BWV Standard view

[Sandisw]

Do you mean how would they start implementing it when there is a constant rolling window and existing reservations. I would make it apply to each reservation individually. Say it started tomorrow. Any reservation made today and before would be able to walk/modify as normal. Once that reservation is used/cancelled then any new reservation made afterward would have the new stop on it. As would any reservation made starting tomorrow. So there would be a small period of time with some grandfathered reservations but within a few months every reservation would be covered

As for how I would make it would work with the booking windows, the restriction would be added only to reservations that extend beyond the 11 month window. If you are booking the 11 month window+the next 6 days, 1 day short of the 11 month window+the next 7 days for an 8 day stay, etc. If the reservation includes dates beyond the 11 month window, the start date cannot be modified past a certain number of days (in my example 1 or 2 weeks) into the 11 month window based on the 11 month window on the day when the reservation was made.

So, it sounds like you want it to be any and all reservations booked can only extend to 14 days and not the current 30?

So, even if I book a trip well into the 11 month window, it can’t be modified or extended? Or, does it only start if the first day was grabbed at 11 months?

For example, I book a 7 day trip next year starting Sept 26th…that trip can only extend at max October 10th…because I booked at the 11 month window.

I can drop days, but not extend? So, international owners who do book longer stays would be stuck?

Now, what happens if I book a few days into the window, and lucky enough to get a few back days too, so the trip actually still starts the 26th but it didn’t get secured at 11 months exactly. I am now limited to the same 14 days?

To me, it’s too complicated and too hard to enforce that way. What they’d have to do is make a rule that any and all reservations can never be extended more than 14 days. Can’t said I’d like that.

 

[Tatebeck]

So, it sounds like you want it to be any and all reservations booked can only extend to 14 days and not the current 30?

So, even if I book a trip well into the 11 month window, it can’t be modified or extended? Or, does it only start if the first day was grabbed at 11 months?

For example, I book a 7 day trip next year starting Sept 26th…that trip can only extend at max October 10th…because I booked at the 11 month window.

I can drop days, but not extend? So, international owners who do book longer stays would be stuck?

Now, what happens if I book a few days into the window, and lucky enough to get a few back days too, so the trip actually still starts the 26th but it didn’t get secured at 11 months exactly. I am now limited to the same 14 days?

To me, it’s too complicated and too hard to enforce that way. What they’d have to do is make a rule that any and all reservations can never be extended more than 14 days. Can’t said I’d like that.

I believe you are still thinking it is more restrictive and complicated than my idea actually is. The only thing changing is how far ahead you can move the check-in date forward, everything else is the same.

You would still be able to extend any stay as normal up to the maximum of a 30 day stay. This would be modifying the check out date and would be unchanged. My example only applies when modifying the check-in or start date.

If you booked a trip today, starting Sep 26th 2025, you could extend to October 26th if you never change the check-in day (or 1 to 2 weeks later if you changed the check-in date to a later date, up to the limit)

If you booked any reservation today, with any number of days extending past the 11 month window, the latest check-in date you could modify that reservation to in the future would be the October 2nd or October 9th (depending if they chose 1 or 2 weeks for the modification restrictions)

You would have effectively secured any reservation up to 30 days long you wanted starting sometime between Sep 26th and either October 2nd or 9th if you booked today.

If you think of it like a bracket [check-in -----check-out] its changing how far forward you can move the first bracket. You can still move the front bracket backwards any amount and the second bracket forwards or backwards any way you need to

 

[Judique]

So, it sounds like you want it to be any and all reservations booked can only extend to 14 days and not the current 30?

So, even if I book a trip well into the 11 month window, it can’t be modified or extended? Or, does it only start if the first day was grabbed at 11 months?

For example, I book a 7 day trip next year starting Sept 26th…that trip can only extend at max October 10th…because I booked at the 11 month window.

I can drop days, but not extend? So, international owners who do book longer stays would be stuck?

Now, what happens if I book a few days into the window, and lucky enough to get a few back days too, so the trip actually still starts the 26th but it didn’t get secured at 11 months exactly. I am now limited to the same 14 days?

To me, it’s too complicated and too hard to enforce that way. What they’d have to do is make a rule that any and all reservations can never be extended more than 14 days. Can’t said I’d like that.

Thanks for saying that it's too complicated and too hard to enforce! Plus I don't think it would be contractual.

I'm directly impacted by bots and walkers for BWV standard view rooms. Neither of the solutions put forth work for me.

Fortunately for me I have another choice and that is to book boardwalk view or garden view and try to switch nights as they are released. That option is there for me as I have enough points to make it happen.

Another option might be using a lottery system for sought after dates such as first week of December. It's been done before. And it could conceivably eliminate some of the bot action.

 

[Tatebeck]

Thanks for saying that it's too complicated and too hard to enforce! Plus I don't think it would be contractual.

I'm directly impacted by bots and walkers for BWV standard view rooms. Neither of the solutions put forth work for me.

Fortunately for me I have another choice and that is to book boardwalk view or garden view and try to switch nights as they are released. That option is there for me as I have enough points to make it happen.

Another option might be using a lottery system for sought after dates such as first week of December. It's been done before. And it could conceivably eliminate some of the bot action.

Sound like you would be unaffected by the changes then, which means it would work for you. It's actually not that complicated, especially compared to everything else in DVC lol!

If any of the dates are booked past the 11 month window:

[check-in] ->	Days of Stay->	[check-out]
moves-> limited to 7 or 14 days forward from today's 11 month window when modifying past the 11 month window <-moves- no change, any available days	no change - max 30 days	no change (up to 30 days from check-in)

 

[Sandisw]

I believe you are still thinking it is more restrictive and complicated than my idea actually is. The only thing changing is how far ahead you can move the check-in date forward, everything else is the same.

You would still be able to extend any stay as normal up to the maximum of a 30 day stay. This would be modifying the check out date and would be unchanged. My example only applies when modifying the check-in or start date.

If you booked a trip today, starting Sep 26th 2025, you could extend to October 26th if you never change the check-in day (or 1 to 2 weeks later if you changed the check-in date to a later date, up to the limit)

If you booked any reservation today, with any number of days extending past the 11 month window, the latest check-in date you could modify that reservation to in the future would be the October 2nd or October 9th (depending if they chose 1 or 2 weeks for the modification restrictions)

You would have effectively secured any reservation up to 30 days long you wanted starting sometime between Sep 26th and either October 2nd or 9th if you booked today.

If you think of it like a bracket [check-in -----check-out] its changing how far forward you can move the first bracket. You can still move the front bracket backwards any amount and the second bracket forwards or backwards any way you need to

Okay, that makes a little more sense. Just not sure how they are going to put it in play in practice because it does mean it makes the average owners ability to modify harder.

Sometimes, the extra steps it would take to cancel and then book can lose you something well into the window.

For example, I just moved my trip two weeks ahead for January that was booked at 11 months…I easily modified and got a room that showed up while I was stalking…and that room was the only one cause it was gone when I checked after getting it.

Had I not been able to move my 11 month booking during the modify process I’d have to cancel first potentially leaving me with no room at all.

That’s why I am not a huge fan of stricter modification rules for the handful of situations like this when the easiest solution for DVC, which only impacts those who own at a resort with such hard to get rooms is to adjust the point charts so you completely lower demand.

No one is fighting for SV rooms to the same degree when it’s not saving them that many points.

And, of course, those owners who bought for the lower point rooms are impacted, but point chart adjusting was always part of the system so it’s something we have to deal with n

Plenty of people who bought for fall because of lower point charts are now spending a lot more because of recent shifts. It can and does happen.

 

[Tatebeck]

Okay, that makes a little more sense. Just not sure how they are going to put it in play in practice because it does mean it makes the average owners ability to modify harder.

Sometimes, the extra steps it would take to cancel and then book can lose you something well into the window.

For example, I just moved my trip two weeks ahead for January that was booked at 11 months…I easily modified and got a room that showed up while I was stalking…and that room was the only one cause it was gone when I checked after getting it.

Had I not been able to move my 11 month booking during the modify process I’d have to cancel first potentially leaving me with no room at all.

We're almost there. In your example you wouldn't be modifying dates into the 11 month window anymore. You would be modifying into a normal booking window so it would be allowed. The modification rules would only apply in the 11 month window (when both the initial booking and new dates included dates beyond the 11 month window)

When you made the reservation your were booking 11months+more into the booking window. But now you are modifying/booking only a few months out with rooms available within the 7 month window. Not walking your current reservation further beyond the 11 month window

 

[Sandisw]

To add, those high point owners who are grabbing and walking would simply continue to grab dates into that 2 week period to start a new reservation that gets them the walk again.

I book reservation one and know it’s going to get me up to two weeks out… I continue to check during those two weeks and grab and start again, continuing alternating but holding more than one room at a time.

Yes, more work and I might not be able to get a second walk started, but it is still doable.

As I said, I will never be a fan of making modifications stricter for the average owner who is not walking.

 

[Sandisw]

We're almost there. In your example you wouldn't be modifying dates into the 11 month window anymore. You would be modifying into a normal booking window so it would be allowed. The modification rules would only apply in the 11 month window (when both the initial booking and new dates included dates beyond the 11 month window)

But see, now we would be asking to have a system set up that has to evaluate each modification as to when it is happening and if we are or are not still within that 14 days?

So, if I book a trip Oct 1 to 8th, I can only move thst specific check in date to October 15th. When would I be able to change the start date of my Oct 1st trip forward beyond the 15rh?

That part I am not getting? If DVc is going to make a change because members want changes, they are going to look for the easiest way to do it and I would be surprised to see they come up with some new, more restrictive modification rules that apply only for this trip that was booked but not that one.

Change the point charts…that is the easiest thing to do to start.

 

[Judique]

I reserve the right to change my mind at any point in my booking process. My present contract allows me to do this. Your proposition restricts the freedoms I've had since I purchased 24 years ago. No thanks.

I would never agree or wish to go backwards for the sake of a few extra points ($'s).

 

[Tatebeck]

But see, now we would be asking to have a system set up that has to evaluate each modification as to when it is happening and if we are or are not still within that 14 days?

So, if I book a trip Oct 1 to 8th, I can only move thst specific check in date to October 15th. When would I be able to change the start date of my Oct 1st trip forward beyond the 15rh?

That part I am not getting?

The system is already tracking the 11 month window and starting date vs ending date, it knows which dates we can choose for a starting date and which we cant, and which ending dates we can choose and which we cant. It would probably be less work than changing point charts.

If you had a reservation from October 1st-8th booked at the 11 month window for October 1st (booked on November 1st) then you could modify the start date as normal up to the 15th (if the limit is 2 weeks).

If you wanted a start date of October 16th, you could grab a new reservation on November 16th (or any date until then and walk it forward a few days)

Or you could wait and modify the first reservation when none of the days are beyond the 11 month window. If you wanted 7 days still, that would be November 23rd

It is by design prioritizing getting new reservations around when you need them over modifying older reservations further beyond the 11 month window. The point is it makes walking reservations harder and more of a pain without changing anything about normal bookings.

 

[Tatebeck]

I reserve the right to change my mind at any point in my booking process. My present contract allows me to do this. Your proposition restricts the freedoms I've had since I purchased 24 years ago. No thanks.

I would never agree or wish to go backwards for the sake of a few extra points ($'s).

Of course you can always change your mind at any point. You can modify to any room available, cancel the reservation, etc. This would have no effect on bookings that do not involve walking

I believe the only thing guaranteed at your home resort via the home resort rules and regulations is to be able to book at least 1 month ahead of any non owners. They could change the 11 month window, how far past it you are allowed to book, etc at any time.

 

[Sandisw]

The system is already tracking the 11 month window and starting date vs ending date, it knows which dates we can choose for a starting date and which we cant, and which ending dates we can choose and which we cant. It would probably be less work than changing point charts.

If you had a reservation from October 1st-8th booked at the 11 month window for October 1st (booked on November 1st) then you could modify the start date as normal up to the 15th (if the limit is 2 weeks).

If you wanted a start date of October 16th, you could grab a new reservation on November 16th (or any date until then and walk it forward a few days)

Or you could wait and modify the first reservation when none of the days are beyond the 11 month window. If you wanted 7 days still, that would be November 23rd

It is by design prioritizing getting new reservations around when you need them over modifying older reservations further beyond the 11 month window. The point is it makes walking reservations harder and more of a pain without changing anything about normal bookings.

And you don’t think that is more complicated for the average owner to understand?

The system, when you modify is set up to see it as a new reservation…and the blockers are the 11 month plus 7 days. Very simple.

Now, booking right at 11 months might be easy to calculate. But what if an owner decides to book 5 days into the 11 month window

So, they book Oct 1 to the 8th on November 5th and not November first? They no longer get the 14 days? Or, are they now allowed to go 14 days from the 11 month date from booking?

See? Too many situations to have to explain. System is simple now, you can book a trip 11 months from the check in date for a reservation, book a max of 7 days and modify it up to 31 days without penalty.

I get people are frustrated with all the things that happen around bookings and rentals.

You have to agree that from an owners and DVC perspective, changes should be simpler and not more complicated…and the simplest solution for BWV SV rooms is to make them more expensive.

Plus your system requires owners to have extra points if they need to change dates, when not walking , if they don’t want to risk losing what they have.

 

[CarolMN]

The easiest way to stop all walking is to make every modification a "cancel & rebook", and make the waitlist process run real time. I doubt that would make anyone really happy if that ever happens. (Be careful what you wish for).

Walking is a limited annoyance - there just aren't enough "cheap" villas or concierge rooms so that everyone can get what they want, when they want. Some will always miss out.

I don't like walking myself, but IMO, all of the potential "cures" are worse than the disease.

 

[Sandisw]

To add, they do have the right to amend the way booking happens, which includes rules for modifications.

What they can’t do is make them arbitrary that makes it appear that one owner’s situation is a priority over the next owners

That is why saying you can modify in this situation to grab a room…but not in this might be seen this way.

So, to stop things, if owners want it, is to not allow modifications at all, make everyone cancel.

My guess is most owners would not see as a good thing.

 

[Tatebeck]

And you don’t think that is more complicated for the average owner to understand?

The system, when you modify is set up to see it as a new reservation…and the blockers are the 11 month plus 7 days. Very simple.

Now, booking right at 11 months might be easy to calculate. But what if an owner decides to book 5 days into the 11 month window

So, they book Oct 1 to the 8th on November 5th and not November first? They no longer get the 14 days? Or, are they now allowed to go 14 days from the 11 month date from booking?

See? Too many situations to have to explain. System is simple now, you can book a trip 11 months from the check in date for a reservation, book a max of 7 days and modify it up to 31 days without penalty.

I get people are frustrated with all the things that happen around bookings and rentals.

You have to agree that from an owners and DVC perspective, changes should be simpler and not more complicated…and the simplest solution for BWV SV rooms is to make them more expensive.

Plus your system requires owners to have extra points if they need to change dates, when not walking , if they don’t want to risk losing what they have.

Again it's not that complicated. The system could do it automatically and the days could be greyed out when you tried to modify if past 1 or 2 weeks forward and it is still past the 11 month window. Many members don't even know what walking is so they would never even run into it unless they specifically are walking reservations.

To bolded point 1: if they booked on on Nov 5th they would be able to move it forward 1 to 2 weeks from Oct 5th since that was the window when they booked. The first 4 nights don't matter because they weren't at or beyond the 11 month window and would have been available to grab by anyone with home resort priority, walking or not. Always from the 11 month window on the day you book like I said before.

To bolded point 2: The system always needs more points when you are trying to secure a possible booking over multiple weeks vs 1 week, whether that is a longer reservation that is walked and extended or 2 smaller ones if you had to start a second walk. This doesn't change that

 

[Sandisw]

Again it's not that complicated. The system could do it automatically and the days could be greyed out when you tried to modify if past 1 or 2 weeks forward and it is still past the 11 month window. Many members don't even know what walking is so they would never even run into it unless they specifically are walking reservations.

To bolded point 1: if they booked on on Nov 5th they would be able to move it forward 1 to 2 weeks from Oct 5th since that was the window when they booked. The first 4 nights don't matter because they weren't at or beyond the 11 month window and would have been available to grab by anyone with home resort priority, walking or not. Always from the 11 month window on the day you book like I said before.

To bolded point 2: The system always needs more points when you are trying to secure a possible booking over multiple weeks vs 1 week, whether that is a longer reservation that is walked and extended or 2 smaller ones if you had to start a second walk. This doesn't change that

Except when you modify, you are not at risk of losing what you have until you secure your new reservation.

If you can’t modify, for whatever reason, and you need those points, you have to cancel and hope that new room is still there.

I know you think it’s simple, but it’s really not for the average owner. I consider myself pretty knowledgeable about how things work and still struggling to see how it works and more importantly, how it really improves the process for the average owner.

As I said, I won’t ever be a fan of any change that makes the modification process more complicated, even if we have to deal with walking.

Point charts or cancel/rebook are the only fair ways to change the rules…but again, not going to be well received by most owners.

 

[Tatebeck]

Except when you modify, you are not at risk of losing what you have until you secure your new reservation.

If you can’t modify, for whatever reason, and you need those points, you have to cancel and hope that new room is still there.

I know you think it’s simple, but it’s really not for the average owner. I consider myself pretty knowledgeable about how things work and still struggling to see how it works and more importantly, how it really improves the process for the average owner.

As I said, I won’t ever be a fan of any change that makes the modification process more complicated, even if we have to deal with walking.

Point charts or cancel/rebook are the only fair ways to change the rules…but again, not going yo be well received by most owners.

In general if you want to fully guarantee you would be able to have a particular room for both weeks 1 and 2 then you should probably get enough points for these 2 weeks... If you are walking it forward then I guess there will be a day or two in the middle where you have the 1st week secured and can decide if you want to walk forward to week 2 instead. You could do the same for the second scenario and try to book just the 1st night of the second week, then modify if you get it after you cancel the first reservation. At the cost of 1 day of points.

But like I said this would be a way to make walking more difficult without affecting normal 7 month bookings. If it now would take 8 days worth of points for a walker to secure a choice of 2 weeks after modifying it 2 weeks forward when it used to take 7, I would personally see that as a win.

Disney and DVC never seem to do anything that makes things simpler. Always more complicated. What's one more? Simple systems are easier to game anyway. Grandfathered points, restricted points, reservation swappable points, non swappable points, multiple tiers of lightning lanes now, multiple tiers of membership extras. I cannot remember a single recent time that they have done something to make things less complicated

 

[Cyberc1978]

Rental companies having confirmed reservations for dozens of value rooms at AKV and standard BWV, sometimes many rooms for the same night, is evidence enough bots are being deployed. Again, I'm not affected (I don't have 11 months access to super-valuable rooms), but I'm annoyed someone can have an unfair advantage.

don’t understand how you can claim that just because a rental company have multiple reservations for the same nights means that they have to be using a bot?

They could book and or waitlist additional nights just like every other member could.

 

[Sandisw]

In general if you want to fully guarantee you would be able to have a particular room for both weeks 1 and 2 then you should probably get enough points for these 2 weeks... If you are walking it forward then I guess there will be a day or two in the middle where you have the 1st week secured and can decide if you want to walk forward to week 2 instead. You could do the same for the second scenario and try to book just the 1st night of the second week, then modify if you get it after you cancel the first reservation. At the cost of 1 day of points.

But like I said this would be a way to make walking more difficult without affecting normal 7 month bookings. If it now would take 8 days worth of points for a walker to secure a choice of 2 weeks after modifying it 2 weeks forward when it used to take 7, I would personally see that as a win.

Disney and DVC never seem to do anything that makes things simpler. Always more complicated. What's one more? Simple systems are easier to game anyway. Grandfathered points, restricted points, reservation swappable points, non swappable points, multiple tiers of lightning lanes now, multiple tiers of membership extras. I cannot remember a single recent time that they have done something to make things less complicated

Well, we will have to not agree on this one because you are looking at this through the lense of walking and I am looking at it from the lense of an average owner who has no idea about walking, and isn’t going to want to have to figure out when they can and can not change a trip booked at 11 months.

All those things you mention are not related to booking and the way they must set the rules for all owners…and even you admit that larger point owners who have more points could gain. an advantage in being able to walk..maybe harder than today…but having enough to hold multiple weeks

This comes up every year and every year the solutions presented are likely to impact far more owners in a negative way.

 

[Tatebeck]

Well, we will have to not agree on this one because you are looking at this through the lense of walking and I am looking at it from the lense of an average owner who has no idea about walking, and isn’t going to want to have to figure out when they can and can not change a trip booked at 11 months.

All those things you mention are not related to booking and the way they must set the rules for all owners.

This comes up every year and every year the solutions presented are likely to impact far more owners in a negative way.

Except for mine.

By design, owners that don't know about walking wouldn't even be able to run into the block... Unless they WERE WALKING, which means that they did know about it. An oxymoron or paradox.

And even if someone runs into it, that means that they are at the 11 month booking window for when they actually wanted to stay, which is exactly where they should be anyway!

Very few members would be affected in any way whatsoever. And every single one who was affected would be someone who was walking a reservation forward over several weeks. Probably a highly competitive room. Heck they could even only put it on highly competitive rooms and leave any rooms that aren't 100% booked at 11 months alone.

Again I would be for this and/or point reallocation like you suggested. I just want them do do something to show they are trying