Born Again Christians Thread-No Bashing please

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Albertan mom said:
Same story as me! I became a Christian at age 7 with my Godly Grandmother at Easter while watching a show about Jesus on tv.
I then rebelled for years, lived a life without Christ. Very many struggles.

Interestingly enough, at least to me :p , church and God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit have always been in my life, from childhood, my teen years, through college and into adulthood. However, because questioning is in my nature, I did question the existence of all of the above from time to time. That questioning did lead me to stop going to church but it never stopped me from my faith and belief. I guess, by those definitions described on this thread by some very patient DIS'ers, I have accepted Jesus into my life. Nevertheless, because of the "gay thing" (sorry to bring it back to that), I still have a feeling that there are a lot of you, if not most, that think that I'm going to burn for all eternity. But I don't feel that way at all.

Also, in addressing Alberta Mom's comment concerning rebelling, I never did. I was the "good kid" my whole life. The only time my actions could be construed as rebellious in nature was in college when I partied quite a bit. But, even then, I was still going to mass and I was very active in the community. But the fires of hell were still nipping at me heels even then, eh?
 
RickinNYC said:
Also, in addressing Alberta Mom's comment concerning rebelling, I never did. I was the "good kid" my whole life. The only time my actions could be construed as rebellious in nature was in college when I partied quite a bit. But, even then, I was still going to mass and I was very active in the community. But the fires of hell were still nipping at me heels even then, eh?
Sounds like my college years, actually more like the couple of years right after college (I wanted to make sure I graduated first). :rotfl2:
 
luvthatduke said:
Rick, I really appreciate your comments,
and would like to add just one more thing to your "works" question:
Others have asked, "When is 'good' good enough?"
and I agree that it's a valid question needing to be asked.
However, I would offer to you the suggestion that
the 'good' actions of the few should really be
the expected actions of the human race.
How much better would everyone's life be if we,
every single one of us - Christian, Jew, Hindu, Muslim, Shintoist, Atheist, etc.,
just how much better would it be if we all acted
in a loving, sacrficial manner?
I am a volunteer, and I see that this world sorely lacks
not a cookie cutter version of myself, or yourself,
but it lacks a generation raised to sacrifice,
raised to give, and give back more than they received.
Not saying there aren't loving, sacrificial people of all ages
currently giving their time, energy and $$,
but simply stating that it seems to me if everyone did
what you describe as witnessing in your city
how much better would we all be?

I absolutely believe there are loving, beautiful people
all around, but I also believe that unless they accept
Jesus Christ their works will only be remembered here.
And tell me, just how long are most folks remembered?

Well, your comments mirror those of a few others on this thread and, again, not meant to put this into a debate, but I don't accept what you say. I do not believe that just because a person accepts Jesus, that instantly makes him or her a good person, nor do I feel that person is any closer to Heaven or God than someone who hasn't. I strongly feel its the actions that are performed on this world that insures what happens to you in the next.

If I were to follow that string of thought, I could accept Jesus every day and still be a pretty rotten individual and yet, when it's my time, I fall into God's grace and get heartily welcomed into heaven.

As for who remembers those folks out there who volunteer and their good deeds, for as long as I'm alive, I know I'll remember all the volunteers that have helped our clients.
 
All of this good works stuff got me thinking...how many people have gone on a missions trip?

I was a Youth Leader with our youth group when attending a methodist church. We took some of the high school students to work on two childrens' homes in Mexico. It was an amazing experience, one I will never forget. It meant a lot to me because my Grandfather was from Mexico, and I was so happy that I was able to help some people there. The kids were just too cute and so very happy for what little they had. I would love to do this again sometime.
 

Hey Rick, This is for you......I remembered you posting on another thread a while back that this was one of your favorite songs.

Stomp - Kirk Franklin & God's Property

Lately I've been going through some things
That's really got me down
I need someone, somebody to help me come and
Turn my life around
I can't explain it
I can't obtain it
Jesus Your love is so,
It's so amazing
It gets me high, up to the sky and when
I think about Your goodness it makes me wanna
Stomp
makes me clap my hands
makes me wanna dance and Stomp
my brother can't you see I've got the victory
Stomp!

Oh, oh, oh, oh, Stomp on the enemy 'cause I've got the victory
Stomp on the enemy 'cause I've got the victory
 
live4christp1 said:
Hey Rick, This is for you......I remembered you posting on another thread a while back that this was one of your favorite songs.

Stomp - Kirk Franklin & God's Property

Lately I've been going through some things
That's really got me down
I need someone, somebody to help me come and
Turn my life around
I can't explain it
I can't obtain it
Jesus Your love is so,
It's so amazing
It gets me high, up to the sky and when
I think about Your goodness it makes me wanna
Stomp
makes me clap my hands
makes me wanna dance and Stomp
my brother can't you see I've got the victory
Stomp!

Oh, oh, oh, oh, Stomp on the enemy 'cause I've got the victory
Stomp on the enemy 'cause I've got the victory

Hey there! And guess what? I HAVE THAT CD! It's one of my favorites! LOL

Edited to add: Oops! You even said that you knew I had said it was one of my favorite songs. Sorry 'bout that!

I also happen to love Sonic Flood. I bought a two-disk set of their stuff and listen to it all the time.
 
Miss Jasmine said:
All of this good works stuff got me thinking...how many people have gone on a missions trip?

I was a Youth Leader with our youth group when attending a methodist church. We took some of the high school students to work on two childrens' homes in Mexico. It was an amazing experience, one I will never forget. It meant a lot to me because my Grandfather was from Mexico, and I was so happy that I was able to help some people there. The kids were just too cute and so very happy for what little they had. I would love to do this again sometime.

We went to the UK in 2002 with a handful of people from our church on a missions trip. We have 3 families called out of our church in the UK as missionaries and a national pastor in Ireland that we support. We visited all of them, we didn't do so much work on this trip....just got a look at the mission field, the culture, etc......as we feel a strong leading towards the mission field. Belfast, Ireland burdened my heart the most I think, to think they have to have a fence that is several stories high to divide the Protestants from the Catholics neighborhoods. And they kill each other over this. Makes you thankful that we can come here from different walks of life and different relegious backgounds and discuss those things without having to fear being killed.

My DH went with the youth group last summer to the Dominican Republic were we also have missionaries from our church. They did some work to a house there and also helped our missionaries with the VBS. It's a real eye opener to those kids to go to a third world country......when they come home they are very thankful and changed. We work with our teens and try to scheduled a missions trip of this nature once every 3 years....that way each teen who comes through the group has an opportunity to go twice while in the youth group. DH said they visited one village that was at the base of a garbage dump and they told them that if the kids had sores, etc.....not to touch them.....but he said you couldn't help it.....they were so starved for love. They took over baseballs and gloves, etc. and handed them out. He said it was unbelievable the joy a $1 baseball brought to those kids who had never had any thing new in their lifetime.
 
RickinNYC said:
Hey there! And guess what? I HAVE THAT CD! It's one of my favorites! LOL

Edited to add: Oops! You even said that you knew I had said it was one of my favorite songs. Sorry 'bout that!

I also happen to love Sonic Flood. I bought a two-disk set of their stuff and listen to it all the time.


I have that one too and its great! :)
Those guys can really sing! :)
 
Another Sonicflood fan.....this is one of my favorites they have done.

Heart of Worship

When the music fades
And all is stripped away
And I simply come
A Longing just to bring
Something that's of worth
That will bless Your heart
I'll bring you more than a song For a song in itself
Is not what you have required
You search much deeper within
Through the ways things appear
You're looking into my heart

CHORUS:
I'm coming back to the heart of worship
And its all about You
All about You, Jesus
I'm sorry Lord for the thing I've made it
When its all about You
It's all about You

King of endless worth
No one could express how much You deserve
Though I'm weak and poor
All I have is Yours
Every single breath
I'll bring you more than a song
For a song in itself
Is not what you have required
You search much deeper within
Through the ways things appear
You're looking into my heart

CHORUS
 
Tasha+Scott said:
My brother is currently at the hospital in Memphis having a cochlear implant done as I type. Will you all please pray that all goes well with it and it is successful so that he may one day soon hear again? Thanks!

Prayer said.
 
live4christp1 said:
They took over baseballs and gloves, etc. and handed them out. He said it was unbelievable the joy a $1 baseball brought to those kids who had never had any thing new in their lifetime.
We brought things for the kids, and everyday you would see a different kid with a different item. They shared EVERYTHING. One would play with a toy for a day and then pass it on to another, so they could play with everything. Really neat.

As for me I learned to frame in doors and use some power tools. :crazy: I was very thankful to leave with all my fingers. LOL

We also snuck some much needed items over the border. Tsk tsk, but we did it anyway.
 
RickinNYC said:
If I were to follow that string of thought, I could accept Jesus every day and still be a pretty rotten individual and yet, when it's my time, I fall into God's grace and get heartily welcomed into heaven.

As I described earlier on this thread, I accepted Jesus long ago, but about 6 years ago I went through a period where I did not act very Christian-like at all. Not that I was out committing crimes or anything, but did a lot of partying, quit going to church, got pregnant out of wedlock, was not always so nice to people, etc. Just overall, was quite rebellious. I never lost my faith or my beliefs, I just kind of pushed them aside so I would not feel guilty for what I was doing. I was a pretty rotten individual IMO. But I know that if my time had come back then, I would still have fallen under God's grace, God understands we are human, are incapable of being perfect, and are tempted to rebel. He still loves us. I have since asked forgiveness, and have straightened up my life, and my relationship with Christ is even stronger knowing that He never gave up on me, even when I was not acting as I should. God's grace is an incredible gift.
 
I went on missions trips twice when I was in high school...once to Reynosa, Mexico and once to Antigua...we didn't stay in resort areas we were staying with the locals...we built churches, and led vacation bible schools.

It was an amazing experience, one that I hope my own children will be able to do at least once.
 
RickinNYC said:
Well, your comments mirror those of a few others on this thread and, again, not meant to put this into a debate, but I don't accept what you say. I do not believe that just because a person accepts Jesus, that instantly makes him or her a good person, nor do I feel that person is any closer to Heaven or God than someone who hasn't. I strongly feel its the actions that are performed on this world that insures what happens to you in the next.

If I were to follow that string of thought, I could accept Jesus every day and still be a pretty rotten individual and yet, when it's my time, I fall into God's grace and get heartily welcomed into heaven.

As for who remembers those folks out there who volunteer and their good deeds, for as long as I'm alive, I know I'll remember all the volunteers that have helped our clients.
I believe accepting Jesus and good deeds/actions should go hand in hand. In other words, yes, I believe you HAVE to accept Christ but if you truly accept him then you are going to do good deeds anyway without a second thought. You would still be a sinner and mess up but you would feel guilty when you do and want to ask God for forgiveness. I cannot fathom someone saying hey, I have accepted Christ and then going out and committing tons of crimes, KWIM? Esp. without feeling any remorse. I believe you are right that your actions are important but I also agree that works alone won't get you into heaven. So I do believe you have to accept Christ but that by doing so you will strive to do good in your life. Does this sound more logical to you or am I even making sense?

But from everything you say anyway, Rick, you have accepted Christ and you do good every day so you would fit my example anyway. And you're right there are those that will argue that b/c you are gay that you will go to Hell. My opinion on that is that is really up to God, not anyone else. And if you really have accepted Christ then I would assume you are going to heaven just like the rest of us. Again, that is between you and God and not us. Your sexuality really isn't an issue so much as your heart and beliefs, IMO.

P.S. I am glad you felt you could come back to this thread! I enjoy our "chats".
 
JoyG said:
I went on missions trips twice when I was in high school...once to Reynosa, Mexico and once to Antigua...we didn't stay in resort areas we were staying with the locals...we built churches, and led vacation bible schools.

It was an amazing experience, one that I hope my own children will be able to do at least once.
Neat! Yeah we weren't in resort area either. It wasn't too far over the border (maybe an hour). In fact we stayed in Texas at a Methodist church (slept in their Sunday School rooms) and crossed the border everyday. That was interesting, at least for me, since I look sorta Mexican. I got checked very closely every day. :p Oh how I wish I had invested in a Passport rather than just using my birth certificate. They would even speak Spanish to me to see if I would react. The only reaction was me looking dumb, because I am lucky I even know "hola".
 
Miss Jasmine said:
Neat! Yeah we weren't in resort area either. It wasn't too far over the border (maybe an hour). In fact we stayed in Texas at a Methodist church (slept in their Sunday School rooms) and crossed the border everyday. That was interesting, at least for me, since I look sorta Mexican. I got checked very closely every day. :p Oh how I wish I had invested in a Passport rather than just using my birth certificate. They would even speak Spanish to me to see if I would react. The only reaction was me looking dumb, because I am lucky I even know "hola".


I could have written the same post! We stayed in a Texas church and drove across the border. I also look Mexican and when we were leaving they stopped me to check closer. I also didn't know any Spanish, but the guy asked in English, "Are you American?" and my first instinct was to answer "Si" the only spanish word I knew! I stuttered and said yes, and they let me go. :rotfl2:
 
Our church does Mission Trips each year. Our High School youth group does UM Army (Methodist Church) and we have recently partnered with a group called Builders Without Borders. My DD and I went the week of June 20th to the village of Carbonaris in Mexico. My DW and DD went last year and they built a house for one of the towns residents. This year we built a 30 x 50 building at the school that will become a library and computer lab for the students. The village has a population of about 1,000. Please keep this village and its residents in your prayers as it is located on the coast at the exact point where hurricane Emily went ashore. We have heard through our contacts that all the residents were evacuated but we are very concerned for their homes. Many are one room structures made of wood and tar paper. There is only running water for bathing and washing and all drinking water has to be purchased in bottles. We are still waiting on word as to the extent of the damage sustained in the village.
 
Ok, here's a scenario that actually happened that really got me incredibly angry not long ago and I would love to hear your thoughts. As some of you know, I manage a volunteer services department for a pretty large non-profit that serves homeless men and women in NYC. It gives me a great opportunity to meet so many diverse people of all ages, races, orientations and belief systems. It's a pretty great gig if you ask me!

Anyway, I had met with a young, newly married couple who had recently moved from the west coast. They were nothing but lovely, attentive during the entire orientation and wanted to stay behind to ask even further questions. While chatting, they revealed that they had moved to NYC with other members of their Born Again Christian church, in hopes of "bringing the word of God" to those of us they felt needed it. They didn't get into who those people were and frankly, it didn't bother me in the slightest. I did explain, however, that our organization was completely secular because we have to respect the wishes, needs and religious leanings of our client base. We want to meet the needs of everyone and not a select few. Plus, from a therapeutic standpoint, we are very strict about establishing boundaries with our clients to insure the success of their participation in our programs. That said, I also mentioned that any kind of prosletyzing was not just discouraged, but it was not allowed in any way, shape or form by staff or volunteers at any time. I should mention that I wasn't gruff or nasty when telling them this, I was just very matter-of-fact.

They asked if they could bring along literature and speak to our clients if any client asked them for it. I turned the question around and asked them how a client was going to ask them if they didn't bring it up? I also asked if that was their primary intent in volunteering with us and they readily admitted that yes, that was what they hoped. I then explained that I knew several other volunteer managers at other organizations that were indeed religiously affiliated, particularly of the Christian faith, and that they would love to have them. They insisted they were interested in working with us.

I took them at their word and put them both to work. A few days later, I was making my rounds of the programs throughout the city, and I stopped by to see them (and other volunteers) to see how all was going. The two of them were in the midst of what I perceived as an intense conversation with a few of our clients and sure enough, it was prayer followed by the distribution of leaflets inviting them to their church.

I was pretty dumb founded and down right angry. Let me say that I am not adverse to prayer at all. I think you guys know that by now. But what galled me was that they disregarded the rules that had been established and still used this "volunteer" opportunity to spread their leaflets, etc... That said, I pulled them aside, reiterated what I had said when first meeting and explained that I couldn't allow them back to volunteer any longer. They apologized and assured me it was just that one instance. They seemed so genuine, I decided to give them another opportunity but I asked the Program Manager at that particular site to call me if she noticed anything amiss.

By the time I got back to the office, there was a message and, you guessed it, they were at it again. I called them and asked that they come down to the office and told them they weren't welcome back.

Sorry for the LONG story but I wanted to make sure I got the full essence of what they did and my actions.

Flame me if you must. I'd love to hear your thoughts.
 
RickinNYC said:
Ok, here's a scenario that actually happened that really got me incredibly angry not long ago and I would love to hear your thoughts. As some of you know, I manage a volunteer services department for a pretty large non-profit that serves homeless men and women in NYC. It gives me a great opportunity to meet so many diverse people of all ages, races, orientations and belief systems. It's a pretty great gig if you ask me!

Anyway, I had met with a young, newly married couple who had recently moved from the west coast. They were nothing but lovely, attentive during the entire orientation and wanted to stay behind to ask even further questions. While chatting, they revealed that they had moved to NYC with other members of their Born Again Christian church, in hopes of "bringing the word of God" to those of us they felt needed it. They didn't get into who those people were and frankly, it didn't bother me in the slightest. I did explain, however, that our organization was completely secular because we have to respect the wishes, needs and religious leanings of our client base. We want to meet the needs of everyone and not a select few. Plus, from a therapeutic standpoint, we are very strict about establishing boundaries with our clients to insure the success of their participation in our programs. That said, I also mentioned that any kind of prosletyzing was not just discouraged, but it was not allowed in any way, shape or form by staff or volunteers at any time. I should mention that I wasn't gruff or nasty when telling them this, I was just very matter-of-fact.

They asked if they could bring along literature and speak to our clients if any client asked them for it. I turned the question around and asked them how a client was going to ask them if they didn't bring it up? I also asked if that was their primary intent in volunteering with us and they readily admitted that yes, that was what they hoped. I then explained that I knew several other volunteer managers at other organizations that were indeed religiously affiliated, particularly of the Christian faith, and that they would love to have them. They insisted they were interested in working with us.

I took them at their word and put them both to work. A few days later, I was making my rounds of the programs throughout the city, and I stopped by to see them (and other volunteers) to see how all was going. The two of them were in the midst of what I perceived as an intense conversation with a few of our clients and sure enough, it was prayer followed by the distribution of leaflets inviting them to their church.

I was pretty dumb founded and down right angry. Let me say that I am not adverse to prayer at all. I think you guys know that by now. But what galled me was that they disregarded the rules that had been established and still used this "volunteer" opportunity to spread their leaflets, etc... That said, I pulled them aside, reiterated what I had said when first meeting and explained that I couldn't allow them back to volunteer any longer. They apologized and assured me it was just that one instance. They seemed so genuine, I decided to give them another opportunity but I asked the Program Manager at that particular site to call me if she noticed anything amiss.

By the time I got back to the office, there was a message and, you guessed it, they were at it again. I called them and asked that they come down to the office and told them they weren't welcome back.

Sorry for the LONG story but I wanted to make sure I got the full essence of what they did and my actions.

Flame me if you must. I'd love to hear your thoughts.

You told them the rules, and they didn't listen. IMO, you were right in what you did. If I was one of these volunteers you are speaking of, I would do exactly as you said, I would only speak to them about it if someone specifically asked me about it. God is great enough that if he wants that to happen, it will. Jesus did tell us we had to obey the laws of our land, and I think that applies also to rules of organizations where we work or volunteer.
 
Rick, I am a human resources manager at a large volunteer-driven nonprofit organization. We have many volunteers who spend time with us as part of a religious mission. Incidents like the one you wrote about are thankfully quite rare. We do not permit our volunteers to proselytise and would remove them from assignment if they disregarded our wishes. I think that you handled the situation wisely and fairly.
 
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