DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[Becky Mouse]

I think they mean this case that included studies from industrial engineers:

https://casetext.com/case/al-v-walt-disney-parks-resorts-us-inc-1

“Mr. Laval, as well as a current Disney industrial engineer, testified about a "Tester Study" in which testers used certain ride passes—DAS, FastPasses, or readmission passes—to experience as many attractions as possible during a three-day period. The results showed that testers with DAS experienced, on average, 45% more attractions than those without DAS. On one of the days, the non-DAS testers waited in queues on average a total of 255 minutes or more than 4 hours, whereas the DAS testers only waited in line on average total of 107 minutes, or just under two hours. As a result, Mr. Laval concluded that the Tester Study showed that guests with a DAS can experience more rides and attractions—as the evidence showed, at least 4 or 5—with much less waiting than guests who do not have a DAS card.”

“The Disney Industrial Engineering team performed an "incremental analysis" study in 2015 which highlights the impact on wait times for the vast majority of guests at the Disney parks. The team measured the impact on wait times if every guest with a DAS pass were given one to three readmission passes, as well as the impact if the percentage of guests with DAS passes were to increase by one or two percent. As more guests enter the FastPass line, the standby line will be slowed as more guests from the FastPass line are put onto the ride to keep that line moving quickly, since guests wait times are limited to around 15 minutes or less in the FastPass line. The "incremental analysis" study showed that the wait times increased significantly for all guests across the board when guests with DAS were given one or more readmission passes. Specifically, if every DAS guest were given two more readmission passes, the standby wait time at the popular Seven Dwarfs Mine Train ride would increase by 39 minutes, from 69 to 108 minutes. The wait times would also increase more significantly if the percentage of guests with a DAS increased, a scenario Disney anticipated as more guests learned about the increased benefits, based on similar problems and abuses that developed with the GAC program. Thus, for example, if all DAS guests were given two readmission passes for their party, a 1 % increase in daily DAS users would cause the standby wait time at Seven Dwarfs Mine train to increase by nearly an hour, from 69 minutes to 124 minutes. Similarly, there were significant increases in wait time for the other popular rides the industrial engineering team studied.”

This is so important. All of these people saying the DAS abuse doesn't impact other guests needs to read this. It does. Good on Disney for addressing this issue that has a major impact on the guest experience!

 

[ryang25]

I didn't say I speak for all people with bathroom issues. I was responding to a person with ulcerative colitis who felt that DAS was a good accommodation for the condition. I have similar symptoms as people with ulcerative colitis, and I said I don't understand how DAS a good accommodation. When I have to go to the bathroom, I have to go NOW. It doesn't matter if the line is even just 5 minutes long. I need to leave it. The person with ulcerative colitis agreed but said the shorter lines make it easier to leave. I agree that part is true, but I don't think that is a good enough reason to give DAS. I think Disney is right to offer other accommodations for people with conditions like mine instead of a blanket DAS accommodation. That just shows an example of two people who have similar symptoms and both agree they need to be able to leave a line to have quick access to the bathroom. One of the two people says DAS doesn't make sense (and the return to line accommodation is better). The other person wants DAS because it'll be a little easier to leave the line if it's shorter.

I presume you’re referring to me here and I’d like to clarify I have other conditions alongside ulcerative colitis (T1D) that also contribute.

I am not denying that for some with conditions like UC, the return to line option would be suitable.

However, I don’t think you have any authority to say that will be the case for everyone. UC has a multitude of symptom manifestations beside just the typical gastro ones. Sudden blood loss is just one to think about.

The severity of my urgency along with bleeding is not something I can deal with in the main queues. The anxiety of going into that queue alone is going to make it a complete nightmare for me. For waits upwards of 2 hours, I’d be trying to actually ride the attraction all day with constant re-entering. Not to mention my dignity. It’s great it works for you, but will not work for me and would also cause complications for my T1D.

All I am saying is that I think the decision on DAS vs another accommodation should be made on an individual level based on that guest’s needs. No need for example conditions to be given by Disney. Purely an assessment of needs and risk, and with education from the supposed experts Disney are going to use, an appropriate accommodative can be given.

 

[OurBigTrip]

Can you please provide a link or more info on where you see this data?

•Mr. Laval, as well as a current Disney industrial engineer, testified about a "Tester Study" in which testers used certain ride passes—DAS, FastPasses, or readmission passes—to experience as many attractions as possible during a three-day period. The results showed that testers with DAS experienced, on average, 45% more attractions than those without DAS. On one of the days, the non-DAS testers waited in queues on average a total of 255 minutes or more than 4 hours, whereas the DAS testers only waited in line on average total of 107 minutes, or just under two hours. As a result, Mr. Laval concluded that the Tester Study showed that guests with a DAS can experience more rides and attractions—as the evidence showed, at least 4 or 5—with much less waiting than guests who do not have a DAS card.

https://casetext.com/case/al-v-walt-disney-parks-resorts-us-inc-1

 

[KCO5988]

A very reasoned response!

My question for the folks that, based solely on the initial press release, as we don't really know what final accommodations would be, what would be a reasonable accommodation for Chron's or MS if DAS is taken away? I know for some, leave & return to the line would work, so that's a subset. But if leave and return isn't adequate and DAS isn't available, what would you see as a reasonable accommodation?

Seriously asking, because I have no idea what that middle ground might be.

I honestly don’t know. Personally for me a return to line pass would most likely not work. I don’t know the details yet so I cannot say for sure, but every scenario I can think of with my disability it is not a viable option. I am not sure what I would do if it was the only option to me because I’m still processing the news and what this could mean for me. I completely get wanting to crack down on abuse and I fully support eliminating preselects and making you wait 10 min to book the next. Personally I would even go so far as needing to scan in at a ride to get my return time, but others have said that won’t work from them. Also okay with somehow not allowing standby lines for other rides during your wait time (again for me personally) And I understanding you are genuinely asking for what would be an appropriate accommodation and you’re not trying to be accusatory. I just don’t have a good answer right now unfortunately because I never had to think about it before.

 

[snoopboop]

I didn't say I speak for all people with bathroom issues.

I mean, you did. You said: “Anyway, it sounds like you hate to hear this, but it still sounds like the real accommodation people with bathroom issues need is the ability to easily leave a line and rejoin it.” That’s you making a blanket statement about what ALL people with bathroom issues need.

 

[OurBigTrip]

I don't think Disney should be in the business of splitting up families to placate resentful able-bodied people. The whole family having fun together is one of the principles that the parks were founded on. Forcing a person with a disability to ride without their family doesn't sound like equal access to me.

Disney is a business, first and foremost, so when something negatively impacts a large segment of their customer base, they have to address it.

 

[Disneychick75]

This is so important. All of these people saying the DAS abuse doesn't impact other guests needs to read this. It does. Good on Disney for addressing this issue that has a major impact on the guest experience!

These were testers. Who knows on what date they did the testing. Also, for some people with medical conditions all the time they spend in the parks might equal half the time that those in good health can. It's impossible for a few testers to know or experience all of the health issues of those that need the DAS. You've seen today that just because Poster A with a certain condition may not need the DAS, another poster will.
Some with neurodivergencies might only be able to handle a few particular rides and this is why their families ride them a few times. This would leave all of the other rides free for those who do not need the DAS.

 

[HopperFan]

Unfortunately, that option was too late for us by the time they released this information. We check in a week after this starts. We have no time after this begins to sit back and see how things play out. If our vacation wasn't until later, it would be easier to digest this info and make alternative plans if we can't get the DAS. They should have given more time between the release of this info and implementation.

I completely agree more time would be better for those having trips sooner than later. MY HOPE is that they will be somewhat flexible for those caught in that overlay of time.

But the point of my post is that most everything being said here is personal opinions, personal interpretations and NOT FACT. Many comments are not helping anyone at all, and are misleading folks with false information. This is not the place to get accurate info about what is happening. The only information that matters will be what Disney says.

 

[lowlight]

I'm so excited about the changes to the DAS pass system. This is a much needed change and will continue to help the people who truly need it

Someone dusted off the old troll account!

 

[RF536]

[/QUOTE]
What would you do if there is a line for the bathroom? Or if you get stuck on a ride and can’t exit?
[/QUOTE]
Honestly id have an accident and deal with it. Which would mean after cleaning up the best i could, a trip back to the hotel for a shower. Sometimes things happen beyond our control. Does that mean i should never get on a ride because it might break down??

I dont see anyone saying a person with mental disabilities shouldn't get on a ride because if it breaks down they might have a meltdown.

 

[traveler9]

Someone dusted off the old troll account!

Just because someone doesn’t post here frequently, that doesn’t make them a troll…

 

[Kerr84]

Does anyone have any knowledge that could perhaps explain why Disney decided developmental disabilities such as autism would be the qualifying DAS disabilities that could progress to an assessment? I am just genuinely curious. I know ASD falls on a spectrum and not all may qualify, but that is the case with other conditions too. I am not for one second suggesting that this group should not be eligible for DAS. Just trying to understand why this is the group that are eligible to proceed to an assessment. Would the leave-the-line solution not be appropriate?

Deleting because I may have shared too much info.

 

[ryang25]

Disclaimer: I’m only sharing my experience with my daughter who has autism and not speaking for others or implying anything about why others shouldn’t receive the same accommodations as her.

I don’t think autism will automatically mean that you get DAS . I think you will still have to talk to someone and they will decide what accommodations you will get. A leave the line option might work for some people with autism so that is what they will receive. In the case of my 4 year old daughter who has autism and a global developmental delay with severe speech and communication delays, that would not work. If she can see the ride, she screams and cries and has meltdowns the entire time we are in line, so we would be leaving every line we got in. She is also an eloper so that is an issue too and she becomes easily overwhelmed when trapped in by people. Once she has something in her mind, it takes a very long time for her to calm down, sometimes an hour or more. You can’t reason with her because she doesn’t fully understand what you are telling her. So, getting out of line to calm down and coming back to the line wouldn’t work.

We just went to Silver Dollar City and using their disability access pass makes me feel so awkward because you are the only people going in the exit. The ride attendant has to stop loading people to give you a return time and fill out your paperwork. Then when you return, you are the only people entering through the exit, the ride attendant has to stop and fill out your paper work again while everyone in line is watching you get on the ride first and wondering why. I’ve had people ask me about it too. I get so embarrassed so I don’t use it for her there very much. If a line looks like it is 20 minutes or so, we will wait in the regular line, but i spend the entire 20 minutes trying to keep her calm and corralled. I can tell everyone around us is annoyed and it is mentally and physically exhausting for both of us. DAS is the perfect solution for her because she waits where she can’t see the ride and moves faster through the LL so feels less enclosed. I agree with someone else that they probably listed autism specifically because of the court cases that involved DAS and autism.

DAS sounds absolutely like the appropriate accommodation for your daughter. I’m 25 now and my brother with autism is 23. A lot of what you shared reminds me of what my parents had to go through and they hated the embarrassment and judgment from others. I think it’s probably the case that more people in the developmental / ASD category would need full DAS vs leave the line than other conditions. Just wish Disney kept to their word and based this all on needs rather than the conditions themselves!

 

[Norton figment]

You keep mentioning Crohn`s and that return to line is a viable option.

"I know you are just the messenger and only telling what you think Disney thinks" but again it seems like you keep getting back to this particular disease....

Let me give you some inside info...
It MIGHT work in theory in a line like Dumbo because both lines are equal
BUT in a long maze like narrow line like BTM or SM or even POTC there is no way you can get to the bathroom on time in most cases.
With DAS you have the option to enter the line when you "feel ready to ride". Numerous occasion CM offered me to get in line straight away when I tried to obtain return time at the ride entrance and I had to refuse it. Knowing I would need a bathroom brake before I "feel ready to ride". And when I was ready I only had to conquer a shorter line.
If someone like me is forced to enter a 2+ hours line it is guaranteed that I would need to fight my way out find a bathroom and kinda fight my way back ? (That part is still unclear). I would feel really bad doing this several time and all together my wait time would be considerably longer than those who don`t need to live the line ... until you don`t have experience what is having Crohn`s mean please stop saying that...

I don`t know what is like having MS means and I`m not trying to say for those with MS that return to line is a reasonable accommodation. I just don`t.

If that`s the case really that people with IBD will be refused DAS I guess lot of accident will happen and that will make some noise. It`s interesting that in Europe in numerous countries IBD is a well recognised disability and tried to be accommodated well. (again we can`t be sure yet that Disney won`t accommodate it in satisfactory manner for now everything is a guessing game).

I genuinely hope Disney reads this forums....

100% this. It’s the fighting in and out of the maze to get a bathroom! That’s the issue. I am hopeful that Disney just isn’t sharing to help remove all of the people that have been abusing the system those that really need it will still get it.

I’m with other posters I’m not 100% sure we would’ve booked our vacation knowing that we might not get DAS, we’ve have gotten it for the last few trips since 2014. Especially now that there’s no fast passes.

 

[elvispursley]

I'm actually surprised they kept DAS at 4...but then again, I think this pass is gonna focus hard on minor kids (so they'd need parents anyway).

For adults without severe developmental issues, I feel like the "return to line" pass will operate like an old GAC for 1 - come to the line, get a time to come back, enter LL as a solo when either you would have ridden (if you are solo) or when the rest of your party would be ready to ride having gone through the standby line (so you can join them).

Maybe I'm wrong, but that would take groups of 6+ down to singles, and that would probably knock 70%+ off the LL - and that's probably what Disney would be looking to do. Accommodate the disabled adult only, and not the entire non-disabled party.

But there are likely many where it is dangerous to leave someone "solo" or unattended due to their person's disability while the rest of their party makes their way through the queue. What if someone, god forbid, has epilepsy and has a seizure while waiting? Or a diabetic passes out? Or someone with dementia/alzheimer's wonders off and never meets their party?? And who wants to experience Disney solo? I certainly don't want to ride anything without my mom (who has her own health issues) or my family when they come. Why do I want to spend hours of my day by myself? If that were the case, I'd book a trip for just me (except I never would due to my health issues). I apologize if I misread the statement, but what I took your statement to mean is that adults with non cognitive impairments can wait/ride solo.

 

[Becky Mouse]

Disclaimer: I’m only sharing my experience with my daughter who has autism and not speaking for others or implying anything about why others shouldn’t receive the same accommodations as her.

I don’t think autism will automatically mean that you get DAS . I think you will still have to talk to someone and they will decide what accommodations you will get. A leave the line option might work for some people with autism so that is what they will receive. In the case of my 4 year old daughter who has autism and a global developmental delay with severe speech and communication delays, that would not work. If she can see the ride, she screams and cries and has meltdowns the entire time we are in line, so we would be leaving every line we got in. She is also an eloper so that is an issue too and she becomes easily overwhelmed when trapped in by people. Once she has something in her mind, it takes a very long time for her to calm down, sometimes an hour or more. You can’t reason with her because she doesn’t fully understand what you are telling her. So, getting out of line to calm down and coming back to the line wouldn’t work.

We just went to Silver Dollar City and using their disability access pass makes me feel so awkward because you are the only people going in the exit. The ride attendant has to stop loading people to give you a return time and fill out your paperwork. Then when you return, you are the only people entering through the exit, the ride attendant has to stop and fill out your paper work again while everyone in line is watching you get on the ride first and wondering why. I’ve had people ask me about it too. I get so embarrassed so I don’t use it for her there very much. If a line looks like it is 20 minutes or so, we will wait in the regular line, but i spend the entire 20 minutes trying to keep her calm and corralled. I can tell everyone around us is annoyed and it is mentally and physically exhausting for both of us. DAS is the perfect solution for her because she waits where she can’t see the ride and moves faster through the LL so feels less enclosed. I agree with someone else that they probably listed autism specifically because of the court cases that involved DAS and autism.

I think your daughter is EXACTLY who should be accommodated with DAS. I'm glad she will still qualify and hope you guys have a magical trip!

 

[prettypatchesmsu]

These were testers. Who knows on what date they did the testing. Also, for some people with medical conditions all the time they spend in the parks might equal half the time that those in good health can. It's impossible for a few testers to know or experience all of the health issues of those that need the DAS. You've seen today that just because Poster A with a certain condition may not need the DAS, another poster will.
Some with neurodivergencies might only be able to handle a few particular rides and this is why their families ride them a few times. This would leave all of the other rides free for those who do not need the DAS.

Agree. I’m betting these testers were not disabled DAS users. Sure, if you use DAS as an able person with no issues, I’m sure it would be great and an advantage. Disabled DAS users are not using it this way. This is a horrible comparison and not even remotely a good real world test if they aren’t using disabled testers.

 

[koszmok]

My last post for today it`s getting late here (2am)

I do think too many people are abusing the system.

I`m not aware of the laws/regulations in the US which kind of proof can be asked to prove you are indeed disabled.

I`m only stating facts : in the UK or even in Disneyland Paris they only honour Disabled ID`s / official government letters stating disability benefits granted / or medical reports. I think we do not have that many people who can abuse the system.

My understanding it is completely different in the US.

This might be a reason that from now on (maybe/probably/who knows really?) those of us who really NEED the DAS won`t be able to get it (even If I`m willing to show my Disabled ID/ medical reports) and those who are willing to cheat will still can get it.

Basically the number of people who receive DAS will be less (in theory) just not with those who are cheating but with those who are don`t have a specific disability.

Sad

But I will still go to Disney still pay for 100`s for ticket and accommodation (not for food though as Disney food makes me really sick) just maybe I won`t do rides anymore...

More time to spend in the shops

I`m sorry guys I`m getting tired and mask my misery with sarcasm...

Have a good night folks!

Sorry about my broken English it`s not my first language (or second)

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

We just went to Silver Dollar City and using their disability access pass makes me feel so awkward because you are the only people going in the exit.

Silver Dollar City also is not full of strollers anywhere near the same as WDW. The park itself is hilly with inclines. When we went in summer of 2022 there were virtually no strollers in usage.

SDC is a great park but it's also not the best designed for several groups of people (people in strollers better train for some of those hills!) although experiencing what you did feeling the way you did is obviously not a good thing

On a side note all of us were impressed with the food. Also admittedly we liked the Trailblazer pass doing one day without it and one day with the Unlimited version. I didn't use it very much (def. not getting the full dollar per dollar value) but my traveling party used it a lot. Their system is much like Universals if you get the Unlimited.

 

[Kerr84]

DAS sounds absolutely like the appropriate accommodation for your daughter. I’m 25 now and my brother with autism is 23. A lot of what you shared reminds me of what my parents had to go through and they hated the embarrassment and judgment from others. I think it’s probably the case that more people in the developmental / ASD category would need full DAS vs leave the line than other conditions. Just wish Disney kept to their word and based this all on needs rather than the conditions themselves!

I am hoping that a lot of people are wrong in thinking they will automatically not qualify because their condition isn’t a developmental issue. I hope Disney will listen to everyone’s personal situation and make a decision on accommodations. I think the wording is more to discourage the abusers or at least I hope so!

I think we need a lot more information about what other accommodations are possible and there will always be reasons why they won’t work for some and hopefully Disney will make exceptions when needed.