Borrowing banked points?

[Tamar]

I could swear I've been told in the past by Member Services that they will always use the oldest points first, and that if you bank points and then decided to use them in the current UY, you can borrow them back.

Today I tried to do that with some points, and was told it couldn't be done. I ended up having to use 2005 points, even though I have unused 2004 points that were banked a while back.

Anyone got the true scoop? I always have felt pretty safe banking all my points before the early deadline, knowing I could borrow them back if I needed them....

 

[dianeschlicht]

What is your use year? If you banked 2004 into 2005, you no longer have any 2004 points. They become 2005 points. If you have not yet had your 2005 use year, you must borrow 2005 points for a ressie that occurs before that use year starts.

 

[DebbieB]

Once points are banked, it's final. What you can do is borrow the next year's points.

 

[vascubaguy]

Just to throw out an example:

If you have a 150 point contract.

You bank the 150 points from 2004 into 2005. So now in 2005 you'll have 300 points coming.

You then decide you want to take a trip in 2004 (but have no 04 points). You can borrow up to 150 points from 2005. You can only borrow from your 2005 allocation of points. The banked '04 points can't be used until 2005.

If you borrow those 150 points for a trip, in 2005 you will get the 2005 points, but those points can not be banked so they will expire at the end of that UY (because they will be the banked points originally from 2004).

 

[Dean]

Remember that points can only be used in the use year in which they reside AT THE TIME OF THE ACTUAL BOOKING. Once a reservation is made, you can't just substitute points within that reservation. Banked points can't be borrowed and borrowed points can't be banked. DVC will usually use the oldest and most vulnerable points first but there is no rule or guarantee they will do so, thus one should always remind them about this issue.

So if I had an August use year and booked a week for next fall (Sept maybe), then later banked my 2005 points. I would have used 2006 current year points and would not have used the banked points. There are ways to try to switch the points to use the banked points first but that is another discussion. If I then wanted to reserve for June, 2005 (after I had banked the points) I'd have to borrow 2006 points (or look for other options) as the points banked to 2006 would also not be available and would not be good for that time.

 

[Tamar]

Okay, that's all consistent with what I was told this morning....it's just not consistent with what I was told when I was a new member banking points for the first time (I've been a member since 2001, so probably did my first bankng in 2002 or 2003. I specifically asked if I could borrow them back and was told I could).

It's a bummer, but not the end of the world...it was only 12 points, and in the long run will not matter. I can see where things would get hairy with this restriction if you typically travelled around the end of of your UY and might need to make a reservation that "spanned" UYs (like Nov 29-Dec 3 for me with my Dec UY). Hopefully I'll never find that one out.

 

[JimMIA]

Actually, we use banking and borrowing as a strategy to avoid losing points. We bank ahead of banking deadlines, and then late in our use year, any trips we take are paid for with borrowed points.

The only issue we may have is if we have to cancel a trip late in the use year, but the trips we take late in our use year are dictated by school vacations, so that's not likely to happen.

The thing to remember is whenever you bank or borrow, it is ALWAYS a final, one-way trip for the points. Once moved either direction, they stay.

 

[Dean]

Okay, that's all consistent with what I was told this morning....it's just not consistent with what I was told when I was a new member banking points for the first time (I've been a member since 2001, so probably did my first bankng in 2002 or 2003. I specifically asked if I could borrow them back and was told I could).

I doubt you were purposefully told incorrectly and it's always been that way. It's also in the paperwork, both the legal and instructional versions. If you had documentation you were told otherwise in the sales presentation, you could likely get some consideration.

 

[Tamar]

Thanks, Dean. I'm not looking for special consideration, it's fine if this is the way it is. I'm glad I found out now, when I have a whole year to figure out how to use those banked 2004 points! Maybe I misunderstood what I was told back at the beginning. Or maybe I asked my question wrong. Anyhoo, it's no big deal.

 

[Caskbill]

My guess is you simply misunderstood, or the guide misunderstood your original question and was answering it one way and you took it another way.

You might have asked if you banked points into the next year and then said if you changed your mind could you get the points back to use after all, and your guide may have thought you were asking how you could use points in the use year you're in and said you could borrow next year's points meaning next year's regular allocation points, but you though he meant the points you just banked into next year.

Anyway, you now know that once points are banked, or borrowed, those points cannot be moved again and must be used within the 12-month use year that they are banked/borrowed into.

A couple of other things to remember: If you make a reservation at a non-DVC resort, those points are immediately converted into Reservation Points and are no longer DVC points. If you later cancel that reservation, the points maintain a status of Reservation Points, and cannot be banked or borrowed, period. Regardless of the original status of the DVC-points that were used. Likewise if you cancel a DVC-Reservation at less than 31 days from checkin, the points are put into a Holding Account and are no longer eligible for banking/borrowing.

Bottom line, only regular annual allocation points can be banked/borrowed. All points classified as Banked/Borrowed/Reservation/Holding are fixed into their current Use Year and cannot be moved.

 

[Tamar]

I distinctly remember the sentence "we always use the oldest points first". This was from Member Services, not a guide, perhaps when I was making a reservation, although I'm thinking it was when I was banking. I knew this was different from what the guide book said, but the MS rep said it with such authority, I figured they were right and that thing in the book was not enforced.

Luckily, it's not a big deal, I just had to use a small number of my 2005 BWV points instead of my 2004 OKW points to complete a reservation for November. It just means I have to be more organized in my tracking, since I'm not using the points "in the order received".

 

[DebbieB]

What they meant was if you banked 2004 points into 2005 and are making a 2005 use year reservation, they will use the 2004 banked points first before using 2005 current year points.

 

[Dean]

I distinctly remember the sentence "we always use the oldest points first".

This was not exactly a true statement. A more accurate statement might have been that they always try to use the most at risk (banked or borrowed) points first that were available at the time of booking for the use year in question. There is no rule or promise that they will always use the most risk points though. Plus if you place at risk points in the use year after the reservation, there will not modify the reservation automatically. However you can ask if you can rebook with the older points and free up the current use year points for possible banking but you must actively ask and in some cases they may not be able to do so.