Dis Breast Cancer Survivors - GAGWTA!

[Pea-n-Me]

GAGWTA!

The biggest thing during chemo is getting enough rest. That's when healing takes place. So listen to your body and pamper it too!

Excellent point, Laura! It is sometimes hard to imagine that while you're getting chemo, but it's true.

I also had to adjust my way of thinking about chemo. Everything I'd ever learned about chemo in school was how toxic it was. When I first became a nurse 20yrs ago, I actually gave it a few times in the middle of the night!! (Today nurses have to be certified in order to give it, and that usually only occurs on oncology units, but once in a while we have a cardiac patient getting it and a certified chemo nurse actually has to come up to our unit for the day to give it 1:1 that patient for the day). I also care for patients with heart failure related to adriamycin, so when I found out I had to get it myself I could barely believe the irony. I thought for sure it was going to kill me, and clearly remember the day I signed the consents, I felt like I was signing my life away. So yes, accepting it into my body required some fast changes in attitude, LOL.

At my cancer support center the wonderful nurse (and fellow sista) who runs it taught me to think about it in a different way. I learned to visualize a white, healing light around it as it was running into my veins. I thought about the work it was doing - fighting off runaway cancer cells - and willed it to do a good job. Instead of sitting there in a state of anxiety (which was not hard to do ), I forced myself to relax, and go in my mind to the top deck of Disney Wonder - I used all my senses to really put myself there. Well I just about worshipped the ground that that nurse walked on for teaching me that, because otherwise, I know for sure it would have been much more difficult for me. I hope you can learn to do the same, Micki. Think now about where you would like to "go" during treatment, and begin practicing at home and anytime scary thoughts enter your head. Practice at least 3 times a day whether you need it or not.

The social worker there also taught me that I needed to keep doing nice things for myself even when I was feeling badly. To embrace LIFE! I was instructed to put down the cancer books and pick up some trashy magazines! To wear my favorite color every day! To drive with my favorite music blaring while singing along! To buy myself some fresh, fragrant flowers! To do some things I've always wanted to do! You get the picture... I also found myself wanting to help others through it, so I spent lots of time thinking about how I was going to accomplish that once I got through it myself. I guess this is the part that becomes true when you hear that cancer changes your life for the better.

Well, just writing this has been therapeutic for me. It helps to be reminded of how important it is to not spend time worrying about everything. I think laurabelle said it best when she said something to the effect that she wasn't going to give cancer anymore than it's already taken away. ITA!!

Hang in there Micki and everyone else who is facing these challenges today!

 

[hopesmommy]

WOW!! As I said earlier, yall are all AMAZING women!!

I am praying for all of yall and doing what I can to support your fight.

Dee Kelley

 

[snappy]

Thank you, Dee, for raising money for breast cancer research.

 

[Mom2Ashli]

Hey Ladies I have a question for you. I posted before that I found out that my Aunt has Breast Cancer. She went in for surgery to have the lump removed.

Why would they do Radiation instead of Chemo?

 

[snappy]

Mom2Ashli, was the lumpectomy done before the radiation?

 

[Mom2Ashli]

Mom2Ashli, was the lumpectomy done before the radiation?

No. She had the lumpectomy and had a drain for a little bit than had a follow up with her Doc. who believe he got it all.

And she was supposed to start Radiation this week.

 

[snappy]

I pulled out my copy of Dr. Susan Love's breast book.

She says in the treatment option section:

the goal of surgery in the breast is to remove or treat the cancer so that it will not come back in the breast. This can be done by taking out as much of the cancer as possible in a lumpectomy and letting radiation destroy any remaining cells. She also talks about how important that there are clear margins in the path report.


She also talks about a study in the 80's where the patients were offer the opportunity to be treated without radiation. To qualify, the women had to have a tumor less than 2 cm's, negative lymph nodes, no extensive DCIS in the tumor, no vascualr or lymphantic invasion and at least a cm of normal tisuue around her tumor margins. They were followed very carefully. After three years there was a 9.2 percent local recurrence rate in three years, compared to 2 percent local recurrence in comparable patients treated with lumpectomy and radiation. Because this rate of recurrence was higher than was felt acceptable, the study was stopped prematurely.

Unless something new has occurred since the edition of my Susan Love book,
which is possible, (third edition, 2000), I think the standard of care is to do both surgery and radiation.

There may be more updated infor or the breastcancer.org site.

 

[Mom2Ashli]

I pulled out my copy of Dr. Susan Love's breast book.

She says in the treatment option section:

the goal of surgery in the breast is to remove or treat the cancer so that it will not come back in the breast. This can be done by taking out as much of the cancer as possible in a lumpectomy and letting radiation destroy any remaining cells. She also talks about how important that there are clear margins in the path report.


She also talks about a study in the 80's where the patients were offer the opportunity to be treated without radiation. To qualify, the women had to have a tumor less than 2 cm's, negative lymph nodes, no extensive DCIS in the tumor, no vascualr or lymphantic invasion and at least a cm of normal tisuue around her tumor margins. They were followed very carefully. After three years there was a 9.2 percent local recurrence rate in three years, compared to 2 percent local recurrence in comparable patients treated with lumpectomy and radiation. Because this rate of recurrence was higher than was felt acceptable, the study was stopped prematurely.

Unless something new has occurred since the edition of my Susan Love book,
which is possible, (third edition, 2000), I think the standard of care is to do both surgery and radiation.

There may be more updated infor or the breastcancer.org site.

Thank you so much for the info. I will check it out.

I just know you guys have first hand knowledge and might just know.

I was surprised she was not scheduled for Chemo.

 

[snappy]

I check this site, there is alot of info there.

http://www.breastcancer.org/tre_rad_idx.html

 

[Mom2Ashli]

Wow - I found some great information on that site about Radiation after a Lumpectomy.

 

[snappy]

Chemo is not always done, it depends on a lot of factors from the path report. SOME of the factors: size of the tumor, involvement of lymph nodes, the grade of the tumor, whether the tumor has invaded surrounding blood vessels and lymphatic tissue. It really depends on the percentage of improvement in survival the patient would receive. According to Love's book, there is less benefit for women between 50-69. How old is your aunt?
Love says chemo reduces the risk of chemo by one third, The higher your risk, the better chance chemo work for you. If you have a 60 % chance of recurrence, a one third risk reduction means it will reduce it by 20 percent. If you have a 9 percent chances of recurrence the one third reduction is only 3 percent.

Some women would choose chemo even if the benefit was 1%. It is really a decision the patient has to make after her doc gives her all the info about her own personal risk.

I hope your aunt's docs have laid this out for her.

 

[snappy]

Wow - I found some great information on that site about Radiation after a Lumpectomy.

It is a great site. One of the things I really like about it is that it is updated with current info.

 

[Mom2Ashli]

Chemo is not always done, it depends on a lot of factors from the path report. SOME of the factors: size of the tumor, involvement of lymph nodes, the grade of the tumor, whether the tumor has invaded surrounding blood vessels and lymphatic tissue. It really depends on the percentage of improvement in survival the patient would receive. According to Love's book, there is less benefit for women between 50-69. How old is your aunt?
Love says chemo reduces the risk of chemo by one third, The higher your risk, the better chance chemo work for you. If you have a 60 % chance of recurrence, a one third risk reduction means it will reduce it by 20 percent. If you have a 9 percent chances of recurrence the one third reduction is only 3 percent.

Some women would choose chemo even if the benefit was 1%. It is really a decision the patient has to make after her doc gives her all the info about her own personal risk.

I hope your aunt's docs have laid this out for her.

She is 69 years old. I wish I knew more, she lives in RI so it is not like we are getting first hand information. It is coming from another Aunt and my Grandmother at this point.

I am so worried for her.

 

[Mom2Ashli]

I really hope they are asking the right questions and getting the proper answers.

My Cousins wife (my Aunts DIL) was a Nurse in a Cancer/Chemo Center. So she is familiar with things to ask. I HOPE anyways.

 

[snappy]

There is also good info on chemo on the same site, interesting info about a new test that is available (but expensive). I wonder if Medicare covers it.

http://www.breastcancer.org/tre_sys_chemo_who.html
about who gets chemo and

http://www.breastcancer.org/research_genetics_033005.html
about the new test.

Hope this helps and not confuses the issue. It is hard to know about things long distance, especially with an older person.

 

[snappy]

I really hope they are asking the right questions and getting the proper answers.

My Cousins wife (my Aunts DIL) was a Nurse in a Cancer/Chemo Center. So she is familiar with things to ask. I HOPE anyways.

Good to hear about your aunt's DIL. I am betting she is involved. How sweet of you to be inquiring too. I think it is impossible to have too much info when you are making a decision on treatment. After treatment is different story. Others might disagree.

 

[MerryPoppins]

I don't think radiation without chemo is that uncommon. I didn't even have to have radiation after my mastectomy. I had clean margins and no lymph involvement, so I just had to do tamoxifen. If I'd just had the area of cancer removed, I would have had radiation, but chemo was not thought to be needed.

 

[Mom2Ashli]

Good to hear about your aunt's DIL. I am betting she is involved. How sweet of you to be inquiring too. I think it is impossible to have too much info when you are making a decision on treatment. After treatment is different story. Others might disagree.

If you guys remember I did the walk last year and put all of your names on my t-shirt. Well this year I am walking in her Honor. I agree you can NEVER has too much information where Breast Cancer is concerned.

It was strange last year I walked for all women including my DIS friends and my DD. Even though B.C. had never affected my life I still like it was something I NEEDED to do.

Than just two weeks after I signed up to walk again this year my Aunt called and told us she had B.C. She will beat this and be a survivor.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Why would they do Radiation instead of Chemo?

Mom2Ashli, you need to know whether your aunt has predominantly invasive or predominantly non-invasive cancer.

Generally, chemo is recommended only for invasive cancer, that which has left the original site and invaded nearby tissues. The thought is that those cells can travel even further via the bloodstream and lymph system, and begin to grow in a distant organ such as the liver, brain, lungs, abdomen, bones, etc. Chemotherapy is designed to kill off any of these renengade cells that may have gone elsewhere in the body.

Some people do chemo first to shrink their tumors before surgery. Some do surgery first, then chemo. It depends on the nature of the tumor. When lymph nodes have cancer in them, it means the cancer has already spread locally. Women with "positive nodes" usually receive extra chemotherapy in addition to the usual dose. Of course, chemo is always optional, people can refuse it if they want to.

For non-invasive cancers, surgery removes the cancer at the site, then radiation is designed to "clean up" any local cells in the surrounding area (of the breast and armpit, sometimes collarbone area) so on the chance any were there to begin with, or they got out during biopsy or surgery, they don't begin to grow further. It is not uncommon for women with non-invasive cancer to do just surgery.

Women with invasive cancers often, but not always, do both. The chemo gets the distant cells, and the radiation cleans up the local area.

It would not be ideal to do radiation before surgery, because radiation affects the tissue in such a way that it might not heal too well after surgery. For example, many women get skin burns during radiation - I had 3rd degree burns myself. You would not be able to do surgery after something like that.

 

[Mom2Ashli]

Mom2Ashli, you need to know whether your aunt has predominantly invasive or predominantly non-invasive cancer.

Generally, chemo is recommended only for invasive cancer, that which has left the original site and invaded nearby tissues. The thought is that those cells can travel even further via the bloodstream and lymph system, and begin to grow in a distant organ such as the liver, brain, lungs, abdomen, bones, etc. Chemotherapy is designed to kill off any of these renengade cells that may have gone elsewhere in the body.

Some people do chemo first to shrink their tumors before surgery. Some do surgery first, then chemo. It depends on the nature of the tumor. When lymph nodes have cancer in them, it means the cancer has already spread locally. Women with "positive nodes" usually receive extra chemotherapy in addition to the usual dose. Of course, chemo is always optional, people can refuse it if they want to.

For non-invasive cancers, surgery removes the cancer at the site, then radiation is designed to "clean up" any local cells in the surrounding area (of the breast and armpit, sometimes collarbone area) so on the chance any were there to begin with, or they got out during biopsy or surgery, they don't begin to grow further.

Women with invasive cancers often, but not always, do both. The chemo gets the distant cells, and the radiation cleans up the local area.

Thanks for the help. I am going to try and find out what I can from them. It is good to know what questions I need to ask to get the answers I am looking for.

She has not been feeling well so we are trying not to bother her and just getting information from my Grandmother who happens to be 94 years old.
So some of this is getting lost in the communications.