First time question on this board?

[RobinHood's merrymen]

We took our now 6 yr old DD to WDW for her 1st time when she was only 3, back in 2004. At this stage she was still in a pushchair (sorry, stroller ) and although diagnosed with a mobility disability we managed fine.
Two weeks ago we returned from Disneyland Paris Resort and quite frankly we had a shock.
Mischa is a delightful, happy little 6 yr old who never complains but has to wear orthopiedic splints and special shoes to aid her stablilty amongst other reasons. At home we often do not see her as having a disability apart from the odd task or two, for example she can not climb stairs without help. Mischa also has a special pushchair that is basically bigger to take an older childs weight.
The shock came when due to Mischa's instability which breeds an inconfidence in her abilities to do even the basic of tasks, we struggled in getting her in/on almost every ride, especially the continual loaders. The French cast members (who aren't a patch on their American counterparts) seemed un-sympathetic to her needs as we were unable to show a 'blue card' when asked for.
It has made us think that we should apply for this 'blue card' when we go to WDW next November. I assume WDW operates a similar system but we feel a little uneasy as she can do many mobility tasks and does not require a wheelchair. Do you think we should/would quallify for this?
Thanks in advance for your comments.

 

[OneLittleSpark]

I'm sorry you had such a rough time of it with the CMs at DLP . I'm afraid I don't really know how the Paris system works, but WDW has the Guest Assistance Card (GAC). There are more details on it in the FAQ at the top of this board, but in brief it can be stamped with various messages, to provide certain accommodations for guests with additional needs. In your case, I think you might benefit from the "stroller as wheelchair" card (either given to you as a card with a stamp on it, or a red tag that goes on the handle). This alerts CMs to the fact that her pushchair (stroller, whatever you want to call it) is needed for mobility purposes, so you can take it through queues and into buildings such as the Land (which you would not otherwise be allowed to do).

I've always found the WDW CMs to be very helpful and friendly, when I've travelled there in my chair. With a wheelchair you will normally be guided to an alternative boarding area (often the exit) and most rides can be slowed or stopped to allow more time for boarding. Peter Pan is one of the few that can't be stopped, due to the suspended track system (health and safety concerns). If you have any more questions on doing Disney with a wheelchair, just post them here and we'll do what we can to answer them.

Hope this helps!!

 

[SueM in MN]

We took our now 6 yr old DD to WDW for her 1st time when she was only 3, back in 2004. At this stage she was still in a pushchair (sorry, stroller ) and although diagnosed with a mobility disability we managed fine.
Two weeks ago we returned from Disneyland Paris Resort and quite frankly we had a shock.
Mischa is a delightful, happy little 6 yr old who never complains but has to wear orthopiedic splints and special shoes to aid her stablilty amongst other reasons. At home we often do not see her as having a disability apart from the odd task or two, for example she can not climb stairs without help. Mischa also has a special pushchair that is basically bigger to take an older childs weight.
The shock came when due to Mischa's instability which breeds an inconfidence in her abilities to do even the basic of tasks, we struggled in getting her in/on almost every ride, especially the continual loaders. The French cast members (who aren't a patch on their American counterparts) seemed un-sympathetic to her needs as we were unable to show a 'blue card' when asked for.
It has made us think that we should apply for this 'blue card' when we go to WDW next November. I assume WDW operates a similar system but we feel a little uneasy as she can do many mobility tasks and does not require a wheelchair. Do you think we should/would quallify for this?
Thanks in advance for your comments.

I was at DL Paris for a day and 1/2 in November. I don't have a disability myself, but did some investigating because I was curious.
I stopped in Guest Relations and explained that I was very familiar with services for people with disabilities in WDW, was a moderator of a website about Disney parks and was just seeking information about what DL Paris had. They offered me a pamplet/map (actually pretty nice), which says that the Studio has Mainstream (accessible lines) but that DL for the most part doesn't. They offered the information that they had a Guest Assistance Card (GAC) similar to the one at WDW.
The DL park seemed very similar to WDW 10 years ago in terms of accessibility. Many of the rides were not well designed for wheelchair access and many of the queues there were not accessible. I saw several people with wheelchairs boarding rides; in many cases, the only accessible way was thru the exit. I don't know if the 'blue card' you are mentioning is their version of the GAC, but if she was not using a wheelchair, they may not have recognized her stroller as a mobility device. That might be why she needed the blue card.

At WDW, strollers used for mobility problems are treated as wheelchairs, which means they can use the wheelchair accessible entrance (if there is one - most attractions are accessible and don't have a separate handicapped entrance). Some of the mobility strollers look very much like 'regular' strollers, so it is best the get a GAC or tag allowing a stroller as a wheelchair as OneLittleSpark mentioned. If she will be walking in line, but needs some special assistance, you will need to get a GAC to let the CMs know that. As was already pointed out, there is more information in the disABILITIES FAQs thread about how GACs work and how to request one.

 

[nobodies36]

I've never been to DLP before. However, I imagine the 'blue card' is the European Parking Permit- the blue badge. I think it may have been a language thing and also that they must be able to ask for proof of disability (unlike the US parks). I think they just wanted proof that your child needed assistance. The sad thing is that not everyone who has a mobility issue has a blue badge and yet, the CM at the rides may only be able to understand the universal symbol that is on the blue badge (a person in a wheelchair) as a form of proof of assistance needed.

So going to the USA parks? Will not accept any proof (of disability) you bring. Ask at Guest Relations for any assistance.

Going to a park outside the USA? Take proof of assistance needed, just incase that it what the problem is.

Hope that helps and don't let it put you off going back.

Lisa
xXx

 

[SueM in MN]

I've never been to DLP before. However, I imagine the 'blue card' is the European Parking Permit- the blue badge. I think it may have been a language thing and also that they must be able to ask for proof of disability (unlike the US parks). I think they just wanted proof that your child needed assistance. The sad thing is that not everyone who has a mobility issue has a blue badge and yet, the CM at the rides may only be able to understand the universal symbol that is on the blue badge (a person in a wheelchair) as a form of proof of assistance needed.

So going to the USA parks? Will not accept any proof (of disability) you bring. Ask at Guest Relations for any assistance.

Going to a park outside the USA? Take proof of assistance needed, just incase that it what the problem is.

Hope that helps and don't let it put you off going back.

Lisa
xXx

From what I was told at guest Relations in DL Paris, you don't need a blue badge to ask for a Guest Assistance Card there. They may have told me that because it was obvious I am an American and in the US, we don't have any sort of universal proof of disability, like the blue badge in the Europe. The US handicapped parking permit is only that - handicapped parking. Many people who have a handicapped parking permit would not need any additional assistance in the parks, so showing a handicapped parking permit at rides would not really mean anything. Other people have handicapped parking permits for reasons other than mobility, so showing it at rides would not tell the CMs what is needed.

It sounded like the CMs at DL Paris are looking for a GAC (a blue card) at the attractions as opposed to a blue badge. I don't know if Europeans would need to show a blue badge as proof to get a GAC at Guest Relations in DL Paris or not, but I'm sure Americans would not.

BUT, for the US, it is illegal to require any proof of disability to provide assistance needed by someone because of a disability. The information about GACs in the disABILITIES FAQs thread pretty much tells what you would need to know for the Disney parks in the US.

ADDED THOUGHT: If you have a blue badge and plan to rent a car in the US, do bring the blue badge with because you can use it for parking.

 

[nobodies36]

From what I was told at guest Relations in DL Paris, you don't need a blue badge to ask for a Guest Assistance Card there. They may have told me that because it was obvious I am an American and in the US, we don't have any sort of universal proof of disability, like the blue badge in the Europe. The US handicapped parking permit is only that - handicapped parking. Many people who have a handicapped parking permit would not need any additional assistance in the parks, so showing a handicapped parking permit at rides would not really mean anything. Other people have handicapped parking permits for reasons other than mobility, so showing it at rides would not tell the CMs what is needed.

It sounded like the CMs at DL Paris are looking for a GAC (a blue card) at the attractions as opposed to a blue badge. I don't know if Europeans would need to show a blue badge as proof to get a GAC at Guest Relations in DL Paris or not, but I'm sure Americans would not.

BUT, for the US, it is illegal to require any proof of disability to provide assistance needed by someone because of a disability. The information about GACs in the disABILITIES FAQs thread pretty much tells what you would need to know for the Disney parks in the US.

ADDED THOUGHT: If you have a blue badge and plan to rent a car in the US, do bring the blue badge with because you can use it for parking.

I'm not saying you do need a blue badge. I said that the French CM's asked for it (with bad English) because (perhaps) that was all they had could say in English in relation to the fact that the family did not have a GAC, and if they had a blue badge on them then the CM may have granted assistance based on the blue badge even if the family did not have a GAC at that point in time. I think the CM was trying to help in the only way they knew how with limited English, without the GAC that the family should have got (in the CM's eyes) as from the OP it seemed like the unsympathetic CM'S were at the rides and not Guest Relations (even if GR that was why I said about the may require proof).

The blue badge has a universal symbol of disability on it- so show the CM (who speaks minimal English) a letter from a doctor and they have no clue, show them a blue badge with an image of a person in a wheelchair and they understand that means mobility disability/difficulties- in any language. Although a parking permit, it is not resticted to someone who drives in Europe.

In the case of the OP, the issue was about boarding rides- which would fall into the category of mobility issues rather than, per se, the issue of having a parking permit due to a mental/psychological condition on which the blue badge was issued. Sure, it would not tell the CM's what was needed, but it would show that assistnace is needed in the real woorld and may be needed in the parks. And sadly, not all the CM's at rides speak perfect English as to properly and in a politically correct manner ask what assistance was needed, perhaps if it was obvious to the CM that the family was struggling and did not have a GAC, and then help.

I guess unless you understand the cultute of 'sick note' Britain, you wouldn't understand why I am suggesting that DLP may require some proof of disability (I'm sure someone her will know if they do), nor would you know that they do ask for proof (and by proof I mean a UK blue badge) at theme parks in the UK (is it for any other reason than that they can? or to stop abuse of GACs/GAPs etc? I don't know. I am merely suggesting it as a possibility- that outside the USA Disney exercises the right to ask for 'proof').

I don't want to get into one of those debates about if Disney should ask- I just wanted to point out that circumstances may have meant the CM was asking for a blue badge and perhaps that the asking of the 'blue card' may have happened at guest relations (in which case, it would be good to know if by refusing assistance unless there is a production of this blue card, DLP are asking for proof or 'proof' of disability), as if visiting it would be a good thing for people to know beforehand and totally distinct from the question of a good or bad thing or whether they even should.

 

[goofieslonglostsis]

we don't have any sort of universal proof of disability, like the blue badge in the Europe.

Just to make a note, before we get into some miscommunication here; a blue badge isn't a 'universal proof of disability' overhere in Europe either. It's simply a handicapped parking permit, and that's it. The rules to get one differ per country (in some countries even per state or council) and the 'perks' associated with it also differ per country. For instance, in some countries with the blue badge you'll be allowed to park at places where no parking is allowed, in other countries you're not. However, all of those perks will come down to 'car associated stuff' and not extend to situations in other forms of publc live. It can give you some credit and with that service, perks, whatever, but that's more on an individual base and the person in front of you believing they want to do the best they can to help you, nothing regulated at all. Those that'll benefit the most are those with an invisible disability. A blue badge isn't something you'll be able to buy so a lot of people will give you credit as soon as they see the blue badge and be more willing to accomodate. But again, that's all on the 'goodwill' of persons and companies themselves.

Actually, we don't have a universal proof of disabilty either. Too hard with all of those different countries with all their own regulations and laws when it comes to disability and it definately doesn't help that it isn't a 'hot issue' to actually do advocate proper policy on this subject. We tend to have a higher standard when it comes to care and help 'behind the frontdoor' -allthough that also is a crying shame in countries like for instance Poland-, but we're definately behind on countries like the US when it comes to regulation of, laws about and accessibilty of public life.


About DLP? I think the reason why this could happen was the fact that they were dealing with an invisable disability. If you're used to the american way of dealing with these kinds of things, you might not expect to run into other situations when on first hand it might look the same. Count in the fact that knowledge still is lacking about even basic stuff let alone 'difficult' stuff like a hidden disability -willingness is there most of the times-, and things can get disappointing very quickly.

If I assume correctly (correct me if I'm wrong please!!) the mom in this story didn't get the DLP 'sister' of the GAC, right? Combine that with the fact that lots of stuff isn't accessible the normall way and that leading to those with a disability needing 'different treatment', I can see where things might have gone wrong. CM's wanting to make sure there's no abuse of other options only available to those not able to otherwise enjoy a ride and them really only trying to do that job. Most mean well but lack the bigger info of hidden disabilities. The mom didn't mean any harm, thought it should be ok (after all, at WDW it isn't a problem per se if you show up at a ride and ask a CM where to go without having a GAC present)) and getting frustrated with the CM dealing with it in a way she totally didn't expect.

All in all DLP doesn't do bad on this subject, but again; you have to look at it from a european (or really; french) point of view. They actually do very well compared to other companies in Europe. They do a lot of make a wish trips, they do a lot of 'helping out' etc. While it wont excuse everything or near everything, this is a company that is -and it's staff is!- willing. It probably was a combination of miscommunication, not knowing what to expect and CM's probably not being informed enough to realise they might have a customer before them that's used to such a different system, they'll need some extra explaning instead of assuming they'll know what to expect when in Europe.

My advice? Use the 'talk to me like I'm an alien and explain how this works with all of the basic info any human would allready know but I as an alien ofcourse can't know' in Europe. Things can differ so much per country and even company, this is the shortest way to get info. ASK. Even if you are 99,9% sure you know the answer. Go to guest service a next time at DLP and do the 'I'm dumb'-routine. Ask about all of the things; queues, rides, restaurants, transportation, hotelroom. They'll be very willing to explain and help and you'll know for sure there isn't any miscommunication or difference in expectations that might have a negative effect on your trip.

I actually use the 'I'm dumb' in the US also whenever I run into a new stuation. Eventhough I knew relatively a lot about stuff like the ADA, AAC etc. by using this method I soon found out I also had some expectations that weren't right. Some for the positive, some neutral, some negative, but it sure makes my live easiest if I ask about it upfront. It might take you as much as 15 minutes, but on a whole day or longer that's like 'nothing'.

 

[goofieslonglostsis]

Hmm that sounded harsher than I meant to. Guess I got a bit carried away with the explaining-part.

Mom; sorry for your experience. Please don't take it personal. I'm 99,9% sure it was a sad case of miscommunication and goodwilling-but-poor-informed people you ran into. Lack of knowledge doesn't excuse everything in my book but maybe it'll feel a bit less worse than having a feeling they might have really looked down on or thought less of you/your little girl.

 

[RobinHood's merrymen]

Thanks for all your thoughts guys.

Just to clarify my main issue was not with the CMs so far as they were just doing their job. It just made me think 'when we go to WDW perhaps we need to be more prepared'. We often dismiss Mischa's disabilities - we're lucky we can in certain circumstamces - But we realised that getting on/off rides, busses etc were more problematic. I think the 'blue card' at DLP was issued at Guest Relations and is not the European parking badge and it sounds like their version of WDWs 'GAC'; Which with thanks to OneLittleSpark and SueM I now understand more from the FAQs.

 

[goofieslonglostsis]

Hmm, you might be right 'mom'. (hope you don't mind me calling you that? Your nickname is a bit long to type) Just goes to show how easily we can think in a certain way; I didn't notice you're from the UK and just pressumed you'ld be american. Shame on me.

Don't worry too much about WDW. Overall they're so good with this subject, you might just be amazed. If you get a GAC that'll state she uses the pushchair as a wheelchair (some can look a lot like a stroller, so you'ld want to make sure there aren't any wrong assumptions), it'll do 'wonders'. She wont need a GAC for simply being in a wheelchair, only for the 'if it might be seen as a stroller, to make sure any CM knows it's not a stroller and she needs needs it'. She'll be fine. And if not; please don't hesitate and go to guest relations straight away! Explain, ask what you want to know and see what happens. At the very least they'll learn from it and you'll give others coming after you that advantage. My experience though is that they'll be very willing to help out with all kinds of stuff in all kinds of ways. (haven't had a bad experience with any CM or anything, but still was offered extraordinary help etc.)

You'll probably have a simular experience as you did when DD was 3 years old. She might be in here chair more often, but that doesn't have to influence her trip at all. After reading the FAQ's on here, I had high expectations of WDW on this subject. And let me tell you; they met those expectations and beyond. I've been there twice, both solo trips which is allways a bit of a ristriction when it comes to my independence. Well, not at WDW. It really felt like I was doing the park just like I would've done in my walking years. OK, I'ld get some handicapped seating on the bus and on shows, but the experience was the same. It really is 'leaving your worries at the gate as you enter WDW, to never see them again untill you leave'.

She'll be OK, you'll both be loving it all over again. And really; do the 'I'm dumb'-routine if you have the sligthest of a question or anything!

The only question you need to answer for yourself; does your DD has any needs that might need addressing while at WDW other than the usage of a pushchair as a wheelchair? If so; talk about it with guest service. If not; get the mentioned GAC, enjoy yourselves and tell Mickey I'll be there a month after you.


(ps; cute picture of the girls. If they love this, they'll just 'die' when seeing the princesses for real. )