DVC plans to target commercial renters

[Cyberc1978]

Disney has full authority to do that today and there are some indications of this happening, like AUL.

How do you know that DVC have already cancelled reservations at AUL?

We have seen more contracts for sale at AUL but that doesn’t mean that owners have received cease and desist letters.

 

[AstroBlasters]

How do you know that DVC have already cancelled reservations at AUL?

We have seen more contracts for sale at AUL but that doesn’t mean that owners have received cease and desist letters.

One might argue the delayed closings indicate that they have not been cancelled or the points would have been returned to the contracts.

Of course the points could have been transferred out to another membership.

 

[Brian Noble]

Transferring would not require a delayed close, though, would it?

 

[Cyberc1978]

Transferring would not require a delayed close, though, would it?

No it wouldn’t.

When points are transferred out you can close on that contract immediately.

 

[AstroBlasters]

Transferring would not require a delayed close, though, would it?

Good point.

 

[nalababybear]

How do you know that DVC have already cancelled reservations at AUL?

We have seen more contracts for sale at AUL but that doesn’t mean that owners have received cease and desist letters.

I don't. The number of stripped hitting the market and similarities all point to at least one player exiting

 

[Sandisw]

The fact that I almost never see a minimum point amount stipulation in these threads renting out huge numbers of point makes me think that DVC is not enforcing even the 20 reservations per year rule. Because if they were, you would think that someone renting out 2800 points would be careful to specify a minimum of at least 140 points per rental, which would keep the number of reservations to 20 or less.

It was 20 per membership. I have three UYs, and each would have its own 20 limit.

 

[Chuck S]

A ton. I have a lot, probably more than I need and I foot the bill for my adult child and her family. I have nowhere near enough points to touch 20 reservations. Well... if I could score Aulani hotel rooms and AKV values consistently... maybe

Not necessarily. I rented 100 points a couple of years ago/ There were 6 reservations total, for those rentals, one night rentals and a two night rental. If I could get 6 rentals out of 100 points, it is foreseeable to get 20+ rentals from only 300 points.

 

[VGCgroupie]

The irony of this one…. Someone is renting a moonlight magic night out for profit. I spent a ton of money buying direct points at this particular resort but I can’t get a reservation for MM night due to it being sold out almost immediately, yet I see people renting that night out, advertising it as moonlight magic night which you have to be a DVC member to attend. So for those who ask why does renting for profit bother you… this… this is why.

 

[AstroBlasters]

The irony of this one…. Someone is renting a moonlight magic night out for profit. I spent a ton of money buying direct points at this particular resort but I can’t get a reservation for MM night due to it being sold out almost immediately, yet I see people renting that night out, advertising it as moonlight magic night which you have to be a DVC member to attend. So for those who ask why does renting for profit bother you… this… this is why.

I still distinguish spec renting (which is your issue here) from renting for profit generally.

 

[VGCgroupie]

I still distinguish spec renting (which is your issue here) from renting for profit generally.

I think spec renting is main source or actually the only source the problem.

 

[Sandisw]

The irony of this one…. Someone is renting a moonlight magic night out for profit. I spent a ton of money buying direct points at this particular resort but I can’t get a reservation for MM night due to it being sold out almost immediately, yet I see people renting that night out, advertising it as moonlight magic night which you have to be a DVC member to attend. So for those who ask why does renting for profit bother you… this… this is why.

The problem is that this one action IMO would be hard to say an owner is using their membership as a business.

Just don’t see how Maximizing what one gets for a rental, if one is not renting as a “pattern” is going to be easy for DVC to use as a threshold.

It might be annoying for owners who see rentals when they can’t get a room…but not sure what reasonable definition DVC can use to include this as against an owners ability and right to rent.

It’s about using the membership as a commercial enterprise. And can’t see DVC making rules to discriminate between what reservations become rentals when going after an owner.

 

[lowlight]

I guess nothing can be done about commercial renters since there’s no way to define them. Anyone want to start a business?

 

[Chuck S]

I guess nothing can be done about commercial renters since there’s no way to define them. Anyone want to start a business?

Sure they can, but most folks just want them to be reasonable in their enforcement. For instance, if I send friends and family down without me, I could show them that they ARE indeed listed on my MDE as friends/family and we also often travel together. None of them share my last name, as I have no living relatives with my last name. Even my now deceased half brother legally changed his last name after our father died, which is why I couldn't locate him while he was alive, I only foiund out after I did a DNA test on Ancestry, and it put me in touch with a first cousin on my fathers side. Not a hard and fast rule of, say, 10 reservations of one or two night reservations in a year, no matter the circumstances.

 

[Sandisw]

I guess nothing can be done about commercial renters since there’s no way to define them. Anyone want to start a business?

DVC can define it with what makes reasonable sense someone is running it as a business.

Where there is a difference of opinion amongst owners, at least here, is what makes a membership a business.

Some think a spec rental should count, some don’t…and from the statements at the meeting, it certainly seemed as though it’s about large point owners renting a lot.

We shall see.

 

[GoingSince1990]

I guess nothing can be done about commercial renters since there’s no way to define them. Anyone want to start a business?

Does anyone disagree that an LLC owning thousands of points and listing pages of spec rentals of desirable rooms on the internet constitutes commercial renting?

 

[lowlight]

Does anyone disagree that an LLC owning thousands of points and listing pages of spec rentals of desirable rooms on the internet constitutes commercial renting?

Do you want to be blocked from renting your 2k points because you got a few colds and couldn’t go for a decade or two? These kinds of restrictions are going to bring in unintended consequences for me when I rent to my extended family just because we all have different names and nationalities and live in separate parts of the world. It isn’t my fault my family prefers AKL values and Club level rooms, they know what they like. Zebra domes or bust.

 

[zavandor]

Does anyone disagree that an LLC owning thousands of points and listing pages of spec rentals of desirable rooms on the internet constitutes commercial renting?

I think everyone agree that.
Also, everyone agree that a member offering 50 leftover points for tent on the DISboard is not commercial renting.
The problem is where it falls in between the two.

 

[nalababybear]

Sure they can, but most folks just want them to be reasonable in their enforcement. For instance, if I send friends and family down without me, I could show them that they ARE indeed listed on my MDE as friends/family and we also often travel together. None of them share my last name, as I have no living relatives with my last name. Even my now deceased half brother legally changed his last name after our father died, which is why I couldn't locate him while he was alive, I only foiund out after I did a DNA test on Ancestry, and it put me in touch with a first cousin on my fathers side. Not a hard and fast rule of, say, 10 reservations of one or two night reservations in a year, no matter the circumstances.

That's the issue though with defining this more narrowly, right?

People travel all sorts of differently. One way is acceptable to one household, while another is an absolute nightmare way to travel -- to each their own.

The beauty of DVC is its simplicity. The elevator pitch is 30 sec. The explanation of basic rules takes 5 minutes. Done. And Disney sells itself with the captured audience.

Rentals themselves are an entry drug to DVC sales and addonitis -- Disney knows this.

Only reason Disney is looking at this now is probably of renting data showing impacting occupancy rates at their moderate accommodation products.

They just need to be cautious not to knock down the house of cards that they built.

 

[Brian Noble]

Rentals themselves are an entry drug to DVC sales and addonitis -- Disney knows this.

Don't kid yourself. Disney does not view rentals as some benevolent sales pitch. The sales pitch is the sales pitch. Rentals are competition to the Mouse's rental arm, first and foremost.

Only reason Disney is looking at this now is probably of renting data showing impacting occupancy rates at their moderate accommodation products.

I will bet a pile of Mickey Bars that the motivation is people on the sales floor who are considering a purchase but say one of (a) they believe/have heard that rentals are making it harder to book and they are afraid to buy or (b) they can get rentals cheaply enough so they don't need to buy.