Best Strategy for a trip in 2022? Lower Your Expectations

[bsjs0708]

I am a retired CM and as much as Disney was a MAJOR part of my life growing up and as an adult, my relationship with this company has changed. I call it a relationship because for decades it was wonderful and magical and literally touched my heart and soul. Working for the company only increased my love for the company. I supported the product, image, direction, philosophies and embraced the company as a whole. HOWEVER, like a relationship, sometimes someone changes and those changes effect that person's direction, philosophies, image and what they bring to that relationship. I have in that last year "broke up" and left Disney. It is no longer reciprocal. We give and give and try to see the good, but now the scales are tipping, and NOT in their favor.
DH and I bought a 5th wheel and although we too love camping at Fort Wilderness, when those prices can reach 200 a night, that's just nuts. For a slap of concrete with power and water? Nope. If Disney can pull their " heads outta their backside" and get back to a semblance of what they were, we are not returning. And like any break-up this has been painful and even feels like a type of mourning.
We have found many places to visit and explore that wont drain our bank and do fill our hearts and soul. This country has many wonders to explore and we are having a great time experiencing them.

 

[Jennasis]

 

[hedg12]

I'm afraid we've "lowered our expectations" just about as low as we're willing to. We took our 5 year old granddaughter in January, and put up with the long lines and high prices for limited experiences and terrible food for her sake. We cancelled our May plans, and for the first time in almost 10 years we don't have a Disney trip planned. My wife and SIL are stirring up a cruise (non-Disney) sometime this year as Covid permits. I'll likely sit that one out - maybe I'll sneak off and go camping while they're gone...

We may go back next year, but if we do it will be a "Florida" trip, not a Disney trip. Stay off site, visit other parks / beach / whatever Florida has to offer, with some Disney thrown in here and there.

I really hope it doesn't stay this way. I have some great memories from Disney, and really want to make more with the grandkids as they grow. Hopefully Disney corrects course and makes that possible.

 

[dijid]

After many years away from Disney, my husband I decided to gift our son a short father/son trip for Christmas. Disney was always his happy place and he could really use the magic in his life. I always planned our previous trips and they were great. DS got excited about planning the trip this time. He read and researched Genie + and all the other changes to the parks. He came up with what he thought was a good plan. He was well-informed and not going into this blind. They had lowered their expectations.

It kills me that the last text I got from the MK was "counting down the hours until we can leave."

You know that commercial from a long time ago with "they'll tell 2 friends, and then they'll tell 2 friends, and so on..." I feel like Disney is about to ride that wave of negativity. Someone with a large social media following tweeting or posting on IG of all the ride shut downs, miscommunications, ginormous queues, and how not paying extra means you are truly "standby" (ie may or may not get a spot on the ride) could go a long way towards damaging Disney's reputation because people will jump on the negative bandwagon. It's just a matter of "when" and not "if"

 

[starousse]

I'm reading all of these horrible and sad reviews and am starting to cringe. I'm wondering if things have gotten really that bad. We go once a year, but obviously skipped 2020 due to the pandemic. We finally went back this past August and really didn't have anything to complain about. Granted, Genie+ hadn't been rolled out yet AND it was mid August, so lines were not horrible....but I honestly didn't see where the magic was lost. We stayed at WL which was great....only downfall was the lack of full room housekeeping. Yeah, it's annoying to spend $450/night and not have full room service, but I did feel that the CMs were friendly, helpful and brought towels and shampoo as needed. Whatever we asked for, we got quickly. We're also big foodies and thought the food was better than it ever was. For us, our kids are almost 16 and 13, so character meet and greets aren't our thing.....we don't watch parades during the day....and to be honest, if we don't get on a ride here and there, it's not the end of the world. We're going back in August and plan to go w the flow. May try genie for one day, but plan on winging it for the rest. Plan on doing a lot of resort-pool time, eating in good restaurants in between and plan on using Mears or that new Sunshine Flyer now that ME is gone. I do feel, that a lot of the complaints seem to be from those who went during extremely busy peak times (Christmas, Thanksgiving, etc.), which even during the FP+ days were horrible and those who are complaining about the food are referencing the quick serve places in which the quality has always been horrible. Overall, there are cuts, as there are everywhere. For me personally, I can live w the loss of ME, I can do without the meet and greets. I would however like to come back to a fresh bed when splurging at the Poly and I would like to see some major adjustments made to Genie+.

 

[T'Lynn]

This has been an interesting thread to read through and I couldn't resist but posting my own experience.

My brief background: been going to Disney since I was a kid in the 80's but didn't go from 2000 until I had my own kid. I have gone in 2016 and 2019 but stayed offsite because I had a large group and didn't want to pay Disney resort prices. With that experience, FP+ was just okay ... I could book in advance but could never get the good rides or any morning times and I never got the extra perks but I did a lot of planning and preparing and created magical trips both times ... and both times my Boomer parents complained about how Disney just wasn't what it used to be and how they were done with future trips.

At the end of March I'm going with just my husband and daughter and we're staying deluxe this time and have 7 days booked at the parks and we're ready to have another magical trip (fingers crossed)

Reading all the issues with G+ and $LL have me a bit nervous but I planned lots of "what if" scenarios in the event that lots of plans go wrong. All that planning has me optimistic for a great trip but I know there will be some things I'm going to have some frustration with. At the price point I would like to have a trip that has no frustrations but at the end of the day ... Disney World offers a vacation that is unmatched anywhere else in the world. Sure, there are other theme parks out there but none have the same multi-day/repeat visitors that Disney attracts.

My earlier observation that even in 2016 my parents were done with Disney is to say that new visitors don't know what they don't know ... my parents talk of a time when you could buy a 7 day pass and use it any time during the year, Mickey Mouse wandered the parks and there weren't lines to greet him. The trip planning they did is nothing compared to what I do but I still have nostalgia for those days and will always remember the smell of Universe of Energy... I want to go to Disney as an adult with my kid and she loves it and will maybe one day want to take her kid and they'll have some wild futuristic Genie 2.0 that literally reads your mind to pick Lightning Lanes and I'll think that is ridiculous because I was just remembering Space Mountain fondly but didn't actually want to ride it ....

It will be interesting to see what happens as the pandemic really ends, travel normalizes, the 50th celebration ends, and the backlash of the changes are felt. There are so many factors going on right now that it's hard to say if one issue is causing a problem or a combination of all of them. For the people reading this thread and are thinking of cancelling I would advise against it. If you love Disney and really want to go (or go back) then you should experience it for yourself and make the decision then. Even amongst the "negative" posts here I usually see people say they DID have a good time but just felt it was too costly or not relaxing enough.

I'll be sure to add my thoughts when I return from my March/April trip!

 

[DavidNYC]

I'm reading all of these horrible and sad reviews and am starting to cringe. I'm wondering if things have gotten really that bad. We go once a year, but obviously skipped 2020 due to the pandemic. We finally went back this past August and really didn't have anything to complain about. Granted, Genie+ hadn't been rolled out yet AND it was mid August, so lines were not horrible....but I honestly didn't see where the magic was lost. We stayed at WL which was great....only downfall was the lack of full room housekeeping. Yeah, it's annoying to spend $450/night and not have full room service, but I did feel that the CMs were friendly, helpful and brought towels and shampoo as needed. Whatever we asked for, we got quickly. We're also big foodies and thought the food was better than it ever was. For us, our kids are almost 16 and 13, so character meet and greets aren't our thing.....we don't watch parades during the day....and to be honest, if we don't get on a ride here and there, it's not the end of the world. We're going back in August and plan to go w the flow. May try genie for one day, but plan on winging it for the rest. Plan on doing a lot of resort-pool time, eating in good restaurants in between and plan on using Mears or that new Sunshine Flyer now that ME is gone. I do feel, that a lot of the complaints seem to be from those who went during extremely busy peak times (Christmas, Thanksgiving, etc.), which even during the FP+ days were horrible and those who are complaining about the food are referencing the quick serve places in which the quality has always been horrible. Overall, there are cuts, as there are everywhere. For me personally, I can live w the loss of ME, I can do without the meet and greets. I would however like to come back to a fresh bed when splurging at the Poly and I would like to see some major adjustments made to Genie+.

They are that bad. And will continue to get worse because Disney has realized there are enough people who will continue to pay more even as the guest experience continues to get worse. The major change is that Chapek and the rest of the team that run the Disney parks don't care at all about anything that is a not a direct contributor to the bottom line. Disney once had a philosophy about what the brand stood for and didn't necessarily try to squeeze every last cent out of people because the name Disney meant more than just a number. Not so any more - the only philosphy is money. The own nothing to guests. The owe nothing to cast members. It's about one thing. These latest changes have shown how the steps they are willing to take to make trips far more stressful for guests if it allows them to reduce operating costs and cut staff. Their latest statements during earnings calls shows how they are affirmatively looking to attract the "right type of guest". They are running on the fumes from all of the goodwill the Disney name garnered over the years and will continue to do so. They don't care if people stop coming - they'd be perfectly happy with a loss of 25% of the guests if they can charge the remaining guests double.

 

[bsmcneil]

They are that bad. And will continue to get worse because Disney has realized there are enough people who will continue to pay more even as the guest experience continues to get worse. The major change is that Chapek and the rest of the team that run the Disney parks don't care at all about anything that is a not a direct contributor to the bottom line. Disney once had a philosophy about what the brand stood for and didn't necessarily try to squeeze every last cent out of people because the name Disney meant more than just a number. Not so any more - the only philosphy is money. The own nothing to guests. The owe nothing to cast members. It's about one thing. These latest changes have shown how the steps they are willing to take to make trips far more stressful for guests if it allows them to reduce operating costs and cut staff. Their latest statements during earnings calls shows how they are affirmatively looking to attract the "right type of guest". They are running on the fumes from all of the goodwill the Disney name garnered over the years and will continue to do so. They don't care if people stop coming - they'd be perfectly happy with a loss of 25% of the guests if they can charge the remaining guests double.

So, having written here and elsewhere that I enjoyed my trip but also had problems (and lowering expectations is important), I also read this and wanted to name my disagreement. Namely, I feel there's a significant disconnect between on the ground cast members and upper-level management. I had a couple of interactions with CMs that weren't positive or particularly helpful (which is absolutely fine - it's going to happen). But for the most part, CMs really did want to make sure I had a good trip, really did care about helping out, and weren't at all concerned with squeezing out every penny. An example: I'm a Disney Visa card holder. I went to pay at Boma and one CM asked and I said - Oh, I am but I'm actually paying with gift cards. No problem, she said - I can make that work. I didn't ask for it or expect it (nor did I bring it up any other time we went to Boma, nor did any other CM) - but the CM was gracious. Another example - mid-Kitchen Sink, one of my kids needed to go to the bathroom (and I'm a single parent). Beaches and Cream doesn't (or didn't seem to) have a bathroom inside. I mentioned to the CM that we needed to pay so we could go and she said - don't worry about it. I'll stay here with your oldest and take your time. I came back and she had a chair near our table but not at it (covid-cautious, I imagine) and was talking with them about school and pokemon.

The problem that concerns me is the institutional decisions that have been made that seem to inhibit the same level of service (things like no Magical Express, moving FP+ to Genie/G+/ILL and having to pay, no included magicbands, parking fees at the resorts, etc). And for what it's worth, I just completed my post-trip survey and when it asked if I would stay a Disney resort in the next five years (definitely will, probably will, may or may not, probably won't, definitely won't) I listed the reasons above and a few more about why I said I probably wouldn't (and that after my first on-site trip in 2002, I had never looked off-site - until now). So, the PP may have meant this - but I think it's useful to delineate between who at Disney is taking the actions that seem to care only about money, etc because largely the Cast Members are stepping up.

 

[Krissy562]

You can see in my signature that I have been to Disney many times.

I even made my second trip on my current Annual Pass and was at Bay Lake Tower and then Animal Kingdom Lodge, Jambo House just a few days ago.

If you are going in 2022 you need to lower your expectations a lot.

I have used Touring Plans and been a rope dropper for many, many years.

I was often able to get 90 percent of my rides/shows done by lunchtime .....and wrapped up each day with a feeling of joy and happiness.

I was able to ride some rides more than once each day and sometimes would hop to a second or third park if I wanted to........I felt free as a bird.

This is not the case anymore.

For the moment, let's put aside the huge cost of resorts, food/beverage, Genie+, and ILL.

Even if G+ were free, it is an inferior product to FP+.

I can even accept the Park Pass requirement for the first park of the day, but park hopping at 2pm it like hitting my kneecaps with a baseball bat.

In the old days, I would often rope drop park number 1 and then hop to park number 2 sometime in the morning.

The present system makes each day feel like we have a national speed limit of 55 again and I am driving around with my parking brake engaged.

If we had little ones in our group, the focus of a typical day would be very different.....even only doing 3 or 4 rides with a child/grandchild, the day's enjoyment is derived from seeing the little ones have a wonderful day.

For years, I tried to maximize the number of days I could be at WDW with my AP.

I would stay off site and on site.

These days, it is not so much that the on site folks have a huge advantage compared to the past.......it is that the off site people barely get adequate leftovers by the time they can enter the park and/or buy ILL rides.

I have trips planned for April/May/Sept/Oct on this AP. (I do not like the super hot months)

I am not going to focus on max days at Disney this year.

I went in Dec 2021, Jan 2022 and have a trip with our daughter (a teacher) over the President's Day weekend.

I will have been 3 times on this AP.......I feel I have broken even on the cost.

I will be cancelling the rest of the trips I had on the books for later this year.

That money and time will be spent elsewhere.

Although some of the environment has been impacted by Covid...... a large part of the reduced experience is due to decisions made by management.

Now......I have not said much about the nickel and diming that really adds up now.

At a value resort, a couple on a trip has to pay an extra $47 each day just to park and use Genie+.

When you add the impact of a diminished experience with the very high cost, the value of the experience has been greatly reduced.

Look......I am a Disney fan.

Disney, Coke, a Big Mac, are all part of a truly American experience. I can not imagine life as we know it if they were to all disappear.

Disney has very good customer service.....if the IT situation was not so mediocre, I would say Disney has some of the best customer service of any company.

However, at this time, the overall experience requires a lot of money, a lot a planning, and each day has a lot of chaos caused by the unpredictability of getting a LL or ILL,........and to be under the gun to compete at 7am for a seat on a ride is not relaxing or enjoyable.
And having my face buried in the phone a good part of the day does not add to my enjoyment either.

I composed this because I saw some small headlines about Disney guests not being really thrilled right now.....I thought I may have been the only one that felt this way.......but there is now a bit of rumbling going on........and social media has the ability to provide us to look at the good and the bad comments.

The experience has changed for the worse.

They better improve it substantially and quickly.

I think many of the 2022 visitors may be so unhappy, they may not return or postpone future trips.

In a way, Disney has messed up my Happy Place................and I am a bit sad about that.

I'm very much like you - my daughter had her 21st trip under her belt before she turned 12....and we are from New England. We are coming back DURING SPRING BREAK (never tried that before) for the first time since 2014 to celebrate her 21st Birthday. I'm trying really hard to manage everyone's expectations as they've been SPOILED.
ALL ADVICE GREATLY APPRECIATED

 

[DSNY4ever]

Man. We are preparing to go on our rescheduled trip (from back when the parks were closed). We haven’t been in 5 years. My kids are at the prime ages to really see buoy and remember this. Our expectations are SO LOW that we are having a hard time getting really excited like we used to. Trying to pump up my family to have a good time while also managing their expectations for this to not be the Disney we once knew and for mom and dad to probably be a little frustrated and stressed (but we’ll try to hide that). I am going to have everyone make a list of three things and hope we can at least do those

 

[DSNY4ever]

Duplicate

 

[Haley R]

I'm reading all of these horrible and sad reviews and am starting to cringe. I'm wondering if things have gotten really that bad. We go once a year, but obviously skipped 2020 due to the pandemic. We finally went back this past August and really didn't have anything to complain about. Granted, Genie+ hadn't been rolled out yet AND it was mid August, so lines were not horrible....but I honestly didn't see where the magic was lost. We stayed at WL which was great....only downfall was the lack of full room housekeeping. Yeah, it's annoying to spend $450/night and not have full room service, but I did feel that the CMs were friendly, helpful and brought towels and shampoo as needed. Whatever we asked for, we got quickly. We're also big foodies and thought the food was better than it ever was. For us, our kids are almost 16 and 13, so character meet and greets aren't our thing.....we don't watch parades during the day....and to be honest, if we don't get on a ride here and there, it's not the end of the world. We're going back in August and plan to go w the flow. May try genie for one day, but plan on winging it for the rest. Plan on doing a lot of resort-pool time, eating in good restaurants in between and plan on using Mears or that new Sunshine Flyer now that ME is gone. I do feel, that a lot of the complaints seem to be from those who went during extremely busy peak times (Christmas, Thanksgiving, etc.), which even during the FP+ days were horrible and those who are complaining about the food are referencing the quick serve places in which the quality has always been horrible. Overall, there are cuts, as there are everywhere. For me personally, I can live w the loss of ME, I can do without the meet and greets. I would however like to come back to a fresh bed when splurging at the Poly and I would like to see some major adjustments made to Genie+.

We live an hour away and August was MUCH different than it is now. That was around the time delta got really bad and tons of people were cancelling. We stayed in a GF studio for 3 nights for $750 because there were so many people trying to get rid of their dvc stays. That was one of the best trips we have ever had. No genie+, parks weren’t crowded, dining was easy to get. It was amazing. We just went last week and it was pretty awful. Way too many people and standby waits are very long.

 

[tano]

I've reached the same conclusion as the OP. Disney has been losing its value proposition for a few years now, and honestly I've remained in denial because of an emotional connection resulting from many years of happy memories. During our trip this past December it suddenly clicked in my brain how I'm paying so much for a vacation thats not even relaxing for us any more and suddenly the thought of not going to Disney anymore didn't freak me out. Ill still be going to Florida 2x in the year so I'll go for a day to try out guardians and Tron when they are ready, but we were annual pass holders so it's a major downgrade.

Everyone has a different threshold...

 

[Seeker615]

My thought is that I cannot lower my expectations. If I am paying for a vacation (especially an expensive one) I expect great things. Why bother going if you have to lower your expectations?

 

[DavidNYC]

So, having written here and elsewhere that I enjoyed my trip but also had problems (and lowering expectations is important), I also read this and wanted to name my disagreement. Namely, I feel there's a significant disconnect between on the ground cast members and upper-level management. I had a couple of interactions with CMs that weren't positive or particularly helpful (which is absolutely fine - it's going to happen). But for the most part, CMs really did want to make sure I had a good trip, really did care about helping out, and weren't at all concerned with squeezing out every penny. An example: I'm a Disney Visa card holder. I went to pay at Boma and one CM asked and I said - Oh, I am but I'm actually paying with gift cards. No problem, she said - I can make that work. I didn't ask for it or expect it (nor did I bring it up any other time we went to Boma, nor did any other CM) - but the CM was gracious. Another example - mid-Kitchen Sink, one of my kids needed to go to the bathroom (and I'm a single parent). Beaches and Cream doesn't (or didn't seem to) have a bathroom inside. I mentioned to the CM that we needed to pay so we could go and she said - don't worry about it. I'll stay here with your oldest and take your time. I came back and she had a chair near our table but not at it (covid-cautious, I imagine) and was talking with them about school and pokemon.

The problem that concerns me is the institutional decisions that have been made that seem to inhibit the same level of service (things like no Magical Express, moving FP+ to Genie/G+/ILL and having to pay, no included magicbands, parking fees at the resorts, etc). And for what it's worth, I just completed my post-trip survey and when it asked if I would stay a Disney resort in the next five years (definitely will, probably will, may or may not, probably won't, definitely won't) I listed the reasons above and a few more about why I said I probably wouldn't (and that after my first on-site trip in 2002, I had never looked off-site - until now). So, the PP may have meant this - but I think it's useful to delineate between who at Disney is taking the actions that seem to care only about money, etc because largely the Cast Members are stepping up.

We don't disagree at all. The CMs for the most part are still wonderful and are just as much victims of what the executives have done to the Disney park experience as are guests. They are bearing the largest brunt of the increasing guest unhappiness and I'm not surprised that you're seeing some portion of them finally hit a bit of a breaking point. And management sees them as expendable - another number. The more we can automate the more cast members we can let go - or reduce hours . . . etc.

 

[sydneysmom]

My thought is that I cannot lower my expectations. If I am paying for a vacation (especially an expensive one) I expect great things. Why bother going if you have to lower your expectations?

100% agree. I'd rather stay home than just say "well, there's a few thousand , it is what it is". that's why we cancelled our previous trips and waited until we felt like it was going to be better. Alot of it, and I don't mean this as a dig to anyone, but alot of the joy of your trip is what you make of it. If you go in happy, you're happy to be alive and at Disney, it will likely be a much happier trip. We're skipping Genie+ because neither of us wants to be a slave to our phone. We're going in Sept, so the lines will be shorter, so hopefully that won't matter being without it. But my DH and I are going into this like we're making this vacation ours, we're not going to be dictated how...... now, I I was bringing little kids, that might be different.

 

[BridgetBordeaux]

The more we can automate the more cast members we can let go - or reduce hours . . . etc.

There used to be a live person who narrated the ride LwtL.

Now we get an automated audio narration.

Think about how much money they have saved since 2006 when the change was made!

 

[RoseGold]

Their latest statements during earnings calls shows how they are affirmatively looking to attract the "right type of guest". They are running on the fumes from all of the goodwill the Disney name garnered over the years and will continue to do so.

They're running on fumes from the borders still being closed. The last few trips I've planned have been people who normally would have gone to Europe or the Caribbean or something, but can't leave the US for job Covid rules or risking quarantine. And sure, paying to make a lightsaber and for the Christmas party worked great! But they won't be back. Ever.

There used to be a live person who narrated the ride LwtL.

Now we get an automated audio narration.

Think about how much money they have saved since 2006 when the change was made!

They could just make fifty videos of The Rock telling Jungle Cruise scripts. Save some more cash.

 

[TiggerBouncy]

I'm reading all of these horrible and sad reviews and am starting to cringe. I'm wondering if things have gotten really that bad.

You have to remember, this is the internet and it's social media. For every loud person on here (and the number of posts is not reflective as some people are particularly into complaining) there are literally thousands of satisfied guests who are not hanging out on boards. Study after study has shown that the negativity and complaints on social media is exponentially higher than people's real life experiences. You don't just need to take comments on here with a grain of salt.... you need to swallow it with the entire dead sea.

From MY PERSONAL experience since the pandemic, I have had a terrific time with each vacation to Disney. Each one has gotten progressively better since they opened (for me) and I EXPECT them to continue to show improvement. One thing Disney is VERY good at is learning from their mistakes even if those mistakes are costly.

They don't care if people stop coming - they'd be perfectly happy with a loss of 25% of the guests if they can charge the remaining guests double.

Wait.... Reduce costs AND raise revenue at the same time? FIND ME A BUSINESS WHO WOULDN'T!!!!!

I'm not even sure that's a BAD THING. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me AT ALL if that is part of their plan. For a long time Disney has been suffering from too many people and too few rides. If they are not going to build a ton more parks (and that brings it's own challenges), then the best solution to the problem is to artificially lower the crowds.

 

[simbaella]

We are going in October for 8 nights split BCV and WLV. We promised our special 36 year old son this trip. My husband and I are worried it won't be fun. We have been many times and have had some great trips. Went for his 30th birthday and felt everything was changing for the worse. Now this trip may be our last. Our son is a Disney lover. He is pretty easy going and loves the characters, shows and parades, but he is also planning to get on the new rides like Slinky and Rattatoie . He also loves to eat and we will be trying to get him into some specific restaurants. As a side note, We do not have smartphones and will therefore be severely compromised, but at least we won't run into anyone while we have our noses in our phones. Hopefully our sense of humor will get us through.