Are the Fort's Days Numbered?

[kc5grw]

I found this link http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-disney2808mar28,0,2316702.story about plans for the Osprey Ridge and Eagle Pines redevelopment on the Podcast board. We all knew about the plans for the Four Seasons resort there, but this articles details actions that go quite a bit farther. Is it just me or does anybody else think these plans are not good for the longevity of the Fort? It seems to me that people buying multi-milion dollar homes are going to want to have a campground in that close proximity.

 

[tim5055]

I found this link http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-disney2808mar28,0,2316702.story about plans for the Osprey Ridge and Eagle Pines redevelopment on the Podcast board. We all knew about the plans for the Four Seasons resort there, but this articles details actions that go quite a bit farther. Is it just me or does anybody else think these plans are not good for the longevity of the Fort? It seems to me that people buying multi-milion dollar homes are going to want to have a campground in that close proximity.

I doubt it will have any effect at all.

First if Disney were afraiod of home sales due to the "low class" campers next door, they wouldn't be upgrading Fort Wilderness

Second, before homes are built and occupied, they will de-annex the property from the Reedy Creek Improvement District (RCID) as pointed out in the article:

The area would be developed much as Disney developed Little Lake Bryan, Celebration and a couple of smaller projects. Disney would have the property de-annexed from both the Reedy Creek Improvement District -- the independent government district created in 1967 to provide countylike services to Disney World -- and from Lake Buena Vista and Bay Lake, the two cities created back then to provide city services to most of Disney World.

Orange County would then provide such services, including utilities, fire protection and sheriff's patrols.

Once de-annexed from RCID the homeowners will have no say so in Disney operations. De-annexing is required, because if the don't the homeowners, as residents would have a vote in elections to the RCID board and other operations. Currently, the only "residents" eligible to vote in RCID elections are hand picked Disney employees who "rent" a residence form Disney on property.

 

[2goofycampers]

we will just offer them beer and kungaloosh, they'll love us.

 

[loveDmouse]

I agree that I don't think they would be doing the upgrades at the Fort if there was a chance they were going to shut it down. I think it is way too popular for them to do it.

 

[msehsejim1]

NOT a chance....the place is booked solid all the time...think about it....they have no headaches with keeping that resort filled....and also notice that there are very few or NO discounts offered.....The Fort is a Disney cash cow...bring the motor home and pay alomst the same price as some discounted rooms.

 

[kc5grw]

I dunno. I wouldn't count on the upgrades as being a sign that they would not shut down the Fort at some point. I've seen my own company pump millions of dollars to add new equipment to a facility then shut it down before the equipment has fully depreciated. Corporate America is going to do what is in the best interest of it's shareholders. Even though the area would no longer be part of RCID don't underestimate the influence that a billion dollar development could have on its neighbors.

Sorry for the negativity, but I've seen too much of this type of thing happen. I think we all know that while Disney is probably making quite a bit of money on the Fort that PFO on a hotel type resort would probably be greater.

 

[2goofycampers]

Sorry for the negativity

no need to apologize just buy us all a kungaloosh........MR. Goofy

 

[msehsejim1]

The place is one that is cash everyday and you the guest will not let it go away. Disney know the money being made there. When you have motor homes come in for 4 months at a time, and people come in for 4 or 5 days and spend money at the parks. The Fort will stay.

 

[kc5grw]

The Fort will stay.

I really hope that will be the case. I hope to be able to bring my grandkids to the Fort 10 years from now. That is assuming that any of my children have gotten married and have kids 10yrs from now.

 

[PolynesianPixie]

I really don't think we have anything to worry about. The Fort is one of the oldest parts of Disney and is always full. It's not going anywhere!

 

[DebbieT11]

OK, feel free to holler at me, but if it were MY company, and I was trying to maximize my space to maximize my dollars... you can fit a LOT more people into a hotel than into the same "footprint" of a campground.

I'm just sayin'......

 

[RvUsa]

But there is one thing disney is not short on, acreage. Look around when you are there, there is open land everywhere. why tear down a campground to put up a hotel, just put the hotel somewhere else, and collect the profits from both.

 

[kc5grw]

Following that logic why bulldoze a couple of good golf courses for a luxury resort and residential development. If getting a tee time on the weekends in central FL is anything like it is here around Dallas it seems to me that the courses should have had no problem staying in business on their own merits.

 

[RvUsa]

True, but driving around we always looked at the golf courses, and we NEVER saw more than a couple people golfing.... but at the same time there was never more than a 1/2 dozen sites empty at the fort.... and maybe like around here, they will build the houses around a golf course....

 

[Boomer1]

OK, feel free to holler at me, but if it were MY company, and I was trying to maximize my space to maximize my dollars... you can fit a LOT more people into a hotel than into the same "footprint" of a campground.

I'm just sayin'......

This is true, however Disney must invest alot of money in building a resort. Most of their latest developments have been with other companies footing the bill (i.e The Four Seasons) or DVC where members buy in. Disney would also measure their cost/return ratio for each guest. Guests using FW in a RV don't require housekeeping, they pay full rack rate all year and have capacity bookings most of the time. The infrastructure at FW is probably paid for and dollar for dollar I expect WDW makes a very good profit margin with FW.

 

[msehsejim1]

The Fort and Bay Lake as well as Giza Island (Discovery Island) were part of the Origianl 250 Acres Walt purchased. The Fort was and is the third resort to open and the same time as the CR and PR. Your right in the assessment of the dollars for another resort. However the Disney company is one of the first "Green" companies ever. Look at old World of Disney shows. Walt was one of the first Enviromentilist. A lot of History here, to be honest. The Fort is a treasure and the company knows it. The one thing Walt wanted and is still a main stay is giving everyone something that is theirs when coming to WDW. Besides our Fort loyal guest would make life miserable for the Board and Management. Beleive it or not they do listen and do understand. Integrity is upmost in the Disney company. The Fort also may have vacation club members use it as well. To much history, and to many memories. Look to see more of Pop century to open and expansion in other areas. with 47 square miles of prooperty, they have plenty of area yet to discover. Our enviroment issue and the Green ideas of today will help keep th Fort where it is at. Cutting a tree down here is like walking up to the President and asking to visit his private office. Not easly done.

 

[kc5grw]

I'm not sure that I share your assessment about Disney's concern for the environment and preserving Walt's vision. They are a corporation beholding to their stockholders. The image below shows the area encompassed by the 2 golf courses that will be bulldozed for the new development.

 

[msehsejim1]

5 world class course and I get tee times all I want. So they lost one, and the new Resort by Four seasons is very upsacle and the lots are in the million dollar or more range. They are keeping Osprey Ridge and that will be semi private. Golf courses are costly to maintain. So now they have 3 to maintain and Four Seasons now will take over Osprey and make it semi private. The Fort, is like I have said a cash cow, plus the stables and do I dare go on. Oh I can get a preferred time for am tomorrow if I call before 10 tonight. Do not think you can do that in Dallas. It is a strong move by Disney. I am sure Four Season paid a very hefty amount not to mention having to follow the Disney Standards which I am sure they fought and lost. Disney will control the Achitechture and building trades and cost. I do not know about you, I would not want to deal with that. Plus the Fort stays right there.

 

[msehsejim1]

those courses were put in with the least amount of tree removal. Look at the original site and you can see that...

 

[kc5grw]

Actually, if you read the article posted when I started this thread. Disney wants to de-annex the property from RCID back to Orange county and therefore would no longer have that control over the property.