Economy, Good or Bad

[momof1princess]

Well, OP, for us, things are pretty much the same. DH changed jobs almost two years ago, after being at his former job almost 22 years. The pay at his current job is much better, and he'll get his last raise (they get a raise every 6 months for the first two years) on may 21st. However, he has to drive 20 extra minutes to and from work each day, and he HATES what he's doing (underbody work in an auto plant, which means he has his arms over his head 10+ hours per day, 5 days a week-it's KILLING his rotator cuff in his right arm). We're hoping he can get transferred to another area of the plant; but, since he's only been there 22 months, that's unlikely.

At my job, I haven't gotten a raise in over 2 years, and I don't see one on the horizon. I'm an admin. assistant/bookkeeper for my church, and make $11 per hour. That's way cheap for someone who's responsible for payroll, taxes, and all other bookkeeping. However, I took the job because I'd been a SAHM for 12 years, and I'd been looking for a job for 14 months when this one came along.

Collectively, we don't seem to have made much progress. We're now able to make small, weekly contributions to an IRA, and we don't dip into our savings as often, but we don't seem to have any more disposable income than we did before. Gas is MUCH more expensive, our homeowners insurance went up almost $150 per year (no explanation why) food prices are way up, and DD16 will get her license soon (still working on learning to park, but she drives great), so our car insurance is going to skyrocket.

Overall, I guess we're holding our own.

 

[eliza61]

As other posters mentioned, it really depends.
My company is consistently on the "one of the best companies to work for".
We've gotten raises the last 5 years averaging 2-3.5% but we've also lost a few divisons.
We also have gotten bonuses the last 3 years. the company values profit sharing so in general if the company makes money, the employees get a share. Keeps morale very high, happy employees are more productive.
The stock market exploded so that has been wonderful for my retirement plan and my investments. Last year I think my growth was ~20%
We are also hiring but new hires will have significantly less benefits. We finally did away with defined pensions for new employees.
We are also hiring and anticipate breaking ground on a new manufacturing plant in Alabama in 2015. the first one in the states in a long time.

My oldest son is an apprentice in the plumbing trade after trying various college routes. He gets union apprenticeship rates.
My youngest hasn't decided on a major but he's strong points are not the "stem" sciences so future job opportunities are definitely a concern.

I moved into a new home but still have my old home on the market. It's been a slow market so hopefully I can ditch the old one soon. I'm pretty lucky in that I didn't have a mortgage on the old home so I'm not stuck with 2 mortgages.

I'm a bit older so most of my friends are winding down their careers. no one's lost their pensions, so we maybe a bit more optimistic than a new college graduate.

 

[Jaime4004]

Personally, things are going alright right now. My husband got a raise a few months ago and then his boss came back and gave him even more of a raise. Our health insurance premium did not increase this year.

Not only that, we are moving next week and our rent is decreasing $100 a month and our commuting costs are dropping about $200 a month. The internet costs are also dropping another $25 a month. Because we are moving much closer to civilization, I should be able to get a part-time job for some extra money in the fall. As it is, we are able to live somewhat below our means on my husband's salary alone and even further below when we move.

What has gone up is propane. It has more than doubled since last year and it is painful, let me tell you. Unfortunately, the new rental is also on propane. Looks like I will be investing in thermal curtains at the very least...

I will say that we do not trust that things will be good forever and are sticking with the plan of continuing to stay far away from any kind of debt, reduce our expenses, and putting away a lot of money in savings for when the other shoe drops.

Most of my extended family is employed at stable jobs. There is only one who has talk of layoffs in his department, atm. A few years ago, this situation was very, very different for my family.

we are in the same boat, seems like things here are improving. Probably depends not only on location, but the industry you're in. DH and mine seem stable. We have gotten raises and bonuses for a few years, luckily. There was some talk of big layoffs for DH last year and he didn't have a good feeling about his position so he quickly got another job, closer, and for the same pay (minus state income taxes which we no longer have to pay). But we are also saving a lot, and more frugal, expecting that things don't stay well forever. Like earlier this year, when our furnace died...
Totally agree on the propane price, that's a killer. Our fill up last month was $4.58/gal. It went up $1.20 something!! It was way beyond what everyone else in the area was paying. We complained, they reduced it by $.60/gal (which was still way above what everyone else was paying). Got another fill up yesterday, and it was back down to $3.32/gal. Interesting that propane prices can increase/decrease by over $1 in a month.

 

[Southernmiss]

Bad

Everything has gone up, except our pay. Insurance (Home and health), gas, groceries, drs. appointments, etc.

DH both work service oriented occupations that rely on other folks to do well in order for us to do better. DH did get a raise 2 years ago when his job title was changed, and I get a basic 3% cost of living increase each year. But DH works for the government (which is known to pay professionals less than the market) and I work for a church where folks expect free services.

DH is looking around for a second career and can retire from this job if something else comes along.

I have been part time for 16 years, but have been told that when our full time secretary retires in about a year, that I will have her job.

Hopefully, these things will come to pass as we'll have 2 in college in 2 years.

 

[momof1princess]

As other posters mentioned, it really depends.
My company is consistently on the "one of the best companies to work for".
We've gotten raises the last 5 years averaging 2-3.5% but we've also lost a few divisons.
We also have gotten bonuses the last 3 years. the company values profit sharing so in general if the company makes money, the employees get a share. Keeps morale very high, happy employees are more productive.
The stock market exploded so that has been wonderful for my retirement plan and my investments. Last year I think my growth was ~20%
We are also hiring but new hires will have significantly less benefits. We finally did away with defined pensions for new employees.
We are also hiring and anticipate breaking ground on a new manufacturing plant in Alabama in 2015. the first one in the states in a long time.

My oldest son is an apprentice in the plumbing trade after trying various college routes. He gets union apprenticeship rates.
My youngest hasn't decided on a major but he's strong points are not the "stem" sciences so future job opportunities are definitely a concern.

I moved into a new home but still have my old home on the market. It's been a slow market so hopefully I can ditch the old one soon. I'm pretty lucky in that I didn't have a mortgage on the old home so I'm not stuck with 2 mortgages.

I'm a bit older so most of my friends are winding down their careers. no one's lost their pensions, so we maybe a bit more optimistic than a new college graduate.

Would it be too nosy of me to ask who you work for? I'm a news junkie and live in Alabama, and I've heard of several companies opening plants/relocating plants in Alabama, so I'm curious if yours is one of the ones that was announced recently.

 

[tvguy]

That all said, many of the positions are not for the type of money I am looking for. They all agree my experience and skills makes me worth the kind of money I want, and that I am exactly the type of person they want and need, but it's just not what they targetted the position for..

In my industry, we typically hire people from smaller cities, where pay USED to be lower, looking to move up. I've had 2 different managers in the past year, and both have been surprised at how many of their top candidates from smaller cities were making more than we pay for the same job. They both flew candidates in, only to discover the salary issue. So they now ask about the salary these folks expect in advance. Seems in smaller cities, the pay raises have been more generous since the economy tanked. It took us 9 months to fill our last opening. Seems to be an issue with our corporate pay scales, because most of our recent hires have been from other locations, not outside.

 

[missnic]

I think that locally, our economy is getting better. Personally, it was never 'bad' for us. 5 years ago, when the economy first started tanking, I was offered a job promotion, which came with a relocation. That also meant that DH had to quit his job and find a new one. Unfortunately, this was right around the time that everyone stopped hiring, so he was out of work until very recently. Luckily, my promotion/pay was enough to keep us afloat.. and very, very thankfully, I have a recession proof job that allowed pay raises throughout the recession. My job also has very inexpensive (but excellent) benefits, and thanks to Obamacare, my cost has actually effectively decreased this year.

In 2009, near the bottom of the housing crisis, we happened upon a bank owned townhouse which we purchased, paying quite a bit less for a mortgage than we were paying in rent. Townhouses in our neighborhood have just begun to sell for more that what we paid, and we are no longer 'underwater'. Unfortunately, that means that investors have started buying, and most of my neighbors are now renters. Nothing against renters, but in our experience, they can't follow rules/aren't given a copy of the covenants (we have a fairly strict HOA). We are now looking to sell, and purchase a house.

 

[AquaDame]

I'd say bad. I still know many looking that are stick in low paying, part time, or contract work that would just love to be stable for awhile. Most I know that are unhappy in their current jobs have already been beaten so low, they are afraid to search for different jobs.

Personally my husband and I have been very lucky, but even his job is in danger of having their Union busted and who knows what follows when (not if, lets be honest here) that happens.

My brother left entirely and is living in the Netherlands now where his life is much, much better.

My parents lost their pension when their own Union lost bargaining power and 50% of their 401Ks tanked. They're still not back to where they were.

My aunts and uncles have all retired and are doing OK, but all the members of my generation are uneasy.

 

[MomToOne]

In my industry, we typically hire people from smaller cities, where pay USED to be lower, looking to move up. I've had 2 different managers in the past year, and both have been surprised at how many of their top candidates from smaller cities were making more than we pay for the same job. They both flew candidates in, only to discover the salary issue. So they now ask about the salary these folks expect in advance. Seems in smaller cities, the pay raises have been more generous since the economy tanked. It took us 9 months to fill our last opening. Seems to be an issue with our corporate pay scales, because most of our recent hires have been from other locations, not outside.

Yeah, it's a wierd dynamic right now. The larger companies in my area seem to be the ones struggling the most with updating their salary levels - they still seem to be working under the "you should just be glad to have a job!" mentality. But there are so many companies trying to hire right now, and a relatively small talent pool with the experience they are looking for in the area (lots of folks left during the downturn), so they just aren't managing to hire people - I've talked to companies who've had multiple openings for someone like me for more than 6 months, and they haven't been able to fill a single slot. But they still insist their salaries are "competitive" - my question, is "by what standards?" If they truly were competitive, they would be filling the slots.

The other problem I notice is companies seem to think they can hire cheaper junior talent and have them perform as well as more experienced talent. My company keeps trying that one - they refuse to pay enough to hire anything more than a very junior person, then get upset when those hires can't jump in cold on very complex assignments with no supervision...

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Yeah, it's a wierd dynamic right now. The larger companies in my area seem to be the ones struggling the most with updating their salary levels - they still seem to be working under the "you should just be glad to have a job!" mentality. But there are so many companies trying to hire right now, and a relatively small talent pool with the experience they are looking for in the area (lots of folks left during the downturn), so they just aren't managing to hire people - I've talked to companies who've had multiple openings for someone like me for more than 6 months, and they haven't been able to fill a single slot. But they still insist their salaries are "competitive" - my question, is "by what standards?" If they truly were competitive, they would be filling the slots.

The other problem I notice is companies seem to think they can hire cheaper junior talent and have them perform as well as more experienced talent. My company keeps trying that one - they refuse to pay enough to hire anything more than a very junior person, then get upset when those hires can't jump in cold on very complex assignments with no supervision...

Same old story - you get what you pay for. Glad to see at least in your case the cheapos struggling to fill jobs. That's a good thing

 

[undertheradar]

The economy can't be bad allover, take a look at the DCL board and the activity related to booking 2015 cruises. There are quotes on there for $20k and $30k for 12-15 night cruises.

 

[OhMari]

The economy can't be bad allover, take a look at the DCL board and the activity related to booking 2015 cruises. There are quotes on there for $20k and $30k for 12-15 night cruises.

I feel people like to talk the talk, but do they really book. Plus I know many of them use their DVC points. On the other hand though, people will live way below their means, just so they can take their vacations.

Sorry, I have read tons of Trip Reports and many people consider their Disney Vacation as a priority.

 

[crisi]

I feel people like to talk the talk, but do they really book. Plus I know many of them use their DVC points. On the other hand though, people will live way below their means, just so they can take their vacations.

Sorry, I have read tons of Trip Reports and many people consider their Disney Vacation as a priority.

DVC points aren't free - we cruised this year on cash - for $4000 - to use points for that cruise would have cost us well over $3000 in dues alone.

I know a lot of people on these boards make Disney vacations their priority - but they are still making room for - to use the example above - a cruise that costs $5-$25k - after making mortgage payments and buying groceries and paying the heating bill. (I'll admit, I don't get the cruise board. We loved our cruise, its a nice vacation - but expensive. I just can't put myself in the shoes of someone who chooses to afford some of these really expensive cruises. ABD is similar - we've taken an ABD trip - and I just can't wrap my head around people who have taken several).

The simple truth is that the economy still is bad for a lot of people - for some people - its never really been bad and last years stock market gains provided a boon.

 

[hopemax]

The simple truth is that the economy still is bad for a lot of people - for some people - its never really been bad and last years stock market gains provided a boon.

Exactly.

In the cruise example, what we are talking about is:

The usually the "one time only" cruises on the small ships (Magic & Wonder) which have capacities of 2400 or 2700. Assume families of 3 = 800 or 900 families on board.

There are about 115 million households in the US. So assuming they're all Americans (which they won't be) that's like .0007% of US households required to "sell out" the cruise. That number drops, once you account for International travelers. The mythical "1%" is 1428 times that, its such a small number.

Numbers that small, are not proof of the overall health of the economy. That's just proof that there are statistically enough "wealthy people who are Disney fans" for a product to be offered.

 

[MichiganKris]

I am doing better then when I left Michigan 4 years ago. However I could never sell my house and finally ended up being foreclosed on. Last year my company had us on rolling layoffs and ended up permanently laying off about 30% of the salaried employees and 50% of the hourly employees. This week they have announced that our manufacturing operations will be shutting down for the months of April and July because of lack of sales. I work for a company making mining and construction equipment selling world wide. I think that this is a bad sign for the economy overall.

 

[tvguy]

Yeah, it's a wierd dynamic right now. The larger companies in my area seem to be the ones struggling the most with updating their salary levels - they still seem to be working under the "you should just be glad to have a job!" mentality. But there are so many companies trying to hire right now, and a relatively small talent pool with the experience they are looking for in the area (lots of folks left during the downturn), so they just aren't managing to hire people - I've talked to companies who've had multiple openings for someone like me for more than 6 months, and they haven't been able to fill a single slot. But they still insist their salaries are "competitive" - my question, is "by what standards?" If they truly were competitive, they would be filling the slots.

The other problem I notice is companies seem to think they can hire cheaper junior talent and have them perform as well as more experienced talent. My company keeps trying that one - they refuse to pay enough to hire anything more than a very junior person, then get upset when those hires can't jump in cold on very complex assignments with no supervision...

Yeah, "grow your own" has been tried here too. One of our competitors has taken to hiring college seniors about 2 months before they graduate. We had trouble retaining "grow your own" staff, they tend to decide to get out of the industry. Last one took a job at the mall. Same pay, better hours, and a discount on clothing.

 

[OhMari]

I am doing better then when I left Michigan 4 years ago. However I could never sell my house and finally ended up being foreclosed on. Last year my company had us on rolling layoffs and ended up permanently laying off about 30% of the salaried employees and 50% of the hourly employees. This week they have announced that our manufacturing operations will be shutting down for the months of April and July because of lack of sales. I work for a company making mining and construction equipment selling world wide. I think that this is a bad sign for the economy overall.

I think the "auction" industry is killing you. But old equipment does wear out and hopefully things will turn around too in your industry. My dh has his yearly work in Florida every year and this year we had or he had to go to the Richie Auction, which is right down the road from WDW. I could not believe the international people that were at that auction and they didn't bat an eye purchasing equipment and having to ship it back to their countries. These people were also coming in on these helicopters you see Donald Trump fly in. My dh told me they probably came in on private jets and then got escorted over to the auction by helicopter.

 

[Juliet25]

]Personally I feel like if you have a job, the economy is looking up for you. The problem is that the job market is a disaster now and people can't find that job to enjoy the uptick in the economy[/B]. ... I think it's down to perspective, employment status, field of work, and lastly your location.

I agree with this. If you managed to weather the recession and not lose your job, you're probably in a good place. However, if you lost your job, it's a real struggle to find a new one. I lost mine in 2011; I'm fortunate that my DH is employed, but another income would be really helpful. With three kids, we get hit with lots of bills (like a looming $1K dental charge). A part time job for me would be great, but I can't even get interviews.

I think the economy is great for some and really, really bad for others. If you're not in the latter category, you just can't grasp how bad it is.

 

[kydisneyfans]

In our part of the world, it's the dramatic healthcare cost increase that is killing our income. We were nailed with a 63% increase Jan 1 on a 6 month policy, we have been alerted of an additional 44% increase on July 1. Our deductible increased, out of pocket increased, and now our total cost will have more than doubled in 6 months.

My wife's employer announced 700 layoffs(in healthcare of all places), she was proactive and landed another job without much of an issue. I was laid off for 43 weeks, landed a job in November, and went back on temporary layoff from the new firm a month ago. I was able to land a more stable position in the past week.

I just saw gas had surged to 3.79 today, which puts an even bigger crunch on the pocketbook.

I disagree that the economy is better.

 

[Colleen27]

I think that coming from Michigan/Detroit, as I did and looks like the PP does, we may have a different view on the economy than a lot of the rest of the US. Since 2008, Michigan has been very slow to recover, and that is right - anyone can get a job at Target or Home Depot for $9.00/hour. That is not even close to being able to provide for a family.

I was born and raised in Detroit/west suburbs, and became an adult in the mid-1990's when the economy was booming, brokers were practically paying YOU to buy a house, and there was no way I would have believed that my $13-15.00 hour job as a 18-25 year old would go away or that I would not have been able to find another one. I even QUIT that job when we built our second house because it was too far to drive the hour commute up US-23 to my new tiny little town in the country and I wanted to be closer to DS during the day who was only 2 at the time. DH was making better money than I was so we could afford for me to work for DS's daycare for $9.00 hour...after all, I was saving daycare tuition (employee's children were free) AND the gas, wear and tear on the car, etc from driving in town instead of dodging potholes, roadkill, and crazy drivers on I-96, right??!!

Great plan, except DH worked in the car industry. When that collapsed (thank you GM, for being the sole driving economic force in our area ) in 2008 and DH frantically tried to find work and was let go 3 more times in two years because the companies he was hired for downsized, went bankrupt, or just stopped paying their employees, and I couldn't get a job because we lived in an area where all employment was scarce, not just my field, after scores of applications I was only able to score an interview/job with Target stocking their shelves at 4am, and house after house in our brand new sub were foreclosing and we lost over $100K in value of ours, we knew we had to do something.

We picked up, took a huge financial hit and sold our house for practically pennies (most likely would have lost it anyway with the way things were going), and moved to Illinois - Chicago's west suburbs. Best decision we could have made. It was tough, letting go of our beautiful house that we built and made ours, where the next 2 children were born, and the only home oldest DS had really ever known, but we knew we had to do it for our future and for theirs. I landed a job exactly 1 month after moving here, and, because it wasn't exactly my dream job (CS call center), it did allow me to get back into the swing of the corporate world, and 5 months later, I was hired by my current company where I have had three promotions and a solid career. Same with DH.

Meanwhile, back home in Michigan, the job market is still pretty stagnant, and people are still living in homes that are nowhere near the value of what they bought them for. I think it is getting *better*, but not nearly as fast as the people need it to, and not as fast as other parts of the country. So, when asking "do you think the economy is good or bad?" it really all depends on where one lives and what experience they have/do have.

Our story is similar. I left a good job because even on two incomes we couldn't afford to buy a home in a neighborhood/school district I was comfortable with. My job was in Detroit and we ended up moving way up 94 to get a home we could afford in a nice area, but then I had a 60min commute and all the extra childcare and transportation expenses that went with it - quitting was a no brainer back then. For a while I even kept up my certifications, thinking I'd eventually go back. There's no way that could happen now - I recently saw a job posting from the last company I worked for. Same job title, same pay, but now they want a bachelors and 3-5 years' experience for the job I held with a couple of tech certs and eventually an associates (finished the degree 6mo after I hired in).

My husband is in construction, not the auto industry but just as hard-hit in this area, but we've stayed. I'd like to leave, honestly, but the kids are at a tough age for uprooting them and DH feels very strongly about staying close to the extended family while the kids are young. So here we are, even though he's got a standing job offer in a booming economy down south (Houston area). We've weathered the storm alright, mostly because we threw every dime we had into paying cash for a foreclosure when the market was at rock-bottom. If we still had a house payment we'd have had some very hand-to-mouth years and might very well have ended up a foreclosure statistic ourselves. I'd still like to leave but feel like we missed our window and that we're sort of stuck at this point on a lower-pay/less-opportunity trajectory for many years to come.