Disney's growing FCC problem

PirateFrank

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We all know the reason why Disney extended the FCC in the first place. As a going concern, Disney Cruise Line could not afford to fully return several months of cruise fees at once. By offering the cruise credit, it provided an incentive for cruisers to allow Disney Cruise Line to keep money from cruise fees (presumably to stay solvent as a business segment) instead of processing a refund for each and every cruiser. However, unless DCL provides for a reasonable opportunity for each and every person that was provided a FCC for agreeing to not seek a refund, it’s tantamount to DCL lying in an effort to secure interest-free loans from its own customers – instead of from a lending institution or stockholders, where financing needs to occur. In this worst-case circumstance, we can all agree how incredibly unethical this is. Obviously, I’m not accusing DCL of this – but if a large enough percentage of us who were given FCC are ultimately unable to use it – then the accusation gets put right back on the table.

Based on my understanding, In August of 2020, Disney Cruise Line extended Future Cruise Credit through to May 31, 2022. Up until that point, Disney had canceled approximately 5 months of cruises. As of now (mid-January), DCL has canceled an additional 7+ months of cruises (with another 1.5 months looking likely). However, the May 31, 2022 FCC expiration date remains the same. The number of cruisers with Future Cruise Credit has potentially doubled (or close to it), however the window that one could use the cruise credit is literally constricting with each and every day that passes.

This is problematic on a number of levels. First, an entire year of canceled cruisers (who opted for FCC) now have just one calendar year to squeeze into cruises alongside cruisers not paying with FCC. Second, If you were unlucky enough to have your cruise canceled in between itinerary releases, you might find yourself shut out of a cruise that works for your schedule (most of us with children know that for every itinerary release, there may be only a small handful of cruises that fit into our busy school/work schedules). Perhaps the cruise you originally intended to sail was one that only occurred during a particular time of year (i.e. transatlantic, European, Alaska, Panama Canal, etc) Third, the pandemic appears to be dictating a great deal of when we can use our FCC. I’m sure most of us don’t want to be cruising on DCL for the first few months DCL returns to open waters. All one has to do is read the various threads here where there are people who will refuse to cruise wearing masks, without a vaccine, with restrictions, reduced activities/excursions, etc.

It’s clear to me that DCL has a growing FCC problem on its hands. They need to extend the FCC window by at least 6-12 months – and they need to do it *before* the next itinerary release!! If DCL opts to not extend the window, they will have to deal with an increasing number of refund requests from FCC holders who either cannot or do not want to sail within the restricting window. This isn’t in DCL’s best interests or us as cruisers. Hopefully, they do the right thing.
 
We all know the reason why Disney extended the FCC in the first place. As a going concern, Disney Cruise Line could not afford to fully return several months of cruise fees at once. By offering the cruise credit, it provided an incentive for cruisers to allow Disney Cruise Line to keep money from cruise fees (presumably to stay solvent as a business segment) instead of processing a refund for each and every cruiser. However, unless DCL provides for a reasonable opportunity for each and every person that was provided a FCC for agreeing to not seek a refund, it’s tantamount to DCL lying in an effort to secure interest-free loans from its own customers – instead of from a lending institution or stockholders, where financing needs to occur. In this worst-case circumstance, we can all agree how incredibly unethical this is. Obviously, I’m not accusing DCL of this – but if a large enough percentage of us who were given FCC are ultimately unable to use it – then the accusation gets put right back on the table.

Based on my understanding, In August of 2020, Disney Cruise Line extended Future Cruise Credit through to May 31, 2022. Up until that point, Disney had canceled approximately 5 months of cruises. As of now (mid-January), DCL has canceled an additional 7+ months of cruises (with another 1.5 months looking likely). However, the May 31, 2022 FCC expiration date remains the same. The number of cruisers with Future Cruise Credit has potentially doubled (or close to it), however the window that one could use the cruise credit is literally constricting with each and every day that passes.

This is problematic on a number of levels. First, an entire year of canceled cruisers (who opted for FCC) now have just one calendar year to squeeze into cruises alongside cruisers not paying with FCC. Second, If you were unlucky enough to have your cruise canceled in between itinerary releases, you might find yourself shut out of a cruise that works for your schedule (most of us with children know that for every itinerary release, there may be only a small handful of cruises that fit into our busy school/work schedules). Perhaps the cruise you originally intended to sail was one that only occurred during a particular time of year (i.e. transatlantic, European, Alaska, Panama Canal, etc) Third, the pandemic appears to be dictating a great deal of when we can use our FCC. I’m sure most of us don’t want to be cruising on DCL for the first few months DCL returns to open waters. All one has to do is read the various threads here where there are people who will refuse to cruise wearing masks, without a vaccine, with restrictions, reduced activities/excursions, etc.

It’s clear to me that DCL has a growing FCC problem on its hands. They need to extend the FCC window by at least 6-12 months – and they need to do it *before* the next itinerary release!! If DCL opts to not extend the window, they will have to deal with an increasing number of refund requests from FCC holders who either cannot or do not want to sail within the restricting window. This isn’t in DCL’s best interests or us as cruisers. Hopefully, they do the right thing.
I hope so too.
 
I suspect that the increasing number of people with new FCCs is probably being balanced out by those who have/had old FCCs but are now bailing & requesting refunds due to their second chosen cruise being cancelled/looking more uncertain. That is certainly the case for us.
 
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We hedged our bets and moved one stateroom booked with FCC to later in the year and cancelled the other one. Our boys decided to go to Hawaii instead. I wasn’t entirely comfortable with letting DCL hold onto $10,000 of our vacation dollars. Cancelling one stateroom gave us almost half that amount in a refund.
 

This is not an easy situation for anyone - including Disney. There is so much uncertainty over when or in which form they can restart. They have been pretty generous in allowing late refunds. Most other cruise lines have put up deadlines, such as:
https://www.royalcaribbean.com/faq/questions/can-i-change-my-refund-option-to-future-cruise-credit
I am pretty sure once more itineraries are announced, they will push back the FCC deadline too. Royal is allowing until Sep 2022 only because they have released itineraries that far out. Allowing an unrestricted credit against a future unreleased product is an accounting nightmare. You can't make it more restrictive later if that future product or plan ends up hitting a snag.
 
Our travel advisor suggested we never take a FCC, but always ask for a refund, especially with all the uncertainty. We were not comfortable leaving all that money with Disney, and after seeing all the DL AP holders get incomplete refunds, I'm glad we did.
 
Our travel advisor suggested we never take a FCC, but always ask for a refund, especially with all the uncertainty. We were not comfortable leaving all that money with Disney, and after seeing all the DL AP holders get incomplete refunds, I'm glad we did.
This. Aside from the prospect of a greatly reduced cruise experience compared to what we're used to (all while paying full fare), the other reason we're cancelling is that at this point, I'm feeling a bit uncomfortable leaving all of that (paid in full) money tied up with a cruise line. DCL is at least in a better position than the others, because it belongs to a diversified parent company, but soon they'll have been shut down a whole year and there's still no light at the end of the tunnel, so I no longer feel comfortable parking my money with them. I don't want to read, "DCL Puts a 'Temporary' Freeze on Cruise Refunds" in the news one day and be part of the collateral damage.
 
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I disagree- there isn’t anything stating you must get/keep FCC. If you want a refund of your fare it’s available. If you plan to still cruise within the specific time frame then take the FCC. If your plans change take the refund.

We have 2 different FCCs on future cruises with 3 booked in 2021. When the may cruise gets canceled that FCC will move to Aug- If Aug gets canceled it’ll bump to a Jan 22. If Nov gets canceled that’ll bump to another one.
 
This is not an easy situation for anyone - including Disney. There is so much uncertainty over when or in which form they can restart. They have been pretty generous in allowing late refunds. Most other cruise lines have put up deadlines, such as:
https://www.royalcaribbean.com/faq/questions/can-i-change-my-refund-option-to-future-cruise-credit
I am pretty sure once more itineraries are announced, they will push back the FCC deadline too. Royal is allowing until Sep 2022 only because they have released itineraries that far out. Allowing an unrestricted credit against a future unreleased product is an accounting nightmare. You can't make it more restrictive later if that future product or plan ends up hitting a snag.


I feel compelled to address a few points you made:

1. Never did I suggest or recommend that DCL make the FCC unrestricted. I did state that the current restriction is unacceptable given the window of available cruises and needs to be extended by a finite period of time. I would appreciate it if you not reframe my comments to support your position.

2. Im not sure its appropriate to refer to DCL allowing 'late refunds' as being generous. Its a policy decision that DCL made, which drives whether or not a cruise customer will seek a refund. If they establish a cutoff date like RCL has, it will result in more refunds. Its clear that DCL is looking to prevent a higher percentage of cruisers from seeking the refund - especially in light of their greater flexibility with refund timing. Sorry, it's not generosity. It's a policy decision designed to curtail refund seeking.

My point above, is that if Disney Cruise Line wants to continue with the objective of limiting refund seeking, it has no choice but to extend the FCC deadline. I do agree that this isn't easy on them (or us), but if they do not extend the FCC deadline (or establish a refund cutoff like RCL has), while cruises continue to be canceled moving forward, it will increase the number of cruisers seeking refunds.
 
This. Aside from the prospect of a greatly reduced cruise experience compared to what we're used to (all while paying full fare), the other reason we're cancelling is that at this point, I'm feeling a bit uncomfortable leaving all of that (paid in full) money tied up with a cruise line. DCL is at least in a better position than the others, because it belongs to a diversified parent company, but soon they'll have been shut down a whole year and there's still no light at the end of the tunnel, so I no longer feel comfortable parking my money with them. I don't want to read, "DCL Puts a 'Temporary' Freeze on Cruise Refunds" in the news one day and be part of the collateral damage.

Tremendous point you made with the last sentence. I've been leaning hard towards simply calling DCL and re-booking on my own terms.

That being said, if DCL put a freeze on refunds without giving proper notice - they would be hit with a blizzard of lawsuits before the end of the business day. The reason why RCL has a page alerting the customer of refund cutoff dates, is because the customer needs to be notified when they will no longer be able to secure a refund. If DCL (or any other company) simply decided to unilaterally freeze refunds, it would be tantamount to theft. It would be dealt with harshly in the courts. I think this scenario only happens if DCL has a bankruptcy concern on the horizon.
 
I don't know, and maybe I am missing something... but until DCL actually offers cruise bookable beyond May 2022... isn't this a bit of a moot point? Once they do, and if they don't extend FCC, then yes, bad on DCL... but until such time... Now, with that said... there is that new ship coming Summer 2022 so... so they may have a business reason not to extend that beyond May 2022 or the FCC has some restrictions attached to it...
 
This. Aside from the prospect of a greatly reduced cruise experience compared to what we're used to (all while paying full fare), the other reason we're cancelling is that at this point, I'm feeling a bit uncomfortable leaving all of that (paid in full) money tied up with a cruise line. DCL is at least in a better position than the others, because it belongs to a diversified parent company, but soon they'll have been shut down a whole year and there's still no light at the end of the tunnel, so I no longer feel comfortable parking my money with them. I don't want to read, "DCL Puts a 'Temporary' Freeze on Cruise Refunds" in the news one day and be part of the collateral damage.
I kind of felt like that even when our August 2020 cruise was cancelled, but I held on. Even though DCL is part of a large company, I think as months turn into years that they will do their best to sequester liabilities of their different segments so that they don't sink the mothership (pardon the pun).
 
@PirateFrank I don't see it as a problem at all. People who are uncomfortable can get a refund. People with FCC see some value in reserving a future spot. And lets be perfectly honest, while I haven't seen their bank accounts, Disney cruisers tend to be a bit more affluent, and I suspect they aren't missing any meals by having that money tied up.
 
I feel compelled to address a few points you made:

1. Never did I suggest or recommend that DCL make the FCC unrestricted. I did state that the current restriction is unacceptable given the window of available cruises and needs to be extended by a finite period of time. I would appreciate it if you not reframe my comments to support your position.

2. Im not sure its appropriate to refer to DCL allowing 'late refunds' as being generous. Its a policy decision that DCL made, which drives whether or not a cruise customer will seek a refund. If they establish a cutoff date like RCL has, it will result in more refunds. Its clear that DCL is looking to prevent a higher percentage of cruisers from seeking the refund - especially in light of their greater flexibility with refund timing. Sorry, it's not generosity. It's a policy decision designed to curtail refund seeking.

My point above, is that if Disney Cruise Line wants to continue with the objective of limiting refund seeking, it has no choice but to extend the FCC deadline. I do agree that this isn't easy on them (or us), but if they do not extend the FCC deadline (or establish a refund cutoff like RCL has), while cruises continue to be canceled moving forward, it will increase the number of cruisers seeking refunds.
1. You are reading too much between my lines, but I'll let that slide.

2. If someone is gullible enough to fall for a lack of deadlines as a way of deterrence towards seeking a refund, it's on them. Disney has no restrictions on the refunds. If you don't like the FCC terms, get the refund and move on. You can always rebook what you want with that money when something become available in the future.
 
I would love to keep my original cruise dates. I always wanted to go on a HOTHS cruise and NYC port is close to me. If they would extend out to the end of 2022 then I would consider moving my cruise to October of 2022 out of NYC. Since you can only use the FCC until May 2022, and since it's not really looking so good for cruises to return in the near future, and there's no telling how long we will continue with cancelations, we decided on getting a refund and going out to Disney World instead. At least Disney World is actually open. I'm in need of a vacation. And I can always rebook a cruise after cruising returns.

Currently I'm just waiting and watching. Seeing how things are turning out. Something could change in the next few months from January to June/July. So I am just giving it some time, maybe I'm just holding out for a little bit hope of there being an official return soon or of FCC getting extended.
 
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I had a very big deposit on a vacation to a resort in Alaska go poof once when the owners declared bankruptcy, so I'm very hesitant to tie up too much money for any trip in advance now, unless I have no choice in order to secure specific reservations I want. Even though I knew my October 2020 cruise would get canceled, I canceled rather than paying in full and then feeling compelled to take the FCC. I would rather have the money in my pocket. I did rebook for October 2021 but if that cruise doesn't look like it will go I will cancel it in advance as well. DCL at least has the Disney corporation as backup in case that segment is really struggling, but I'm sure they also have ways of keeping things separate so that the parent company isn't liable if a bunch of cruisers suddenly find themselves sitting with worthless FCC.

As it is, I'm just praying that the operator with whom I have a sizable deposit for a summer 2022 safari in Kenya doesn't go bust in 2021 (we booked the trip in 2019). Most travel insurance policies don't include financial default of the operator unless you buy the insurance right after you book your trip.
 
That being said, if DCL put a freeze on refunds without giving proper notice - they would be hit with a blizzard of lawsuits before the end of the business day.
I disagree. When the airlines balked at giving people refunds, they weren't hit with a blizzard of lawsuits. They got lots of complaints, and the airline's regulatory agency did look into it and make them give the refunds, but that isn't the same thing as lawsuits. It isn't as easy to instigate a lawsuit as you might think. You have to either pay a lawyer (most people can't afford this when going against a big corporation) or get one to represent you on contingency, which means the lawyer has to think you have a good chance of winning against Disney's lawyers (and even if the case is successful, a contingency lawyer will walk away with 30% to 40% of the client's settlement.) For an issue like having your refund indefinitely "on hold" while a genuinely cash strapped DCL works on its finances, customers would likely find themselves being advised to be patient.
 
Fact is, cruises prior to end of May 2022 (with the exception of rare itineraries like Hawaii) are not selling out. Until they do, why would DCL extend FCC?
 
I was on the 2020 WBPC where we were given a 40% credit to use on a future cruise. At the time we were told that we had to use it on a currently scheduled cruise. Cruises were available to book into September 2021 and I booked a cruise for May 2021. In November as it began looking increasingly likely that DCL wasn't going to be cruising anytime soon I called DCL to ask if the date by which we had to use the credit had been extended and I was told no. A few weeks ago, however, DCL did extend the credit so now we have until May 2022 to use it. So DCL very well may extend the FCC out past May 2022 if the cruising restart date gets too close to that date to reasonably accommodate all passengers with FCC.
 

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