Before you post that NASTY REVIEW!!

[DawnCt1]

From November 2005's Budget Travel pg 38.

Budget Travel talks about a tourist who stated in a little hotel in Europe. He had a terrible time so he posted a bad review on TripAdvisor once he got back. The hotel figured out who wrote it and threatened to sue if he didn't take it down. The article goes on to say; "American reviewers on bulletin boards such as TripAdvisor and IgoUgo might be surprised to learn that the rest of the world doesn't protect free speech the way the USA does. "Libel laws overseas usually lets Americans be sued for any statement that stings a foreign business or resident". If you criticize a French hotel online, and the hotel sues you. If you don't plan to make a habit of visiting France, you can ignore it. If a French court issues a default judgment, you can only be forced to pay if the execute the judgement, and unless you live in the E.U. that's a tough thing to do. If you do plan on returning to France, be careful. You may not want to post quite so freely. Also, the article said, "Don't assume that you'll be able to persuade TripAdvisor to remove your own review. This person had a very difficult time getting his post removed.
Personally, when I am considering a resort or hotel that I am not familiar with, I read every review on TripAdvisor. Sometimes I will find one from a person who just cannot be made happy and I have stayed in hotels that I, along with the majority of posters felt was just fine. If I do however see a preponderance of bad reviews, I will definately think twice. If its a location that doesn't have many reviews, if there are indeed specifics, I will think twice about staying there or post on Fodors.com for a first person account of the property and someone I can ask questions of. Do you pay attention to on line reviews? Should that free speech have "consequences"?

 

[Planogirl]

Maybe the best idea is just to state exactly what happened and let the readers draw their own conclusions? Then it's your word against theirs.

 

[MrsNick]

If all you are talking about is a personal experience, I don't see how anyone can dispute what your personal experience is .

If I say that "on Saturday, my room was not made up, even though the hotel is supposed to have daily maid service," I don't see how they would have a case.

 

[DawnCt1]

If all you are talking about is a personal experience, I don't see how anyone can dispute what your personal experience is .

If I say that "on Saturday, my room was not made up, even though the hotel is supposed to have daily maid service," I don't see how they would have a case.

Apparently its no big deal in the USA but in France, you can be sued even if the truth as you see it, impacts the business of the hotel/resort. The same is true in other European countries. I am glad that the USA does not inforce these judgements.

 

[eclectics]

Anyone who would post on a web board that would give out enough of the posters personal info to give somebody else, or some foreign country, the ability to track down their identity, or if they give it out voluntarily in their post, deserves exactly what they get, imho!

 

[escape]

Wow, interesting. I always read TripAdvisor and other boards before staying in a hotel in unfamiliar territory. I have posted a bad review on one occasion...for a hotel in Las Vegas and believe me; it was for a very good reason. And, I might add, most people agreed with me. I have traveled to Europe on several occasions and have stayed at mostly good hotels. However, I have stayed at a couple of hotels that I would not do business with again but I have never posted a bad review on them.

Interesting. I need to read my issue of Budget Travel for November!

 

[3DisneyBuggs]

I always read tripadvisor. Maybe they shouldn;t allow reviews of these foreign hotels to protect the innocent reviewer.

 

[kadaten]

Anyone who would post on a web board that would give out enough of the posters personal info to give somebody else, or some foreign country, the ability to track down their identity, or if they give it out voluntarily in their post, deserves exactly what they get, imho!

If it's a small hotel, it's quite possible they remember the reviewer simply from his list of complaints and time frame he was there.....two things that are NOT personal information, but are almost always included in hotel reviews.

I've worked retail and could pinpoint many customers from their comments, both positive and negative, without getting any personal info from them. All I'd have to do to get their name would be to go through receipts until I remembered them from their purchases.

This reviewer was trying to save others from the bad trip he must have had....and look what he gets for his troubles.

 

[eclectics]

If it's a small hotel, it's quite possible they remember the reviewer simply from his list of complaints and time frame he was there.....two things that are NOT personal information, but are almost always included in hotel reviews.

I've worked retail and could pinpoint many customers from their comments, both positive and negative, without getting any personal info from them. All I'd have to do to get their name would be to go through receipts until I remembered them from their purchases.(

But that's taking quite a chance. What if there were two similar complaints from two totally different people. I would think a law suit would, or could not be initiated unless the hotel had proof positive of the posters identity. The only way to get that identity info would be from the board or the poster themselves. I would hope if I were to post a review on some secure (hopefully) board and I called myself say "Disappointed in Virginia" without giving my email address or other info, that's as personal as it's going to get. How can someone track me down? In this day and age of identity theft, I am very careful of who knows what. But I suppose I have to agree with you about the traveler. His intentions were good. All he wanted to do was to warn. No good deed goes unpunished.

 

[Obi-Wan Pinobi]

JMO, but I think the laws of the country where the website is based and hosted should apply. If Tripadvisor and IgoUgo are based in the USA, then the laws of the US should apply.

It's nice to know that France is giving that one customer-reviewer so much power that his words will make or break that hotel. One person isn't going to have that much of an impact on business. There are websites devoted to negative experiences at places like Best Buy and WalMart, and their business is booming.

I'd like to know what the reviewer said, though. Did he go off ranting and raving, or was he calm and factual?

Oh, I just had a thought -- if the US had signed on to the World Court, what impact would that have had on something like this? Yes, that was a criminal court and this was a civil case, but would it have been enforceable?

 

[princesspumpkin]

I just read that article in my Budget Travel Mag. I always read TripAdvisor and find it funny how reviews can be so vastly different. I read them each carefully and decide which ones have merit (if they continually state that the air conditioners don't work well) or which ones are opinion based (they think the hotel stinks because it wouldn't allow them to get special stuff). I do believe that reviews can poison someone's mind against a hotel so I could see how hotels might be upset because of that.

 

[kadaten]

But that's taking quite a chance. What if there were two similar complaints from two totally different people. I would think a law suit would, or could not be initiated unless the hotel had proof positive of the posters identity. The only way to get that identity info would be from the board or the poster themselves. I would hope if I were to post a review on some secure (hopefully) board and I called myself say "Disappointed in Virginia" without giving my email address or other info, that's as personal as it's going to get. How can someone track me down? In this day and age of identity theft, I am very careful of who knows what. But I suppose I have to agree with you about the traveler. His intentions were good. All he wanted to do was to warn. No good deed goes unpunished.

True. But if law enforcement is involved, they can get records (customer registration info or IP address of computer from which the review was posted, among other things) from the computer companies, websites, etc. that will lead them to the person that posted it. Didn't read the article, so don't know if that was done or not...but it happens....

 

[DawnCt1]

Anyone who would post on a web board that would give out enough of the posters personal info to give somebody else, or some foreign country, the ability to track down their identity, or if they give it out voluntarily in their post, deserves exactly what they get, imho!

As a previous poster said, timing, the complaints and the incidents in a small hotel are big give aways as to the identity. Why would a poster posting their opinion "deserve anything". How many movies reviewers would be "sued" if opinions were fair game. The law in Europe is ridiculous. If a hotel, a restaurant or a resort had enough confidence in their product, the reviews would be meaningless. I have read some negative reviews of the Ka'anapali Marriott. I also read enough positive reviews that I was willing to take a chance. We loved it. My experience doesn't equate to someone elses experience. Think of the negative reviews written on the Dis about hotels, restaurants, attractions, etc. There are enough positive ones out there that lend balance.

 

[eclectics]

True. But if law enforcement is involved, they can get records (customer registration info or IP address of computer from which the review was posted, among other things) from the computer companies, websites, etc. that will lead them to the person that posted it. Didn't read the article, so don't know if that was done or not...but it happens....

I can see if the hotel files a criminal complaint, yes, but for a civil matter, I would doubt the hotel has the authority to do it on their own. But I do not know French law.

 

[eclectics]

As a previous poster said, timing, the complaints and the incidents in a small hotel are big give aways as to the identity. Why would a poster posting their opinion "deserve anything". How many movies reviewers would be "sued" if opinions were fair game. The law in Europe is ridiculous. If a hotel, a restaurant or a resort had enough confidence in their product, the reviews would be meaningless. I have read some negative reviews of the Ka'anapali Marriott. I also read enough positive reviews that I was willing to take a chance. We loved it. My experience doesn't equate to someone elses experience. Think of the negative reviews written on the Dis about hotels, restaurants, attractions, etc. There are enough positive ones out there that lend balance.

My point with this post was to say, If you don't check out the forum you are providing information to, be prepared for anything to happen. It's just common sense not to throw around your personal information to just any board or forum. And I still say you need to be sure the person you sue actually commited the act in question. That makes sense in any Country. Otherwise you can be fairly certain of defeat. In order to be sure of the persons identity, you need a "source" to obtain this info. And if the forum he posted on was "the source" than yes, he deserves whatever happens. You have to check out a websites security before trusting them with your personal information. If you don't, you are just asking for trouble. And if he posted the information himself for the world to see, what exactly did he expect to happen? As for the hotel in question, I find it hard to believe they just looked at their guest book, perhaps recalled a similar complaint lodged, pointed a finger and said, I think it was him! Even if it wasn't him, let's sue him anyway! Does that make any sense at all?

 

[DawnCt1]

And if he posted the information himself for the world to see, what exactly did he expect to happen? As for the hotel in question, I find it hard to believe they just looked at their guest book, perhaps recalled a similar complaint lodged, pointed a finger and said, I think it was him! Even if it wasn't him, let's sue him anyway! Does that make any sense at all?

I would never expect to be sued for posting a review of a hotel or resort. I think its an outrageous law that allows that type of thing. If I were planning a trip to France, I now wonder what good a tour book like Frommer's or Fodor's would be if they could be sued for saying the rooms are "noisy, uncomfortably small, the beds a lumpy and the staff is rude". Those are things I would like to know as a potential guest that possibly one could never find out from reading a guide book. When we travel to Hawaii, I use Wizard Publication's blue books. Sometimes they are effusive in their praise of certain locations, other times they seem to tell it like it is and are blunt in their descriptions. I have made a decision not to stay in a place based on a descriptive bad review. I would be angry if all I read was positve and the place was a dump.

 

[eclectics]

I would never expect to be sued for posting a review of a hotel or resort. I think its an outrageous law that allows that type of thing. If I were planning a trip to France, I now wonder what good a tour book like Frommer's or Fodor's would be if they could be sued for saying the rooms are "noisy, uncomfortably small, the beds a lumpy and the staff is rude". Those are things I would like to know as a potential guest that possibly one could never find out from reading a guide book. When we travel to Hawaii, I use Wizard Publication's blue books. Sometimes they are effusive in their praise of certain locations, other times they seem to tell it like it is and are blunt in their descriptions. I have made a decision not to stay in a place based on a descriptive bad review. I would be angry if all I read was positve and the place was a dump.

I was never debating the stupidity of the law. I agree with you. Frivilous lawsuits are irritating to all concerned and clog up any courts dockets, regardless of the Country involved. My concern was the easy availability of this mans identity and who gave what info to who, unless the Hotel did indeed "guess" that he was the one. If that's the case, then the hotel was way out of line and not very smart.

 

[DawnCt1]

I was never debating the stupidity of the law. I agree with you. Frivilous lawsuits are irritating to all concerned and clog up any courts dockets, regardless of the Country involved. My concern was the easy availability of this mans identity and who gave what info to who, unless the Hotel did indeed "guess" that he was the one. If that's the case, then the hotel was way out of line and not very smart.

I understand your point now.

 

[nwdisgal]

I'm also surprised that the laws of the country where the site is owned don't have some bearing? Also, many travel books are written about Europe and the authors express their opinion, how do they have protection from libel?

 

[DawnCt1]

I'm also surprised that the laws of the country where the site is owned don't have some bearing? Also, many travel books are written about Europe and the authors express their opinion, how do they have protection from libel?

Good question. I have never read a travel guide book, such as Frommer's or Fodors, with regard to France, etc so I don't know if they just list the positive and refrain from the negative or simply describe the hotel. Now that I know that this law exists, I would read those reviews with a different perspective.