Disney rethinks links with Mel Gibson

[Fitswimmer]

forgetting the whole drunken fiasco for a moment-but did anyone really think that a movie about Mayan history, with all dialogue in the Mayan language (forgive my ignorance if I'm using incorrect terms) was going to be some monster hit? I don't see that the subject matter really has a lot of commercial appeal. With Passion, Gibson had a built in audience, even with the langauge issue because any Catholic that has been to Stations of the Cross or said the Sorrowful Mysteries of the Rosary knew what was going on, as did any Christian that has read the Gospel of John. I don't know that there is a large enough community conversant in Mayan history to bring in the kind of money Disney needs to see from this movie.

 

[Another Voice]

but did anyone really think that a movie about Mayan history, ... was going to be some monster hit?

It was all based on Mel Gibson.

A decade ago you have said the same thing about a movie centered around a long forgotten Scotish revolt. But Mel Gibson made a movie about a lot of guys in skirts into a megahit and a huge Oscar winner.

The idea was Disney would sell Apocalypto as a sort of sequel - Mel the filmmaker directing another epic war movie. You can all but see the ads starting with "From the Oscar winning Director of Braveheart...".

The holiday period is different than summer. People want a different kind of film and are more willing to spend their money on more "serious" flicks. And ever since Titanic Hollywood has been trying to come up with the next big old fashioned Hollywood historical epic. Apocalypto was Disney gamble this year...and they lost through no fault of their own.

 

[Fitswimmer]

A decade ago you have said the same thing about a movie centered around a long forgotten Scotish revolt. But Mel Gibson made a movie about a lot of guys in skirts into a megahit and a huge Oscar winner.

True, but he didn't use the language of the day. I think that's the biggest hurdle that this film had to overcome-prior to Mel's little weekend. If he had done the story in English, he might have been able to pull it off. The other thing is, Braveheart was great, but it was also a decade ago. I'm not sure that retreading it with another culture, even if he had done it in English would produce the same result. Part of what made Braveheart a success was because it was novel. We don't get a lot of original thought out of Hollywood. We get Will Farrell who basically plays the same character in different settings, we get sports movies where the underdog overcomes the odds to triumph, comic book heroes and horror movies where teenagers get tortured and killed. Don't get me wrong, the stuff sells and I've enjoyed most of it-from Netflix. There's not much that makes me run to the cineplex anymore, and that's the larger issue all the studios are facing.

 

[Another Voice]

We don't get a lot of original thought out of Hollywood.

The real shocker is that any originality gets out at all.

The past twenty years witnessed all of the studios - with Disney leading the way - become nothing but business units in a larger corporate structure. Corporations require steedy earnings, predictablity and minimal risk. Those are the exact things a movie studio does not offer.

To reduce risk the studios go for "sure things" - presold stories and ideas. Apocalypto wa sold as "Breaveheart meets Passion" (two solid hits are better than one). No one really cared about the exact setting of the new film, the idea had "a trackrecord" in Hollywood's mind. It's exactly the same thinking that said if Will Farrell was funny driving a mini van in Old School he's going to be funny driving a race car in Taladega.

Hollywood's thinking isn't all that deep.

Disney's problem is unique in Hollywood. Although the studio is just part of the larger company, Disney lacks a steady corporate earner. It's something that all its competitors have - Warner Brothers has TimeWarner Cable, Columbia has all of Sony behind it, Universal is backe by General Electric, Paramount by Viacom, etc.

In the last couple of weeks Warner Brothers have dropped more than a half billion dollars between Superman Returns, Posideon and [/i]Lady in the Water[/i]. That's going to hurt, big time. But from CNN to Time Magazine to cable and a a hundred other businesses, they're going to be able to take the blow.

Disney is faced with the same challenge for the same about of money between Apocalypto, PotC: Ends of the Earth and Meet the Robinsons. But Disney's only back-up are a bunch of theme parks that may be facing a year of $4.00/gallon gasoline.

 

[MJMcBride]

The real shocker is that any originality gets out at all.

The past twenty years witnessed all of the studios - with Disney leading the way - become nothing but business units in a larger corporate structure.

This is another example of being unfair or what I view as overly critical of Disney. Why would you say they are leading the way? Yes, Hollywood has forgotten all about originality that is clearly true. But I don't see how Disney is any worse (or better) than anyone else.

I agree with your previous point about the bloat. Record companies and network television are taking it on the chin in today's world and Disney is front and center on those. Their radio division must be hurting to as people move towards satellite radion. And as the FCC starts to force cable companies to offer channels individually, you can bet ABC Family and some of the silly ESPN offshoots will go by the boards.

And what is your problem with Lindsey Lohan?

 

[Another Voice]

Why would you say they are leading the way?

Disney, and specifically Michael Eisner, lead the way with the whole “corporate synergy” myth. Eisner promised ever expanding profits through stuffing the same movies through theaters and cable and broadcast and cell phones and onto amusement park rides and mall stores and breakfast cereals.

Everyone else followed the same path – Warner Brothers opened up mall stores, Paramount bought parks. It wasn’t long before the whole mess came crashing down. You can’t a bad movie on the public no matter how many different places you show it. The difference is they got out of their unprofitable divisions – Disney is still stuck with Fox Family, Hollywood Records and all the “synergy” drivel. The first thing that Iger did was make it worse – ESPN Cell Phones? Good God.

And what is your problem with Lindsey Lohan?

Not only is she a symbol of everything that’s wrong with Hollywood, Disney’s continued pandering after this cokehead – er, “dehydrated” bimbo just shows how pathetic and clueless Disney has become about their core business. If anything proves that Disney has willfully abandoned all standards, it’s her.

 

[MJMcBride]

Disney, and specifically Michael Eisner, lead the way with the whole “corporate synergy” myth. Eisner promised ever expanding profits through stuffing the same movies through theaters and cable and broadcast and cell phones and onto amusement park rides and mall stores and breakfast cereals.

Everyone else followed the same path – Warner Brothers opened up mall stores, Paramount bought parks. It wasn’t long before the whole mess came crashing down. You can’t a bad movie on the public no matter how many different places you show it. The difference is they got out of their unprofitable divisions – Disney is still stuck with Fox Family, Hollywood Records and all the “synergy” drivel. The first thing that Iger did was make it worse – ESPN Cell Phones? Good God.

I got ya. I misunderstood what you were saying. I agree with you on this. Disney did start it. I thought you were talking about the corp structure removing originality from movie making which I think all the studios share equally.

 

[LOLA2]

I for one am excited to see his new film, loved all his other films. He seems to be a really genuine and nice guy. Everyone says he is a pleasure to work with. We don't know what was on his mind when he got drunk. As someone else said he has a lot of Jews bashing Passion and maybe he has built up anger and doesn't vent about it until he has a bad day a throws down some drinks and then thinks about what happened to him. There are times after my mom has made me livid and I can't stand her and I say thing that I regret (not even being drunk) You can have a fight with your spouse and say something you really don't mean. Nobody knows for sure what Mel really feels but Mel. Drunk Driving is horrible, he is lucky he did not injure himself. You know how many people drink and drive? I don't agree or condone this at all but there are so many celebs and us normal people that go out to dinner and have drinks or a nightclub and make a horrible decision becuase they don't think they have drank too much. Otherwise you would have to say that all those people at bars and nightclubs and anywhere else for that matter have a sober driver to drive them home. Sorry but sad reality is he got caught but many people drive after having benn drinking. How can I dislike someone for doing this when I know it happens all the time. Sure I am dissapointed but I still beleive he is a good guy and is only human and makes mistakes like eveyone else.

 

[MJMcBride]

. We don't know what was on his mind when he got drunk.

Sure we do, he was thinking about how anti-semitic he is. Now we all know. Plus, these anti-semitic comments were directed at police officers who send a great deal of time in danger protecting his sorry behind. Plus, he was drinking, driving, and excessively speeding so he could have killed someone else not just himself. Plus, he made a lewd comment to a female officer. But you're right, he's a real sweetheart.

 

[SoCalKDG]

It happens when you spend over seven billion dollars to buy a studio and then their next release is considered a major disappointment at the box office. And every single dime that Disney sees from Dead Man's Chest has already been spent to make World's End - a good gamble probably but just ask the folks at Warner Brothers how they did with Matrix 2 and 3.

First, the purchase netted close to a billion dollars in cash, thus much closer to a 6 billion purchase. Second, the toy sales alone from Cars are outpacing the previous record holder, Nemo(with sales being over 3 times movie revenue). This one movie alone will net over a close to 2 billion dollars in sales by the time the DVD has been in circulation. One movie. Pirates and the next one, expect 3 billion in all products. Movie revenue is but the tip of the iceberg.

There's a reason Disney is firing 25% of its film staff and it's not because they've run out of office space.

This was planned for months.

 

[LOLA2]

Sure we do, he was thinking about how anti-semitic he is. Now we all know. Plus, these anti-semitic comments were directed at police officers who send a great deal of time in danger protecting his sorry behind. Plus, he was drinking, driving, and excessively speeding so he could have killed someone else not just himself. Plus, he made a lewd comment to a female officer. But you're right, he's a real sweetheart.

Your pretty defensive, I wonder why? We do not know what he was thbinking,
like I said he may have been thinking about all the aminosity he got from Passion by the Jews. If I had my house toilet papered I would be like Damn teenagers! If I get in trouble by my boss I might say I can't stand my boss! Just be cause he made comments does not mean that is who he is as a person, when you say things when your mad and especially drunk, they can be very regrettable. It should not have to tarnish you. I think how you carry on in everyday life is how you should be judged, not in your weak moments.

 

[Another Voice]

First, the purchase netted close to a billion dollars in cash, thus much closer to a 6 billion purchase.

wow- what a bargain.

The Pixar deal wasn’t made for financial reasons. It was made to please Wall Street. If Iger wanted to keep his job, he had to fix “the Pixar problem”. That’s what the street had fixated on; that was the one big mistake the street assigned to Eisner.

Iger blew megabucks in the easiest and quickest fix; but Wall Street had some problems with the deal because it was so expensive. The alleged underperformance of Cars feed right into Wall Street’s fears – and now Iger (and Disney) are now no better off than they were before. But Disney is still several billion poorer.

This was planned for months.

Well, Disney movies have been in the tank for a long time. Disney has vastly overspent on for what they see in returns; Disney’s overhead is many times too big to be sustained by the Studio. Iger, as usually, took the easiest and most short-sighted solution to the problem.

 

[DisneyFanGuy]

Money aside, true creative minds are still a premium. Disney did get John Lassatter, and they positioned him in a potentially influential position. Everything that I have read about him screams a quality first profile. I HOPE that pays off, because in the end Disney will be more creative.....not less.

 

[MJMcBride]

Your pretty defensive, I wonder why? We do not know what he was thbinking,
like I said he may have been thinking about all the aminosity he got from Passion by the Jews. If I had my house toilet papered I would be like Damn teenagers! If I get in trouble by my boss I might say I can't stand my boss! Just be cause he made comments does not mean that is who he is as a person, when you say things when your mad and especially drunk, they can be very regrettable. It should not have to tarnish you. I think how you carry on in everyday life is how you should be judged, not in your weak moments.

I'm really not that defensive. I just don't think we should just give the guy a pass based on the totality of the incident i.e. bigotry, sexism and criminal behavior. If there was no past with this, like previous anti-semitic accusations and his father's idiocy, I might agree with you and give him a pass. Frankly, I don't care his anti-semitic, I just wish he owned up to it.

 

[LOLA2]

I'm really not that defensive. I just don't think we should just give the guy a pass based on the totality of the incident i.e. bigotry, sexism and criminal behavior. If there was no past with this, like previous anti-semitic accusations and his father's idiocy, I might agree with you and give him a pass. Frankly, I don't care his anti-semitic, I just wish he owned up to it.

Now today after I pposted I picked up a people magazine and read the article about Mel. What I did not know was anything about his dad. When I read that info about him thinking the Holocaust never happened I was like you have to be kidding me. Well If Mel is anti-semitic we know why.

 

[Fitswimmer]

My grandmother believed that the stars where holes in the sky where the sun shone through, and that the rockets NASA fired were screwing up all the weather. That doesn't mean that my father believed those things. We can't assume that an adult child carries the values of the parents.

Did anyone see Crash? The thing that I found interesting about that film was how it showed racism in EVERY culture. Each group harbored racist thoughts and stereotypes about the others. We all hide those thoughts and shove them deep down, but I think if we're all honest with ourselves we know that they're there-whether its racism, sexism, prejudice against other religions or even class envy. Nobody wants to admit to having those thoughts, and I'll bet that I get responses from people vehemently denying that they ever have had them. I'll admit it, I've had them and as much as I know that they are wrong-they are there.
Being Catholic, I take these thoughts and feelings to confession, where my confessor would advise me to apologize for anyone that I may have hurt and to pray for greater awareness that all people are Children of God. It sounds like that's exactly what Mel is doing.

 

[cxcelica]

Frankly, I don't care his anti-semitic, I just wish he owned up to it.

Why do you not care if he is anti-semitic but you just so desperately want him to admit it??? That does not make sense at all.

To me the bigger issue would be that he is anti-semitic not whether or not he admits it.

As far as Gibson's dad, I remember when that story came out about his dad a while back, I believe part of the story behind it was that the reporter had went and found his old father because he knew he would be able to get him to say these nonsensical things, that would be used to smear Mel.

 

[YoHo]

Having Imbibed a little too much on occasion myself, I can say that while Alcohol may make you profess your true inner feelings about something, it also just makes you generally stupid.

While it's entirly possible that Mel is Anti-Semetic, it's equally possible, that in his drunken state, he thought he was being funny and said something dumb.

I've said lots of dumb stuff while drunk (though not Anti-semetic stuff).

It shouldn't make anyone feel better about what was said, but it's entirely possible that he isn't anti-semetic.


Also, LOL to everyone who thinks Disney is making good money this year, If you think that, then Jerry and Johnny have a Bridge they wanna sell you.

 

[dbm20th]

Why do you not care if he is anti-semitic but you just so desperately want him to admit it??? That does not make sense at all.

I don't think MJ means to say that he doesn't care about anti-semitism. I think he means that a person, especially a public one, with these issues is much more dangerous when he's covert about it.

 

[cxcelica]

I don't think MJ means to say that he doesn't care about anti-semitism. I think he means that a person, especially a public one, with these issues is much more dangerous when he's covert about it.

Maybe but I think it would be better that he was not anti-semitic, rather than he be anti-semitic and be open about it. He said he didn't care that Mel was anti-semitic just that he was not open about.