Can you combine points?

[disneytraveler96]

I'm an old time Disney fan, GoH '87, and as a bargain seeker I've always taken advantage of the annual passholder resort discounts, instead of considering the DVC, until recently. I've been reading tons of info about the DVC for the past week or so and I may become a member within a year or so.

Anyway, I think I may want to rent a timeshare first. I have a question about renting points for this purpose. If I as a non-member need to rent 200 points, can I get say 120 points from one seller and the other 80 points from another? Or do all need to be from the same seller?

Also, I've noticed that points somehow expire. Can someone tell me when they expire? How long do you have to use/rent/give away your points before they dissapear from your bank?

One other thing, if I become a member and another member gives me some points (as a gift, for example), when will those points expire?

Thanks for your help.

 

[PamOKW]

A non-member really has no use for points. You need to have a member make a reservation and then sell it to you. Common practice has been to base the price on the number of points that they must use to make the reservation. So, you could have more than one person make your reservation for different full nights. I'm not sure whether these could be "linked" so you might have to physically change rooms when you switch reservations. You would also have to check-out and check-in again.

Points are good for 12 months. We don't all get them in January. They are staggered throughout the year -- that's the term Use Year. If your Use Year is Apri, the points are good for trips from April 1-March 31 of the following year. You can "bank" points forward one year. They must be used by the end of that year or they are lost. You can also "borrow" points from the future and these must then be used by the end of that year and cannot be banked. At any one time, you could have use of 3 years worth of points.

 

[disneytraveler96]

So basically what you're saying is if my use year is January I can use those points without having banking them between January 1st year 1 until December 31st year 1. If I chose to bank them, I can save those points for use between January 1st year 2 until December 31st year 2. But if I don't tell them that I want to bank them, then I'd lose them after Dec. 31st year 1. Is this correct? Is there a specific deadline during year 1 for me to tell them that I wish to bank the points? Or can I chose to bank them on the same day they would normally expire (Dec 31st year 1)?

Thanks.

 

[Cruelladeville]

You are basically correct, except that there are no January use years, they begin in February. January is when we all pay our dues, unless we are on a monthly withdrawl. When I get my points on February 1 for 2004, I have a year to use the points, unless I bank them. If I don't use any of the points, I have until August 15 to bank them all for the next use year. I can bank less than the full amount after that date. Usually, you know whether or not you are going to use your points, and bank them immediately. And, yes, you are responsible as an adult for banking your points, no one does it for you unless your mom works for MS (mine doesn't, unfortuneately).

 

[disneytraveler96]

So you must decide whether you will use your points or not during that year in the first 6 months? This is a very noticeable downside for me. I usually plan Disney vacations only 4-8 weeks in advance. I'm young, with no family of my own and I'm very busy with my own company. Therefore I don't plan months ahead of time based on the childrens' out of school time or my corporate-allocated vacation weeks. For me it's more a spur of the moment kind of thing, which very rarely happens more than 8 weeks in advance. Since my travel dates can be so flexible, I usually plan around small things that may arise just weeks or days before the scheduled vacation such as meetings, visiting relatives, even around "hot dates". Heck, I even delayed my vacation an extra week because I got a date with a girl I had been wanting to go out with for months (which worked positively for me, because after we went out she ended up coming to the trip with me, but I had to delay it another 2 weeks to fit her schedule). When you have a wide array of resorts to choose from, all this changing and modifying isn't a problem. I normally go to Moderates, but if they are unavailable, I go to the least expensive deluxes, or sometimes can even settle for AS. Settling for a resort other than my first choice isn't much of a problem for me (as long as it's onsite) because other than sleeping, I rarely spend more than 15 minutes a day at the resort. I've been dozens of time to WDW, always staying onsite, and only very few times I've gone to a resort pool or enjoyed any of the other resort amenities.

OK, I've gotten carried away explaining my reasons not to buy into DVC. But here comes my next question, what are the reservation modification policies? What about cancellation? Do they give you back your points? Can you make two or more "tentative" reservations? Many times if I'm uncertain of my travel times, and I'll be going in a busy time, what I do is make 2 or 3 reservations of my tentative dates, and then cancel the ones I won't use. Can you do something similar with DVC?

Also, what can you do (other than renting them) if the deadline to "bank" the points have passed and you then realize that you can't go? Isn't there a way you can move them forward? What if you've banked your points forward, and later realize that you will be able to go, can you bring them back to the present year?

How hard/easy is it to get reservations? I mean if I try to make a reservation 6-8 weeks in advance for non peak times, will I usually get the room I want with no problems? Is getting a room with only 1 or 2 weeks notice something highly unusual or can it be done consistently (to the point of being able to count on it)?

Is there anywhere online where I can read ALL the rules and regulations (ie. the OFFICIAL rulebook, if you will).

PS: I've realized that many of my comments/questions here are out of the original subject, so I may repost part of this message in a separate thread.

 

[tjkraz]

I'll just issue a blanket reply to your questions and say that you are probably not an ideal candidate for DVC ownership. Availablility can be quite limited on short notice. DVC owners are currently permitted to book 11 months in advance at their home resort, and 7 months in advance at non-home resorts. I suspect that most DVC owners are long-term planners, many of whom make their reservations 11 or 7 months to the day of their stay.

You COULD have multiple reservations at once, but you need to have the points available to make them. In other words, if you want to make 2 ressies for 50 points each, you need to have at least 100 points available when you call.

In order to have enough points to hold 2-3 ressies at a time (1 or 2 of which would later be cancelled), you would have to buy more points than you would actually use. So you would either end up with a banking/borrowing nightmare, or end up losing points you cannot use.

You questioned "non-peak" times and the ability to make reservations. Well, many of the typical WDW non-peak times are PEAK times for DVC. A period like December 1-15 has the lowest point costs of the year, and the DVC resorts are guaranteed to be booked solid weeks (if not months) in advance. Low points often equates to high popularity with DVC members.

I am also worried about your comment regarding your low use of other hotel rooms. Under DVC, you're making an investment that will often pay for itself in anywhere from 5-12 years (depending upon your own analysis) when compared to the "Rack Rates" at the given DVC and WDW Deluxe resorts. But if you compare DVC pricing to Value or even Moderate resorts, you will probably never come out ahead. If you are content with those types of accommodations, you will be wasting money buying into DVC.

If you want to find out ALL of the rules, I'd suggest just calling DVC and speak to a Guide. From my experiences, they use a VERY low pressure sales approach. My Guide never tried to talk me into more points than I wanted. He never called me unsolicited to prod me along, but he did return every call I placed and answered every question I had.

DVC will send you all of their marketing materials including a 15-20 minute video that summarizes the program. If you look everything over and eventually tell them "it won't work for me because...", I doubt you will ever hear from DVC again.

 

[disneytraveler96]

Thanks for your input.

Until now, I've stayed at the Moderates, and sometimes at the least expensive Deluxes. But I've always (except once in 2000) used the annual passholder discount, which can be up to 45% off rack rates, with an average of 40% off rack rates. So when comparing the DVC vs. the Moderates at Value season, I don't compare it to the rack rate of $133, I compare it to the annual passholder rate of $79. If I stay a week at this discounted rate, I would save enough to buy a microwave, a coffee maker and a refrigerator and bring it to the room, virtually converting it into a DVC studio!

Anyway, my point wasn't that I was content with lesser accomodations, because I'm not. But I am happier staying at an Moderate resort while being able to make a reservation with only 2 weeks notice for a long weekend (with a friend, sibling, relative, girlfriend, or whatever), than staying at a better place, but having to decide 6 months in advance whether I'll be going during the following six months to WDW or not, and if so, which EXACT dates I'll be going.

In that sense, the DVC is not for me.

HOWEVER, I've been throwing numbers around, and I have realized that investment wise, it would still be a good idea to get into DVC. Why? First of all, if my calculations are right, if the dates I want aren't available through DVC, I can rent my points for that year, and with the proceeds pay the maintenance fees, and have enough to cover the cost of the same amount of nights on a Moderate resort (at the annual passholder discount rate). Secondly, even though right now I'm young (24 yrs) and have a varying lifestyle, chances are that will change before I know it, as eventually, I'll have a wife, 3 kids, 2 dogs, a van, a life-term insurance plan and a bad back. Therefore I'll have less "spur of the moment" trips, and more "6-months ahead planned" trips.

Which brings me to my next question: is it difficult to rent DVC points? It seems the "market price" is around $10 bucks per point. Is it safe to assume that I can find a buyer within 15-30 days if I needed to rent say 150 to 200 points?

Thanks for your help.

 

[tjkraz]

Originally posted by disneytraveler96

Which brings me to my next question: is it difficult to rent DVC points? It seems the "market price" is around $10 bucks per point. Is it safe to assume that I can find a buyer within 15-30 days if I needed to rent say 150 to 200 points?

Thanks for your help.

The point rental process typically goes something like this:

1. You post on the Rent/Trade board that you have points available, or respond to an ad from someone looking for points.

2. Discuss terms of the transaction. You will have to decide for yourself how much you want up front and when the balance is due. A written contract is wise, which spells out cancellation clauses and so forth.

3. You check on availability for the prospective renter. They may have their heart set on a specific room type / resort / dates. If that combination is not available, it may take some back-and-forth before an agreement is reached.

Then, if all is well, at some point of your choosing money changes hands and a reservation is made.

Is it difficult to rent points? No, but it can be time consuming. You probably won't find a single person willing to rent 200 points, so you may be juggling relationships with 3-4 people. You are bound to get a lot of replies from people who aren't really interested or people who back out somewhere in the process.

There is also a great deal of trust involved. If you ask for money in advance, how to you prove you are an honorable point renter?

Once a reservation has been made, all that your rentee receives is a DVC confirmation that a reservation has been made in their name. You still control the points and could (emphasize COULD) cancel at any time. How do you adequately convince someone that they don't need to worry about this happening?

Can you find a buyer in 15-30 days? Well, that depends on how you define those days. If you have a February Use Year and decide on January 1 that you won't use your points, can you get rid of them in the 30 days before 2/1? Probably not. Points need to be actually used for a stay by the end of the Use Year. The odds of you finding someone who needs points on less than 30 days notice, and then getting them a room at a DVC resort on that short notice are fairly improbable IMO.

But, if you're using the 15-30 day figure without any consideration toward Use Year, then yeah it is possible. You could probably find prospective renters on 2-3 days notice. But it will take time and energy to keep moving those relationships forward.

 

[ear_poppin]

Whilst I did not pose the original question I would like to thank Tjkraz for the extremely detailed reply that helped me out greatly as I had similar questions.