DVC Survey

[Sandisw]

How would maintenance fees be split with association and the trust at the same property? I could see some big issues and game playing coming when it comes to shared facilities.

Well, I don’t see DVDs trying to do that because it would make no sense.

But, if they did, it would be no different than any other shared resort.

The benefit of using the trust model vs a leasehold condo model is to leave ownership of the property with DVD and give them options they can’t do otherwise.

If they add future resorts to it, and I lean they will, then that model will be the one they go with from that point on.

 

[Sandisw]

It really depends on what they do with the trust. If they end up adding a bunch of resorts into the trust over time, it could be done in a way that buying into the Trust could me more flexible than buying a home resort (even direct) outside of the trust.

Looking at the survey, yes they could be looking at options for a paid extra membership like MMB, but it could also be that they are looking for ways to get members to keep buying direct by possibly adding extra benefits to members who would buy into a newer resort in the Trust. Access to some undeclared inventory, longer than 7 month booking windows (for the other resorts in the trust), swaps for 11 month booking at non WDW resorts like HHI.

I could see myself buying into a Trust option if the cool extra benefits are there (or if they put an awesome resort, Yacht Club, or a different new Crescent Lake DVC resort ).

What I don’t see though is creating a program with undeclared inventory because eventually that goes away if sales are going well.

I think what I could see is that they expand something more like the OTU program in the sense that owners can “swap” their points with rooms DVC has reserved with their own points at a restricted resort or as I mention, offer DVc owners a chance to book with cash and points a room that was traded out for things like the Disney collection

What we do know is that the current POS documents don’t allow them to give any owner a booking advantage over any other owner at the same resort.

And, I think the way the DVc resort agreement is written is that they can’t even do it with trades at an indivual level because the rules are based on the resort.

That is why RIV and beyond can have resale restrictions. They entered into trading via BVTC with those rules…they agreed to block resale points to be used at their resort in exchange for their resale owners to be blocked from trading.

So, in order to give a booking advantage for a fee, I think it can only apply to new resorts going forward, unless they are offering to let owners access the inventory they own.

 

[Tatebeck]

What I don’t see though is creating a program with undeclared inventory because eventually that goes away if sales are going well.

I think what I could see is that they expand something more like the OTU program in the sense that owners can “swap” their points with rooms DVC has reserved with their own points at a restricted resort or as I mention, offer DVc owners a chance to book with cash and points a room that was traded out for things like the Disney collection

What we do know is that the current POS documents don’t allow them to give any owner a booking advantage over any other owner at the same resort.

And, I think the way the DVc resort agreement is written is that they can’t even do it with trades at an indivual level because the rules are based on the resort.

That is why RIV and beyond can have resale restrictions. They entered into trading via BVTC with those rules…they agreed to block resale points to be used at their resort in exchange for their resale owners to be blocked from trading.

So, in order to give a booking advantage for a fee, I think it can only apply to new resorts going forward, unless they are offering to let owners access the inventory they own.

Right, I was thinking something like 8, 9, or 10 month booking availability for the other resorts that may be put into the trust in the future if you buy a contract at a resort in the trust. Not messing with home resort availability (keeping it at 11 months and at least 1 month until anything else). So adding a tier for new Trust resorts between 11 month home resort booking and 7 month BVTC booking

 

[Sandisw]

Right, I was thinking something like 8, 9, or 10 month booking availability for the other resorts that may be put into the trust in the future if you buy a contract at a resort in the trust. Not messing with home resort availability (keeping it at 11 months and at least 1 month until anything else). So adding a tier for new Trust resorts between 11 month home resort booking and 7 month BVTC booking

Yes, I can see that aspect for sure and one big benefit of the trust.

They keep all resorts in their own RTU plan for home resort, give the one month, and then give access to other trust properties prior to the 7 month trade via BVTC for the current resorts.

 

[Girlstar30]

Yes, I can see that aspect for sure and one big benefit of the trust.

They keep all resorts in their own RTU plan for home resort, give the one month, and then give access to other trust properties prior to the 7 month trade via BVTC for the current resorts.

But owners would still have at least a month priority with the trust over pay to book priority non owners right or could that be axed with the new resorts in the new trust too?

 

[Cfabar1]

My understanding in other systems that run hybrid is there are essentially two products

A Trust that has a finite number of points available for access at specific resorts

The Legacy Product that has ownership at a resort with the possibility to trade into other properties

When this was being considered last time, most DISBoarders felt that it is not possible to take existing points at say, BCV and throw them into the trust currently. There is some language in the POS that provides enough to make that unlikely having to do with full units.

But new resorts, as well as possibly undeclared inventory could be put there.

Other systems have done this in other ways - and admittedly I don't understand how they did it - others can offer more specificity than I could offer.

But, what I do imagine is that the trust, would have it's own inventory available to owners at whatever window it wants, and the other associations would have their own inventory at whatever window it wants (currently 11/7).

The two might combine at 7 months (Trust and other resorts) or they could do something different outside of the BVTC. Who knows...

What is unclear to me is how do resale restrictions work with a trust system. Seems to me you'd have access to any inventory in the trust, but nothing outside of it. Which sounds potentially less restrictive than what DIS currently offers in terms of resale restrictions oddly enough.

 

[airjay75]

What is unclear to me is how do resale restrictions work with a trust system. Seems to me you'd have access to any inventory in the trust, but nothing outside of it. Which sounds potentially less restrictive than what DIS currently offers in terms of resale restrictions oddly enough.

If resale contracts from the trust are able to be used at every new DVC resort that is placed in the trust, I'll lead every RIV owner who wants to join me with pitchforks to Bob Iger's house. LOL.

 

[Girlstar30]

If resale contracts from the trust are able to be used at every new DVC resort that is placed in the trust, I'll lead every RIV owner who wants to join me with pitchforks to Bob Iger's house. LOL.

But we still losing Riviera and vdh so we shall be forced to purchase

 

[Cfabar1]

If resale contracts from the trust are able to be used at every new DVC resort that is placed in the trust, I'll lead every RIV owner who wants to join me with pitchforks to Bob Iger's house. LOL.

He'll be long retired and untraceable somewhere on his yacht... Smiling...

 

[PolyRob]

If resale contracts from the trust are able to be used at every new DVC resort that is placed in the trust, I'll lead every RIV owner who wants to join me with pitchforks to Bob Iger's house. LOL.

I assume Disney will also restrict these just like the newer non-trust resorts.

Isn't that how other timeshare operators function and then offer a point washing system to make the points useable on all the other properties?

 

[Cfabar1]

I assume Disney will also restrict these just like the newer non-trust resorts.

Isn't that how other timeshare operators function and then offer a point washing system to make the points useable on all the other properties?

I don't know too much about other systems... I think what they do is offer an "education fee" or something to that extent, that is more or less required for the resale purchaser to get in order to be able to use the points. But, like I said, I don't know other systems... I find most of them so confusing with the exception of Hyatt (until recently).

 

[Sandisw]

But owners would still have at least a month priority with the trust over pay to book priority non owners right or could that be axed with the new resorts in the new trust too?

IIRC, home resort owners always get at least one month advantage with FL timeshare law.

But trades are different and they are whatever terms is set when the resort is developed.

 

[Sandisw]

My understanding in other systems that run hybrid is there are essentially two products

A Trust that has a finite number of points available for access at specific resorts

The Legacy Product that has ownership at a resort with the possibility to trade into other properties

When this was being considered last time, most DISBoarders felt that it is not possible to take existing points at say, BCV and throw them into the trust currently. There is some language in the POS that provides enough to make that unlikely having to do with full units.

But new resorts, as well as possibly undeclared inventory could be put there.

Other systems have done this in other ways - and admittedly I don't understand how they did it - others can offer more specificity than I could offer.

But, what I do imagine is that the trust, would have it's own inventory available to owners at whatever window it wants, and the other associations would have their own inventory at whatever window it wants (currently 11/7).

The two might combine at 7 months (Trust and other resorts) or they could do something different outside of the BVTC. Who knows...

What is unclear to me is how do resale restrictions work with a trust system. Seems to me you'd have access to any inventory in the trust, but nothing outside of it. Which sounds potentially less restrictive than what DIS currently offers in terms of resale restrictions oddly enough.

The resale restrictions would work the same way they do now.

It’s part of the documents when the resort is created and they can decide how that works.

Inventory has to be first added to the trust association. Once added, they activate it into a RTU plan and that is what is sold.

If they add different component sites to the same RTU plan, and that plan has restrictions, then those would be the only resorts that they’d be able to stay at.

If they use the trust to create multiple RTU plans, then each would be its own and owners who buy resale would be limited to just that resort.

Basically, they can go a lot of different ways with using it for future resorts.

For example, they could decide to add LSL to the same RTU plan as CFW and it would function as one home resort.

Or, they could add it on its own and it would have its own rules.