Current owners: Do you feel that renters are impacting resort availability?

[TheDailyMoo]

I thought the value rooms face the parking lot and the standard views at Jambo either face the savanna or pool. That’s why we chose Jambo standard. Hoping to maybe get a Savanna view.

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but only 2 of the values face the parking lot the rest being savannah and pool/resort view

 

[TheDailyMoo]

Not worth starting a separate walk for 2 reservations when they know one longer one will still sell probably...


The weird thing is that DVC Rental Store only lets members ask for up to $18 per point on a drop down menu for confirmed reservations vs some others that let you put in a custom amount. I know because I checked recently as we have a reservation for next year that we may not use and are debating renting or banking the points. So that reservation is either:

1. A member that is basically wasting that reservation as they would easily be able to get the same $18 for easier to book rooms through a broker (or way more than $18 if they rented the reservation themselves or a different broker that pays more for confirmed reservations)
2. A member that is part of the company that is walking and then spec renting for max profit. Though I don't know which companies have been suspected of that in the past.

Interesting I didn't know the board sponsor only allowed up to $18 a point. I would definitely want more than that if I was spec renting let's say an AKV concierge.

 

[Tatebeck]

Interesting I didn't know the board sponsor only allowed up to $18 a point. I would definitely want more than that if I was spec renting let's say an AKV concierge.

Just for accuracy I just checked again and it looks like they did increase it to $20 within the last few weeks since I last checked, but still a bit low if they are going to charge $28. They should be making about the same for each reservation, not making extra on the good bookings that they mark up. So they should pay the member more or have the rental price lower if paying $18 or $20

 

[Tatebeck]

I thought the value rooms face the parking lot and the standard views at Jambo either face the savanna or pool. That’s why we chose Jambo standard. Hoping to maybe get a Savanna view.

officially they both say views of landscape/parking areas but there are many reports of good savannah or pool views from the value rooms

 

[TheDailyMoo]

Just for accuracy I just checked again and it looks like they did increase it to $20 within the last few weeks since I last checked, but still a bit low if they are going to charge $28. They should be making about the same for each reservation, not making extra on the good bookings that they mark up. So they should pay the member more or have the rental price lower if paying $18 or $20

So in essence if I rent a value room that I paid 9 points for or a concierge room I paid 33 points for I'm basically getting the same money from them? I guess that's why there are so many value rooms being rented.

 

[Heroes_or_Villains]

So in essence if I rent a value room that I paid 9 points for or a concierge room I paid 33 points for I'm basically getting the same money from them? I guess that's why there are so many value rooms being rented.

On a per point basis - yes you are getting the same money from them. The rental agency will get a higher or lower margin depending on whether it is a high demand item or not.

 

[Chili327]

Why make it for 15 days I feel like that cuts down on the number of people that would want that reservation no? That was obviously a nice long walk more than likely though!

Chainging probably risks losing a night or 2, so they just get max, or can call it in to break it up when needed.

Just for accuracy I just checked again and it looks like they did increase it to $20 within the last few weeks since I last checked, but still a bit low if they are going to charge $28. They should be making about the same for each reservation, not making extra on the good bookings that they mark up. So they should pay the member more or have the rental price lower if paying $18 or $20

Yes, my issue is that they are specifically taking 15 nights out of the system for rental purposes only, so that's where its deceitful, not an owner trying to rent out there extra points.

 

[mi*vida*loca]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but only 2 of the values face the parking lot the rest being savannah and pool/resort view

I just googled and found that same info. I was doing so much research before I rented points that I must’ve got that all confused.

 

[Tatebeck]

Yes, my issue is that they are specifically taking 15 nights out of the system for rental purposes only, so that's where its deceitful, not an owner trying to rent out there extra points.

Ah, so you just don't like them specifically renting confirmed reservations instead of offering the points for rent?

 

[Chili327]

Ah, so you just don't like them specifically renting confirmed reservations instead of offering the points for rent?

I don't like owning, specifically to rent... maybe that's selfish of me, but i feel like its similar to big corporations owning properties just to rent out... and gouging people. It's not what the product was intended for. (any deeper and we'll have to move this to Controversial section. lol)

 

[TheDailyMoo]

I don't like owning, specifically to rent... maybe that's selfish of me, but i feel like its similar to big corporations owning properties just to rent out... and gouging people. It's not what the product was intended for. (any deeper and we'll have to move this to Controversial section. lol)

I think most of us feel this way to some degree. It feels not right. I think most of us would feel better if it weren't specific rooms they were getting but instead renting out points even as a business. If you want to buy contracts just to rent your points fine but to be specifically grabbing hard to get rooms that other members would like a chance at to stay on vacation as they intended to do with their contracts...it just feels a little...well....yeah lol

edited to add I don't even see much wrong with spec renting if you do it once just to ensure a sale on a down year or a year where you can't make it out of many you have already...but yeah it's the LLCs with thousands of points doing this in large quantities that make it feel tainted.

 

[Sandisw]

Perfect example of how commercial renters are a bad thing.
https://dvcrentalstore.com/guests/reservations/66b26861a0ede000273e9618

Except you don't know that is someone who is renting for commecial purposes, do you? That could be someone who simply decided they wanted to rent next year, and grabbed a very popular room in hopes it goes fast.

While I definitely agree that the rental market has changed over the years, and morphed into confirmed reservations more than just points, it doesn't mean that its any differnt than renting points...other than frustration. Personally, renting doesn't bother me and whether one rents out points, or rents a confrimed reservation, doesn't really matter.

ETA: It does boggle my mind though that the value rooms are so popular for confirmed reservations, when, as noted, you can get a standard view for less and not worry.

 

[Genie+]

The confirmed reservation is charging $252 avg per night for value studio.

Right now a person could rent a normal AKV standard (bigger) studio for $18pp, but… they’re already booked up.

At $18 per point on those dates, a standard AKV room averages out $216 a night. $20pp would avg $240/nt.

Confirmed reservations get the most per point by holding lower than average point rooms/seasons long enough for other comparable cost effective options to become depleted (DVC availability and cash discounts). It’s not hard to learn for those doing repeated spec res. Timing is important, and with little risk. This reservation can be held hoping for the $28pp, and if no bites just lower it to $25pp in that last 30-60 days ($225/nt) and it will move, still at great profit. For now they can still try for the extra few hundred dollars and probably get it. The best values are popular and go quick whether DVC or cash offers, so direct competition are the first to go even when plenty of other occupancy still exists.

 

[Chili327]

I think most of us feel this way to some degree. It feels not right. I think most of us would feel better if it weren't specific rooms they were getting but instead renting out points even as a business. If you want to buy contracts just to rent your points fine but to be specifically grabbing hard to get rooms that other members would like a chance at to stay on vacation as they intended to do with their contracts...it just feels a little...well....yeah lol

edited to add I don't even see much wrong with spec renting if you do it once just to ensure a sale on a down year or a year where you can't make it out of many you have already...but yeah it's the LLCs with thousands of points doing this in large quantities that make it feel tainted.

Yes, this.

Except you don't know that is someone who is renting for commecial purposes, do you? That could be someone who simply decided they wanted to rent next year, and grabbed a very popular room in hopes it goes fast.

While I definitely agree that the rental market has changed over the years, and morphed into confirmed reservations more than just points, it doesn't mean that its any differnt than renting points...other than frustration. Personally, renting doesn't bother me and whether one rents out points, or rents a confrimed reservation, doesn't really matter.

True, I don't know, but I'd bet money on it. lol (and technically if I'm wrong it's still a good example of the type of thing that I'm talking about... because even if this isn't, they do exist.)

 

[Sandisw]

Yes, this.



True, I don't know, but I'd bet money on it. lol (and technically if I'm wrong it's still a good example of the type of thing that I'm talking about... because even if this isn't, they do exist.)

Maybe, but for me, the problem that happens is that people see confirmed reservations and may then call them commercial renting, which makes others, who may be new, think that in and of itself is a violation of the contract.

I think its important to make sure that the two don't get seen as the same thing. The contract prohibts a membership from renting in such a way that makes it commerical. Advertising a reservation one has prebooked does not automatically make that reservation or that membership commerical. That's all.

 

[Tatebeck]

I used to really hate seeing the hard to book rooms pop up for confirmed reservation rentals but my situation recently has made me think about it a bit more. I had made a reservation for a week late next spring/early summer in a hard to book room (I am not posting the actual dates as I am not advertising it as up for rental, this is an example) I didn't get it ahead of time and walk it, some days came available and I booked a few days and then a few days more after following a person probably walking themselves forward. I snatched it up because it was a good point value, and very hard to book. I even had to borrow a few points for the last night or two. We went around the same time this last year so I thought it would be a great way to fit in another cheap trip!

But the timing is pretty soon after our annual passes expire and we try not to go to the parks in the summer. And it was pretty hot (around 90 and hotter than we had expected this last year) So that means we would have to renew our passes or buy dated tickets. It would save us quite a bit on passes if we just skipped that last trip, banked points, and waited to renew until next fall (the 15% renewal discount for the annual pass is a better deal if going all year, but if taking 2+ months off it is cheaper to wait and renew at full price and extend the next renewal date). But now I have borrowed some points for it, so now we either have to:

1. Go when it is hotter than we would like, and renew our passes earlier with a bigger expense
2. Cancel the booking and then mess with my other winter reservations to try and use the borrowed points, then bank the rest
3. Just rent out the reservation because it is a valuable room type.

Looking back I feel that I would still snag that reservation every time because it is such a good value/hard to book and I definitely want to stay in the unique rooms eventually. So, many members probably have heard that they are hard to book and so then book them whenever they see them available as I did. And if they use it, great! But if it turns out that the dates don't work, it can be hard to just drop such a valuable room once you have it booked lol, which would lead to even more rentals for these rooms once you have one booked

 

[lowlight]

Some people view it through the lens of “it’s your points, if it doesn’t go against the rules you can do it”, and some people view it through the lens of “if everyone treated their membership like this, the entire system would fall apart”. It’s kind of like capitalism, when people have morals it’s a great system, but throw a few amoral/immoral people in there and the entire thing burns itself to the ground.

Or guest behavior in the parks. There’s always the type of person that moves out of the way when another guest is walking directly towards them, while the other guest never moves and would walk right through you if you didn’t move. Or the preshow people that start off at the end of the line and claw their way to the front during preshow. None of these things are legally wrong, they just make you a bad person and if everyone did it, this world would suck. These are likely all the same type of people- walkers, hard to get spec renters, line sneakers, right of way ignores, etc. Sorry if it ruffles feathers, that’s the truth.

 

[Sandisw]

Some people view it through the lens of “it’s your points, if it doesn’t go against the rules you can do it”, and some people view it through the lens of “if everyone treated their membership like this, the entire system would fall apart”. It’s kind of like capitalism, when people have morals it’s a great system, but throw a few amoral/immoral people in there and the entire thing burns itself to the ground.

Or guest behavior in the parks. There’s always the type of person that moves out of the way when another guest is walking directly towards them, while the other guest never moves and would walk right through you if you didn’t move. Or the preshow people that start off at the end of the line and claw their way to the front during preshow. None of these things are legally wrong, they just make you a bad person and if everyone did it, this world would suck. These are likely all the same type of people- walkers, hard to get spec renters, line sneakers, right of way ignores, etc. Sorry if it ruffles feathers, that’s the truth.

These types of judgements are not helpful. Thread closed.