Comcast is going to cream Disney

[ahoyle]

Its taking everything within me to not properly reply to this post.......everything

Why? What in that was inflammatory?

 

[lockedoutlogic]

It sounds great, and I hope it pushes disney to do more, but...

When USO creates an attraction where you need to buy the upgrade on the ticket to ride it, and puts sales at each end of the ride, it is "financially brilliant". When disney does it, they are money grubbing suits who care about nothing but the stock price.

When USO builds an attraction which is "buggy" and having trouble getting up and running, it is "reportedly impressive". Disney would have been torn apart for having a their new ride (or magic bands) delayed for opening because of some glitches.

If you want to play in the big leagues......

Granted...

But the truth is a little more in the middle between "haters" and "Koolaid drinkers"

Comcast has been spending my money from my bloated cable bills on things I can go do at USO...

Did they need to, have a bigger hill to climb? Absolutely...

But still

And Disney's ire from me comes at their cruise control mentality.

I have vacation club and love the new options...but that just isn't enough in their price structure.

Just not.

Remember in 2003 when they announced Everest?
Eisner was under siege from roy o at the time...but he made the comment that they were "working" on Animal kingdom...

A half broken ride, that nemo thing on sticks and 15 years of construction silence until avatar opens...

Tell me that's cutting it? After they cut the budget and time and shorted the park before it opened...

That's what my $46 1998 ticket to animal kingdom translates into a $95 ticket today?

I'm harsh...but well researched and fair if you get below the sauce.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I can't see how this isn't anything but GOOD news for us Disney folks.

HP is amazing. The new expansion looks to be about a hundred times better. That's AWESOME. It really is something special.

Now, think about how jealous this is making Disney imagineers. And then think about Star Wars.

I cannot WAIT. Gonna be an awesome few years, I hope.

You have faith that the engineers have any say over the accountants...

As long as the CEO is more cheapsuit/banker than creative/mechanical...you're gonna lose that battle


And remember...Michael Eisner came in working to make TV and movies...he only became an accountant later.

Iger is a TV boardroom guy...from the agency of Dewey Cheatum and Howell

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I don't think Universal will ever be a real competitor to the Magic Kingdom and Epcot. I do believe at some point that Universal and IOA could be a competitor to DHS and AK..

With that being said, with the ticket prices the way they are at Disney, once you've done MK and Epcot, they make it very hard to justify going to IOA or Universal instead of AK and DHS.

Yes Universal has been around for awhile now, but the Disney theme parks have been around for a much longer period. More people have grown up going to to Disney Parks than they have Universal. Many of us go back to Disney parks because of the memories that we had as a child. We want to experience that with our own children.

Do I see in my future a trip to Disney and then going to Universal for a few days? Yes I do.

But do i see a trip to FL to just go to Universal and not Disney? No.

I do see a trip to Disney without Universal.

All that being said, they are making some serious gains.

As a big Disney fan, I'm pretty upset with Disney that they've allowed Universal to "wow" us the way they have. What I see in Universal is what I used to see in Disney. We went to WDW in May, I can say that I was not personally "wowed" by FLE.

Total
Agreement

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Why? What in that was inflammatory?

Yes how so?

I thing ahoyle's take is pretty accurate and close to center of the road...

Most of the Disney defenders/universal detractors start their arguments built on the foundation of "disney has always been/ done it the best..."

Ok...that's fairly accurate...but if you want to have a semi objective opinion based on the last 10 years or so...you have to strip that away and judge what has been done in that period...

General joe did a fantastic job building the utilidors and dredging the lagoons in the late 60's...
But that's about as relevant as the jets Super Bowl at this point...

Disney has built meh new "attractions" and concentrated on shops and timeshare and universal had taken the lead on attraction construction and new hotels...
That isn't really much of a debate in that context...

Honestly...all there things should be judged in terms if what's include in the price...
And Disney has not added much to the ticket value or put a competitive entry into the rooms categories in that time...

I'm trying to be as objective as possible...it is tough.

 

[dwight16]

So 100% disney biased disclaimer. Disney has what like 15 hotels across 3 prices points and universal has what 3 or 4???? I mean of course they can expand that. I am a dvc member also but bought a resale in 2009 when the world was ending and paid about 45 cents on the dollar at the time so I don't feel ripped off but anyone who buys full price I can see that and understand. BUT and this is a big but I go every year and all and all for a week for my family of 3 it's about 3000 dollars plus maintenance fees of around 700 a year plus air fair. So right now I am ok with going every year for a week. Have a new ride to check out next time and then avatar land all cool but not good enough. I need and want to see some major work planned over the next 2 years in order to keep this yearly commitment going. Major work inside of HWS ie starwars land or something also in Epcot that update to test track was cool but it's just a fresh coat of paint same ride. Cars land and the 2 new boats and china really really diverted a ton of cash away from Florida. I have a feeling it's going to start to pick up or maybe just a hope. I want to see a 2016,2017,2018 plan and see it soon.

 

[Princess_Nikki]

I would be ok with Universal being a healthy competitor to Disney. I wouldn't mind the crowd level at WDW to decrease a bit.

 

[JoeA]

I heard Disney just decided to close all their Orlando parks! Games over, evidently.

 

[rteetz]

So 100% disney biased disclaimer. Disney has what like 15 hotels across 3 prices points and universal has what 3 or 4???? I mean of course they can expand that. I am a dvc member also but bought a resale in 2009 when the world was ending and paid about 45 cents on the dollar at the time so I don't feel ripped off but anyone who buys full price I can see that and understand. BUT and this is a big but I go every year and all and all for a week for my family of 3 it's about 3000 dollars plus maintenance fees of around 700 a year plus air fair. So right now I am ok with going every year for a week. Have a new ride to check out next time and then avatar land all cool but not good enough. I need and want to see some major work planned over the next 2 years in order to keep this yearly commitment going. Major work inside of HWS ie starwars land or something also in Epcot that update to test track was cool but it's just a fresh coat of paint same ride. Cars land and the 2 new boats and china really really diverted a ton of cash away from Florida. I have a feeling it's going to start to pick up or maybe just a hope. I want to see a 2016,2017,2018 plan and see it soon.

Disney has over 20 hotels, universal just opened number 4 and now has filed permits a possible 5,6, and 7.

Disney is as you know focused elsewhere, they are okay with what is going on in WDW. If it hasn't been announced by now or shovels are moving I don't see anything else other than what we know opening by 2018.
2016- disney springs, and rivers of light
2017- avatar
2018- nothing as of now
If and when Star Wars happens I would expect it to be around 2020
Frozen also still seems likely for maelstrom that would open in 2016.
Shanghai opens in 2015
Iron man in Hong Kong 2016
Disneyland diamond anniversary 2015
Ratatouille in Paris opens tomorrow
The hub is getting redone at MK 2015 sometime
Other than that I have rumored stuff but nothing confirmed.
Universal just opened DA, WWoHP in Tokyo opens next week, kong is under construing, permits and construction for more hotels or hotel expansion, WWoHP in universal Hollywood 2016, potter phase 3 in Orlando? Universal still has a lot up their sleeves

Disney is on cruise control, universal is on their catch up game

 

[Josh Hendy]

So 100% disney biased disclaimer. Disney has what like 15 hotels across 3 prices points and universal has what 3 or 4???? I mean of course they can expand that. I am a dvc member also but bought a resale in 2009 when the world was ending and paid about 45 cents on the dollar at the time so I don't feel ripped off but anyone who buys full price I can see that and understand. BUT and this is a big but I go every year and all and all for a week for my family of 3 it's about 3000 dollars plus maintenance fees of around 700 a year plus air fair. So right now I am ok with going every year for a week. Have a new ride to check out next time and then avatar land all cool but not good enough. I need and want to see some major work planned over the next 2 years in order to keep this yearly commitment going. Major work inside of HWS ie starwars land or something also in Epcot that update to test track was cool but it's just a fresh coat of paint same ride. Cars land and the 2 new boats and china really really diverted a ton of cash away from Florida. I have a feeling it's going to start to pick up or maybe just a hope. I want to see a 2016,2017,2018 plan and see it soon.

Wondering about something ... if DVC is a timeshare and you use 1 room for 1 week per year, and you pay $700/year for maintenance, does that mean that Disney collects around (52 weeks x $700 =) $36,400/year for every DVC room from the owners for "maintenance" ??? Making a total of (if my numbers are correct) over $167 million per year for the 4600 or so DVC rooms for providing the occasional paint job and faucet repairs? On top of the per-use fees and the original purchase price. Sounds like a humungous profit margin. If so, I think I know why Disney is lagging somewhat at building exciting new rides, and why Universal wants to play "catch up".

 

[Silock]

You have faith that the engineers have any say over the accountants...

As long as the CEO is more cheapsuit/banker than creative/mechanical...you're gonna lose that battle


And remember...Michael Eisner came in working to make TV and movies...he only became an accountant later.

Iger is a TV boardroom guy...from the agency of Dewey Cheatum and Howell

Iger is also on his way out.

 

[dwight16]

Wondering about something ... if DVC is a timeshare and you use 1 room for 1 week per year, and you pay $700/year for maintenance, does that mean that Disney collects around (52 weeks x $700 =) $36,400/year for every DVC room from the owners for "maintenance" ??? Making a total of (if my numbers are correct) over $167 million per year for the 4600 or so DVC rooms for providing the occasional paint job and faucet repairs? On top of the per-use fees and the original purchase price. Sounds like a humungous profit margin. If so, I think I know why Disney is lagging somewhat at building exciting new rides, and why Universal wants to play "catch up".

Yes and no that is for 200ish points that is almost 12 days at a studio but only like 5 days in a 2 bed room. So your not totally out of the park. It's also paying for magical express and updates and a lot we get a budget every year and there is a generous fee involved but it's not all profit.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Wondering about something ... if DVC is a timeshare and you use 1 room for 1 week per year, and you pay $700/year for maintenance, does that mean that Disney collects around (52 weeks x $700 =) $36,400/year for every DVC room from the owners for "maintenance" ??? Making a total of (if my numbers are correct) over $167 million per year for the 4600 or so DVC rooms for providing the occasional paint job and faucet repairs? On top of the per-use fees and the original purchase price. Sounds like a humungous profit margin. If so, I think I know why Disney is lagging somewhat at building exciting new rides, and why Universal wants to play "catch up".

It's not "a week"

That's an old timeshare and why most of us chose to buy disney instead of one of those...

Disney is a point system...and the fees are per point...and the amount you purchase depends on what you get out of it.

If i book a "studio"...basically a normal room with a fridge and a microwave...you can get several weeks out of a normal size contact. If you want a two bedroom with full facilities - much less because the point cost is higher.

You're also not locked into week block...you can go shorter/longer as needed.

It's also seasonal...you pay double for Christmas (hell week) than You do in may (best month of the year)

But to answer your maintenance question...

I "own" 2.7% of unit 27a at Saratoga...

Which yes...means they can sell the same room and collect the same maintenance fees roughly 40x over...

DVC has been 25 years of hard work for them...and it took 15 to really turn the corner.
But it's a monster program..

And for the "owner"...it means we're not subject to Disney prices tinkering for rooms...which have 100% adhered to a curve straight up on a 45 degree angle since 1970.

The frustration...growing for types like me...is that I agree to pour my money down their drain longterm to make sure it's successful...under the premise that they can maintain the complex as top notch in a future of guaranteed higher costs and increased competition...

But I think they are abusing that business relationship/trust.
Disney parks were founded and have always preached reinvention...they are stagnating Orlando on purpose to funnel profits/income to other places and doggie doo stocks...

That's my DVC stance in a nutshell...still a great deal for me...but they're pushing it.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Iger is also on his way out.

And if the next contestant is "Tom Staggs"...because disney has absolutely lost the ability to recruit anyone of value (since Steve jobs is gone and they are fresh out of companies of his to buy)...
Then we are in deep trouble.

 

[Reddog1134]

Making a total of (if my numbers are correct) over $167 million per year for the 4600 or so DVC rooms for providing the occasional paint job and faucet repairs?

The fees also cover the operating expenses. Not just repairs and refurbs.

 

[carmelhp]

There was an interview with a Universal executive in Entertainment Weekly something late last year. He said Universal's strategy in Florida is to increase the overall Orlando vacation market and to take it's bigger cut of a bigger market. It's a "rising tide lifts all boats" type of approach. They don't see themselves as taking TDO on head-on, just in the process of improving themselves. I can't find fault with that. By the way, Comast is no lightweight, it has a lower market cap than Disney at $130B vs. $143B, but it has $65B in revenue vs. Disney's $46B and $158B in assets vs. Disney's $83B.

 

[dwight16]

So the new Harry potter ride is been down all morning and they have left people inline since 7am. Looks like a real well run operation.

 

[rteetz]

So the new Harry potter ride is been down all morning and they have left people inline since 7am. Looks like a real well run operation.

The ride has had many glitches, and so do a lot of rides when they open. Mine train had glitches as well. They haven't run the ride anywhere near full capacity yet. For example I was at Six Flags great america the second full day of operation for Goliath the new wooden coaster. We were in a large group ten people from out group went there at about 10:30 am line said 120 minutes wait after multiple breakdowns they got on at about 3:30. it happens at all new rides it takes months to get to full capacity at some attractions.

 

[FlipHipster]

There was an interview with a Universal executive in Entertainment Weekly something late last year. He said Universal's strategy in Florida is to increase the overall Orlando vacation market and to take it's bigger cut of a bigger market. It's a "rising tide lifts all boats" type of approach. They don't see themselves as taking TDO on head-on, just in the process of improving themselves. I can't find fault with that. By the way, Comast is no lightweight, it has a lower market cap than Disney at $130B vs. $143B, but it has $65B in revenue vs. Disney's $46B and $158B in assets vs. Disney's $83B.

I agree. The parks feed off each other. US has everything to gain by pushing Disney to expand. WDW expansion won't shut down US it will just bring more people to Orlando.

I never get the Star Wars argument either. I like Star Wars, would love to see a land if they don't pull another NFL. However I can totally see why Disney is in no hurry to build SW land. They will spend a ton of money on it, spend 10 years developing it and in the end it will end up attracting millions of sci-fy fans to Orlando. Disney will build 2 rides a restaurant and a Yoda M&G. That will turn DHS into a legitimate full day park. So then what are all those sci-fy fans going to do next?
7DMT, Splash, VOTLM?
OR
Spiderman, Hulk, Transformers, MIB, wizards, fire breathing dragons?

Don't really care who is beating who at the attendance game, but it seems like US is doing a good job at positioning themselves to catch a good portion of the park going public. Seems like to me Disney would be wiser to do a Pixar expansion in DHS that would appeal to the people they already cater to vs. attracting a bunch of people that are more likely to get siphoned off.

 

[Figmentforever24]

Disney has over 20 hotels, universal just opened number 4 and now has filed permits a possible 5,6, and 7.

Disney is as you know focused elsewhere, they are okay with what is going on in WDW. If it hasn't been announced by now or shovels are moving I don't see anything else other than what we know opening by 2018.
2016- disney springs, and rivers of light
2017- avatar
2018- nothing as of now
If and when Star Wars happens I would expect it to be around 2020
Frozen also still seems likely for maelstrom that would open in 2016.
Shanghai opens in 2015
Iron man in Hong Kong 2016
Disneyland diamond anniversary 2015
Ratatouille in Paris opens tomorrow
The hub is getting redone at MK 2015 sometime
Other than that I have rumored stuff but nothing confirmed.
Universal just opened DA, WWoHP in Tokyo opens next week, kong is under construing, permits and construction for more hotels or hotel expansion, WWoHP in universal Hollywood 2016, potter phase 3 in Orlando? Universal still has a lot up their sleeves

Disney is on cruise control, universal is on their catch up game

Exactly that.....catch up.....they aren't on the same playing field. It takes more then one ground breaking land to make you the best. And since universal has seen their share of misses to go along with those wins the last few years. (Transformers, Rip Ride Rocket,) They still have plenty of work to do.