Couple Arrested for Refusing to Pay Tip

[LuvCuteBoys]

I don't think it should matter if they were jerks though. They were arrested for theft over not paying a tip. I deal with obnoxious customers on a regular basis. That doesn't mean I have them arrested.

 

[disykat]

It just doesn't make sense that the restaurant would call the cops on the tip if they had already offered to comp the meal.

Exactly. Their story doesn't make sense. The side with the huge hole in their story is the side who is not going to be believed.

 

[quentina]

When you go in usually on the menu it will usually say groups of 6 or more 15% w ill be add to your bill. I think when you read that and still stay there then you agree to the terms of the resturant

If you are allowed to increase for good service, why can't you decrease for poor service?

 

[JOCAmom]

It just doesn't make sense that the restaurant would call the cops on the tip if they had already offered to comp the meal.

Like disneyfav4ever, I've heard a lot about this today. How much is true, I don't know. I've heard that they were not offered to have their whole meal comped but just the part that took so long. I know that differs from what the article says but it's only what I've heard. When that offer wasn't good enough is when they refused to pay the tip. I still don't know why the cops were involved.

Now what I don't understand is if this was a party of 8, why were only 2 arrested?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

We aren't the only ones who feel this way:

restaurant reviews

Some of those are funny.




My Friendly's update:

28ish tables in the place, no real wait, but tables remained filled for most of the time though, so the 3 servers were busy.

Service was pretty good for our server having to serve roughly 9 tables at a time. He was kind, considerate, and jovial.

When he brought our silverware--the napkin (for some odd reason) had a tiny bit of ketchup on it and I politely asked if we could have another. No biggy. After he took our order, as he passed one of his other tables and checked in with the customers to let them know he'd be with them in a minute.

Dinner was nice--he checked on us a couple of times. I will say I was being extra-attentive for purposes of reporting back here.

He got our 15%+ tip which is tipped on the taxed total rounded up to the next dollar. Not too shabby for serving us for 45 minutes or so (forgot to note my arrival time).

I had my gatorade with me since I can't drink soda yet and can't tolerate plain water. He came back later and offered bottled water in case it was just a tap water thing. I thought that was sweet and then explained my situation as I didn't want to come across as snooty or anything.

Interesting that there was no need for him to blame how busy it was--b/c he was attentive to serving the customers despite the number of tables he was serving.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I think you misunderstood. LLP ( I think ) means that it is illegal to base a suggested tip from the restaurant's end on the inclusion of taxes.

Yes--that is what I meant.


FWIW--I usually tip on the taxed total b/c it is the lowest on the receipt (too lazy to find the subtotal) and it gives the server a little bonus as well.

 

[scuba]

was this at said pub or just a general review of your night?...either way i'm glad you had a good time

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

That's why I was kind of thinking that there must have been some sort of melee that ensued that wasn't reported in the article but they weren't arrested for breach of peace or disorderly conduct or something like that, only the theft. I truly feel that the restaurant made a BIG mistake calling the police over this...

I'm not saying there wasn't--however (and I will read the article again), it seems the restaurant claims they called the cops b/c the gratuity was not paid.

It would seem that if there was a disturbance or altercation, it would have been in the restaurant's interest to make that known. Public opinion would be different and griping on the guy for taking it to that level.

It would seem to me too important of a fact to omit.

 

[Mickey's Minion]

Here is another version of the story from a local Lehigh website.

Here it states that there were two issues the patrons were objecting to.

As noticed by the eagle minds here, the $16.00 was more than 18% of the bill. This apparently was one of the disputes that the "gratuity" added to the bill was actually 23% and not the stated 18%. 18% would have been the $13.00 and change.

Also, allegedly the server was outside smoking when the patrons had to go retrieve their silverware.

No tip leads to trip in police cruiser for pair of local college students
By Express-Times staff
November 17, 2009, 12:32AM

Moravian College senior Leslie Pope and John Wagner, a Lehigh University graduate student, were handcuffed and transported from the Lehigh Pub to Bethlehem police headquarters Oct. 23 after failing to pay a mandatory 18 percent gratuity.

Buffalo WingsAP File PhotoBuffalo wingsPope and Wagner, members of a party of eight during happy hour, refused to pay a $16.35 service charge on top of their $73.87 tab because of what they say was shoddy service as well as a surcharge that was nearly 5 percent higher than the 18 percent listed on the menu.

“Gratuity is thanking you for your service,” Pope, 22, said. “You can’t give us terrible, terrible service and expect a tip.”

The group reportedly had to wait more than an hour for salad and wings and had to approach the bar themselves for drink refills and find their own napkins and silverware as their waitress smoked outside.

The general manager of the Lehigh Pub, at 4 S. New St., declined to comment.

Pope and Wagner, 24, have pleaded not guilty and await a summary trial before District Judge Nancy Matos Gonzalez.

“It is minorly ridiculous,” Pope, a native of Pottsville, Pa., said.

What do you think? Were Pope and Wagner correct in refusing to pay the required gratuity? Feel free to leave a comment below and take the time to participate in the online poll question.

http://www.lehighvalleylive.com/today/index.ssf/2009/11/no_tip_leads_to_a_police_cruis.html

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Exactly! That is why I treat the retail worker, the teacher, etc. etc. with the same respect that I would like to receive at my job. That is why I am patient and polite, not rude and demanding. If more people would try to understand what it's like to be in someone else's shoes, there would be a lot less frustration in all jobs.

So if they feel that you do not give them the proper gratitude, then you should be arrested, right?

None of us are saying that all servers should not get tipped.

What we are saying is that as a customer, we have the right to use our discretion to tip based on the service received.

I only tried stiffing a server TWICE in my entire life.

One essentially called me a pig. IF he got anything, it was pennies.

The other was a flighty new server who neglected our table long after we got assistance from another server and a manager who served us. When they realized which server had our table--she was spoken to and then flighty server came and filled one drink and apologized. To me--that was just too little too late. I am not responsible for her flightiness.

Sure she was knew and got frazzled with a larger group that she was dealing with. But again, not my problem. She never once spoke to anybody about it (i.e. perhaps bringing in a manager to help her with what was supposedly a difficult group.) The restaurant wasn't that busy and the kitchen was not slow. This was ALL her!

I gave her tip to the waitress who did assist us, but my husband left a little something b/c he felt bad for her. I completely disagreed with that. This was her own doing and her own issue and noone elses. She didn't get much though, I will tell you that.

It seems that servers may want to walk in the shoes of a customer--your average customer. Not the persnickety jerk or the cheapskate customer. Just your average customer who expects baseline service.

All these excuses--if parents made them for their kids, the kid would be called a snowflake.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I would try the restaurant, even after reading the article that is the topic of this conversation.

I would want to find out for myself.

And this is exactly what we did when DH and I were at Mackinaw City for our anniversary. We really wanted to eat at the Dixie Saloon, but most of the reviews on Trip Advisor were poor. So did we really want to risk it? We said yes, let's see for ourselves. I'm glad we did. We had a very sweet server, attentive and helpful. The food was great, no complains whatsoever.

If we would have listened to all the bad complaints we would have missed out on a very nice anniversary dinner.

This goes beyond your standard complaint.

What folks are talking about is boycotting it.

I can look past bad service.

I can't look past an idiot manager calling the cops b/c they think their customer broke a law by not paying an automatic gratuity.

It's called protest.

I've given restaurants that have had bad reviews a shot. That's different. But I'm not going to risk arrest in case I might not have a pleasant serving experience and wish to express my dismay via a discounted or eliminated gratuity.

 

[scuba]

Here is another version of the story from the local Lehigh paper.

Here it states that there were two issues the patrons were objecting to.

As noticed by the eagle minds here, the $16.00 was more than 18% of the bill. This apparently was one of the disputes that the "gratuity" added to the bill was actually 23% and not the stated 18%. 18% would have been the $13.00 and change.

Also, allegedly the server was outside smoking when the patrons had to go retrieve their silverware.

Ok that story makes me embarassed that I even chimed in with my opinion. We should be mad at the media for even reporting the incident....Good Day sirs

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

was this at said pub or just a general review of your night?...either way i'm glad you had a good time

No--it was Friendly's

Not a 5 star restuarnat by any means, but hubby had called while I was on the thread to meet him there, so I had concluded a post to say that I'd report back on it.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Ok that story makes me embarassed that I even chimed in with my opinion. We should be mad at the media for even reporting the incident....Good Day sirs

Mad at the media for doing their job--

But not mad at the restaurant for #1 calling the cops and #2 the server not doing hers?


Color me confused.

 

[merryweather20]

My expectations aren't high either, If she is basing her poor service on having to get her silverware and napkins as well as having to ask fro a refill from the bar, or was she just sitting there expecting to have someone check back with her. I would have asked for a refill, got my own napkin, asked where my food was.....I just have the impression the group was just sitting there not being an advocate for themselves. I know that my not be the patrons responsibility but certainly the alternative of being in handcuff wouldn't be my second choice either

I actually snorted Pepsi through my nose at this! You think they were just sitting at the table going "if she doesn't guess what our table needs I'm going to be so mad!". No, the server disappeared completely. Either she wasn't around at all, or she disappeared after they reminded her of the silverware, or the drink.

 

[punkin]

Do cops really have nothing better to do? How is this theft by any definition? Sounds like the genius who tasered a 10 yo girl.

I have a feeling the kids who didn't pay are going to be suing the Restaurant and the Police Dept for false imprisonment.

 

[scuba]

Mad at the media for doing their job--

But not mad at the restaurant for #1 calling the cops and #2 the server not doing hers?


Color me confused.

Mad at the media for thinking I need to know about the incident. Hardly news worthy except for maybe in this town.

Mad because the owner called the police and/or just didn't let the patrons walk

Mad that the "adults" couldn't work it out as adults

Mad that the patrons didn't take the comps that were offered

Mad that the police even responded and then handcuffed folks and actually pressed charges resulting in more tax payer burden

Mad that the server didn't do her job and that she smokes thus one day getting emphysema and increasing our already taxed out healthcare system

Mad that i'm still reading this thread

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I actually snorted Pepsi through my nose at this! You think they were just sitting at the table going "if she doesn't guess what our table needs I'm going to be so mad!". No, the server disappeared completely. Either she wasn't around at all, or she disappeared after they reminded her of the silverware, or the drink.

You mean....we aren't supposed to do that??


Maybe if they put a buzzer on the table like they do on airplanes--then the servers can just sit aside until we call them. But then dinner may be limited to a small bag of honey roasted peanuts and a small cup filled with glaciers and a few drops of soda.

 

[CathrynRose]

Can I tell you a story?

I served and bartended for many years. One time I had a 12 top - and we also clearly had stated on the menu "18% gratuity added to tables of 8 or more"

I served - very efficiently - a table of 12. When everyone was done, and it was check time, my manager had a custom of doing a drive by. Going out to the table and asking "How was everything? How was the service tonight?" things like that. I passed (of course ) with flying colors. "She was great, it was great, blah blah blah"

They then asked for the check to be split. Everyone wanted their own check. That's fine. But 18% was still getting tacked on to each check.

Long story short - the fit they threw was ridiculous. "We had separate checks!!!" they exclaimed. My manager went back to them "But I thought you said the service was great, everything was great?" It was, but they didn't want to have to tip.

That was what they said. They didn't want to have to tip. I don't want to tip out my busser, my bar and my host - but I have to. Why should I literally pay to have you sit and hog my 2 big tables all night? Because by not tipping me, that is exactly what you're doing.

My manager paid my tip. My manager had to give me his own money, because they didn't want to have to tip.

Do I think they should be arrested? I dont know. I do know that the tip is added to the bill - so in the laws eye's, the patron is not paying their bill. Why can't they be arrested?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Mad that i'm still reading this thread

Can I get you anything else to go with that?

Glass of wine, shot of tequila?

Chips and salsa?


(just teasing )