BRACES QUESTION

[descovy]

I think OP is asking if she has to pay orthodontist 1 the full 18 months treatment if she moves in month 10 of treatment.

Honestly I have the same question. We are military, and I have 2 kids that need braces. What if I move in the middle? Do I pay twice for once set of braces if I move?

You certainly could be starting over once you move.

Not every orthodontist does things the same way. When I had 2 ready for braces I got 4 consultations on each. Each one was very different. Not just in price, but in treatment. Some wanted to pull teeth, others did not. One wanted to wait a couple more years, the other wanted to start right away. One wanted to make an appliance. There was phase 1/2 or do them all at once.

It was dizzying. I talked to my kids' dentist about it. She said their was no right or wrong way, just different methods to achieve the same results. She helped me pick, and we went on our way.

My payment contract has nothing to do with months of treatment. Rather, it's just a payment plan. I owe $3000. I could pay it all up front or installments. ($200 for 15 months) Even if I leave I may still owe the $3000 for the course of treatment he started. (Possibly he gives a refund?)

If I were to change orthodontists mid stream, I'd probably shop around for someone who would most likely finish what #1 started. But it wouldn't be as simple as finding a random ortho in the new town to take over for 7 months.

Your new ortho is going to prescribe their own course of treatment. Theoretically, it will cost less than starting from scratch, because some improvements were made at orthodontist #1.

Finally how "perfectionist" do you want to be? These days almost all children (who can afford it) get braces. It's no longer for severe cases. Much of it is cosmetic. An ortho can go all out, or not. And often price dictates that.

 

[kidshop]

But I think she thought that the insurance paid their 1500.00 upfront and they do not. They pay it over time, so they won't cover the whole 1500.00.

Right, but the ortho didn't provide the full amount of treatment either. Why would they get the full benefit of insurance for only 10 months? From what I understand, the insurance pays monthly so would the ortho be caught up to when the op leaves? ( if payments stop)

Or do you owe the full payment for 18 months ( insurance and payment) to him even if you leave at 10 months. Then you start over with a new doctor with no insurance?


I don't like the sound of that!

 

[HM]

That just doesn't seem right. I can't imagine having to pay for work that isn't done. OP, you might want to check with the licencing board for the Orthodontists in your area and see what they say.

 

[SandyinMonterey]

Business office said many insurances do not pay the lifetime max up front. I read on threads some time ago that most people don't pay the total amount due for braces up front in case the orthodontist retires/leaves or (such in our case) patient moves. Why does our orthodontist want FULL payment (approx. $4000) for phase 1 braces which takes 16-18 months when she only has had them for 7 months right now? Maybe that's why dental insurance didn't pay lifetime max up front because of circumstances like this? How can they say that by the time we move (probably June) we will owe in full amount? If we weren't moving, we'd still be going to this orthodontist to complete phase 1 at least until February 2017?

 

[Mickeyluver37]

I think the issue is more that the cost to the orthodontist is that initial treatment of fitting the child for braces and then putting them on. The contract includes 18 months of treatment almost as just a bonus. I see your side of it too, but what if you were moving after 1 month? 3 months? It's not as simple as taking the cost and dividing it over 18 months when most of the cost to the orthodontist's office is front-loaded. It works the opposite way when you have a baby- they bill nothing to insurance until after the delivery even though they provide 9 months of "treatment" leading up to the birth. This is a nightmare when dealing with deductibles and 2 calendar years.

Now, the way insurance pays makes no sense to me. Yes, our insurance paid the same way for both of my kids in braces through MetLife- quarterly payments spread out over the course of the treatment.

 

[brockash]

I think OP is asking if she has to pay orthodontist 1 the full 18 months treatment if she moves in month 10 of treatment.

Honestly I have the same question. We are military, and I have 2 kids that need braces. What if I move in the middle? Do I pay twice for once set of braces if I move?

The way I have always been explained it...yes. We too are military and our DS needs braces...the problem is we never know how long we're going to be somewhere and we need to be somewhere at least 2 years to prevent paying twice. We've consulted with 3 different ortho's that all say he needs braces, but that until we're sure we're going to be somewhere that they wouldn't do it, because for braces you pay upfront (or are billed for the full amount in the beginning, which is why I think OP is stuck and will have to pay for the all of phase I even though she won't be there for a lot of it). I don't know what we're going to do. I'm to the point that the next time we move I'm going to request that he gets braces put on immediately (we have 2 other kiddos we're going to have to do this with as well.) I also considered possibly having him get the braces where my family is from, because I know that we would at least be back in that area a couple times a year, but that still does not sound like a decent plan.

 

[NinaBella]

The way I have always been explained it...yes. We too are military and our DS needs braces...the problem is we never know how long we're going to be somewhere and we need to be somewhere at least 2 years to prevent paying twice. We've consulted with 3 different ortho's that all say he needs braces, but that until we're sure we're going to be somewhere that they wouldn't do it, because for braces you pay upfront (or are billed for the full amount in the beginning, which is why I think OP is stuck and will have to pay for the all of phase I even though she won't be there for a lot of it). I don't know what we're going to do. I'm to the point that the next time we move I'm going to request that he gets braces put on immediately (we have 2 other kiddos we're going to have to do this with as well.) I also considered possibly having him get the braces where my family is from, because I know that we would at least be back in that area a couple times a year, but that still does not sound like a decent plan.

Enlisted typically have at least 4 years time on station (CONUS) and officers at least 2 years time on station (CONUS). I just retired from military HR. Of course there are varying circumstances. When my oldest son was needing an expander we lived in Korea. They were about to schedule him to get one (free since we were overseas) and then they realized we didn't have enough time left to complete the procedure. So they said they wouldn't put on the expander if we couldn't finish the treatment so we had to wait until we got to our next base, which was stateside, and had to use insurance for it.

Most doctors/ortho are very accommodating to the military moving. I recall being on leave from over Christmas break and my son had a bracket break. So we were out of state and I found an ortho but the door was locked. The guy planting some flowers out front asked me what I needed. Turned out he was the ortho and fixed his bracket at NO CHARGE. Just said Merry Christmas!

My civilian friend moved to Australia and had to have her daughter's brace taken off before treatments were complete before they left.

 

[NinaBella]

I also considered possibly having him get the braces where my family is from, because I know that we would at least be back in that area a couple times a year, but that still does not sound like a decent plan.

That wouldn't work. My son goes to the ortho every 2 weeks with his expander. My daughter every month. They have to make adjustments every 2-4 weeks on the braces themselves. That is how they get the teeth to move. It's not just metal sitting on your teeth, they tighten and pull them over the course of treatments. Plus if something breaks (which does happen at least a few times) you need somewhere to take them too.

 

[havaneselover]

It certainly seems like they should pro-rate but who knows what the contract says. I agree that it's somewhat front loaded but I'm guessing the op's full cost included retainers which her child won't be getting from this ortho not to mention taking the braces off and several monthly visits.

 

[tasha99]

When we left Alaska, my son still had his braces on. Our orthodontist gave us a partial refund, because we would have to hire a new orthodontist in Oregon to continue the braces remove them and make the retainer.

Enlisted typically have at least 4 years time on station (CONUS) and officers at least 2 years time on station (CONUS). I just retired from military HR. Of course there are varying circumstances. When my oldest son was needing an expander we lived in Korea.

We were never anywhere more than 14 months as enlisted.

 

[natenapril]

Enlisted typically have at least 4 years time on station (CONUS) and officers at least 2 years time on station (CONUS). I just retired from military HR. Of course there are varying circumstances. When my oldest son was needing an expander we lived in Korea. They were about to schedule him to get one (free since we were overseas) and then they realized we didn't have enough time left to complete the procedure. So they said they wouldn't put on the expander if we couldn't finish the treatment so we had to wait until we got to our next base, which was stateside, and had to use insurance for it.

Most doctors/ortho are very accommodating to the military moving. I recall being on leave from over Christmas break and my son had a bracket break. So we were out of state and I found an ortho but the door was locked. The guy planting some flowers out front asked me what I needed. Turned out he was the ortho and fixed his bracket at NO CHARGE. Just said Merry Christmas!

My civilian friend moved to Australia and had to have her daughter's brace taken off before treatments were complete before they left.

I get you said "typically" but my husband is enlisted and our last 3 stateside bases have been 18 months at each one. And that is the norm for his career field to advance. We haven't met a accommodating ortho yet. They all just assume we will bring her to them for her monthly check up. Sorry but I am not driving 21 hours to a dentist!

 

[brockash]

Enlisted typically have at least 4 years time on station (CONUS) and officers at least 2 years time on station (CONUS). I just retired from military HR. Of course there are varying circumstances. When my oldest son was needing an expander we lived in Korea. They were about to schedule him to get one (free since we were overseas) and then they realized we didn't have enough time left to complete the procedure. So they said they wouldn't put on the expander if we couldn't finish the treatment so we had to wait until we got to our next base, which was stateside, and had to use insurance for it.

Most doctors/ortho are very accommodating to the military moving. I recall being on leave from over Christmas break and my son had a bracket break. So we were out of state and I found an ortho but the door was locked. The guy planting some flowers out front asked me what I needed. Turned out he was the ortho and fixed his bracket at NO CHARGE. Just said Merry Christmas!

My civilian friend moved to Australia and had to have her daughter's brace taken off before treatments were complete before they left.

I'm not sure that 4 years for enlisted is "typical." My husband has been in for 17 years and the longest we've ever been anywhere has been 3 (and that was for a special assignment, it's almost always right around the 2 year mark). I also don't know many others who have been somewhere for very long either.

 

[kidshop]

This is good information to have! Dd's treatment is only 9 months for a cross bite, so in a few weeks I will know if we are moving and can start her. Ds will have to wait as his treatment will be much longer. our guy offered a significant discount for the 2 of them for paying in full all at once (10%) but I won't be doing that!

I am also going to encourage one of the kids to look into becoming an orthodontist! seems like they have it pretty good...supervising while others work, off on Fridays, and all the ones I have met look pretty happy and rested.

 

[NinaBella]

When we left Alaska, my son still had his braces on. Our orthodontist gave us a partial refund, because we would have to hire a new orthodontist in Oregon to continue the braces remove them and make the retainer.



We were never anywhere more than 14 months as enlisted.

What branch and career field? I was Air Force HR for 20 years. CONUS to CONUS is 4-years on station to volunteer to move, two-years on station to volunteer for overseas. Of course, if there are exceptions to everything. But Air Force it is typically at least 4 years on station for CONUS assignments. I do not know how the other services operate but the Air Force likes to conserve PCS funds and keep people on station for a minimum amount of time.

 

[Pembo]

OP, we switched insurance between phase 1 and phase 2. Phase 1 - the insurance paid $1500 up front to the ortho and I had payments. Phase 2 - insurance is paying monthly and I have payments. No interest fees though. We will be changing insurance again and I assumed I'd be responsible for what the insurance hadn't paid.

I would question why you have to pay the balance before you move? They didn't do all the work yet?! Maybe call some other ortho offices for their policies.

The one thing I have learned from the ortho? They are really good at taking your money, referring you to other specialists to take your money, and saying "only a few more months" when they really mean years.

 

[tasha99]

What branch and career field? I was Air Force HR for 20 years. CONUS to CONUS is 4-years on station to volunteer to move, two-years on station to volunteer for overseas. Of course, if there are exceptions to everything. But Air Force it is typically at least 4 years on station for CONUS assignments. I do not know how the other services operate but the Air Force likes to conserve PCS funds and keep people on station for a minimum amount of time.

Army, korean voice interceptor. Our pattern was 14 months together stateside, then he'd go back to Korea for a year. Rinse and repeat.

 

[NinaBella]

Army, korean voice interceptor. Our pattern was 14 months together stateside, then he'd go back to Korea for a year. Rinse and repeat.

Interesting. I love Korea! I ran the Command Sponsorship Program for all of the Air Force billets in Korea. Our linguist are given priority for command sponsorship and most do the KAIP incentive and they stay there 3 years with their families (some extend more). Even the folks we had at the more remote camps that were not family friendly, we would work out where the family was at Yongsan or Osan and that way the active duty member could at least come home on his days off to stay with the family at Yongsan or Osan. That is the part about being active duty HR... we don't talk to the non-military spouses. Spouses would call me all the time. I will tell you there were quite a few military members who were not quite honest with their spouse when it came to what they could and couldn't do (not that this is the case for you). I also witness military members volunteering for tours and telling their spouse it was a non-volunteer tour. I had military members tell me if their spouse called to ask about command sponsorship to say they were not eligible. I don't lie to spouses. I just simply tell them I can only speak to the military member unless they had a power of attorney. I had one or two spouses drag the military member in with them and stand there while the military member asked questions so they could hear the answer. LOL.

My two younger kids were born in Korea (I have four). It was at Yongsan (Seoul Korea) that wanted to do the expander and start braces on the oldest, until they realized I did not have enough time on station to complete treatments.

Why not apply for command sponsorship which is a 24 month tour in Korea. If KAIP is still offered for the Army, that give you a third year with incentive pay. Korea is an awesome place to live with kids. There is so much to do as long as your willing to venture out. My first tour, I went as a single parent with two kids, got married there, and came back with four kids. My brother, his wife, and daughter ..... and my dad, Korean step-mom, and two Korean step-sisters.... were all stationed at Yongsan together at the same time.

You can get braces FREE while overseas.

 

[SandyinMonterey]

UPDATE: OP here. Had to go to orthodontist yesterday. Bracket came loose and wire was loose (third time braces have come loose). Anyway, when orthodontist wasn't around, I asked technician what will be happening in the coming months. She said straightening her top front teeth, making her "bite" in better alignment and a couple other things. But most importantly commenting how this will take at least the next 11 months. Orthodontist gave an oral surgeon referral, needing 4 teeth pulled and one "shaved." Both oral surgeon and orthodontist said there is no room. Orthodontist said now is the time to have teeth pulled in order for treatment plan to go forward. I'm thinking of calling business office and questioning how much I owe and why. Any thought? Any suggestions?

 

[lanejudy]

Is the orthodontist aware of your moving plans? Both the doctor himself and the business office? Assuming the move has come up within the past 6 months after your DD started the braces, I would have been open with the ortho at the very next visit once I knew we'd be moving. While he clearly has a treatment plan in place right now, he may be able to modify (not necessarily cut short) based on the timing of your move; and he might be able to recommend a colleague at your new location who would continue the same treatment plan (rather than starting fresh). It sounds like the ortho is continuing to expect to see your DD for the next year; if he's been informed but forgot, I'd be sure to remind him/staff each and every single time they mention length of treatment.

So to specifically answer your question...yes, definitely call the business office. Have your contract in front of you. Confirm their policy regarding patients who move -- while it likely doesn't happen a lot, I'm sure you aren't the first family they've encountered who had to leave mid-treatment. Find out your financial obligation, and get it in writing. Also be sure to speak with the ortho directly at the next visit and hash over the treatment plan, what will be done prior to the move and what would be unfinished, should any individual part of the timeline/expectations be adjusted, etc.; and any recommendations at your new area. He has time to network with other professionals. Ultimately, you've signed a financial arrangement and depending on the wording of that contract you may be on the hook for the full amount regardless of whether you opt not to finish treatment with this ortho (and moving would be considered "your choice" as opposed to the ortho cancelling treatment). I'd also be sure to speak with your regular dentist about recommendations at your new location; start that process now so the transition might be as smooth as possible -- maybe even get a "potential new patient consult" (which is sometimes free or minimal charge) on a visit to the new location this spring prior to actually moving.

Good luck! Long distance moves are stressful and it takes a lot of effort to work out the little details like new dentists/doctors.

 

[NinaBella]

UPDATE: OP here. Had to go to orthodontist yesterday. Bracket came loose and wire was loose (third time braces have come loose). Anyway, when orthodontist wasn't around, I asked technician...

Speak to the orthodontist directly. If he knows you are moving, he may be able to do a more aggressive treatment plan to finish it before you move! I don't understand why you seem like you are too intimidated to speak with him. We love our orthodontist and he is wonderful! He works with us and we tell him what is going on with our schedule. Really, it seems you are dragging this out when it could have been addressed and treatment plan modified already.


Also, if this is the third time a bracket has come loose, you need to speak to your child about what they are doing to break them. That is the child eating the wrong foods or chewing on things they shouldn't be. Brackets don't typically come loose on their on. Some orthodontists will start charging to repair broken brackets if it keeps happening so frequently.