point.

Additional FP+ offerings can help tip the scales for visitors on the fence in tough times, just like free dining did/does.

I do get your point, and I agreed it could be a possibility. It may even work well to replace free dining as a promotion that doesn't cost Disney anything.

I'm just not sure the prospect of additional FP's is a very compelling reason when a family is faced with a $5K decision during poor economic conditions.

Disney spent $2B to maximize guest spending. Which has potential when those guests have money to spend. It has no effect whatsoever when they don't.

 

[JimmyV]

LOL! Yes it does. Their pedigree includes many well known favorites as Barnstormer, Rock N Roller Coaster, and.....well, you get the idea.

I could have sworn that I saw a show on either the Discovery Channel or Travel Channel that made it sound as if Disney Imagineering came up with the "erector set" concept for Soarin'. Was that a load of hooey, or did they invent the concept and sell it to Vekoma?

 

[jade1]

I do get your point, and I agreed it could be a possibility. It may even work well to replace free dining as a promotion that doesn't cost Disney anything.

I'm just not sure the prospect of additional FP's is a very compelling reason when a family is faced with a $5K decision during poor economic conditions.

Disney spent $2B to maximize guest spending. Which has potential when those guests have money to spend. It has no effect whatsoever when they don't.

I think it is, sorry.

Depends on the family, and there are many millions of situations out there (as in past tough times), but a family with no money to spend won't show up because they spent 2 billion on NFL/Pandora/Frozen/added Soarin/added TSM/Star Wars either.

 

[Laketravis]

I think it is, sorry.

Depends on the family, and there are many millions of situations out there (as in past tough times), but a family with no money to spend won't show up because they spent 2 billion on NFL/Pandora/Frozen/added Soarin/added TSM/Star Wars either.

FP's don't hold much value when the parks are practically empty due to a recession. But yeah, better attractions wouldn't help that much either.

 

[mom2rtk]

FP's don't hold much value when the parks are practically empty due to a recession. But yeah, better attractions wouldn't help that much either.

Agreed. If you are there during a time when there are extra fast passes to give away, you were there at a time you probably don't need them.

 

[Laketravis]

I could have sworn that I saw a show on either the Discovery Channel or Travel Channel that made it sound as if Disney Imagineering came up with the "erector set" concept for Soarin'. Was that a load of hooey, or did they invent the concept and sell it to Vekoma?

Soarin' was actually all Disney, only because they weren't happy with any third party offerings suitable for pairing with an IMAX type presentation. They were working with Vekoma at the time because Vekoma had just finished building Space Mountain in Paris; it's entirely possible Disney shared/sold some of the IP to Vekoma, or perhaps substantial portions of the design could not be patented and therefore could be replicated.

I think that's a good example, though, of the sort of innovation Disney can produce when they don't settle for status quo.

Edit to add: While Soarin was Disney's design, I don't know who actually built it. Most likely Disney contracted the build to Vekoma and agreed to license the design.

 

[Hokie2000]

I could have sworn that I saw a show on either the Discovery Channel or Travel Channel that made it sound as if Disney Imagineering came up with the "erector set" concept for Soarin'. Was that a load of hooey, or did they invent the concept and sell it to Vekoma?

You definitely saw it b/c I saw the same thing. I'd like to know if there was any truth to it as well.

It was pretty convincing - they had the guy talking about their engineering problem - how to load guests onto the three levels of "hanggliders" and he took out his old erector set and built the prototype. Interesting...

 

[jade1]

Agreed. If you are there during a time when there are extra fast passes to give away, you were there at a time you probably don't need them.

We know that (although I still think headliners are always worth having a FP+ for) but when folks hear/see they can reserve an entire day (instead of just 3 FP+, the OCT video last year at TSM showing them gone by noon ex) there would be a lot of interested to folks with available or yet borderline funds IMO.

 

[mom2rtk]

FP's don't hold much value when the parks are practically empty due to a recession. But yeah, better attractions wouldn't help that much either.

Agreed. If you are there during a time when there are extra fast passes to give away, you were there at a time you probably don't need them.

 

[jade1]

Agreed. If you are there during a time when there are extra fast passes to give away, you were there at a time you probably don't need them.

We know that (although I still think headliners are always worth having a FP+ for) but when folks hear/see they can reserve an entire day (instead of just 3 FP+, the OCT video last year at TSM showing them gone by noon ex) there would be a lot of interested to folks with available or yet borderline funds IMO.

 

[JimmyV]

Agreed. If you are there during a time when there are extra fast passes to give away, you were there at a time you probably don't need them.

I do chuckle when I read a report where someone in mid-September crows about being able to get 9 FP+s from the kiosks. What were they bypassing, 5-10 minute SB lines?

 

[mom2rtk]

We know that (although I still think headliners are always worth having a FP+ for) but when folks hear/see they can reserve an entire day (instead of just 3 FP+, the OCT video last year at TSM showing them gone by noon ex) there would be a lot of interested to folks with available or yet borderline funds IMO.

The beauty of being there at a low crowd time is that you no longer HAVE to schedule your entire day then watch the clock for return times. Something strikes your fancy? Just step in line.

 

[MrInfinity]

I could have sworn that I saw a show on either the Discovery Channel or Travel Channel that made it sound as if Disney Imagineering came up with the "erector set" concept for Soarin'. Was that a load of hooey, or did they invent the concept and sell it to Vekoma?

Interesting. What I get from reading some articles, is that Disney invented it, then Vekoma later copied it, tweaking just enough to not lose a lawsuit. Or maybe, Disney sold the rights to build these? If anyone knows the real deal here I'd love to know.

Edit to add: While Soarin was Disney's design, I don't know who actually built it. Most likely Disney contracted the build to Vekoma and agreed to license the design.

The Disney version was built by Dynamic Structures. Who built Soarin, Test Track, Radiator Springs Racers, and the Mark VII monorail in DL.

http://www.dynamicattractions.com/portfolio/

Also interesting is that what Vekoma now calls their "Mine Train" model which they're actively marketing, is a blatant copy Dynamic Structures' BTMRR.

There seems to be a working relationship between Vekoma and Disney, as they were contracted to build the SDMT.

 

[Hokie2000]

Some do. Some don't. Everyone agrees it's not a "thrill" ride, and most people agree it doesn't need to be because "thrill" is not required to produce "wow".

The discussion is really more along the lines "Did Disney further their heritage of building innovative, unique, imaginative, immersive attractions when they built 7DMT?"

I don't think the answer to that is a definitive "yes". Take the coaster track out of the equation and compare what is left to the theming of Expedition Everest or Tower of Terror or Rock n Roller Coaster or even Space Mountain. From entrance to exit they contain much more and better theming than was put into 7DMT, which is primarily stamped concrete and some projection-head figures (same as the extensive queue for Under the Sea, by the way, which seems to indicate a trend).

I'll let you know what I think after I ride it for the first time. I've read some people claim it's their new favorite while others were completely underwhelmed. Only time will tell if the majority feel more like the former than the latter. Either way I don't see it being that big of a deal. Under the Sea is a very disappointing ride (to me) but I don't think that will keep people from visiting WDW. It's filler, fluff, something to do once per trip (unless it's plussed, a LOT). If I were betting I'd say that for most adults/teens 7DMT will fall into that category, but for the shorter set (and their parents) it will remain very popular and repeatable.

I also don't think that guest's enjoyment of 7DMT will preclude the company from doing bigger and better things. Everyone is quick to point out that their main goal is to turn a profit. This point is true and fine by me. But I also know that these are people, not robots. The drive is there to push the envelope, to make something new and exciting. Great design is a reward unto itself, so as long as there are great designers and artists at Disney - people who are inspired by their craft - I think it's going to be ok. Even though there will always be disappointments, not everyone will accept every decision, and fans will always argue about something.

 

[Hokie2000]

From entrance to exit they contain much more and better theming than was put into 7DMT, which is primarily stamped concrete and some projection-head figures (same as the extensive queue for Under the Sea, by the way, which seems to indicate a trend).

You mention stamped concrete a lot - I think I'm missing something because I thought they always used stamped concrete. It seems like the details in the walkways are in every guidebook/imagineering book I've ever read.

Is it not done well in the 7DMT queue? I usually love the little details on the ground - the peanuts in Storybook Circus, the rough, "mud" walkways in AK, the "jewels" around the magic carpets in Adventureland. I'm trying to remember what the ground was like in the Under the Sea queue. There was no line so we didn't spend a lot of time in it. Weren't there some details like shells embedded in the concrete? I honestly can't remember.

 

[jade1]

I do chuckle when I read a report where someone in mid-September crows about being able to get 9 FP+s from the kiosks. What were they bypassing, 5-10 minute SB lines?

The beauty of being there at a low crowd time is that you no longer HAVE to schedule your entire day then watch the clock for return times. Something strikes your fancy? Just step in line.

That's just one example though, if times are that tough they can make offers for moderate times as well if you stay onsite-even busy weeks if they really want.

That and many folks just don't know better for low season.

 

[mom2rtk]

That's just one example though, if times are that tough they can make offers for moderate times as well if you stay onsite-even busy weeks if they really want.

That and many folks just don't know better for low season.

Eh. You think it will move the needle.

I don't.

 

[Laketravis]

The Disney version was built by Dynamic Structures. Who built Soarin, Test Track, Radiator Springs Racers, and the Mark VII monorail in DL.

http://www.dynamicattractions.com/portfolio/

Where do you see that they built Soarin? They only mention the others in their portfolio.