DVC vs. Competition

[MouseOfCards]

View attachment 276660

Wow. Never realized that BC was that close!

 

[ziravan]

Not related to the thread at all, just a follow up pic from the earlier one. Both taken from SWA plane leaving MCO.

You can see the DHS construction in the lower left corner. Pic taken last Dec.

 

[littlestar]

We own a Marriott lock off 2 bedroom platinum week that we paid $1,000 for. It is an every other year week. We divide it and trade both halfs of it - we get good value for it trading it in Interval International. We use Interval's cash getaways in May and September and that enables us to book Marriott and Sheraton vacation club two bedrooms in Orlando for around $400 for the week.

We also own Wyndham resale points (paid less than $2,000 for 281,000 points). Those are used for Hawaii, Destin FL, Gatlinburg, etc. We only use our DVC points for onsite stays.

 

[chicagoshannon]

We own Wyndham and a resort in Vegas that we solely use to trade with in Interval. The fees for trading have gone way up since we bought 12 years ago. It's almost better to just book the Extra Vacations for cash. Banking points with Wyndham is also much more of a hassle than with DVC. I wish we could dump our Interval resort and buy more Disney but can't seem to even give the blasted thing away.

I don't know how Marriott resorts work but that's where I would look if I was looking to buy another non Disney time share.

 

[bwvBound]

2) bwvBound, in your examples the only one I can really try to compare to would be the first one. We stayed at an ocean front studio on Maui (Lahaina Shores) in 2015, ~5 minute walk to Lahaina town, 9 nights, and I believe it was around $2.5k. This was 12/20 - 12/29 so definitely in the Christmas pricing range. Roughly similar pricing but I assume Maui is generally more expensive (on average) though I do also realize that is a 2BR vs. Studio comparison as well.

Thx! Adding to the disparity ... the one I found via RCI's rental weeks is far from the ocean.

3) Speaking of which, are you typically forced to book in weeks in most time shares? We tend to be more 9-11 night travelers. Also, with us being 2 adults 0 kids does that open up certain options that could help with being more flexible?

As suggested in earlier replies ... it all depends on the specific timeshare. To answer for Worldmark, a point system launched in the late 1980s, there is a 7-night minimum enforced if you are booking at the earliest reservation window (10-13 months out) for a "red season" (high season) period. If you are booking in white (mid) or blue (low) seasons, the 7-night minimum is removed. Likewise, if you are booking inside the 10-month window, the 7-night minimum is removed. However -- even if your reservation period requires a 7-night minimum, you may split the reservation across multiple locations; example: 3 nights on Kauai and 4 nights on Maui. While the system can support a 1-night reservation, it tends to be impractical due to housekeeping charges imposed on stays beyond a certain allotment for each account.

 

[glamdring269]

Thanks all. I've spent some time reading quite a bit over at TUG and have made a post in their "new to timesharing" forum. Hopefully I can get some more specific advice there. Not quite sure if this will end up being the right thing for us to do or if we should continue to just rent but I do know we like to go to Maui at least every other year so if it is possible to find some savings via a timeshare resale then I want to have that option!

If only Aulani were on Maui...

 

[DVC Doctor]

I personally find the Hilton Grand Vacation Club to be very similar to DVC and the quality is very good with a nice selection of properties

 

[Dean]

Thanks all. I've spent some time reading quite a bit over at TUG and have made a post in their "new to timesharing" forum. Hopefully I can get some more specific advice there. Not quite sure if this will end up being the right thing for us to do or if we should continue to just rent but I do know we like to go to Maui at least every other year so if it is possible to find some savings via a timeshare resale then I want to have that option!

If only Aulani were on Maui...

Just spend time getting educated and like DVC, but even more so, resale is the way to go. In general I like to take my preferences including quality and location and work backwards. For Maui that means looking at villa size, location and personal preferences. For us starting without ownership but knowing what we know that'd be Westin, Hyatt, Marriott or Diamond. That's because we prefer a higher end product and Kaanapali Beach and these are the 4 systems that would do that directly. But there are other resorts worth considering though not that many for Maui. Sands of Kahana is worth considering as is the Schooner and I think Hilton is supposed to build a resort in Kihei. If I were looking at EOY, I'd buy an EOY Marriott personally. Since we go about every fourth year, this is actually what we've done though Oahu and Kauai. Once you narrow it down a little, make sure you understand the systems ins and outs and how that will or will not work for you.

For example, getting a Marriott reservation for Maui in a floating week might be tough though getting one using Marriott Trust points (their points system) might be a little easier depending. For Marriott it also means understanding it's really 2 resorts in one, the older one with a limited kitchen. For Westin, make sure you understand their points system. Buying a different Westin location that has mandatory points might be a great choice. Not sure about Hyatt, when I looked at it years ago, their points system was very limited. For Diamond, make sure you understand their maint fees and resort quality as they are not as high end.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I personally find the Hilton Grand Vacation Club to be very similar to DVC and the quality is very good with a nice selection of properties

I second that, we are also HGVC owners and have gotten great use of our points.

We have found that the addition of RCI through HGVC (just like rci through DVC) can be of great use IF you "know" what to exchange for. But mostly it will be a downgrade, same as DVC.

So besides from using the HGVC points within the network we have used the points in RCI but only for hilton properties in NYC and DVC. We could potentially get 2,5weeks in NYC and only pay the MF + exchange fee. That equals $590 + $239. If I had to split up the 2,5weeks into 1 week + 1,5 week i would need to pay an additional $239 exchange fee. To me thats a great value. I could also opt to trade into NYC and DVC (mostly only SSR, OKW and maybe AKV but all 1br), that would cost slighty more but the MF part is the same. So 1 week in NYC + exchange fee, 1 week at DVC + exchange fee.

NYC: $239
DVC: $239 + because we can fee of $190

A total of 239 + 239 + 190 + 590: $1258

Again still a great value.

Before deciding on which other system you should go for, I would look at the most common destinations you would go to and see which timeshare systems is present there. Then learn about those systems and ask a lot of questions to learn the pros and cons. If you still feel that one of the systems is right for you, then look for the perfect contract.

 

[glamdring269]

For Maui that means looking at villa size, location and personal preferences. For us starting without ownership but knowing what we know that'd be Westin, Hyatt, Marriott or Diamond. That's because we prefer a higher end product and Kaanapali Beach and these are the 4 systems that would do that directly. But there are other resorts worth considering though not that many for Maui.

This is basically what we would want i think. Maui, Lahaina area, EOY and since there are only 2 of us we would want a 1BR at maximum. To be honest I think the biggest hurdle we may run into is that it seems most of these timeshares always start on a specific day of the week and I haven't been able to figure out if they're always for 1 week or if you can extend to 10 or 11 nights. We also don't have a lot of flexibility and would only travel last week June/first week July/Christmas time. I'm still trying to figure out if that means we should buy a fixed week or if floating/points would still work. But again, that's where the research will eventually pay off!

 

[skier_pete]

I would agree - even though I don't own it - that from everything I read HGVC is #2 in the industry. If you look at the list of the top timeshares for resale value several of the HGVC resorts are ranked up at the top with DVC resorts.

 

[skier_pete]

This is basically what we would want i think. Maui, Lahaina area, EOY and since there are only 2 of us we would want a 1BR at maximum. To be honest I think the biggest hurdle we may run into is that it seems most of these timeshares always start on a specific day of the week and I haven't been able to figure out if they're always for 1 week or if you can extend to 10 or 11 nights. We also don't have a lot of flexibility and would only travel last week June/first week July/Christmas time. I'm still trying to figure out if that means we should buy a fixed week or if floating/points would still work. But again, that's where the research will eventually pay off!

Seems to me if you want the same week every time, then a fixed week might work for you. There are also timeshares out there where you get every other year, and since that's when you want to travel, that might also be an option. My suggestion though before you take the plunge and buy a fixed week at a resort you will stay at is to actually go and stay at that resort. There's too big a risk to buy-in and then discover you don't like it.

 

[chalee94]

I would agree - even though I don't own it - that from everything I read HGVC is #2 in the industry. If you look at the list of the top timeshares for resale value several of the HGVC resorts are ranked up at the top with DVC resorts.

I would have thought it was Marriott but I'm more familiar with Interval International resorts.

 

[skier_pete]

I would have thought it was Marriott but I'm more familiar with Interval International resorts.

marriot is #2 or #3 most of what I've seen, but I think usually Hilton is ahead of Marriott.

 

[glamdring269]

Only issue I'm finding with Hilton is no Maui presence. Could be overlooking that though. Then again I guess that's where the exchange program (? I think.. still researching) comes in but if I couldn't be guaranteed being able to head to Maui every 2 or 3 years then I wouldn't want to purchase.

 

[Dean]

I second that, we are also HGVC owners and have gotten great use of our points.

We have found that the addition of RCI through HGVC (just like rci through DVC) can be of great use IF you "know" what to exchange for. But mostly it will be a downgrade, same as DVC.

So besides from using the HGVC points within the network we have used the points in RCI but only for hilton properties in NYC and DVC. We could potentially get 2,5weeks in NYC and only pay the MF + exchange fee. That equals $590 + $239. If I had to split up the 2,5weeks into 1 week + 1,5 week i would need to pay an additional $239 exchange fee. To me thats a great value. I could also opt to trade into NYC and DVC (mostly only SSR, OKW and maybe AKV but all 1br), that would cost slighty more but the MF part is the same. So 1 week in NYC + exchange fee, 1 week at DVC + exchange fee.

NYC: $239
DVC: $239 + because we can fee of $190

A total of 239 + 239 + 190 + 590: $1258

Again still a great value.

Before deciding on which other system you should go for, I would look at the most common destinations you would go to and see which timeshare systems is present there. Then learn about those systems and ask a lot of questions to learn the pros and cons. If you still feel that one of the systems is right for you, then look for the perfect contract.

No Maui HGVC resort, one is supposed to be coming but it's not official and it sounds like it's 2 years away minimum if it happens. Plus it's not in the posters preferred location. And like HHI, it's not likely to be available for the non home resort reservations.

This is basically what we would want i think. Maui, Lahaina area, EOY and since there are only 2 of us we would want a 1BR at maximum. To be honest I think the biggest hurdle we may run into is that it seems most of these timeshares always start on a specific day of the week and I haven't been able to figure out if they're always for 1 week or if you can extend to 10 or 11 nights. We also don't have a lot of flexibility and would only travel last week June/first week July/Christmas time. I'm still trying to figure out if that means we should buy a fixed week or if floating/points would still work. But again, that's where the research will eventually pay off!

To get the flexibility for long weeks and guaranteed reservations is tough. Since you prefer the same area we do, it sounds like Marriott and Westin would be the best options for many people. You might also want to look at fixed weeks but you need to understand how the true timeshare calendar works. It's true that most fixed weeks start on a specific day of the week. Marriott weeks float within a season but for Maui, they start Friday, Saturday or Sunday. The problems with Marriott (and most anyone else) in your situation is getting a reservation that time will be tough even if you plan 12 months out. And Marriott fixed weeks there are only Saturday start I believe where floating will be any of the 3 days. Week 51 will be a fixe week in the newer towers and week 52 a fixed week in both he old and new towers I believe.

If it were me and this were my goal as you've shared more info, I'd probably buy 2 Marriott weeks plus Marriott Trust points or possibly just Trust Points alone. Having 2 weeks with one being Maui and the other being wherever, will allow one to reserve 13 months out with another crack at it 12 months out. Trust points will allow access to a different inventory set at 12 to 13 months out as well plus would be good to get into Kauai Lagoons, Oahu or Kauai Beach Club. Or one could buy a good "trading" Marriott elsewhere and try to trade in each time and pay cash or rent privately for the odd days. We have 3 weeks in HI planned next summer. Using a modest Marriott trader (2 weeks using 2 years and lockoff's) I've exchanged and gotten (all at Marriott's) a 1 BR on Maui, two 2BR plus a studio on Oahu and two 2BR in Kauai. Exchanging isn't for everyone but if you learn the system and plan well, it can be a good option though that's not likely to get you to week 51 or 52 routinely. BTW, that second week purchase allowing 13 month access could be in Orlando, Palm Dessert, Branson, LV, etc. Fixed week, fixed view weeks during these times will be DRAMATICALLY expensive. For a 2 BR fixed week you could easily be looking north of $50K per week depending on old/new towers, floor and view type. I don't think they sold smaller than 2 BR fixed weeks in the new towers but one could use the 1BR and exchange or rent the studio or even do back to back weeks moving villas. Just realize that using them back to back doesn't give you the 13 month reservation option.

Just spend time learning so that you'll know exactly what's best for you and what compromises and risks you're taking with the route you chose.

 

[Cyberc1978]

No Maui HGVC resort, one is supposed to be coming but it's not official and it sounds like it's 2 years away minimum if it happens. Plus it's not in the posters preferred location. And like HHI, it's not likely to be available for the non home resort reservations.

I missed the Maui location. I would not buy HGVC with the hope of hilton building a resort in Maui. It may happen eventually but who knows. Even if it did, I think Hilton would restrict the normal 9 month booking window down to 6 months as they have done with others of their resorts.

Another thing to have in mind should Hilton build is that in the first years only retail/direct points would be available. Buying hgvc directly is more expensive than DVC.

 

[Dean]

I missed the Maui location. I would not buy HGVC with the hope of hilton building a resort in Maui. It may happen eventually but who knows. Even if it did, I think Hilton would restrict the normal 9 month booking window down to 6 months as they have done with others of their resorts.

Another thing to have in mind should Hilton build is that in the first years only retail/direct points would be available. Buying hgvc directly is more expensive than DVC.

And the proposed HGVC resort is not in the area the poster is interested in.

 

[Bing Showei]

The contributing members to this thread may be able to provide a unique and valuable perspective on another topic of interest to the rest of the board... increasing DVC resale prices. While I know we're not comparing apples to apples, I'm hoping some sort of price trend can be gleaned from the larger timeshare market.

Some have speculated that:

1- This is attributed this to the economy's health as a whole
2- This is attributed this to D23 announcements
3- This is a natural rise in prices over time
4- MF coming due will drop prices

Given your experiences with the greater timeshare resale market, is there anything that would support these predictions? Are prices for other luxury timeshare resales in general going up across the board (supports 1)? Or is this uniquely DVC (which would support 2)? Do you see the same cyclical price fluctuations in other timeshare resale markets dependent on time of year?

Hoping some of the TUG knowledge would be helpful here. Thanks!

 

[skier_pete]

Some have speculated that:

1- This is attributed this to the economy's health as a whole
2- This is attributed this to D23 announcements
3- This is a natural rise in prices over time
4- MF coming due will drop prices

I have only really been following DVC resale for about 4 years, but the spike in prices this last 6 months is unlike anything I've observed.

I think that it's mostly #1, due to a supply and demand situation - good economy means less people putting their DVC units up for sale, and more people wanting them. One factor that you are not listing - I noticed is that based on limited data from DVCresalemarket, that Disney is buying back a greater % of contracts in 2017 than 2016. (Their data says 2016 it was 4.4 %, while in 2017 its like 7.8% average.) Disney could possibly be leveraging the ROFR to elevate DVC resale pricing. It's a factor that really ONLY applies to DVC, as I don't think any of the other timeshare systems are really interested in buying back contracts. Disney has this ability to "control" to a degree resale prices - and that factor shouldn't be ignored.

I don't think #2 has anything to do with it - people don't think 2 years in advance. I also don't think #3 - the economy isn't roaring so much to explain the 15-20% spike in prices. Can't tell you if #4 has any factor. ersonally, I can't imagine people going "Oh no, my dues came up, I better sell it!" but I'm sure there are SOME that do this - but I don't think really the case.

I always swore I would wait until there is an economic downturn before buying more points (assuming I don't lose MY job). Prices are definitely going to sink if there is a recession of some sort - the first to go is your vacation time.