DD has hit the 4 month seperation mark update

[Tiggerlovinggrandma]

I posted some issues I was dealing with concerning my DD and SIL a few months ago. Here is an update. I am writing tonight on top of not being able to sleep (ongoing issue) because I'm generally upset. I guess I just need to vent.

Some background DD (our only child) and SIl have been married just 2 1/2 years (Oct 2006). They met in Aug 2005, began dating in Jan 06, became engaged July 06, announced they were pregnant in Aug 06, married in Oct 06, became parents in Mar 2007. DH and I gave them the wedding of their dreams in Oct 07. Not exactly in the order DH and I would have liked things to happen but it is what it is. We accepted SIL into our family even though we had misgivings and welcomed our first grandson happily into our lives. He is our joy.

In January 09, DD seperated from SIL citing she was tired of all his lies, lack of financial responcibility (ex: buying guns for his collection when he needed to make a house payment) and disregard for son's well-being ( Ex: going to home depot instead of buying milk and diapers for his son) , She moved out of their house into a one bedroom apt. They made a temporary custody agreement between themselves. Both of them said they would try counseling although they didn't start this until two weeks ago. They have had only 2 individual sessions so far. Mind you, SIl goes to National Guard Training in July for 4 months. IMO not much hope for counseling with him gone.

SIL claims absolutely no responcibility for the seperation citing DD can come back home anytime. He says this is all her. SIL personally is the type to say all the right things to come off to others a certain way. Right now he is playing the poor me, my wife has left me profile to his friends and family. Since the seperatiion DD and SIL have quit wearing their wedding bands. Recently SIL's cousin referred to him as her beautiful recently single cousin. DD seems so wrapped up in her work. She has recently become a manager where she works. She also goes to college and of course finds time for her social life. This is normal for her. When discussing what their son's schedule is, they quickely point fingers at one another and tell us to go ask the other one. Is this what life will be like from now on? It's appearing more and more to DH and I like they are already divorced. I honestly don't think they could get anymore seperated.

DH and I have always babysat A LOT for DGS since he was born sometimes for weeks and months at a time. Believe me no complaing her. We love having him. However up until January SIl has had no interest in calling or visiting our home while DGS is here. It doesn't matter how long he goes with oput seeing him. Once our DD was gravely ill last year and we cared for our DGS for 8 weeks. SIL did not come by nor call to check on his son or to spend time with him at all. As sick as our daughter was, she called a few times and came by to play with him whenever she could. Now SIL wants at least 3-4 days a week with his son even though most of that time his son spends with SIL's 75 year old parents, neither of which are in the best of health. Our daughter gets an average of a day and a half to two a week at most with her son. DH and I get 1-2 days a week. It bothers us that DD would agree to sucha schedule allowing her so little time but she only says he is the child's father.

For DH and I to watch from the sidelines as our daughter's marriage falls apart is unbearable at best. To witness neither of them really trying to salvage it is just sad. Having to look on as DGS's parents both of whom we feel are iiresponcible bounce him around every week is just heartbreaking. He has 4 entirely different schedules for meals, nap and bed time. Ours is the only consistent one. I have hoped and prayed they would care about each other and their son enough to work things out but that has not happened. And I don't think it is going too. I feel my grandson is at the mercy of his parents witha future of radical visitations, step parents, and court battle. It truly breaks my heart!!

DH and I know this child is not ours. We both realise this is our daughter's life and her and SIL's choices. They are not our choices to make. However knowing that does not make it any easier to cope with. All DH and I can do is make sure the time DGS spends with us is happy, secure and full of love. Thanks for alllowing me to vent. It helps!

I welcome any and all comments, suggestions, advice and stories of how others have coped with divorce whether it be their own or their childrens.

How others worked out children's schedules with the in laws would be of great help as well.

 

[ms_missy66]

Awww, Grandma! I can only imagine how hard it is to watch! I think you're doing the most wonderful thing you can possibly do...providing a safe, securing and loving spot for your DGS and DD. I have a lot of hope things will settle down. It sounds like they're still working through this new situation. Perhaps as time goes on, things will get more consistent. And, if your DD and SIL do proceed with a divorce, that custody agreement can be modified. She may decide that 3-4 days a week is too much.

I'll be thinking about you and your family. *hugs* I'm so sorry you're having to go through this. Divorce is never easy. I'm so thankful for your DD and DSG they have you. It sounds like you're giving them lots of love.

 

[Mouse House Mama]

I am so sorry you are going through this. I have no real advice except that I know if I was doing stuff like that my own family would have sat me down and very bluntly told me that I was hurting my child. From what you have posted it seems like neither parent has too much of a personal investment in this child. If the marriage doesn't work out then fine, but they both need to step up and do what is right for their child. I am sorry but social life comes after caring for your child. Can you sit the two of them down together? Don't focus on them getting back together, but focus on them taking better care of their child. Thank goodness this child has the two of you. Good luck!

 

[micheleq]

I'm so sorry! I remember your earlier post a few months ago about this situation. Your DSG is the one that's being hurt in all this.

Try and convince your DD to get a laywer and file for divorce before SIL leaves for guard training (when he'll be gone and nothing can get done). That way custody and child support can be squared away before he leaves.

Hopefully this will help your DD become a better mother in the end. You said you had concerns about her parenting, so talk to her if you can. I know my parents love my DDs and would do anythng to help us out if we needed it, but sometime when a grandparent takes too much responsibility, the parent gets left out of the mix. Your DSG might be better off with you, but you have to give your DD a chance to be a good mom It sounds like she has a great role model already - you!

Good luck. Your family is lucky to have you! Hang in there and know your DISers are here for support!

 

[lil mermaid]

I am probably going to get flamed for this....


Both of this child's parents are irresponsible and have been less than stellar parents. The only stability in this poor baby's life (this is according to all of your posts) has been YOU and your home. You and your DH are more this little boy's parents than the actual parents are!

You stated that last year your DD was ill and that you had your DGS for two months. During this time, your daughter "called a few times, and came by to play with him whenever she could." I don't understand that at all.

I don't think either one of them deserves him, quite frankly. The way he is being bounced around is sickening.

I agree with the previous poster who advised you to get a lawyer before SIL goes to guard training.

Is there any way that your daughter can live with you in your home with her son?

 

[Sunset Cliffs]

So sorry for the difficult situation that you are in. If I am doing my math right, it sounds like your DGS is 6 months older than my son. This is a very important time in his life as they are developing so much and being really observant of all that is going on around them. My son picks up on new things every day and I have no idea how observant he really is. All of this to say that if you DGS is being bounced around in all of these different environments, who knows all of the people & situations that he is coming in contact with.

I agree w/ some of the previous posters that your DD should try to get the situation resolved before her husband leaves. She might be resistant to this because she knows that will mean she will have to take on more responsibility than she wants to. But I know that if I was relying on my parents as heavily as she is relying on you, they would have sat me down for a very blunt conversation by this point. I know that is hard to do, but she will never accept the responsibility if you don't insist upon it.

You sound like you are wonderful grandparents who truly love their DGS and he is lucky to have you. Good luck w/ this situation, and please keep us updated.

 

[sunnyday123]

the only way my DD would not be living with me even if I was sick and she was 2-3 was if I had recently lost all of my limbs. She came by and called when she could? Unless she was hospitalized, he should have been with her, period.

Honestly, finding time to socialize is way down the list AFTER being a responsible parent. Sounds like the soon to be XSIL is trying to up his time with the kid in an effort to pay less child support. They need to file with the court system, get a schedule in place, and follow it. Just because she is the mother doesnt auto-matically give her custody, and it sounds like she is pawning him off on you just as much as the father is on the other Grandparents.
When you are a parent, married or single, your wants and needs come AFTER your child. Right now this poor little boy is going through a very trying change in his life, and he needs stability and routine. They are both playing the "poor me" game, if they don't know their own childs schedule.

Their marriage sounds over. Don't dwell on that, concentrate on the fact that they are not being the parents that they should be. Geography does not make a parent less of a parent. Both can be strong role models in this childs life no matter where they live, it just takes work.

 

[Maggie'sMom]

I am probably going to get flamed for this....


Both of this child's parents are irresponsible and have been less than stellar parents. The only stability in this poor baby's life (this is according to all of your posts) has been YOU and your home. You and your DH are more this little boy's parents than the actual parents are!

You stated that last year your DD was ill and that you had your DGS for two months. During this time, your daughter "called a few times, and came by to play with him whenever she could." I don't understand that at all.

I don't think either one of them deserves him, quite frankly. The way he is being bounced around is sickening.

I agree with the previous poster who advised you to get a lawyer before SIL goes to guard training.

Is there any way that your daughter can live with you in your home with her son?

I too remember your posts from several months ago regarding irresponsible behavior on the part of both parents. And I have to totally agree with the above post. For the sake of your DGS, I think it would be best for your DD and DGS to come live with you and your husband.

 

[Tiggerlovinggrandma]

Thanks for the advice. I do want to take a minute and answer a few of you.

Mouse House Mama and Sunset Cliffs:[/COLOR] DH and I have already sat DD and SIL down many times and talked until we are blue in the face. It simply does no good.

micheleg:[/COLOR] Both DD and SIL have said they will wait until January (1 year) to divorce if they are going too. Our state requires 1 yr mandatory seperation before divorce. So they will not take any action prior to SIL leaving for NG.

Also it was DD and SIL who initiated how much time we spent with DGS. Neither of them can afford daycare and do not have good care providers besides us grandparents. Orginally it was to be while they work, then DD went back to school and then they began eaving him over night out of convierence (distance and work schedules) and on and on. They both took advantage and we know that. Now since they have seperated DH and I watch the little guy only 2 days a week which is less then we ever have.

lil mermaid:[/COLOR] Yes, even my sister in law and nieces have suggested that DH and I are practically co-parents. However DD and SIL are in complete denial over the very suggestion.

As for DD being ill last year. In her defense she did try to see her son even with all she was going through at the time.She had to be hospitalized for MRSA and later liver and gallbladder surgery. She was gravely ill for a time and had a long recuperation. So we did care for DGS while all of that was going on. Towards the end when she began feeling better and had regained some of her strength, her doctor okayed limited activity. It was during this time that DD would call to check on her son as well as make small visits with him until such time she could take his care over again. SIL however did not call to check on son at all during the 8 weeks we had him nor did he come by to get his son or come play with him. Nothing.

sunnyday123:[/COLOR] Yes, DH and I agree DD and SIL's social life should take a back seat to their child but it doesn't. We have battled with DD many times over this issue.

As for them pointing a finger at one another over each others schedule with son. It is infuriating when we ask DD what DGS schedule is with SIL for a certain week and she just says - ask him. We literally have to go to each of them when they have son and ask for what we need to know or want. Perhaps this is how it is done with divorce. DH andI have never expierenced it so it is all new and very frustrating. We feel DD should know what SIL is doing or planning for son while he is in his care and vice versa. However DD says DGS time with daddy is his time and hers is hers.

maggiue's mom:[/COLOR] We have offered for DD and DGS to live with us, She has refused and wants to live on her own.

A couple of other things:

DH and I will not give up on talking to DD about her responcibilites as a parent. We pray she will see things more clearly. In the meantime DGS has us to keep a close eye on him and hopefully that will benefit both him and DD.

DH and I do believe we are the only consistent care givers in DGS life at the moment. His other grandparents do love him dearly but are limited as to what they can do for him due to health and age limits. We pray DD and SIL will become better parents over time. There has to be hope. We don't think they are bad people. They have no alcohol or drug issues which is on their side. . We believe they do love the little guy but however are young, misguided, irresponcibile and perhaps selfish. Hopefully they both can change and grow up before he does.

Unfortuantely DH nor I trust our SIL fully and feel his recent concern over son's time spent with him is a ploy of some kind. This worries us. Nearly two years went by where DGS was like a play toy to be taken out whenever. Since the seperation however SIL has changed drastically in how much time he spends with son as well as how SIL represents himself. I hope we are both wrong but past interactions with our SIL has given us do right to be wary of his intentions.

All in all I hope and pray things will find a way of working out for all inviolved but most of all for our grandson. Divorce is an ugly mess that affects all involved. I wish couples would take more time before getting so involved with someone. No one should be jumping off the deep end of love in this day and age. People need to take relationships more slowly and seriously. I wish my DD had taken her relationship more slowly but then again if she had, our beautiful grandson would not be the joy in our lives that he is. I would never wish him away for anything. I am thankful he has Grandpa aka Pepa and me (Grandma aka Mema) to lean on during this time.

Again everyone, thank you for being there for me and my family with your kind words, encouragement and advice. You are the BEST!!

 

[sunnyday123]

to you all. It truly sounds like you are the only stability in this childs life, and he needs you now more than ever.

I can tell you, divorce doesn't have to be like this, and it infuriates me when parents use their kids or feel because they are divorced they are excused from having to deal with each other.

I've been divorced for almost 6 years, I talk to my DD every day that she is with her father, and he does the same ( when he calls that is ) I know where she and when she is with him, and what their schedule is. Everyone treats each other in a civil manner and he's welcome at my house or any event for her. Is it hard? Absolutely. After 5 minutes in a room with him I want to run him over with an 18 wheeler. But you have to put your differences away and be parents. They can still be good,supportive, involved parents even if they don't live together. It really does sound like SIL is planning something, with the sudden visits all the time. If he can prove he's the primary care-giver he could fight, and possibly win, primary custody. Maybe he's trying to lessen his chid support payments. Does your state have Grandparent rights? You may want to look into that as well.

Good luck, and keep talking to your DD. She'll get it eventually.

 

[Tiggerlovinggrandma]

SIL believes he will not have to pay any child support. His view is he provides care (food, clothing, diapers) of child on the days he is with him and DD should provide the same care of son when he is with her. No money should need to change hands according to him. SIMPLE in his eyes.

I think however he is forgetting about the child's others expenses such as medical, insurance, education, birthday, holiday, sport related, etc

 

[badblackpug]

SIL believes he will not have to pay any child support. His view is he provides care (food, clothing, diapers) of child on the days he is with him and DD should provide the same care of son when he is with her. No money should need to change hands according to him. SIMPLE in his eyes.

I think however he is forgetting about the child's others expenses such as medical, insurance, education, birthday, holiday, sport related, etc

He is right. If the custody arrangement goes as you stated above with the child with his father 3-4 days a week and only with his mother 1-2 days a week, then he will not have to pay. ...but she will! He will have primary physical custody based on the fact that he has the child the most. I don't know child support works in your state, but here primary custody is determined by the number of "overnights" the child spends with a parent. The parent that has the child for the most overnight stays is considered to have primary physical custody. Usually the child support agreement covers things like who insures the child and how medical and educational expenses are split. Your daughter really needs to get a lawyer.

For what it is worth, I think you need to stop making it so easy on both of them. I understand watching him while his parents are at work or school, but I absolutely would not watch him so they can socialize. I also don't understand the illness thing. Even if she were hospitalized, she can still call her son, unless she was unconscious, and if she is not in the hospital there is really no excuse for not seeing him daily. Maybe she couldn't do some things physically, but she could see him. ...and, yes his father didn't show up at all, and there is really no excuse for that, but it doesn't make your daughter shirking her responsibility any better. Both of these people have a lot of growing up to do.

 

[marlynnp]

Neither of them have any reason to change. You are enabling them. I know you want what's best for your grandchild but I think if you stepped back for a while and forced the parents to step up he'd be fine. I see no indication of a physical danger.

 

[luvsJack]

For whatever reason, a lot of young women go through this when they are newly separated or divorced. Its as though they need to separate themselves from everything in their life--even if this includes their kids. I went through it myself for a short time and thank God my parents were there for my boys.

I am not excusing their actions, just saying that it may only be temporary. I can't say what made me come back to my senses and being there for my kids, but it did happen. I am sure that stepping back is much easier said than done; especially if you feel that they will just find someone else to keep the baby. At least you know he is well taken care of with you; but I agree that you need to make it a bit harder on them.

Your daughter needs to get a custody and support agreement. And she needs to seriously think about how the agreements she makes will affect her and her child later. She will be connected to her ex for at least 18 years, what will make it easier to deal with?

 

[ilandrazdsw]

Grandma, I am so sorry to hear that things have gotten worse.

One thing that crossed my mind when reading about the responsible parenting issues with DD and SIL was that it may be beneficial for you to look into what it takes to be a foster parent...just in case! I don't know how it works in your state (if a child is removed from his parents for any reason) if the child can go to any relative or if the relative must be able to foster (even if it is your own DGS). I know it is one more thing to think about, but at least then you would know that the chances of DGS ending up with you over strangers (or maybe SIL's family/friends) is a better chance.

At least there is one light in this with your DD...her manager position and that she is still in school. Now if she could only focus on the personal life (her DS) rather than social. I do hope with her promotion she has been able to take care of more of DGS and her needs, as she was quite dependent on you for some time it seemed.

I'll keep you and your family in prayers.