Born Again Christians Thread-No Bashing please

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Buckalew11 said:
Albertnmom,
We posted at the same time. I understand what you are saying. It is a lot like my example. So what about overeating, smoking (which is much the same--we know smoking is bad for the body--the Temple of the Lord) etc. I just have a hard time grasping this.
::yes:: EXACTLY. This is what causes me to question why homosexuality is made out to be a big deal with so many Christians, yet no one is running around saying the overweight are damned to hell.
 
Miss Jasmine said:
::yes:: EXACTLY. This is what causes me to question why homosexuality is made out to be a big deal with so many Christians, yet no one is running around saying the overweight are damned to hell.

Man, can you imagine the uproar with an overweight gay guy with a gambling problem that smokes and drinks?

I think I just heard a BAC head pop.


JUST A JOKE!
 
RickinNYC said:
Man, can you imagine the uproar with an overweight gay guy with a gambling problem that smokes and drinks?

I think I just heard a BAC head pop.


JUST A JOKE!
:rotfl2:
 
EXACTLY. This is what causes me to question why homosexuality is made out to be a big deal with so many Christians, yet no one is running around saying the overweight are damned to hell.

i posted something similar on another thread, but i believe the difference is a matter of human psychology. homosexuality to many christians is other. weight problems, smoking, drinking, etc. are things that are more familiar. it's easy to separate homosexuality out as something really bad when you don't struggle with that or know anyone who is a homosexual.
 

Just a little something I wanted to add on the topic of salvation.

Mark Chapter 10
13 And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them.
14 But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
15 Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.
16 And he took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.

** I don't think that Jesus is saying here that we have to accept the gift of salvation when we are a child but as a child. Trusting, believing, that is faith.

Wanted to share my DS's salvation experience to paint a better picture. Now he has always been in church and he goes to a Christian school where they talk about this a lot. In K5 they evidently were really talking a lot about salvation and the Book of Life, etc. He knew who Jesus was, what He did, and why but he hadn't made that decision. So one day on the way home from school (he had brought this topic up for several days but my DH and I had decided we weren't going to push him, he would make the decision when he was ready) he asks me "mom, is my name written in the Lambs Book of Life?" Instead of going into a long rant telling him no, etc....that it didn't happen until you asked Jesus to by your savior, etc. I asked him what he thought. Asked him how your name gets there, why it needed to be there, to make sure he understood. Now a lot of small kids understand the concept of sin but they just can't get a grasp on "yes I am a sinner" I think God brings them to that accountability point at varying stages. DS and I went through the whole thing, mostly me asking him questions and him telling what he understood, something I think he needed to talk out as he seemed to be wrestling with this issue himself. He finally said, "mom, can I pray and ask Jesus in my heart" So when DH got home, that is exactly what he did.

Now does that mean that DS will never sin, no. There are lots of things in the Bible he doesn't even understand yet. But he does grasp the most important point......Yes, I am a sinner and I can't save myself. Jesus paid the price for me so I am trusting in him.

He wanted to get baptized but when he looked at the baptismal he got scared so we didn't push that issue either. Figured when he was ready, he would do it. Right before the school year ended this year he said, "I want to talk to pastor so I can get baptized" so on his own he went and talked to our pastor. Our pastor is great and loves to see kids come to the Lord but he also wants to make sure they understand.

The evening he got baptized, (pastor always asks them something) and he asked DS "Micah, tell us how you got saved" DS replied "well, the Lord got me saved". See he knows that it is nothing he did, the Lord was working in his heart and drawing DS to Himself. :teeth: When I think about this whole experience (which stretched over a 2 year time frame) I get all happy and teary eyed at the same time.

As little children.....that's how we are to believe. Sometimes as adults we are so analytical that we make everything to complicated......and want to read more into things than there actually is.....thinking surely it couldn't be so simple, surely I have to do more.
 
caitycaity said:
i posted something similar on another thread, but i believe the difference is a matter of human psychology. homosexuality to many christians is other. weight problems, smoking, drinking, etc. are things that are more familiar. it's easy to separate homosexuality out as something really bad when you don't struggle with that or know anyone who is a homosexual.
I never thought about it that way.
 
RickinNYC said:
Man, can you imagine the uproar with an overweight gay guy with a gambling problem that smokes and drinks?

I think I just heard a BAC head pop.


JUST A JOKE!

LOL, Rick! Let me tell you, I think her head would pop! It was funny though. One of the days we "got into it" I didn't want to use the overeating example as she is overweight so I used smoking instead. Come to find out, after class, she smokes!! :rolleyes1 I had know idea when I chose that for my example. And to be clear, I have nothing against smokers except that it is bad for you and since my FIL died from complications due to his habit, I'd love to see people be able to quit.
 
caitycaity said:
it's easy to separate homosexuality out as something really bad when you don't struggle with that or know anyone who is a homosexual.

Umm, I know my cousin is gay and yes, as a Christian, her lifestyle is against my beliefs. But as my pastor always says, "You can love the sinner, not the sin". ;)

God made woman for man. He didn't create another man for him. And there are several passages in the Bible stating how God made woman for man. ::yes::

And yes, if a person is distroying his/her body by overeating, smoking, or anything else, he/she should re-evaluate that lifestyle. The body is God's temple. And hey, I am preaching to myself, too, folks. I want to loose 10 pounds. I am by no means fat, but I know if I continue to eat "naughty", such as too much sweets, Mexican food, or the such, I put my body at a greater risk of heart issues, diabetes, and other related ailments, just as smoking can create lung issues and cancer. :rolleyes1
 
Miss Jasmine said:
::yes:: EXACTLY. This is what causes me to question why homosexuality is made out to be a big deal with so many Christians, yet no one is running around saying the overweight are damned to hell.
I think Christians call into one of the following 3 categories of thought.

1) Homosexuality is worse sin than overeating
2) Sin is Sin, God does not have a ranking system. Homosexuality is a sin, but no more or less so than overeating.
3) Homosexuality is not a sin at all.

Most every Christian I know falls in category 2 or 3. Yes, I know a couple of category 1s, but they are the vast minority amongst the Christians I know. I suspect the mix I am familiar with is also the mix in the Christian population at large, but even if only 1% of the Christians out there are in category, that would be a whole lot of people, more than enough to make a lot of noise.

Personally, I fall in category number 2 (I also happen to overeat a lot, but thats beside the point). I have never understood the concept of mortal vs venial sins, or any other sin ranking system. I have also never understaood the idea of telling someone that if they commit sin X, they are automatically and unstoppably going to hell (do not pass go, do not collect $200). That takes away all of the power of Jesus' sacrifice. I do beleive that we need to trust in that sacrfice to be free of the consequences of our sin. But I have yet to meet a Christian who has managed to stop sinning. Instead of ranking the sin, we should be emphisizing the salvation that is available to all of us, since we all need it equally as much.
 
He paid a debt He didn't owe because
I owed a debt I couldn't pay


think about that........
 
WDWHound said:
Instead of ranking the sin, we should be emphisizing the salvation that is available to all of us, since we all need it equally as much.
I agree. I just get frustrated with the people who do rank sins, who go around telling people they are going to hell, etc. Anyway, I guess that is something I need to work on, to be more patient with those types of people. :rolleyes1
 
disneyaggie said:
Umm, I know my cousin is gay and yes, as a Christian, her lifestyle is against my beliefs. But as my pastor always says, "You can love the sinner, not the sin". ;)

God made woman for man. He didn't create another man for him. And there are several passages in the Bible stating how God made woman for man. ::yes::

And yes, if a person is distroying his/her body by overeating, smoking, or anything else, he/she should re-evaluate that lifestyle. The body is God's temple. And hey, I am preaching to myself, too, folks. I want to loose 10 pounds. I am by no means fat, but I know if I continue to eat "naughty", such as too much sweets, Mexican food, or the such, I put my body at a greater risk of heart issues, diabetes, and other related ailments, just as smoking can create lung issues and cancer. :rolleyes1

perhaps i was not clear enough in my post. i did not mean all christians felt that way. i was specifically addressing the christians that another poster (iirc missjasmine) was referring to. the ones who think homosexuality is a horrible sin and the other ones are somehow lesser. sorry if i offended you. :confused3
 
WDWHound said:
Personally, I fall in category number 2 (I also happen to overeat a lot, but thats beside the point). I have never understood the concept of mortal vs venial sins, or any other sin ranking system. I have also never understaood the idea of telling someone that if they commit sin X, they are automatically and unstoppably going to hell (do not pass go, do not collect $200). That takes away all of the power of Jesus' sacrifice. I do beleive that we need to trust in that sacrfice to be free of the consequences of our sin. But I have yet to meet a Christian who has managed to stop sinning. Instead of ranking the sin, we should be emphisizing the salvation that is available to all of us, since we all need it equally as much.
Very well said, Hound. I completely agree with you.

live4Christp1, thank you for sharing your son’s salvation story. I come from a similar background, and it was a blessing to hear his story.
 
I thought I'd share a thought with you folks that, even though it first occoured to me when I was 12, still has the power to take my breath away.

The consequence of sin is eternal death.
Jesus bore the consequences of the sins for everyone who will ever live.
This means Jesus bore the consequences of the sins of billions.

Think about the eternal pain of billions of people, suffered by just one man.
Think about that. The suffering he most have borne is simply beyond comprehesion.

Now consider this. He did it for you. Not for faceless billions. Not for some concept of right and wrong, but for you. You, personally. If all the other people on earth had never existed, he would have willingly borne the same suffering for just you, because that was the only way that you could be brought back into the presence of love and joy

An infinite sacrifice. Incredible suffering. All so that you and he could be together. Is it any wonder we say that God is love?

Think about that.
 
About the different 'sins'......

You know, it is up to GOD to define, and determine, convict, judge, and wash away our sins. NOT US!!!

As the examples that have been mentioned here show (smoking, overeating, sexuality, etc.. etc.. etc.. etc...) It is just way to easy for us, our human nature, to see the faults that we do NOT happen to have, and do not understand, as 'sins'!!!

The Bible says, how can we see to remove the splinter from anothers eye, while failing to remove the log in our own eye???

The Bible says, Judge not, lest YE be judged...

The Bible says, Let he who is without sin cast the first stone...

The bottom line is, to even try to define sin, is an example of the ultimate sin.... To see things through our own eyes, and to issue our own judgements! This is our ultimate human-sin-nature, as shown by the story of Adam and Eve, and how they ate from tree of knowledge of good and evil, and began to see themselves as Gods. For example: Adam and Eve had not even noticed that they were naked... But, after eating the fruit, they saw their nakedness and were ashamed...
 
As the examples that have been mention here show (smoking, overeating, sexuality, etc.. etc.. etc.. etc...) It is just way to easy for us, our human nature, to see the faults that we do NOT happen to have, and do not understand, as 'sins'!!!

yes - that is exactly what i was trying to say before. thank you.
 
WDWHound said:
I thought I'd share a thought with you folks that, even though it first occoured to me when I was 12, still has the power to take my breath away.

The consequence of sin is eternal death.
Jesus bore the consequences of the sins for everyone who will ever live.
This means Jesus bore the consequences of the sins of billions.

Think about the eternal pain of billions of people, suffered by just one man.
Think about that. The suffering he most have borne is simply beyond comprehesion.

Now consider this. He did it for you. Not for faceless billions. Not for some concept of right and wrong, but for you. You, personally. If all the other people on earth had never existed, he would have willingly borne the same suffering for just you, because that was the only way that you could be brought back the presence of love and joy

An infinite sacrifice. Incredible suffering. All so that you and he could be together. Is it any wonder we say that God is love?

Think about that.
Beautiful thoughts that sent a chill up my spine reading them. Thank you for sharing that. It really is beyond my comprehension that the God of the universe wants a personal relationship with little old me.
 
And through Christ, that we are able to have a relationship with God. We GET to have a relationship with God! As believers this is the God who created the universe and us, the God who loved us so much that He paid the debt we owe and we GET to have a relationship with Him!

That always amazes me! :)
 
Me too....


I do not 'Believe' because I think it is necessary to believe to try to be a good person. (There are many unbelievers who are 'good people'.)
This is completely backwards... I am led to be a 'good person', according to GODS desires, because I believe.

I do not 'Believe' because of fear of 'Hell Fire' (I do not believe in 'Hell')
This is completely backwards, because unbelievers would not be concerned with hell, or the afterlife.

I do not 'Believe' because I feel that I must be good and be pure and holy and do good works in order too experience eternal life... (Honey, if THIS is life, I could never imagine it being eternal!!!)
This is completely backwards, because I have no vain and selfish desire for immortality. If I were an unbeliever, then immortality would be no reward.

There is only ONE reason that I 'Believe'.

I Believe, because thru His grace and wonderous love, God has shown Himself to me, in that he indwells in me, as my Creator. I believe, because, having acknowledged that God is indeed my Creator, I have been born again, in His spirit.... I can now see things thru His eyes, where I once was blind. (Faith is NOT blind, folks!!!) I believe, because, being born again, I feel the LOVE and the power of God! I believe, because having felt the LOVE of God, I wish to become closer to him. The ultimate of this is the realization that we can be reunited, as one, with Him.
 
caitycaity said:
perhaps i was not clear enough in my post. i did not mean all christians felt that way. i was specifically addressing the christians that another poster (iirc missjasmine) was referring to. the ones who think homosexuality is a horrible sin and the other ones are somehow lesser. sorry if i offended you. :confused3
No offense taken. Thanks for clearing it up! :flower:
 
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