Disney Genie+ and ILL$ Details & FAQ - Launches 10/19 at WDW, Paid "FastPass" at WDW and Disneyland (date TBD)

[Aluminum Falcon]

I think you're underestimating the "average" guest. Priceline isn't particularly difficult to use, nor is vrbo or airbnb or orbitz.

I agree, I’m saying there is a certain demographic that fits into staying at a Disney resort, and based on the changes they’ve made/are making, I don’t envision them driving that group outside of the park

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

I think you're underestimating the "average" guest. Priceline isn't particularly difficult to use, nor is vrbo or airbnb or orbitz.

Edit: Here's an example of just how ludicrous it has gotten and how I think Disney is making a big mistake with cutting all hotel perks commensurate with raising prices. I'm looking at a potential 1 week trip the week of April 16th.

Here's a 1 bedroom 1 bathroom at Wyndham Bonnett Creek (which is basically on disney property and closer then many disney hotels to the parks), that includes kitchen, living room, appliances,washer/dryer, etc and a nice resort: https://www.vrbo.com/7455760ha?adul...enCount=2&departure=2022-04-23&unitId=6848771 It is $1,215 all in with taxes, fees, etc, includes free parking.

Here's a 1 bedroom 1 bathroom at, oh, lets go with Old Key West for the same week, $6,216 all in plus parking if you bring or rent a car.

OKW is further from the parks then Wyndham and they charge for parking. What do you get as far as Disney Perks right now at OKW? Really spotty & crappy bus service, 30 minutes early entry if you want to wake up at the crack of dawn to try to fight for a spot on that crappy bus service, and two nights a week late at MK & Epcot.

I mean, there is just no way that is sustainable. People aren't stupid. Taking a lyft from an off-site everywhere ends up being thousands of dollars cheaper with effectively better service then Disney transportation. And you can get a lyft with a car seat if you have young ones like I do. Same with renting a car.

The 60 day fastpass benefit was a really valuable, tangible benefit of staying onsite that there was no way to replicate by staying offsite. Short of staying offsite and booking a VIP tour, you were not going to be able to advance book most popular headliners at 30 days out. You could try your luck with the refresh method day of, but there were no guarantees. You were never going to get andvance fastpass at 30 days for SDD, 7DMT, FOP, Test Track, Frozen, Peter Pan, Splash Mountain, Space Mountain, MFSR, and you were going to have a lot of trouble getting decent times or getting any at all for even some of the less popular attractions like Soarin, TOT, Kilimanjaro, Navi, EE, etc. That was an extraordinarily valuable benefit that made even the ridiculously overpriced for what you get All-Star resorts worth it. Now anyone can stay offsite and pay a lot less then the difference between onsite and off to simply purchase whatever headliners they want.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Edit: Here's an example of just how ludicrous it has gotten and how I think Disney is making a big mistake with cutting all hotel perks commensurate with raising prices. I'm looking at a potential 1 week trip the week of April 16th.

Here's a 1 bedroom 1 bathroom at Wyndham Bonnett Creek (which is basically on disney property and closer then many disney hotels to the parks), that includes kitchen, living room, appliances,washer/dryer, etc and a nice resort: https://www.vrbo.com/7455760ha?adul...enCount=2&departure=2022-04-23&unitId=6848771 It is $1,215 all in with taxes, fees, etc, includes free parking.

Here's a 1 bedroom 1 bathroom at, oh, lets go with Old Key West for the same week, $6,216 all in plus parking if you bring or rent a car.

OKW is further from the parks then Wyndham and they charge for parking. What do you get as far as Disney Perks right now at OKW? Really spotty & crappy bus service, 30 minutes early entry if you want to wake up at the crack of dawn to try to fight for a spot on that crappy bus service, and two nights a week late at MK & Epcot.

I mean, there is just no way that is sustainable. People aren't stupid. Taking a lyft from an off-site everywhere ends up being thousands of dollars cheaper with effectively better service then Disney transportation. And you can get a lyft with a car seat if you have young ones like I do. Same with renting a car.

The 60 day fastpass benefit was a really valuable, tangible benefit of staying onsite that there was no way to replicate by staying offsite. Short of staying offsite and booking a VIP tour, you were not going to be able to advance book most popular headliners at 30 days out. You could try your luck with the refresh method day of, but there were no guarantees. You were never going to get andvance fastpass at 30 days for SDD, 7DMT, FOP, Test Track, Frozen, Peter Pan, Splash Mountain, Space Mountain, MFSR, and you were going to have a lot of trouble getting decent times or getting any at all for even some of the less popular attractions like Soarin, TOT, Kilimanjaro, Navi, EE, etc. That was an extraordinarily valuable benefit that made even the ridiculously overpriced for what you get All-Star resorts worth it. Now anyone can stay offsite and pay a lot less then the difference between onsite and off to simply purchase whatever headliners they want.

Not disagreeing with your price analysis, I just believe that imbalance has been there for years and years, I cannot see FP+ Justifying as you stated, thousands of dollars more. I think that was a good perk, but not a market mover on its own

 

[EACarlson]

Not disagreeing with your price analysis, I just believe that imbalance has been there for years and years, I cannot see FP+ Justifying as you stated, thousands of dollars more. I think that was a good perk, but not a market mover on its own

The imbalance has been made more noticeable and for many people that was enough for them to recognize it. In the two years since I stayed on site, which was a close decision for my family. Lost has been DME, MagicBands, FP, EMH, RAC and being able to charge everything to the room. I may be going back in 2025, and there is no chance that we would even consider staying on site. There are no benefits, only drawbacks.

From a business perspective I think it will be a good move. Standby lines will move faster than they did with FP+, those that want to pay will have shorter lines, and it will monetize the headliners. Fewer people will go to the parks, which will alleviate the number one complaint about WDW, that it's too crowded. The target market is not the folks here that go once a year or even once every couple years, the target market is folks that go every 5-10 years and will pay whatever it costs to do so.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

The imbalance has been made more noticeable and for many people that was enough for them to recognize it. In the two years since I stayed on site, which was a close decision for my family. Lost has been DME, MagicBands, FP, EMH, RAC and being able to charge everything to the room. I may be going back in 2025, and there is no chance that we would even consider staying on site. There are no benefits, only drawbacks.

From a business perspective I think it will be a good move. Standby lines will move faster than they did with FP+, those that want to pay will have shorter lines, and it will monetize the headliners. Fewer people will go to the parks, which will alleviate the number one complaint about WDW, that it's too crowded. The target market is not the folks here that go once a year or even once every couple years, the target market is folks that go every 5-10 years and will pay whatever it costs to do so.

Now that’s something I can agree with! I do think some perks will come back, but not until the pandemic is well under control. Until then Disney has to cut and recoup what they lost

 

[Nabas]

I guess the question is, how many years did they delay raising prices, I’m curious if it’s like throwing a frog right into boiling water, or a gradual temperature rise kind of thing. Yes prices may have gone up 20-30%, but how many years did pricing sit stagnant or with minimal movement. Like I said, Disney has been adding on like crazy, and now it’s time to pay the piper, that’s at least how I’ve been interpreting it

I dont think there was a single year they havent increased prices in some way shape or form. Two times a year sometimes.

You arent paying for anything you are padding their profits even more.

Even in their "slowest" years, Disney raised prices faster than inflation.

This was posted on another fan site and gives you some idea of what has been happening to WDW prices for 20 years:

 

[DougEMG]

My daughter is a a hard core Disney fan. She has been going to WDW since she was 5 and is now 26. After talking about the changes taking place with Genie+ and IAS, she said something I never expected "We should just sell all our DVC". Never thought I would hear her say something like that. We've got a set of annual passes that we still need to use so we'll see how it goes.

Personally though I don't like the way the new system works. For large families and people who go for a lengthy stays this new systems is either going to cost you a lot more money or you are going to be standing in a lot of standby lines.

 

[Jrb1979]

I will say is that I find it kind of weird to see so many families with teens that love Disney. I only say that cause judging by my nieces, who are 11 and 12, they have no interest in Disney. They prefer parks with high thrills and coasters.

 

[Jimmy Mouse]

I was thinking the same thing. This is a short term money grab that will hurt them in the long run. If families cannot afford to take their kids, then those kids will not have the attachment that their parents have. In addition, Disney will really take a hit once Universal's new park opens. Universal will then become a multi-day destination. It will not be an addon to a Disney vacation, but a vacation itself

We own DVC but we have gone down to Universal twice now and stayed a week each time. It WAS the vacation and we did 2-3 days at WDW as our add on.

 

[Liquidice]

My daughter is a a hard core Disney fan. She has been going to WDW since she was 5 and is now 26. After talking about the changes taking place with Genie+ and IAS, she said something I never expected "We should just sell all our DVC". Never thought I would hear her say something like that. We've got a set of annual passes that we still need to use so we'll see how it goes.

Personally though I don't like the way the new system works. For large families and people who go for a lengthy stays this new systems is either going to cost you a lot more money or you are going to be standing in a lot of standby lines.

I'm in the same place as you except my kids are still young so they don't really understand the cost of Disney yet. But we have DVC and APs that don't expire for awhile - so despite not liking the changes, I'll give them a chance first. I think I would have anyway, because I do enjoy Disney and perhaps Genie and Genie+ won't be as bad as I'm imagining.

Maybe standby lines won't be as long as we're thinking, maybe it won't be a 6:1 ratio of Lightning Lane to Standby Lane (although I doubt it).

Since my children are still young - if I decide not to continue going to Disney, I figure I can still use my DVC points to go other places like Aulani, but also visit other places in Orlando like Universal. I doubt I sell my DVC at least immediately.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

Maybe standby lines won't be as long as we're thinking, maybe it won't be a 6:1 ratio of Lightning Lane to Standby Lane (although I doubt it).

6:1 sounds low to be honest. Wasn't the old fastpass like 8:1?

 

[Liquidice]

6:1 sounds low to be honest. Wasn't the old fastpass like 8:1?

I honestly thought the number was 10:1 but I couldn't find anything when I searched for the answer to confirm it. 6:1 is the number I most commonly found.

 

[Kjdisney]

I think the fact on-site guests get to buy IAS$ at 7am instead of waiting till park opens is a great perk. Considering how many folks are willing to pay to ride ROTHR, I think it is possible there won’t be many passes available by park opening for off-site guests. I think it will get to be just like the advanced FP.
The biggest problem I have with the VC as an out of state traveler, is I have to compete with local people that have faster internet and or cell service that isn’t roaming,which makes it harder to compete when even a second can make a difference in getting a boarding group with the VC, and without BP you have NO option to ride. While it isn’t the end of the world, it is disappointing.
I feel much better knowing that I’ll either have first chance of getting an IA$, and if that fails I can wait in line. If you travel far and only go every five years or so, this new process is welcome news.
I think though, the VC will be back shortly with the other 2 options. They are probably trying to figure out wait times so they can figure out ratios of paid/VC/SB. In the initial announcement they did say the Virtual queue was part of the mix, so I wouldn‘t be surprised if it’s back when IAS$ starts.

 

[ThistleMae]

I will say is that I find it kind of weird to see so many families with teens that love Disney. I only say that cause judging by my nieces, who are 11 and 12, they have no interest in Disney. They prefer parks with high thrills and coasters.

My grandsons are 17 and 21 and they still love Disney. In fact my 21 year old just did his first solo trip without the family! He was so excited. They grew up Disney and they still love it. My DD and SIL are doing an all inclusive vacation this year. My DD won't even talk to me about the changes, she's so discouraged. So we shall see what they decide in the future. I'm going in December, so hopefully I'll bring her good news about the Genie + so we call all keep going. It's really a wonderful family vacation that keeps us all together as some of us do not live near one another. I don't want to lose it.

 

[msufan]

I think people are underestimating machine learning. I think Genie will ask for a your preferences first. You will likely be able to create a custom plan or follow a premade touring plan. The touring plan (custom or premade) could create an optimitized schedule, based on historical data, that updates on the go as things change throughout the day. It's not just going to look at current wait times. Instead it might see space mountain wait times are historically low at 7pm and that most people get fp at park opening. It would recommend on your itinerary to get FP around 6 o clock.
If used correctly and created with good software it would be much "smarter" then any Disney veteran. It could calculate millions and millions of data points to make your day the most efficient.

I hope you are right,

 

[Miffy]

There are a few advantages of staying onsite--depending on where you stay--that I think bear a mention:

(1) Walkability: If you stay at a monorail resort you can walk to MK and take the monorail to Epcot. If you stay on the Boardwalk, you can walk to two parks, DHS and Epcot. This cannot be duplicated by anywhere off-site.

(2) If you have children who are old enough to be on their own and you're onsite, your children can take Disney transport. They aren't dependent on their parents for transportation and the group can easily split up.

(3) Even if you're not at a monorail or Boardwalk resort, you still have Disney bus transportation. Or the Skyliner. Super convenient when they work, and it's my experience that they work more often than not.

(4) Theming. This is not as easy to explain, but, for example,I have never stayed anywhere that compares even remotely to AKL. The theming is amazing, the experience of being there is unmatched, the lobby, the grounds, the rooms--it's beautiful. Ditto WL. I stayed at the Swan once. Yes, the location is great. But it was like being in a very nice hotel in Anywhere, USA. It was not the Disney experience I enjoy. This is very personal and I realize that space, a full kitchen, and other amenities available off-site are more important to plenty of people. But I love the theming and it'll definitely downgrade the WDW experience for me if I get priced out of it. I'm very aware that it's possible that I will get priced out at some point.

That being said, I understand what people are complaining about. Rack rate at the resorts has gone up dramatically, discounts are rare and unimpressive, many things WDW used to provide are nonexistent now (like DME and daily housekeeping), and the upcharges at this point seem to be huge annoyances at best and infuriating money grabs at worst.

We'll see how it all shakes out.

 

[ThistleMae]

There are a few advantages of staying onsite--depending on where you stay--that I think bear a mention:

(1) Walkability: If you stay at a monorail resort you can walk to MK and take the monorail to Epcot. If you stay on the Boardwalk, you can walk to two parks, DHS and Epcot. This cannot be duplicated by anywhere off-site.

(2) If you have children who are old enough to be on their own and you're onsite, your children can take Disney transport. They aren't dependent on their parents for transportation and the group can easily split up.

(3) Even if you're not at a monorail or Boardwalk resort, you still have Disney bus transportation. Or the Skyliner. Super convenient when they work, and it's my experience that they work more often than not.

(4) Theming. This is not as easy to explain, but, for example,I have never stayed anywhere that compares even remotely to AKL. The theming is amazing, the experience of being there is unmatched, the lobby, the grounds, the rooms--it's beautiful. Ditto WL. I stayed at the Swan once. Yes, the location is great. But it was like being in a very nice hotel in Anywhere, USA. It was not the Disney experience I enjoy. This is very personal and I realize that space, a full kitchen, and other amenities available off-site are more important to plenty of people. But I love the theming and it'll definitely downgrade the WDW experience for me if I get priced out of it. I'm very aware that it's possible that I will get priced out at some point.

That being said, I understand what people are complaining about. Rack rate at the resorts has gone up dramatically, discounts are rare and unimpressive, many things WDW used to provide are nonexistent now (like DME and daily housekeeping), and the upcharges at this point seem to be huge annoyances at best and infuriating money grabs at worst.

We'll see how it all shakes out.

I definitely agree that the theming and the other things you mentioned are magical for me. Two years ago we stayed at my cousin's time share in Kissimmee. It definitely felt like a different trip for me. Definitely not as good. So I'm willing to try and figure out how Genie + will best serve me. I don't want to give up onsite, until I have no choice, and who knows maybe Disney vacations will be a thing of the past and I'll find other things to do. We shall see.

 

[coolbrook]

I will say is that I find it kind of weird to see so many families with teens that love Disney. I only say that cause judging by my nieces, who are 11 and 12, they have no interest in Disney. They prefer parks with high thrills and coasters.

Lots of teens and young adults enjoy Disney vacations. It's part of the reason the college program is so successful at recruiting students. My 5 kids all still love Disney Parks at ages 18, 26, 29, 29, and 30. Two of them did college programs and one is still working there in management. They go without us now to the parks in Florida, California, Paris, and Tokyo. Of course not all people of any particular age like Disney or any other vacation destination, but I would say that Disney parks have a wide appeal.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

I think people are underestimating machine learning. I think Genie will ask for a your preferences first. You will likely be able to create a custom plan or follow a premade touring plan. The touring plan (custom or premade) could create an optimitized schedule, based on historical data, that updates on the go as things change throughout the day. It's not just going to look at current wait times. Instead it might see space mountain wait times are historically low at 7pm and that most people get fp at park opening. It would recommend on your itinerary to get FP around 6 o clock.
If used correctly and created with good software it would be much "smarter" then any Disney veteran. It could calculate millions and millions of data points to make your day the most efficient.

This is what I’ve been saying from the start, and completely agree with. The fact that everyone thinks it will be $FP+ Would be Disney asking for punishment from their guests haha, I think this technology has been years in the making. Disney is always forward dreaming, and constantly has to wait to tech to catch up, so we shall see

 

[EACarlson]

There are a few advantages of staying onsite--depending on where you stay--that I think bear a mention:

(1) Walkability: If you stay at a monorail resort you can walk to MK and take the monorail to Epcot. If you stay on the Boardwalk, you can walk to two parks, DHS and Epcot. This cannot be duplicated by anywhere off-site.

(2) If you have children who are old enough to be on their own and you're onsite, your children can take Disney transport. They aren't dependent on their parents for transportation and the group can easily split up.

(3) Even if you're not at a monorail or Boardwalk resort, you still have Disney bus transportation. Or the Skyliner. Super convenient when they work, and it's my experience that they work more often than not.

(4) Theming. This is not as easy to explain, but, for example,I have never stayed anywhere that compares even remotely to AKL. The theming is amazing, the experience of being there is unmatched, the lobby, the grounds, the rooms--it's beautiful. Ditto WL. I stayed at the Swan once. Yes, the location is great. But it was like being in a very nice hotel in Anywhere, USA. It was not the Disney experience I enjoy. This is very personal and I realize that space, a full kitchen, and other amenities available off-site are more important to plenty of people. But I love the theming and it'll definitely downgrade the WDW experience for me if I get priced out of it. I'm very aware that it's possible that I will get priced out at some point.

That being said, I understand what people are complaining about. Rack rate at the resorts has gone up dramatically, discounts are rare and unimpressive, many things WDW used to provide are nonexistent now (like DME and daily housekeeping), and the upcharges at this point seem to be huge annoyances at best and infuriating money grabs at worst.

We'll see how it all shakes out.

1 is only a factor at Deluxe resorts, 2 if your kids are old enough to be on their own they probably have their own phone and CC to use Uber. The Uber rides would be a lot less expensive than the price difference between on-site and off-site. 3 While the Skyliner is cool and is a quick way to the two of the parks, there are also drawbacks. Evidenced by the number of people here complaining they have to walk from IG to the front of EPCOT when the Skyliner goes down. 4 you are absolutely right about, is that theming worth 3 or 4x the cost? Not to me, but I can understand it will be for some people