Do *Parents* No Longer Have Any Discipline?

[RitaZ.]

I just wonder why being late to school seems okay with so many people.

Just because I don't agree with your post doesn't mean that I don't believe in being punctual. Being punctual is one of the expectations that I have set for myself and my children, not for the rest of the world. Things do happen daily that alter the best laid plans, we are not in as much control as we like to think that we are.

Christine, you may not want to see it, but your tone in your original post was definitely condescending and judgemental.

 

[Christine]

Originally posted by RitaZ.

Christine, you may not want to see it, but your tone in your original post was definitely condescending and judgemental.

Actually, I do see that my thoughts (and I did verbalize my thoughts) were condescending and judgemental. I think I was pretty clear that I do not agree with taking children to school late for oversleeping. That's judgemental--no doubt about it. What I find odd is that people were so upset that I felt that way. It would be a different matter if I was acting on those feelings but I didn't. As kasar said, I just kind of threw it out there to see where people stood and at the time I wrote the post I was feeling amazed that there were actually three people in one morning who did it--bam, bam, bam, one after another. It was kind of funny in a way but still surprising to me.

 

[mcnuss]

I find odd is that people were so upset that I felt that way.

I won't presume to speak for everyone, but for myself it isn't that you feel this way that gives me pause, it's the over-dramatic way that you phrased it. "Disgusting" is a pretty strong word. If you get this riled about something this trivial, I'd hate to see how peeved you get at the important stuff.

For the record, I am a very punctual person who has a very un-punctual child. Time is not the same for her as for the rest of the world - it is an extremely amorphous concept to her. We struggle every single day to get her out of the house on time. With a lot of work, she makes it 99.9% of the time. You should feel blessed and fortunate that you can get your kids out by 5:50 am everyday with no problems, and can take the time to worry about other people's children. We start over an hour ahead of time, and yet she still gets on the bus with an imprint of my shoe on her fanny at least 3 out of 5 days. It ain't pretty. You just can't go around assuming that these are a bunch of lazy swine who don't care.

 

[Christine]

Originally posted by mcnuss
IFor the record, I am a very punctual person who has a very un-punctual child. Time is not the same for her as for the rest of the world - it is an extremely amorphous concept to her. We struggle every single day to get her out of the house on time. With a lot of work, she makes it 99.9% of the time. You should feel blessed and fortunate that you can get your kids out by 5:50 am everyday with no problems, and can take the time to worry about other people's children. We start over an hour ahead of time, and yet she still gets on the bus with an imprint of my shoe on her fanny at least 3 out of 5 days. It ain't pretty. You just can't go around assuming that these are a bunch of lazy swine who don't care.

Hey, I hear you. I didn't mean to give the impression that my life was/is perfect. We all have problems getting out of the house. Sounds like with your DDs habit for being late, you've compensated by taking the extra time and getting her on the bus anyway. My DD (who is 12) has ADHD. Talk about disorganzied--if you don't think I don't have a problem getting both my kids out, well then you read things into my post. I think most kids dawdle inthe morning and don't want to get out of bed. I never said it was easy. Yet, I can still make it on time. I sound like a drill sergeant every morning. I bark commands. I do it and it is unpleasant. My mornings are horribly stressful. Maybe that is why I cannot understand people being late somewhere at AGAIN "9:30 a.m." Also, these posts weren't aimed at the kids. The excuses written were that "Mommy lost track of the time" and "we overslept." Elementary school kids don't oversleep. Their parents oversleep.

 

[Pin Wizard]

Speaking from personal experience...

One night I forgot to set the alarm...LATE!

Another time I set the alarm but it didn't go off! LATE!

And yet another day I was running late and ran into traffic.

Sometimes you do the best you can, but it's just not enough. I would HARDLY say the parents are irresponsible.

P.S. When I was in school, I got the Perfect Attendance award. And that was NOT my parents' doing. I was in business school.

P.P.S. or is it P.S.S.? DS has not been late one day this year.

 

[nowellsl]

Hey Mickeyfan1- I agree that not enough parents teach their kids responsibility for themselves - that said, in FL, if your Jr. High or High school child doesn't go to school (laziness, skipping or whatever the reason) and the school invokes Florida truancy procedures, they will be going after you (the parent) not the child! You are still ultimately responsible for your child complying with the compulsory attendance laws.

Sorry this is off the original subject.

 

[DemonLlama]

Pin Wizard: it's PPS for post post script (after the post script)

I feel like replying at this point is just a PPS, but I'll weigh in anyway.

I teach college English. I have a very strict statement in my syllabus outlining tardiness. Here is the gist: a student who is habitually tardy is being disrespectful to the instructor, his or her peers in the class, and his or her own education.

If I have read between the lines of Christine's posts, I think that was her issue from the beginning.

When students enter my classroom 15 minutes into the lecture they disrupt everyone in the class. The ones that act like it is no big deal, never discuss their tardiness in conference with me, and never apologize are the same ones who want to turn in their assignments late, make up the quiz they missed at the start of class, and generally seem to think that the world revolves around them.

Other students, those who may be late once or twice to class, but are generally good students, will discuss the reasons for their lateness with me, or at least apologize after the lecture. There is a difference. And I think Christine was reacting to the former type of attitude, not the latter. If you have not had the pleasure of encountering the centers of the universe then you are truly blessed.

As for the heat she has taken, I can only point out that arguing with the either/or fallacy (either you are perfect or you cannot post such a question here) does not a logical rebuttal make.

 

[gymnasticsmom68]

And I think Christine was reacting to the former type of attitude, not the latter.

That may be, but she has no idea how often, or even if, the kids were late before that. She made a judgement about them and their parents based on something that small children wrote about being late. Also, she says in the original post

I work outside the home full-time and rarely do I get the opportunity to take my son to school.

She can't even give herself credit for getting him to school on time everyday, but she felt the need to rip on others for being late one time (as far as she knew).

 

[Wishing on a star]

Soooo, I see that this inane debate continues...

Nevertheless, I feel compelled to post...

GM68 - No, the OP did not know the history of these particular students... And, I still fail to see where she makes any direct judgements against any particular person??? These things are simply not true. And they are beside the point. The OP simply listed this as the latest example of what she has noticed that seems to be all to common. The OP did not Title her OP "How could these three parents be so undisciplined!!!" Based on her recent experiences, she asked whether, in general, and I quote... "Do *Parents* No Longer Have Discipline?". Whether she knows the particulars of any or every given case is COMPLETELY beside the point.

There have been too many untrue and assumed accusations against the OP, for things that she either never did... or things that are completely ridiculous... or things that have absolutely nothing to do with the original topic. It would appear that people who agree that it is Okay to be late with no real reason (just, 'Duhhhh I guess we overslept') have no real basis to support their argument, so they are hurling accusations at the OP.... You know, the old idea of "Don't like the message, attack the messenger...."

Personally, IMHO, to see that parents would send a small child into school that late in the day, without providing an excuse, would indeed make me question their discipline and responsibility...

 

[CJMickeyMouse]

Great post, Wishing on a star!

I agree that the sign in sheet was just what made the question of discipline in parents come to mind. That may have been the ONLY day in those three kids' lives that they were late. So be it. That does not change the fact that there is a major problem with parents, responsibility and discipline these days.

 

[septbride2002]

Bravo!

~Amanda

 

[gymnasticsmom68]

You know, the old idea of

Yes I do, it's to mind my own business.

Personally, IMHO, to see that parents would send a small child into school that late in the day, without providing an excuse, would indeed make me question their discipline and responsibility...

I guess you could also go back to the first quote.

 

[Christine]

Wishing On a Star--EXCELLENT post. I wish I could put it so eloquently. You summed up my original thoughts exactly.


gymnasticsmom--PLEASE!! Why so mean??? I get my kids up every day and get them to their sitter on time. Why does that seem to bother you so much and how is that any different than the other parents who have to get their kids to school at an even later time? I think you're just mad at me because I somehow hit close to home for you? My DD meets her carpool for school at 5:55 a.m. My son is at his sitter at 6:00 a.m. I have to meet my carpool at a certain time. Darn right, I DO take credit for getting us all out on time. But I don't want to show any pride in that because then I may be trying to be "perfect."

I was not judging these particular parents--just society in general. Again, a trend I noticed. And the day I do oversleep and take my kid in late for that, I'll be pretty darned mortified.

You know, there have been other "debates" on this site that have to do with raising children. There was one about how we are feeding our children. There were some posters that do a very good job of feeding children all the right things and very healthful food. They go out of their way to "go organic" and keep the junk out of the house. Well, I don't do that. I'm somewhere in the middle. We have the occasional chicken nuggets, hot dogs, etc. There are many days I totally slack. In my heart, I *know* that sometimes my nutrition for my children is irresponsible and lazy on my part. I admit that. But I don't slam the other posters who feed their kids well and who look down on chicken nuggets and hot dogs. They are doing the right things by their kids, why should I slam them because I don't do so well in this area?

I guess I got the answer to my original post.

 

[WishingStar]

Christine-Bravo to you. I have to have my kids on the bus at 8:30, and it is sometimes a struggle, but I do it with my drill instructor impression because that is what I have to do to raise responsible young people.

 

[tiggersmom2]

Christine,
I am so with you. I have tried to stay out of this debate, but I find I cannot (By the way, I think you would have gotten a MUCH better response on the debate board.).
I too am a responsible mom and my kids have never, yes, I said NEVER, been late to school. No, I do not have delusions of grandeur about myself, nor am I lying! I find it very disturbing parents cannot have their kids at school at 9:30 and use "overslept" as an excuse.
I applaud you Christine and I think certain posters have been particularly nasty. Maybe they see themselves in your post?

 

[CJMickeyMouse]

Originally posted by tiggersmom2

I applaud you Christine and I think certain posters have been particularly nasty. Maybe they see themselves in your post?

I think you are exactly right!!!!

 

[TrixyA]

A friend of mine pointed me to this thread, knowing how obsessive I am about punctuality.

It's so good to see other people admitting to what I thought were strange habits of mine-- keeping a book in the car for when I am too early (again!) was just one.

Re: the OP, I think that she made a judgement about the trend in parenting to not teach children responsibility and came here to vent. Whether it was fair to the specific people signing in late is not really an issue. The issue that seems to bother the OP, IMO, is the issue of parents just not caring enough to teach their children responsibility and courtesy to others.

For the person that was allowed to be late everyday because they wanted to watch TV, I'm glad that you turned out ok. But I find your parents' decision to allow this to be reprehensible. By allowing you to watch TV and be continually late to class, they were teaching you that your personal enjoyment of TV was more important than the needs of the other children and the teacher in your class. As you point out, mathematics are not what's being taught in kindergarten-- learning to work with others is the main point and I think you missed the mark that year.

Re: occasional tardiness. It happens sometimes. As long as it's not a habit and it's not because you just didn't care, I don't see a problem.

Re: habitual tardiness. Although a habitually tardy person may not think that they are showing disregard to the others impacted; to the person that is waiting on a regular basis, it sure feels like the tardy person has no regard for you or your schedule.

Re: whether it's possible for a child to never be late to school. My daughter is in 8th grade and has never been tardy unless there was a doctor's appointment scheduled early in the day. However, I am not willing to promise she won't be late to school tomorrow. Sometimes, things happen. We'll see. Even if she is never late once in her school life, no one in our household is perfect.

Re: making children be ready to leave at 5:50am. I had to be at work very early every morning and my daughter had to be out of the house at 6:45am everyday for 5 years. She learned to do it and it wasn't a big deal. But, I took a lot of grief from well-meaning relatives that told me I was cruel to make her get up and out so early. Yes, they actually used the word cruel. Not a single one of them ever asked if she was always awake at 5am without the aid of an alarm clock. My point is that we had to be up and out because of my job and we learned to deal with it. To judge someone for their lifestyle when you know nothing about it is unfair.

My opinion regarding punctuality in general is that, if a person is repeatedly tardy and it negatively impacts anyone else-- and it probably does or else there wouldn't be a scheduled time of arrival-- that person is acting in a self-centered way. However, I also believe that every single person in the world has a few self-centered habits that impact those around them. Tardiness is just the habit under scrutiny at this moment.