Effort to accommodate Muslim women's modesty spurs debate

[Charade]

discuss...

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-06-13-muslim-modesty_x.htm

I thought this part was a bit over the top.

• In Bridgeview, Ill., a Muslim school says it wants its girls' basketball team to play road games against non-Muslim schools provided the public schools ban men and teenage boys from the game.

• In North Seattle, Wash., a public pool set up a swim time for Muslim women in which men, even male lifeguards, are banned.

 

[CJMickeyMouse]

IMO, if they choose to make the US their home, then they adapt to US customs and policy. They should NOT expect the US customs and policy to adjust for them. If they can't handle the rules or policies in place, maybe they should buy their own exercise equipment and work out at home!

Sorry, I don't go for everyone coming to the US and making demands on how things are done and how people act.

 

[N.Bailey]

I'm all for accommodating them when it's possible. IF it's private business, it should be up to that business and that business alone. I take issue when their right start interfering with other's rights as in this example from the link.

In Bridgeview, Ill., a Muslim school says it wants its girls' basketball team to play road games against non-Muslim schools provided the public schools ban men and teenage boys from the game.

IMO, this is asking too much. If it's simply a request however, I have no problem with them asking. I would have a problem with non-Muslim schools accommodating at the expense of men/boy's rights.

 

[Miss Jasmine]

I'm all for accommodating them when it's possible. IF it's private business, it should be up to that business and that business alone. I take issue when their right start interfering with other's rights as in this example from the link.

"In Bridgeview, Ill., a Muslim school says it wants its girls' basketball team to play road games against non-Muslim schools provided the public schools ban men and teenage boys from the game."

IMO, this is asking too much. If it's simply a request however, I have no problem with them asking. I would have a problem with non-Muslim schools accommodating at the expense of men/boy's rights.

I agree with this!

 

[Crankyshank]

Muslim students have attended schools in this country and participated in sports in the past as well as currently. Why now do some of them need special accomodations? Unbelievable

 

[mickeyfan2]

They are forcing religion into the public space. I am completely against what they are doing. They can practice their religion freelyin their homes and places of worship. Private businesses can decide it they want to accomodate them, but the public space if imposing their belief on ours.

In the basketball example, why should the fathers and brothers of the non-muslim girls have to be denied thier rights to see their daughters play?

 

[JimboInLimbo]

But Ebrahim Moosa, professor of Islamic studies at Duke University, says the requests are attempts to integrate with U.S. culture. They show "that America can become their home," he says.

How exactly is trying to force their beliefs on me "intergrating"? To me, this is no different than forced religion. They are welcome to have their beliefs and live the way want to live, but to try and force that on others who do not share that belief is wrong. Should we make all of them wear a Yarmulke if they're playing against a Jewish team?

 

[eclectics]

We all make certain little accommodations in our public life for others religious beliefs, but there has to be some sort of reasonable limit. The swimming pool thing is not an unreasonable request, but the basketball request is totally unreasonable and should not, hopefully, be entertained. Of course, as usual, just imho.

 

[rayelias]

IF it's private business, it should be up to that business and that business alone.

• In Lincoln Park, Mich., Fitness USA relented when Muslim women demanded that the gym wall off a co-ed aerobic center from their women-only section because men could see them working out.
• In North Seattle, Wash., a public pool set up a swim time for Muslim women in which men, even male lifeguards, are banned.


Let's follow the logic...

What if...
A gym business doesn't want Jews to work out with their members?
A private pool club doesn't want blacks to swim in the pool when whites are swimming?
A buffet restaurant business doesn't want to serve fat people?
A business doesn't want to hire women?
A business doesn't want to serve handicapped people?


I'm very disappointed that businesses are caving in to these intolerant people. No wonder they have to wear head covering. If I acted like that, I'd cover my face, too! (Relax, it's a joke.)

 

[N.Bailey]

• In Lincoln Park, Mich., Fitness USA relented when Muslim women demanded that the gym wall off a co-ed aerobic center from their women-only section because men could see them working out.
• In North Seattle, Wash., a public pool set up a swim time for Muslim women in which men, even male lifeguards, are banned.


Let's follow the logic...

What if...
A gym business doesn't want Jews to work out with their members?
A private pool club doesn't want blacks to swim in the pool when whites are swimming?
A buffet restaurant business doesn't want to serve fat people?
A business doesn't want to hire women?
A business doesn't want to serve handicapped people?


I'm very disappointed that businesses are caving in to these intolerant people. No wonder they have to wear head covering. If I acted like that, I'd cover my face, too! (Relax, it's a joke.)

Joke aside, if a private business wanted to do all that you've suggested here, I'd be on their side to do so. Hopefully no one will refuse to serve _____ (fill in the blank), but IMO as a private business owner, they should have the right. I think most know they'd have dire consequences if they took such actions, but I'd still defend their right to do so. I certainly wouldn't spend my money there, and that would be my right as well. If it became racial, who knows what someone that you've offended might do. You take your risks.

If private business wishes to accommodate these Muslims, that's their right. It shouldn't matter what I think. If they don't wish to accommodate them, that too should be their right, regardless of how you or I feel about it.

If I personally owned the gym I might try to work out a solution if it benefited me to do so. Otherwise, I'd stick to my guns.

 

[ozarkmom]

They are forcing religion into the public space. I am completely against what they are doing. They can practice their religion freelyin their homes and places of worship. Private businesses can decide it they want to accomodate them, but the public space if imposing their belief on ours.

In the basketball example, why should the fathers and brothers of the non-muslim girls have to be denied thier rights to see their daughters play?

Also many times the coaches are men.

 

[OzFan]

I used to live not to far from Bridgeview, IL. We had a community pool, and the women would come and swim, not in a bathing suit but in their long clothing. It was a hazzard to them and the lifeguards, if they were to drown it would make it very diffecult to get them out of the water with the weight of the clothing. When the group of women were told to please either put on a bathing suit or stay out of the pool, they told our village they would sue them. Our village board closed the pool. They would not cave in, they just said ok, fine NO POOL. They leveled it and turned it into a skate park. Our elementary school last year put on their Christmas Program, it did not include 1 Christmas song. We didn't even say the Pledge before the program started. Some of the parents stood up and just started saying the Pledge. My children were losing their rights to freedom of speech. During Ramadan (sp) a few years back, it fell during the Christmas holidays, our PTA was not alllowed to bring any treats because all of the children could not enjoy them. OK fine. Then when Ramadan was over the Muslim children and ONLY the Muslim children were allowed a special feast in the gym, during school hours. I moved furhter away from the community I had been apart of of 13 years.

 

[FreshTressa]

Very conservative christians have beliefs too that aren't reflected in the public school system.

They have to homeschool or do private school. The public school system does not accomodate those needs.

Nor should they accomodate the needs of other religions.

 

[poohandwendy]

Very conservative christians have beliefs too that aren't reflected in the public school system.

They have to homeschool or do private school. The public school system does not accomodate those needs.

Nor should they accomodate the needs of other religions.

I was thinking the same thing. I wonder if any of these accomodations would be even entertained if a Christian School said they wanted to play sports with local public schools, but wanted no men/boys allowed to attend because of modesty issues?

 

[bsmcneil]

Very conservative christians have beliefs too that aren't reflected in the public school system.

They have to homeschool or do private school. The public school system does not accomodate those needs.

Nor should they accomodate the needs of other religions.

Bull****

Then why was I taught abstinence is the way to avoid AIDS, that condoms fail more times than not (inaccurate) and that Darwin was an athiest fighting religion and not being scientific (blatantly untrue). Similarly, why did my school have a yearly "motivational speaker" who was a local paster or a Christian rock group without allowing other faiths the same or allowing kids to sit the assembly out. The name of the program (and other events of that week)? PSI - Public School Invasion. I kid you not. Conservative christians DO get their way in some schools.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

I don't see any harm in the women asking a private club for a private workout area. Many Gyms had them long before now and there are even a couple women only gyms in my town. And the Muslims had nothing to do with it. We seperate restrooms don't we? Much ado about nothng really.

The school's request is going to be turned down. More ado about something that will not go far.

 

[Nanoer]

Even though I'm a kid here's what I think

If it's public we don't have to do listen... If it's private.. knock yourself out

 

[Charade]

Bull****

Then why was I taught abstinence is the way to avoid AIDS, that condoms fail more times than not (inaccurate) and that Darwin was an atheist fighting religion and not being scientific (blatantly untrue). Similarly, why did my school have a yearly "motivational speaker" who was a local paster or a Christian rock group without allowing other faiths the same or allowing kids to sit the assembly out. The name of the program (and other events of that week)? PSI - Public School Invasion. I kid you not. Conservative Christians DO get their way in some schools.

Technically they were right. Abstinence is a sure fire way for avoid all sorts of risks associated with sexual relations. Abstinence doesn't necessarily need to be pegged to Christian beliefs. It usually is but they don't hold the exclusive rights to it's promotion.

They were completely wrong (motive???) about condoms and Darwin. It was religion that was fighting Darwin.

What school did you go to? And when?

I personally don't have a problem with exposure to religion in the public setting but I do have a problem with expectations of participation or adherence to it.

 

[ducklite]

We all make certain little accommodations in our public life for others religious beliefs, but there has to be some sort of reasonable limit. The swimming pool thing is not an unreasonable request, but the basketball request is totally unreasonable and should not, hopefully, be entertained. Of course, as usual, just imho.

That was my thought on it. In all honesty, my guess is that there are pools in this country already that have a small time set aside every week for a women only swim. Provided that there is an equal time set aside for a men only swim, I see no problem with that one, even in a public pool, provided it was GENDER based, not religion based. If they want to make it only for Muslim women, they can go swim in their bathtubs.

On the other hand, the basketball one is outrageous, particularly because it's a PUBLIC SCHOOL. If they want to ban men from attending their home games, that's really their perrogative. But don't even THINK about coming to the school that my tax dollars support and saying that my husband can't go watch the game.

As far as asking a gym to wall off a section because men could see the women doing aerobics, no way. They joined the gym fully aware of the layout. If they want an all women gym, there are plenty of them out there, they should have joined one of those. That's just a freaking DUH!

If Christians can't have Christmas displays and Jews can't have Mennorah's (sorry if that's spelled wrong) on public property, then why should Muslims recieve any special accomodation on public proerty based on their religion either?

If they are unhappy in the United States, there are plenty of countries in the Middle East that would be happy to accomodate their beliefs.

Anne

 

[LindsayDunn228]

That was my thought on it. In all honesty, my guess is that there are pools in this country already that have a small time set aside every week for a women only swim. Provided that there is an equal time set aside for a men only swim, I see no problem with that one, even in a public pool, provided it was GENDER based, not religion based. If they want to make it only for Muslim women, they can go swim in their bathtubs.

On the other hand, the basketball one is outrageous, particularly because it's a PUBLIC SCHOOL. If they want to ban men from attending their home games, that's really their perrogative. But don't even THINK about coming to the school that my tax dollars support and saying that my husband can't go watch the game.

As far as asking a gym to wall off a section because men could see the women doing aerobics, no way. They joined the gym fully aware of the layout. If they want an all women gym, there are plenty of them out there, they should have joined one of those. That's just a freaking DUH!

If Christians can't have Christmas displays and Jews can't have Mennorah's (sorry if that's spelled wrong) on public property, then why should Muslims recieve any special accomodation on public proerty based on their religion either?

If they are unhappy in the United States, there are plenty of countries in the Middle East that would be happy to accomodate their beliefs.

Anne